Rethinking Foreign Policy -- Can Pakistan and India Agree?

DM ji

what is the resolution of kashmir problem? give it to pakistan. wow
u are a Real Strategic thinker (as u describe yrself).

If kashmir belongs to pakistan because of having muslims then what abt non kashmiri muslims ?
may be 50 yrs down the line they can again be given their own land and so on and so on.

its so fun to read all yr posts and articles.

If he has to undertake such a bold departure, he would need some support and sympathy from India in the form of a relaxation of its stand on Kashmir. Musharraf has presented numerous proposals on Kashmir without receiving any favourable response from the Indians. It is time for Indians to show a willingness to reveal their cards.

``As you sow, so you reap``.

I don`t understand this feeling among some people that if India shows magnanimity, the Kashmir problem will go away. If DM sahib you expect Pakistan will forget decades of hatred if India gave them Kashmir away, I cannot help but call you naive. If you give a greedy mongrel a bit of your food, will it go away satisfied? No, it will expect the rest of the food as well. It is the same with Pakistan. Besides, the Paki public has been condii(that Kashmir will one day be their (Kashmir Banega Pakistan)) was something that the Paki establishment has brainwashed the awaam to believe in. So Pakistan must deal with that sentiment on its own; why expect favors from India? After all, everyone has to deal with his/her own Karma.

ON MC PLATFORM, OMAR ADMITS SHEIKH’S MISTAKES

ARSHAD HUSSAIN KALOO

After almost 80 years, a historic meeting took place here as leaders of Muslim Conference and National Conference on Sunday shared a platform and were unanimous in demanding immediate resolution of Kashmir issue according to wishes and aspirations of people of Jammu and Kashmir. Both the parties pledged to work together till final resolution of Kashmir issue.
Viewed as unprecedented development that is going to shape future dynamics in new Kashmir dispensation, the meeting saw leaders like Sardar Qayuum Khan, Sardar Sikandar Hayat Khan and other Muslim Conference leaders receiving Omar Abdullah with warmth and patiently listened to his views. Omar conceded that mistakes done in the past should be accepted and never repeated again for better future of the people.
“Nobody should feel low about admitting mistakes and the acceptance of those mistakes make people high and not low and so I am doing that by admitting. Similarly India and Pakistan should admit those mistakes,” he said.
Omar was referring to “decisions” taking by his grand father Sheikh Abdullah. “But Sheikh Sahib took those decisions keeping in view the ground realities as he saw breaking away of East Pakistan (now Bangladesh) and accordingly deemed fit that in consonance with the situation at that time,” he said..
This forthright admittance draw applause and sigh of relief in Muslim Conference ranks who were surprised that Omar, the president of National Conference, would feel apologetic about the past mistakes of his grandfather on the Pakistani soil.
All rank and file of Muslim Conference patiently listened to Omar and saw history in making as leaders of both the parties pledged to work jointly till final settlement of Kashmir is achieved. Conspicuous was the absence of President of Muslim Conference in Jammu and Kashmir Prof Abdul Gani Bhat. However, Prof Ashraf Saraf was present and witnessed himself the historic occasion as Muslim Conference leaders embraced grandson of Sheikh Muhammad Abdullah. Muslim Conference is the ruling party in Pakistan administered Kashmir.
Criticising the moves to create plethora of political or separatist parties, he categorical said that the more number of parties or leaders is not only confusing for the final dispensation but helps those vested interests who want Kashmir issue to linger for ever.
The leaders were in one voice that the ongoing peace process should continue and also expressed willingness to help India and Pakistan to settle the issue.

Harish Hyd,

As usual your inner ugliness is on ample display with the kind of analogies you make...

The problem with the world is this self righteousness that forces naive wide-eyed ideologues to believe all the crap that is forced down your throat by your nation state.. same goes for your opposite numbers in Pakistan...

#4 by Mantolives

[As usual your inner ugliness is on ample display with the kind of analogies you make...]

Which is nothing compared to yours, considering the fact that your posts are frequently peppered with references to bodily orifices and other profanities.

[The problem with the world is this self righteousness that forces naive wide-eyed ideologues to believe all the crap that is forced down your throat by your nation state..]

One such ideologue was was your hero who force-fed a divisive ideology to the gullible Muslim (and now Paki) awaam, and the disastrous results are there for all to see.

Harish mian...

``considering the fact that your posts are frequently peppered with references to bodily orifices and other profanities. ``

And yet you can`t produce any such thing from any post in over a year... always pointing to a slip up from a year ago... the problem with you is that you are a pathological case.
Meanwhile you were repetitively calling me ``chutiya`` and what not because as usual you had no arguments to defend your contentions with.

So continue to delude yourself... but I have take good measure of the kind of person you are...

India`s problems are internal; so are Pakistan`s.

More than the various insurgencies in the North Eastern states of India and J&K, it is the growing Naxalite/Maoist insurgency as well as the Muslim terrorist attacks in other parts of India that are more dangerous to India`s growth and unity.

The Naxals and Maoists are protesting uneven economic growth, lack of jobs and stranglehold of certain caste groups on economic/social power in the rural areas. More Indian Muslims are signing up for Pak sponsored terrorism because they have been pushed to it by a political and judicial system that has only exploited them - think about Gujarat riots and Babri Masjid demolition. While the terrorist activities will not bear fruit in either the short or the long run, they have the capability of retarding economic growth which affects everyone - Hindus and Muslims.

Pakistan`s problems too are internal - feudalism, active Islamization of society since Bhutto and insurgencies in the Baloch and NWFP regions.

India`s limited economic success has not yet benefited the have-nots. In fact, it has increased the gap between the haves and the have-nots. Democracy has translated to kleptocracy, muscle power and caste power. The caste or religious groups that do not have the power suffer economically. We need to follow the Constitutional principles diligently and ensure that everyone is equipped to take advantage of this economic growth - through improved education, health care facilities and better infrastructure (power, water, roads, sanitation). Creating only islands of prosperity will be dangerous.

On the J&K issue, India should do some soft-selling to its own people - it has to win their minds (hearts may take longer) - reduce avoidable humiliations and HR abuses.

In any case, people in J&K, Pakistan and the liberals in India must realise that India cannot give up land, it cannot give too much autonomy lest there be similar demands from other states. Pakistan should realize it cannot win land through any means - war, insurgency or talks. If expectations are too high on Kashmir in Pakistan, its govt needs to tone down the expectations and ensure economic growth, so Kashmir is no longer used as a distraction.

I dont expect any grand accords or deals to bring peace to Kashmir. It will take its own time.

Re: # 6

Myself: ``always pointing to a slip up from a year ago``

And that too in face of the worst kind of abuse from you... where you even distorted my name in a most childish manner... that should raise doubts about your mental age.

DM-sahib,

It`s a nice article but not too connected to reality. Consider just some of the following:

(1) Pakistani military and mullahs are dependent on continuing this conflict for survival. do you think these handsome brigadiers and generals want to reduced to scooter driving goverment officers? I dont think so. For the mullahs, similar thinking applies.

(2) With huge money being made by gulf countries, some of this will definitely be used to fund killing of hindus. After all, what is the point of being a rich islamist, if no infidel get killed? So little incentive there to settle for our paki friends. Plenty of cash to send their children to harvard/sharvard while letting the masses rant about hinuds.

(3) Participation of indian muslims in terror is inevitable. Once india began to assert an independent foreign policy that did not involve sucking up to islamic mass murderers like Saddam, Wahhabi prince of Saudi, iranian mullahocracy, Syrian tyrant, palestinian wastrels etc, there is ``naturally`` going to be reaction. At the same time the community is in a difficult spot: hostility from many hindus, poor education, few prospects etc. This has to change and it will, but slowly.

(4) The one point I disagree with you is that pakistan has a real china card. I dont think that will provide much leverage. Maybe pakistan can become a colony of china, but not too much beyond that. I think we should welcome their becoming a chinese colony. They will be forced to work hard for their money and otherwise be given the stick. Whats wrong with that?

Answer, in a word - No.

Reason, in a word - Religion.

As long as the Hindu fanatics of India preach hatred against muslims in general and against Pakistan, through indoctrinating `Made in Britain` history, and Pakistani jihadis do the same, there is very little chance of understanding or lasting peace between the neighbours.

#10 parthaab

How right you are! Those disgusting hindu terrorists in Pakistan are killing so many people. It is really shameful that such people call themselves hindus. They should not take their frustration at being a small minority and turn it into terrorism!

This was your main point, right?

As always your inputs are unadulterated nonsense and 100% fact free.

DM,

Have you read the history of Prithviraj Chauhan and Shahabuddin Ghauri? Prithviraj defeated Ghauri in an earlier war but as a sign of goodwill and compromise let him go back to Ghaur hoping to win his heart and create a ``paradigm shift``. Ghauri returned some time later in full force and defeated Prithviraj, except that he did not feel so generous. So he decided to imprison him and take over Delhi. So much for paradigm shifts!!

Dont you understand that Musharraf`s proposals are all Trojan Horses? They are meant to con India into moving its troops out of Kashmir and give up control over the territory. He cannot do it by force so he is taking a different approach. What will happen the next day after India withdraws forces and gives ``self-governance``? The militant camps in PoK that have been preparing thousands of jihadies will let loose. All these jehadies will flood the valley. It will be de facto rule over Srinagar as the control of government will pass to these non-state actors. It will be accompanied by large-scale violence so that the state government will be paralyzed. Now what will India do then? Take back self-governance and send troops back? Immediately the human rights people, communists and UN will start screaming bloody murder. The Islamic countries and Al-Quaeda will get into the act as they see India reconquering the valley. The US will step in, use its economic leverage and ask India to cool off. India will have de jure status but the de facto rule will be by Pak proxies kind of like Kosovo in the balkans. In other words, we will lose Kashmir forever. Prithviraj-Ghauri will repeat again!!

Does this mean India should never compromise? Of course not. When the conditions are right, we should compromise for the sake of peace and good relations. But those conditions have NOT been reached by any stretch. You have Lashkar-e-Toiba chief Prof. Hafeez Saeed strutting around in Lahore and Muridke. His followers are there all over Azad Kashmir participating in earthquake relief, while sending some surplus manpower to India to organize bomb blasts. The Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Masood Azhar is cooling his heels in Pakistan. The United Jehad Council, which has Jehad as a middle name, is strongly active in Azad Kashmir under Syed Salahuddin.

What kind of peace is possible, when these people are roaming around and mobilizing in Pakistan If Pakistan wants India to move an inch on Kashmir, it must eliminate all militants, period!! Unless this is done, no dice. No talks, no compromise. Get rid of the militants, get rid of the militancy infrastructure, let India and/or US in to verify and then we can compromise. Otherwise, we should tell them to just get lost!! No paradigm shifts at gunpoint. If we fence our Nepal and Bangladesh borders properly we can protect against a lot of internal terrorism. As far as internal stability of Pak is concerned, that is a permanent issue with Pakistan. We have heard that a lot of times but we cannot run our foreign policy based on reacting to their potential suicidal instincts.

p-mishra...

Don`t feign innocence... Through the 1980s RAW was KGB`s proxy in Pakistan bombing cities in Pakistan... routinely.

Nice summation Dost Saheb. Pakistan`s problems at the moment are indeed dire. The recent developments in Waziristan are highly ominuous where militants now felt confident enough to attack the region`s capital Miran Shah, and actually took control of the telephone exchange for a day, before being repelled. Hundreds were killed. The area is slowly but surely slipping out of Pakistan`s control into that of Taliban. That will certainly invite direct US military intervention. Pakistan is fighting on just too many fronts and losing all of them.

With US policy on the Kashmir issue now clear, Pakistan is left completely alone in its stand with no support even in the Muslim world. Sooner or later, the issue will have to be decided bilaterally and there appears to be no option than to accept LOC as international border. Failure to do so will result in the Indians or Kashmiris or both laying claim on Pakistan controlled Gilgit and Baltistan as well.

#6 by Mantolives

[And yet you can`t produce any such thing from any post in over a year... always pointing to a slip up from a year ago... the problem with you is that you are a pathological case.]

But that is because anyone wanting to read your posts is free to do so (and probably knows so already). Besides, I don`t need to ``produce any such thing`` every time you get an itch to prove yourself innocent. If you are really innocent, any accusations to the contrary shouldn`t be worrying you too much no? But as BJ bhai sahib said, ``thou doth protest too much``, which in other words is a clear giveaway.

[So continue to delude yourself... but I have take good measure of the kind of person you are...]

And you continue to delude yourselves that I`m deluding myself. If that`d make you happy, I`m glad.

#13 by Mantolives

[Don`t feign innocence... Through the 1980s RAW was KGB`s proxy in Pakistan bombing cities in Pakistan... routinely.]

Hmm..so anyone accusing Pakistan (or you) must provide evidence to prove it, while your word must be taken as the gospel of truth?