Are We The Most Racist Of Them All?

Some Terminologies for Chowkies

It is observed that Chowkies use many terminologies in addressing each other in the interactive forums. They are generally limited to Moron(mostly used), Stupid, Fool and Idiot.

Here are some more for them :-

Bonehead, Dummy, Dullard, Dunce, Buffoon, Duffer, Jackass, Sucker, Fathead, Nerd, Clown, Joker, Screwball, Wag, Madcap,Duckegg,Pinhead,Baboon.

Or try this subcontinental stuff :-

Ullu, Nalayak, Bevkoof, Gadha, Pagal, Khat-dimag, Pajama, Lallu, Be-akal, Akal-ka-dushman, Akal-key-paidal, Akal-key-kacchey.

#19 sadna, #28 anil

Yours are well-intentioned comments each but (in addition to being impractical) they happen to be off-the-mark.

Chauvinism does not come through the language and it does not go away by learning more languages. Some of the most prejudiced individuals have been highly educated literary scholars (the example of Gore Vidal comes to my mind (I am not an expert on him)). And knowing many languages does not get rid of narrow-mindedness. An argument can be made that this site is teaming with chauvinists – everyone of which knows at least two languages (English in addition to their own) – what has changed over the last 7-8 years? (Go back and look at the earlier postings – the answer is – precious little.)

It’s little to do with any part of the culture. Chauvinism begins at home. And the knowledge of language (the vehicle) is not a prerequisite for the understanding of cultures – it used to be so once – but in this day and age the language is simply an appendage of the culture.

From the communication point of view – which is the original purpose behind having a language, Hindi and Urdu are more similar than different (in spite of the more recent attempts to emphasize on and to artificially and consciously build upon the differences) – people who know one of these have rarely difficulty understanding the spoken version of the other. Yet the chasm remains between the communities that claim each as their exclusive mother! The chasm remains – because its underlying poison gets injected (in my view, more among the Muslims of Pakistan, some of whom have invested too many of their emotions into what I consider a mirage and as that mirage continues to recede – such individuals continue to beat upon those hot sands in frenzy!) and then it gets reinforced through repetition – and demagogues (both in uniform as well as in civilian clothes) take advantage of it!

These are miraculous times when it is possible to learn about other cultures (or big parts of those) without what used to be the absolute necessity of having to learn their languages.

As technology evolves, enlightenment is sure to follow – the only question is will it come in a timely manner for our brethren on the other side of that border?

This is a great article. The worst thing to me is when Indians and Pakistanis call Black Americans as ‘Kala’ very disdainfully, although most of them ‘Desis’ are darker than the black Americans and even not physically as great as them.

Zeena is right in two ways:

1. Somebody had posted ‘Desi’ links on Pakistan proving his point, I believe Pakistanis generally do not use this word. It is too non-Urduish. At least Pakhtuns, Urdu speaking, Sindhis, and Kashmiris don’t use this word. Perahps a Punjabi on this site will like to add his viewpoint here. The origin of this word is ‘Dais’ meaning native land. Pakistanis tend to use its Urdu equivalent ‘Watan’ more often than not. The word ‘Desi’ seldom appears while we are talking to each other. It is perhaps when we refer to Indians and Pakistanis together in the USA, that we use the term. I have not heard this term being used by Pakistanis in the UAE, Bahrain, Australia and Canada.

2. In Pakistan there are ethnic biases, but generally no racism. For example, a Mohajir may call a Punjabi ‘Punj-aibi’ (referring to a religious term for a person with his 5 big religious sins), Punjabi may call a Pakhtun ‘Kho-chay’ (referring to our speaking two words very often), a Pakhtun may call a Mohajir ‘Hindustora’ (referring to the origin of the Mohajirs). However, all the 3 communities inter-mingle and cross-cultural marriages amongst different ethnic groups are common, provided they are arranged. Admittedly, there can be serious repercussions, if marriages are carved out without the blessings of the elders.

Ranjit referred to Bangladesh. Yes, that was the only example that fits the topic on racism. However, soon after BD came into being, most of the prominent members of the founding family was murdered and one party in the two party politics of that country emerged as pro-Pakistan. However, instead of Pakistan, I would attribute all of this to a general Bengali characteristic of forgiving others on their wrong-doing. I have many examples from personal experience where I have seen that Bengalis generally forgive when the wrong doers apologize. I am sure this personal trait has become national character also.

#34

It is not that complicated. At the basic level, prejudice is fueled by lack of information about the other. Learning another language and its literature and its associated cultural, geographical and historical contexts increases information about the other and opens up the different world of the other. Many educated N.Indians don`t even bother to know what languages are spoken where in India. How many N.Indians know of even one nonHindi poet or writer or classic from another part of the country?


At a more sublimal level, while learning another language is to absorb a different set of cultural idioms and to be different from a person knowing only one`s own. To encompass more than one cultural idiom in oneself is an organic way of being tolerant.

Correction: At a more sublimal level, learning another language is to absorb a different set of cultural idioms and to be different from a person knowing only his own.

#36 Sadna

The point ma’m was that there needs to be that “openness to learn” and the language is incidental. If such openness is absent, all the mastery of the vernacular will fail – worse than all the king’s horses and all the king’s men – a phenomenon sometimes (or perhaps more than sometimes) observed even in THIS little “kingdom”!

bjkumar
Correct. That is why N.Indians have to be caught (and taught) at a young age in school before their minds close.

Ahamdzai

Until fairly recently, the term desi was not inappropriate for a Pakistani. The `Pakistani` culture one thought of was the culture of Lahore and of Karachi of an earlier era.

Lately, people from places like Bajaur, Charsada, Peshawar are finding their rightful place in defining Pakistan and its culture, both inside and in the eyes of outsiders. Historically, these men and women had more to do with Afghanistan and Afghanis than with Punjab and Punjabis, or Sindh and Sindhis (the latter being, one suspects, as racist and tradition-bound as the rest of us).

If this development is not an aberration, and represents a long-term, planned shift toward embracing traditional Afghanistani and Middle-Eastern cultures (and these are and were great cultures with proud warring traditions), then soon nobody would confuse a Pakistani for a desi.

Like India`s, Pakistan`s culture too is up for grabs. People like you and Zeena can surely make your contribution in moulding it.

By the same token, I have met a number of S. Indians who refuse to accept Hindustani classical music as classical music or as music worth the name. And the other day there was this educated S. Indian columnist calling Hindi a foreign language and N.Indian Hinduism as unauthentic *rolling eyes icon*. This when there is so much of Hindustani music, Hindi and N Indian brands of Hinduism pervading media and public sphere.

You`ve got to wonder what people from the North East (about whom there is relatively very little or nothing at all in the public sphere) put up with, from the entire set of thickheaded ignorants that we are in the rest of India.

Re:bjkumar and sadna

We are overlooking the role of economics in facilitating national integration. In my opinion, the greatest reason why India is together is because most of us realize that it is in our interest to stay together. The economies of scale and the synergies of being a large nation complety outweighs our petty parochial instincts. In that respect, India is no different from the US which is also a melting pot of even greater magnitude. You dont need to force immigrants in US to learn English - they have to do it to succeed. The same applies in India.

Consider this. A lot of north indians pursue jobs in the high tech sector and have to live in Hyderabad, Banaglore or Chennai. In that scenario, it is self-defeating to have a very parochial attitude of racism towards south indians. Also when you live in these places, you have to interact with everyone, pick up the language and integrate with the local culture. Your kids grow up there and so on. The same way south indians take jobs in Delhi, Mumbai or Kolkata and go through exactly the same experience. The parts of the country that are not integrated properly like Kashmir or the North-East are essentially due to their lack of full participation in the national economy.

Therefore, the key for national integration is to basically expand the economy at a blistering pace by accelerating reforms, investing in infrastructure and spreading education. Also it is important to ensure that the maximum number of people from all parts of India can participate in the juggernaut. The rest will take care of itself. As they say - ``Baap bada na bhaiyya, Sabse bada Rupaiyaa``!!

ranjit, you put forward sabse bada argument. Additionally, the economic and political gains of the South will tranform the cultural landscape of India. Old prejudices will become harder to sustain.

#42 Ranjit

Some of what you say about economic considerations is true – but it is mere pipedream to say that such considerations wipe out the inbuilt prejudices which have been injected during childhood and nurtured through young ages by the family environment, schooling and the society at large and sometimes (as in the case of our Pakistani friends) the media at large – such prejudices usually lurk beneath the surface and are ready to strike at an opportune time.

We have seen it time and again in the US that every time the economy takes a dive, immigrants (usually the illegal ones but most people fail to make a distinction) become the favorite whipping boys – the easy targets – and don’t kid yourself that Indians are any different – we do the same with wherever we can find a visible target “minority” – be it of a different faith, race, or caste – you name it.

#40 by kaalchakra

“or Sindh and Sindhis (the latter being, one suspects, as racist and tradition-bound as the rest of us).”

Not true. Most Sindhi would not like to be associated with the kind of name calling and mocking that goes in India. Mohajirs, who moved from India, brought this in Sindh. Incidentally, they are the only group that ended up with several names. Mostly people did not like their attitude with local Sindhis, Balochis or Pathans.

What Ahmedzai said is mostly accurate. Sindhi, Balochi, Pathan or Punjabis rarely mock each other despite several political grievances against the Punjab.

This is tricky but I also think that Sindhi, Pathan and Baloch culture is somewhat different than overall Indian culture. Punjabi have much more in common with their Indian cousins in Punjab and Delhi but Sindhi, Pathan or Balochi really don’t share much with overall central India or what you call north Indian culture.

I agree with Zeena and Ahmedzai the word Desi is somewhat alien to Pakistanis.


I think the author is talking about regional biases and not racial differences but then the word Racist is tossed around everywhere for everything nowadays.

Aha_snark ,

That was an interesting article. Thanks.

ranjit #42
You are quite right, economics and the movement of people it results in, plays a significant role in national integration.

But economic reasons aren`t enough for peace, amity and `synergy` between peoples. After all, the English came to India and the US went to Iraq for economic reasons but one can`t argue that it resulted in lasting peace and amity no? And how about those `ashrafs` from a previous period who held themselves as separate ?

And Turkish immigrants went to Germany and Africans to France for largely economic reasons, but for instance fundamental problems between Turkish immigrants and the local Germans still exist. The issue of who should appreciate whose culture, how much and why is still not settled between them.

In India, the why is not an issue at all of course. All Indians are our brothers so we appreciate our brothers` food, cultural identity, concerns etc..

And in India, economic migration has been good for national integration. But as a rule I find that while a state X`s inhabitants who migrated to other states for jobs do become more tolerant, that does not make the inhabitants still remaining in state X more tolerant of outsiders from other states coming to state X for jobs. Being taught at a young age more about those outsiders before they come, will help according to me.

If I am not mistaken, India has given the constitutional right to linguistic minorities to have their own schools which has also helped ease some pressures between locals and migrants to some extent, IMO.

re: HP # 45

I am fortunate enough to know a number of (urban) Sindhis, and they are absolute gems of people. Culturally, in the openness of their minds and in their progressivism, they could teach us bhaiyyas quite a few lessons. Although if there were deep differences between them and other Indians, I didn`t really notice.

Balochis and Pathans are largely unknown quantities to most Indians. In my mind`s eye, Ahmadzai and Zeena appear as accomplished and wonderful representatives of their people. It would indeed be hard to discover much in common between these two excellent individuals and Indians.

But then, about Sindh and Sindhis too, I am forced to rely for my understanding on limited interactions with a few Hindu Sindhi families. You would have an infinitely better awareness of whether Sindhis have closer cultural ties with and are temperamentally similar to Pakhtoons and Balochis.

(Actually, Sindh fascinates me. I hope, some day, I am able to make a deeper study of it)

Totally agree with you about the misuse of the word `racist.` When this misuse is not foolish, you might agree, it is part of a deliberate campaign of misinformation, often by dyed-in-the-wool racists themselves :)

ranjit, sadna

An optimistic argument can be made that increased mutual understanding and mutual trust build economic efficiencies. `Synergy` between peoples (copyright Sadna) is an interesting concept. It can have economic payoffs.

Of course, beejay would rightly remind us that this is all too rosy and too simplistic. But he can be too cynical at times :) :)