Why Aren’t Muslim Women Converting to Christianity?

re#62 by dharma on April 25, 2006 3:01pm PT
>>>>>>you are telling me! You need a will of steel not to convert.
First pair of muslim girls that want to marry me at the same time
i am outta here:)

LOL.
This web site is getting more and more interesting for
me. All male f+++$&s sharing their
secret desires and it is not even a XXX site and free.
I`m all for a global Jihad now.

al-test-ul-marhaba

The author writes

<<< Majority of the Western media and the Pat Robertsons of the world will have you believe that Islam is the most backward religion in the world >>>

Yes, they have an agenda and to pursue that agenda they don`t consider truth as the criterion only what sells their product and in the case of Pat Robertson that product that he is selling happens to be (metaphorically speaking) urine dressed up as health tonic.

Then he writes

<<< I have a simple question: why is it that even after all this oppression we never hear of Muslim women whether they are living in Islamic countries or even in the west converting to Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism or any ‘ism’ for that matter? >>>

Conversion is not the criteria for the truthfulness or lack thereof of a system. Truth stands on its own merits regardless of the # of followers.

He writes <<< Peter Ford the author of this article writes that according to researchers, the rationale for this mass conversion amongst women is the moral bankruptcy and the superficial nature of the society that surrounds them >>>

It is not the superficial or ``moral bankruptcy`` of society in my opinion but rather how that impacts on women and their view of themselves in such a society. Women in western socieites are oppressed, much moreso than Muslim women (who are oppressed more by their traditions than anything Islam or the Quran teaches). Like I tell my class, the west makes a big deal (for propaganda reasons) of the ``Muslim veiliing of women`` (even though there is no such ruling concerning that veil in the Quran) yet it is busy veiling its own women by making everything about them invisible (about their personalities) both to themselves and to others, except their physical appearance judged by male standards of attractiveness. That is how the personality develops if you`ve heard of the ``looking glass self``, you see yourselves as others see you. Now I can throw in plenty of stats to show just how oppressed women are in the US but that would be a repetition, you all can go through my posts on your own time to check those.

On a side note, I would not characterize the Christian Science Monitor as a ``right-wing magazine`` because it is not. Its coverage is closer to the BBC than Fox News. I would also not agree with the author including sources other than the Quran as ``authority`` on Islam. Given the history of those extra quranic sources as well as the recommendations in the Quran, no extra-Quranic sources can ever be considered an authority on Islam.

Author,

Sometimes people convert simply for the ``novelty`` of the effect - or perhaps because they are continuing to seek because they are not satisfied with what they have .

Usually these are isolated instances and such individuals do not fit the ``norm``.

Therefore, like all isolated instances, there is not much to be read into such stuff.

The best preachers are those who restrict their discourse to the good things their religion teaches and keep its focus on individual acts - rather than trying to use the religion as an agent of change.

The ``fire and brimstone`` type is pretty much out of style - most reasonable people tend to tune them out because they appeal to the destructive tendencies which are part of us all.

However, every religion has some such types as well as some followers of such types.

The trick is not to focus on the religion itself but those types of individuals.

``My religion is better than yours`` is effectively an oxymoron - because the good parts of any religion are universal so can not be owned by any segment of population through a label.

[Majority of the Western media and the Pat Robertsons of the world will have you believe that Islam is the most backward religion in the world. They will make a case that Islam is oppressive to women; it preaches hate towards anyone and everyone. They will blow fire out of their mouths about how all practising Muslim men are nothing but wife beaters.

I have a simple question: why is it that even after all this oppression we never hear of Muslim women whether they are living in Islamic countries or even in the west converting to Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism or any ‘ism’ for that matter? We will hear the Irshad Manjis and Asra Naumanis trying to ``INNOVATE`` in Islam by pleading to us how lesbianism and illegitimate children are fine and how this behavior should be encouraged in Islam. But even they will never say that another religion is the answer. On the other hand, despite open prejudice and harassment to some degree, Islam is spreading in Europe and America like wild-fire. ]

Whether it`s Muslims, Christians, Mormons or Jews, any kind of religious extremism deprives the women of their basic rights and options to enjoy the life they want to (whether it is tango or rumba - someone else chooses the type of dance movements they need to follow). In these kinds of societies, men take upon themselves to control, dictate, analyze and review the lives of their family women and the women around them.

Just recently, there was a program on CNN regarding polygamy among the Mormons. It was amazing to see that some women who were in polygamous relationships were fine with the fact that the husband had multiple wives. Some of the female children had issues. But it was interesting to listen to wife#1 of a guy with 3 wives. Wife # 1 did not believe in having multiple husbands and was fine that women were not allowed to lean in that direction in her faith, whereas it was fine for a man to go for it. The woman shared all the good points about joint family system and stuff like that. Interestingly, all other wives did not hold the same opinion as that of the first wife. This is happening in a country where we believe women have equal rights and they are a not a possession of a man nor completely dependent on him. According to the guy, he was following his belief and its leanings. Was that fair with all his wives? Were they comfortable in that relationship? It was not clear and was left in the air except for wife#1`s comments. Some children who were the by-product of such relationship spoke vehemently on the maltreatment they received in the hands of stepmothers and other extended family. It was an interesting program with completely different perspectives depending on the stakeholders and their angles.

[I have a simple question: why is it that even after all this oppression we never hear of Muslim women whether they are living in Islamic countries or even in the west converting to Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism or any ‘ism’ for that matter?]

Why is the writer assuming that having Muslim women with an affinity to their religion has anything to do with Muslim men`s treatment toward the women? It`s not that Muslim men treat their women so well that the women have decide to stay devoted to Islam. This is silly and plain nonsense. Some of our well-meaning Muslim men tend to confuse these two elements and forget to treat them separately. There may not be many Muslim women converting but there are many Muslim women who grew up in Islamic countries but decided to marry non-Muslim guys by choice. Some of these guys converted whereas others did not. There are a lot of born Muslims who lack the basic decency and values that Islam emphasizes. On the contrary, there are many non-Muslims who have qualities and attributes that comply with the basics of what Islam preaches.

Like any organized religion, Muslims do have love and affinity for each other. Unfortunately, lately they are showing their love and affinity by eliminating each other. That is something very unique to the Muslims. With that kind of mindset, it`s very hard to trust a Muslim male`s leanings. An educated man who may appear sane and sophisticated one day can transform into a religious zealot later down the road. He may decide to become a jehadi due to some spiritual transformation. Still, this is not a good reason for a Muslim woman to turn away from her religion. Religion is not about performing rituals and being the caretaker of criticizing/reviewing Muslim women`s leanings. I do not believe that is what Islam preaches or even emphasizes in any way or shape.

[I find it amazing and it’s a lesson for the haters of Islam as well as the supposed “Mullahs” that when asked by his companions who are the best amongst Muslims, my beloved prophet said “The one who is polite and loving towards his wife”. All the wife-beaters are duly warned! ]

I am very amused to read this ending. Is there any specific definition of ``love``? Is the Muslim man supposed to follow a prescribed guideline and ritual to display that love? Do Muslim men subscribe to a certain line of thought when it comes to expressing love? Why cann`t a Mm express that love in the form of slow and smooth dancing or the invigorating salsa? When the goal is clear, does it matter how you achieve it? Does it matter if it is in a certain form? There are many Muslims who love their Creator/Allah. Not all of them express their love in the form of following certain specific rituals. Some people have no other way of expressing love toward God than following the rituals. Others good human beings and are kind to God`s creation out of sheer love of God. Then there are those who get into the Jehad mode by killing the creation of God. In their eyes, that is a form of love toward their creator. Unfortunately, that kind of love is what alerts the rest of the civilized world and makes them wonder if the orthodox Muslims truly know the meaning of love. There are various types involved in this picture. We cannot say who is better here. But we definitely know the worst kind.

Keeping that in mind, I think it is extremely unfair of a sweet and polite Mm who knows how to move his limbs, is in good shape, and has good taste in music to not enjoy a healthy activity with his spouse or significant other. He should feel terribly guilty for not enjoying life and not sharing something that can bring joy to his spouse`s life. It can be very disappointing for a lively Muslim woman to be with a man who does not believe in cherishing life and its liveliness. Point to ponder!

#68 very true, indeed.

#65 that is from masadi. so it must be untrue. no need to read. :-)

Post #67 -

An Update -

Religion is not about performing rituals and being the caretaker of criticizing/reviewing Muslim men/women`s leanings.

Re: # 23

Naqsh (e-baz),

You could ask ur Mohajir friends what the above word means?

Spirituality in Islam you must be joking. You would not know spirituality if it hit you at 200 kmph.

Oh i forgot in islam the spirit resides in the blood that is why you slaughter animals by the barbaric halal method, by that its spirit is released. So you must be experiencing spirituality at least once a year and BUTCHERS must be the most spiritual of all Islamic people. What a great PR opportunity ``Our butchers are spiritual``. Care to add more permutations to the theme.

No Regards
Sanatani

#70 by tahmed32 <<<
#65 that is from masadi. so it must be untrue. no need to read. :-) >>>

Your unconditional opposition to my posts mirrors your unconditional support for colonization and the ``Anglo Saxon tradition``- (whatever the hell that means). It appears the time off you took for some much needed soul searching hasn`t paid off.

OK. Enough of this crap coming from yet one more of these Islamists.

Reading the blanket statements and self-serving questions makes me wanna puke !

``why is it that even after all this oppression we never hear of Muslim women whether they are living in Islamic countries or even in the west converting to Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism or any ‘ism’ for that matter``

-- Who is playing the trumpet that Islam is spreading like a wild fire in the west? Its islamists like this author. One mullah writes an article that Islam is spreading like a wild fire, and another quotes it. Doesn`t surprise me.

``the word used should be reverting because we as Muslims believe that every ...``

-- It doesn`t matter my favorite Islamist buddy. We will continue using the word ``converting``. It is an open secret that mostly only losers from other religious backgrounds convert to Islam. You should have seen how my Hindu friend from Hyderabad went to Arizona, met some loser Hyderabadi and Pakistani Muslim friends, fell for the BS they fed him, and turned into one Jameel. He never finished his Masters, is back, and is now so perfect a Muslim, going to Mosques, and eating lotuses.

``Islam doesn’t put emphasis on the “HOTNESS” of a woman``
-- Sure, but that`s because Islam in North Africa slices away the clitori of women. And, in the middle east it does not permit them to lead lives independently. In South Asia it leaves them with Burkhas (In Pakistan it occasionally gets them stone washed). Even in relatively modern Malaysia, and Indonesia it stifles their life styles.

``Even today in this age of materialism I am a personal witness to families back home, where women in their 80’s who are completely unlettered, are obviously not the bread-winners of the family, but yet they have the stature of the head of the household``

-- Sure, so the conclusion being? In my non-muslim immediate family, we treat elderly women with care and love. And, whats the non-sense about materialism? Have you stopped working for your daily Naan, taking drugs, and playing sufi music on the streets of Karachi?

``Islam is still thriving in the heart of America``
-- Mostly in prisons, black ghettos, pakistani neighborhoods, and in some parts of rural Texas.

``Please spare me the lectures on how times are changing and Islam needs to change with time. ``
-- Please spare us with your doctrinaire ! If you are baffled, there`s more than one channel on the TV. Watch your Israr Ahmed buddy talking about how Ahmedis are non-muslims, `maslah yeh hai....maslah wo hai....`

``We need to reclaim our media from these Indian wannabe’s. ``

-- Please do that. And, make sure others quite easily distinguish between Indians and Pakistanis. Enough of this bhai-chara between religious freaks, and Indians.

``But if someone is going to plead the case of ``Mixed Prayers`` or how dancing whether classical or otherwise is somehow part and parcel of our religion and Pakistani culture then you’ll get an earful from me and believe you me I am the voice of the majority on these issues.``

-- Are you married? Do you feed your wives and kids well ? Or do you keep patronizing like this all through the day?

Sometimes it appears that the saying ``Religion is a poison for mankind`` is true.

Look at Nepal of today. The liberal people there have fought hard, braving polics and army, and have restored democracy. Chances are that they will also now make the Monarch leave the country so that Nepal is a true republic. Thats a real victory for the people as the major powers including India, were said to be hand in gloves with the Monarch.


The free thinkers and those believe in liberty, freedom and democracy the world over must congratulate the Nepalese people for their great achievement.

Now look at Pakistan... they are also craving for democracy in their country...but do not have guts to face army and police....because they find an easy solace in their Religion.

Nepalese have attained in 14 or so months what Pakistan has been unable to achieve in the past 7 years.

Jaago Pakistan Jaago....

Sanjay # 75,

The Nepalese indeed wanted a democracy, they fought for it, and won it.

Sanjay: 75

Jaggo Pakistan is good if uttered by a Pakistani or Indian muslim!

You may continue to let your hindu-head roll and toss and turn in your sleepless nights. That suits you more.

amass money, count it., & stay sleepless.

Aah. I get it. It must be what Guru Raw-Dust says .... maybe they experienced some invisible light of Truth in Islam....

If not that, then what the hell did inspire her to forsake her hard-drinking-hard-partying ways in return for a hijab???