Celebrity Courts and Kangaroo Justice

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#47 by GT on April 19, 2006 8:21am PT



For those who believe in free markets, you have to pay heed to property rights.


I guess America is Stalinist too then..

What? you`ve never heard of eminent domain?

#45 by FarzanaVersey on April 19, 2006 7:15am PT


If people can bring out such strong reactions, it only means they are successful in what they have set out to do.


Sure he`s successful at what he set out to do...if what he set out to be was a socialist/commie anti-development rat..


No, the movie is not that old…there is a new one about to be released. I think he plays a terrorist. Everybody in the entertainment business needs publicity. He always gives interviews just before his film is to be out.


Your piece accusses him for promoting Rang de Basanti because he brought the cast of RDB along..now he`s promoting his new movie?


He may be genuine in his concern for some issues, but do not run down Patkar just to buffer him.


Patkar deserves condemnation of her own right and by her own actions..

Reading the discussion here is making me more confused , sometimes too much information is not good & at times limited information is useful -
I think people here on chowk seems good at writing & don`t seem to understand practical life & how it works .
In Urdu theres as phrase which goes like `tanqeed barayay tanqeed` which goes like criticism for criticism - no matter what happens there will be people who will `criticize` anything & everything just for the sake of criticizing - either its a fashion now or something else only they know .
My opinion is that,
kah , its the duty for anyone who is popular & if he / she is heard or considered role model in ones respected society has a moral obligation to stand up for causes - Imran Khan did it , Abrar ul Haq did it - lot of Pakistani Pop Singers , Sportsmen & others are doing it - atleast they are contributing something , anything -

An aside:

For those who believe in free markets, you have to pay heed to property rights. The dam has, is and will deprive people of property. As far as compensations are concerned, they cannot be dictated by one party (i.e. the government). Compensations have to be negotiated ex-ante and with each landholder. If many people in Gujrat are to become better off and some worse off, then transactional feasibility can result only when those who are better off can compensate those who are worse off and as a process nobody is worse off. Since no market for such transactions exist, the transaction has to be carried out through the government. That is, those who are going to be potentially better off should be taxed and these taxes should be used to compensate those whose property is to be taken away. If this cannot be done, then sorry the project is simply not feasible. It does not matter who says what. Forceful implementation by the govt. is nothing but Stalinist. Such implementation has to be opposed by all means within the present legal framework. It also does not matter if China or some other country can bring about such forceful implementation to increase growth. Indians have to focus more on creating markets.

Harimau #36 {``The answer I got in Bangkok was a surprise. I was told that if I bought the car, the salesgirl would probably spend a couple of weeks with me, and that given the option of walking the streets to make ends meet or making the sale, she would prefer the latter as it pays better. You never know until you ask! ``}

Hari,
LOL. And I spent my time hanging around Patpong for nothing. I should have headed right for the Yugo dealership!

More..

#23, #35 by ballukhan

[may be he did not associate with the Polio drop campaign and now wants to promote some public movement.......may be something about the poor villagers inspired him to speak for them...........and you cannot expect one person to speak for every cause because it is physically and intellectually impossible to devote one`s time to every other cause]

There is a vast difference between Polio drop campaigns and the NBA. The former is an endorsement where the government is a participant, therefore there is no antagonistic System to deal with. The NBA is a movement where the forces are not just the government but also big industrial houses. The issue is far too delicate, and whoever wishes to align themselves with this cause will have to not take a ‘balanced’ pov; you have to stick your neck out and say you are for this or against it completely. Aamir, by saying he is for the dam, is watering down the argument.

[Amir Khan who has atleast shown the truthfulness to say that he does not know the dertails of the issues behind the dam`s height but he is concerned about the lack of proper rehabilitation of the villagers.............]

Okay, so next time I write an emotional piece about my ‘concern’, but is a bit short on facts, I should hope you will be kind enough to support me. Or do I have to be a celebrity?

[There are a number of loaded questions thrown around within the body of this article which distracts a reader`s attention from the issues raised within the article.]

If you noticed the issues raised, then you have not been distracted.

[FV, you need to make assertions and put forth arguments without putting all those `` ? `` as if the reader knows the ``obvious`` answer to them or assumes that the author`s charges and accusations have been proven because these questions are left unanswered in the article!!]

I do not have the answers to everything, which is why all the “?” Ask Aamir to make assertions and provide arguments, too.

To get to the specific queries you pointed out…

[``Did he join any agitation to get water for those people then and in the intervening years? ``]

He did not. That is why he is now talking about the scarcity. It is a valid question.

[``Do they know about boys who are exploited by the cops? ``]

Why do you find this accusation needs to be proven? As a citizen, would you not express doubts about these matters?
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#31 by chaltahai:

[We see this in the west all the time. An actor somehow feels that he has the right to adopt a cause to rail against Bush`s or Clinton`s policies. He gets media attention, uses the celebrity, his celebrity is used by orgs that cater to his thinking to further promote and prepare entire agendas around the celebrity. It`s all good....]

One, you are talking about making common cause with a certain political ideology, which is part of the System. As I have stated earlier, the issue becomes delicate if it is driven by voluntary organisations.

Two, like celebs in the west who support anti-fur campaigns, or PETA etc, these are essentially appealing to individual choices. They’re not about policy decisions. We too have many celebs who work for these causes and that is fine.

I would like to add here that when Aamir joined, Medha Patkar made it clear that he would be ready to make sacrifices.
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#32 by IB:

[Does the case make the celebrity or does the celebrity make the case?]

Neither. The case is there, which is really a cause in this instance. The celebrity can speak up for a case, but cannot make a case. There needs to be sufficient grounds for how committed/genuine s/he is. If Sanjay Dutt speaks up against drugs, we know he is talking from a position of knowledge and experience.

[in a media age where there are so many options available - one listens to whom he could relate too - now as a Pakistani , I would listen to someone like ( hate to admit ) Abrar-ul-Haq more then lets say a politician - reason being is simple that I could relate to him]

This is not about who you or I listen to; it is about what action can be taken. Let me ask you: would you listen to Asma Jehangir
or Abrar? Would you listen to Ardeshir Cowasjee or Abrar? Celebs aur celebs mein bhi fark hota hai.

[in our society ( India / Pakistan ) we somehow are in a hibit of criticizing no matter what - atleast someone is doing something - contributing , raising a voice - let him / her to it - atleast he // she is better then us that they are doing something practical not nothing b.shi*ting in our drawing-rooms or typing it on this forum]

You are not going to see Aamir Khan in every rally/agitation. He too will be in his drawing room. May I draw your attention to the fact that some of us have indeed been in the field, worked at the ground level, and because we feel our contribution is paltry as compared to those who give so much more time and effort, we type out our concerns. It is unfortunate that these days to be considered legit you need to be a film star/socialite even to type out on fora. Tab sab shabaashi dega…
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#41 by arjun_m:

[Anand Patwardhan has been a lifelong socialist/commie anti-development rat and somehow that`s a positive thing..him and medha patkar make me want to disown my father`s tribe..]

If people can bring out such strong reactions, it only means they are successful in what they have set out to do.

[Amir Khan otoh is 100% genuine..I watched a private video of him when he visited Indian soldiers in a certain part of Kashmir..He`s the last person to need free publicity..it`s been what? a few months since his movie came out?]

No, the movie is not that old…there is a new one about to be released. I think he plays a terrorist. Everybody in the entertainment business needs publicity. He always gives interviews just before his film is to be out.

He may be genuine in his concern for some issues, but do not run down Patkar just to buffer him.
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Thank you to the few people who can see beyond the ‘negativity’

And GT, I liked the article myself. Just in case the irony escapes some, I am merely confirming what interactors here are trying to say: that self-promotion is not such a bad thing!

Re: # 39

FV:

These are people (both incestuous and non-incestuous :) ) who look upon Aamir Khan as a person worth emulating. As to the young generation..well they are our only hope as President Kalam reminds us so frequently and some of them may be enticed by the actor to the cause.

Aamir was candid enough to admit, that after the Gujarat riots, he didn`t speak up as he should have, but now for whatever motivation or reason, he has found his voice and is using it for a cause dear to him. The proof would be if he is consistent in the future and continues to speak out and support the causes he wants to. Of course, i don`t think he is looking for endorsement from netizens such as you and me :).

He could have sent a petition to the PM sure..but he chose another route which he probably thought would garner more publicity for the cause.

As to the fast track justice system, yes it is loaded in favour of celebs and foreigners, but i am sure some enterprising lawyer would file a PIL in some court to ensure that it is applicable for all or something similar.

Cheers
Jayant

On side note:-Criminal injustice System can`t be 100% perfect as it is made and practiced by imperfect humans, unless treated and prevented for the factors which lead to future injustices. Let`s Hope..................................

Dear Chief Editor
Your article is a prototypical example of a ,``Truthful writer``. You just hit the nail on the head, hit the nerve and step on the tail of the criminal injustice seen in third world countries with extreme biasedness. Wonderful..................................

These are the extract of the whole article,{{He is just too smart. He is not fighting for any cause but pitting himself in a very heroic role.}}

{{ How many poor tribals/commoners are even aware of the concept of justice, leave alone fighting for it? }}

{{Real citizen`s awareness is dying. ‘Vox pop’ is now the voice of crystal consciences.}}

You hanged the criminal injustice with your words.Bravo

Your article informed us truthfully the flaws and big black holes of the judicial system to raise awareness with clarity of your mind. Truthful writers play a big role in educating and informing commoners. This is the type of leadership that third world countries lack.

There are lots of criminal injustice, day to day stories, unfortunately only few of them come up surface, majority never do. Criminal injustice system in these countries exploits the poors with the help of corrupt police which plays a major role in coercing innocent citizens to make false confessions for the crime they never commit and meanwhile letting go of the real criminals based on their power and links...................tragic, haan.confirmed BIASEDNESS.

#39 by FarzanaVersey on April 18, 2006 9:28pm PT

Anand Patwardhan has been a lifelong socialist/commie anti-development rat and somehow that`s a positive thing..him and medha patkar make me want to disown my father`s tribe..

Amir Khan otoh is 100% genuine..I watched a private video of him when he visited Indian soldiers in a certain part of Kashmir..He`s the last person to need free publicity..it`s been what? a few months since his movie came out?

What`s so hard to understand? Any cause needs to be amde sexy otherwise people just don`t pay any attention to it. Simple as that.

Medha Patkar has been screaming herself hoarse about displaced tribals and what not for two decades now. All it has done has established her image as some of sort of goody-two-shoes at best and annoying anti-progress busybody at worst. Aru-baby got in on the bandwagon a while ago, but nobody takes her seriously anyway- they just want to see pictures of her and even that novlety has faded after she cut off all her hair.

Aamir Khan (and crew) joining the party is just what the NBA needs. In fact, strictly speaking, Aamir is not anti-dam, as the NBA is. He is just insistent that, having accepted that dams are required for progress (a premise contested nby Medha and her NBA buddies), fair recompense needs to be made to those displaced by the waterlogging of surrounding areas. Is that too much to ask?

Modi is a loser. His ``Gujarat and nothing else`` rhetoric may win him votes but he aint fooling nobody. I can`t wait to see how his stupid hunger strike ends.

Aamir Khan zindabad. Arjun_m is right, if more celebrities lent their voices to honorable causes rather than trying to keep flyovers out of their posh localities and shooting endangered species in the jungle, we would be a lot better off.

I thought most Indians would be with me on this.

#10 by jaymog:

[If through Kangaroo courts and Celebrity justice, if it does awaken social conscience of the people, then it would have served its purpose.]

I deliberately used the phrase celebrity quotes and kangaroo justice…don`t go spoiling it for me…

When you talk about awakening social conscience, who do you think these people are? The same incestuous group. Do we dignify trade union rallies and other protests by ordinary people in the same manner? I have spoken up for Arundhati Roy and her role in NBA earlier, because the commitment is different.

I don’t think this has got anything to do with Aamir Khan’s or anyone’s intellectual growth. I don’t understand how people can suddenly find a cause dear? Do note that Anand Patwardhan etc too took out a rally in Mumbai – I do not think that is a publicity stunt, for despite certain views I may have about Patwardhan, his involvement with these issues goes back in time.

[As to the whole of `RDB` team showing up..maybe it was to entice the younger generation of Indians to the cause. Atleast, he is honest about it or so it seems. It is easy to be a cynic, all of us are some more, some less.]

Do you seriously believe that enticing of the younger generation is going to be enough? What would they be enticed by – the cause or the actor? What will they do after they have been enticed? Is Aamir Khan or anyone going to put pressure on the government? Then we would like to know why this happens – only celebs who suddenly reach the scene have this kind of access to the powers-that-be? It does seem like a no-win situation and you may again accuse me of cynicism, but asking a few questions does no one any harm.

It is the courts and the government that will decide. In fact, the PM has been vested with the power this time. Would it not have been a good idea if Mr. Khan had spearheaded a petition campaign and gone straight to the PM?

[You could have also written about the son of IPS officer who was sentenced in Alwar for the rape of a german tourist. The charges, trial and conviction happening within a space of weeks. And we all complain about the extreme tardiness of Indian justice system.]

I touched upon this fast-track justice in part 2. My grouse is famous cases where celebs and foreigners are involved seem to be getting quickie justice.
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#23 by ballukhan:

Will address your other queries later but at least you ought to understand that there was no juxtaposition of the two actors. I have dissed Salman earlier…the idea of the celeb as prey has to be seen in the context it was written. Here, in a role reversal, the tribals were deified for challenging the ‘hero’.
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Is it always necessary to term me elitist? I do not live in Kemp’s Corner and I do not support Lata Mangeshkar’s move to oppose the flyover.

FV,

Very well put........hard hitting........and right where it should be.......below the belt. A suggestion: A hindi version could perhaps be sent to Navbharat Times for publication. Great write-up FV.

Re: # 34
[Me are having a scholarly discussion in Latin.]

...i wish you would learn english before slaughtering latin...;)