Modi’s Men and their Mean Machines

Ferzana
``why no one has picked on the Gujarat High Court`s orders for demolition``
the question you raised was that of legality. so its up to you to show what was illegal about guj high court decision ordering demolitions. if may be partial, but i doubt it has much leeway to order ``illegal`` demolitions..can you shed some light on why its illegal? i suspect its easier to argue that the demolition was communal or soemething (but VHP made sure to remove some temples before to counter this). in fact if the court considers aspects other than law, its stepping out of its role, and indulging in political activism.

the best way to address this would have been for dargah-lovers to get a protest movement of all parties together .. involve hindus as well, after all they were major patrons to the pir. you try your best, and if it fails, you accept defeat gracefully and go on with life. there are bigger fish to fry. it highly doubtful if the rioters were really interested in the dargah itself, or the community they claim to represent.

Indian007 #168, {``Is it the majority`s fault that the 160 million strong minority chooses to herd its female members in cattle like sheds , depriving them of education ,never letting them out of the house and making them only fit for child bearing duties ? Or that this particular minority would rather enrol its little boys in urdu medium schools madrassahs where they learn the quran by rot while the majority send their kids to secular school where they get an actual education equipping them for the realities of the modern world ? ``}

Gujju,
There is much truth in what you have stated. While I am all for the protection of the lives and property of all people - minorities, majorities, and in-between, I am also for their advancement. The mad mullahs, e.g. Imam Bukhari of the Delhi Jama Masjid and others, are probably doing more harm to Muslims than the outright murderders like Modi. The persecution of Sania Mirza for her tennis apparel is a telling indicator of their myopia and desire to hold Muslims back. Everyone knows that if Muslims become modernized, self-reliant, confident, educated, and prosperous their need and dependence on Mullahs will subside and may even vanish. Instead of questioning IM`s sincerity and loyalty, you should join the progressive ones in dismantling the cruel hold that Mullahs hold over these people.

I agree with you that wherever Muslims live, they should participate as loyal, progressive, industrious, moderate, and active citizens of their respective countries. It is rather stupid to live in India and be loyal to Pakistan just as it is silly to live in the US and pray for its downfall. I think that Muslims the world over are realizing the pernicious effects of extremism and intolerance.

Revathy Gopal : ``In a country where the majority community cannot see its way to being generous and large-hearted, instead invent ways to keep minorities cowed down and poor, one cannot even begin to speak of one nation, indivisible.``

So you realise what an absolute idiot you are ?

Is it the majority`s fault that the 160 million strong minority chooses to herd its female members in cattle like sheds , depriving them of education ,never letting them out of the house and making them only fit for child bearing duties ? Or that this particular minority would rather enrol its little boys in urdu medium schools madrassahs where they learn the quran by rot while the majority send their kids to secular school where they get an actual education equipping them for the realities of the modern world ?

And what about the other much smaller minorities ? The 20 million strong Sikhs , 25 million strong Christians and 5 million strong Jains ? What about the 1 lakh strong parsis ? Are they being `cowed down and kept poor` by the majority as well ?

If not , why not ? Perhaps because they consider themselves to be citizens of India and believe in getting an education and working hard instead of wet dreaming about the whole world some day bowing down to the might of some dude called allah and accepting allah`s chamcha muhammad as some prophet , and closer home , about kufr hindustan becoming a part of `Greater Pakistan` , and so on ?

As I said , you are an idiot. And also dishonest , biased and stupid enough to believe you are being `sophisticated` by being so. You are not `secular` , you are just a sympathiser of Islamic fundamentalism. And I expect no better from leftists like you. This is just another evidence of both a nation and global alliance of Leftist Extremists and Islamic Fascists.

And why should the majority be generous and large-hearted to this particular minority ? We all know what happens whenever and wherever suddenly this particular minority becomes a majority and the majority becomes a minority......go ask the folks living in various refugee camps in Delhi and Jammu.....

No, it wasn`t quotas I meant. There have to be other ways to ensure free enrollment of all communities within the forces or into government jobs. In an ideal situation, you would not even be asked which community you came from.Just to say one is Indian would be, should be enough. But we are far from living in an ideal state aren`t we, my brothers?
In a country where the majority community cannot see its way to being generous and large-hearted, instead invent ways to keep minorities cowed down and poor, one cannot even begin to speak of one nation, indivisible.
And Harimau, one has to grow up somewhere. Bombay was as good a place as any.

FV, with her Islamist bent, won`t post this...

BMC reminded of illegal shrines

MUMBAI: At a time when the apex court has ordered a stay on demolitions of shrines in Gujarat which encroach on public land, the Janhit Manch in Mumbai has written to the BMC commissioner informing him about the re-emergence of at least 600 illegal shrines on the city streets.

The letter comes in the wake of a recent note by civic ward officers which also said encroachments continue to mushroom due to political interference and lack of administrative support.

Three years ago, the Bombay high court had ordered the demolition of all illegal temples, masjids, crosses, Buddhist vihars and other religious shrines on the city’s roads.

In 2001, the Janhit Manch filed a PIL, pointing out that there were at least 5,000 such illegal structures on the streets of Mumbai.

Acting on a court order, the BMC then carried out a sustained campaign and demolished 1,100 such shrines between August and September 2003.

``The peaceful manner in which it was carried out was a testimony to Mumbai’s secular credentials,`` said Bhagwandas Raiyani, who filed the original PIL.

But soon the momentum wore off and the issue was forgotten. Now activists involved with the Manch say that many of the shrines, which were demolished, have made a comeback.

``The PIL has not been disposed off and a few months ago we filed a notice of motion to restart the hearing. Since the campaign, at least 600 shrines have come back and we want the BMC to demolish these as well as the balance,`` said Raiyani.

Civic sources said local ward officers could be held responsible for the re-emergence of such structures in their areas although many of them had recently informed the BMC chief that the availability of men, material and machinery was far from sufficient.
They have also cited constant pressure from politicians against demolitions in a note to the commissioner. ``If a officer does not yield to pressure from a politician, he faces harassment.

The earlier drive ordered by the court had come after two separate petitions, including Raiyani`s, was filed.

The other one was filed by activist Edwin Britto, who had approached the courts against an illegal temple and a madarasa at Khar village. ``While the BMC demolished the temple, the madrasa is now a shopping centre.

#154: FV aunty ji, I am trying to evoke the reverance from within for your lilty words on chowk, just like many of your unsuccessful self-immolating fans ala Salim_chauhan, DW and Zeena. Trust me on this, I am indeed trying very hard.

Now, having read the responses of many of the interactors here, including Gujju`s take on ``intentions and actions``, I am nowhere nearer to clarity of understanding on this Modi, his men and the 250 yr old stump in the middle of the road.

Perhaps your question,``I wish to know how a 200-year-old dargah qualifies as being ‘illegal’. After a couple of centuries it is suddenly seen as an ‘encroachment’``, requires not inputs from mere mortals like chowk folk, but actually some planning commission that seeks to demolish it for other reasons...could it be making a paved road?

I went to vadodhara in 1999, when I had first joined an Indian Bank in the US to learn about the roots of the legal entity which I signed on to join for 4 years. the bank with it`s humble beginnings in Vadodhara, now was in 12 countries and climing rapidly among the league tables in every financial services category. It brought atm`s to farmers, it employed over 15000 people and sometimes it financed schools for local workers in remote parts of Gujarat through its NGO arm. Over the course of next few years, we saw re-zonings and eminent domain coming into play as project finance activity took rapid hold of the Indian economy. Hindus were also affected by this. You see, if you have gone to rural India you know that these silly hindus will start worshipping trees, rocks..practially anything they feel that has a connection to god. And guess what, the tree came down, the rock was removed, the mandir was relocated etc etc..

a country like India is at a cross roads of destiny. It can cater to the whims of religon, forgetting spirituality and lose its rightful place in this fast moving world or it can get over stupid shit like worrying about an impediment to growth like this shrine of a saint that died 200 yrs ago and provide a thoroughfare for all the people..not just the adhrerents of this saint.

I also do not understand why the parallel between modernity and killing that you are drawing here? Could you please explain....


BTW/My 143 was more Mad magazine than the New Yorker.

As I am not a writer, i would love for someone to come up with an article on the following topic.,`` why do some people make car parts, while others can only blow them up`` Thanks in advance.

Highly Respected Dear Madam Editor-In-Chief ,

``Although he was not on duty so it cannot be said that Muslims killed a brave soldier. He was an innocent person who became a victim of mob violence.``

Interesting perspective. Was the `mob` muslim by any chance ? You know - full of ugly bearded skull capped men of all ages , who with every stab at the unfortunate Indian soldier cried `Allahu Akbar` ? `Pakistan Zindabad` , `Maaro kafeer kutte ko`, perhaps ? Maybe certain burkha wearing ladies , young and old , assisted their men in the task by throwing stones from the houses across the street , aiming for the skull of that Indian Army soldier , and egging them on , chodna mat kafeer ko ? Inshallah , must have been such a warm and fuzzy sight , good muslim women marching side by side with good muslim men in the elimination of the kafeer - who as a bonus , also turned out to be an Indian Army vermin !! (No doubt that was the gift of the good muslim brothers and sisters of Vadodara to their beloved Kashmiri freedom fighter !! Allhamdulillah !!) That should disprove the canard that the Western crusaders spread - about the lack of emancipation of women in Islam......How dare they !! Dont they know Islam is the only PERFECT religion in the world ? And every living person on this planet will eventually submit to Islam , accept Muhammad (PBUH) as their Prophet and bow to Allah the Merciful , and no power on earth can stop that !!!

``No one is rejoicing over the stabbing of the armyman.``

How do you know ? Are you in touch with his killers ? Did you participate in the killing ? Infact its probably festive time for the entire colony. Everybody is probably distributing sweets and blissfully exclaiming `Allahmdulilllah` !!! Crackers may have been burst !! Children wearing bright green colored clothed , flying cute little green colored flags , while their mothers watch admiringly !! After a great feast , they all get together and offer a namaaz , thanking allah the merciful for giving them an opportunity to help in serving the just and secular cause of the Kashmiri freedom struggle....and getting the world rid of a kafeer vermin , that too an Indian soldier , further clearing the deck for for Muhammad (PBUH) to rule the world and for India to become a part of `Greater Pakistan`


You are welcome to celebrate too. Buy beef from the neighborhood butcher shop and munch on it , imagining the beef to be parts of that dead Indian soldier`s dismembered body . Have fun !!

One realises that `action-reaction` theory is not restricted to disgusting politicians alone; everyone seems to be eager to join the bandwagon. This is the unfortunate part of contemporary democarcy in India today.

No one is rejoicing over the stabbing of the armyman, although he was not on duty so it cannot be said that Muslims killed a brave soldier. He was an innocent person who became a victim of mob violence.

Only a typically narrow and divisive mentality could produce an excerpt from a report to show only one such death.

For those who do not have the patience or the inclination...here is the rest of the SAME report. Incidentally, the headline states, ``Faces of tragedy: an Armyman trying to get daughters admitted to school; a young groom to be``

Similarly, the two Fatehpura residents, Imran Hussain Dhobi (25) and Mohammad Hayat Mansuri (22), were returning home from work when they caught police bullets in their heads near Champaner Darwaza, after they took refuge in neighbouring buildings.

?The boys were sitting down, when they stood up, the police suddenly fired and they got hit,? said Mansuri?s relative, Yasmin Sheikh.

While Imran used to work in a dry-cleaning shop owned by his family, Mansuri, a Sarsia Talav resident, was employed as a mattress-maker.

Imran had shifted to his new residence at Adania Pul after his Baranpura home was burnt during the post-Godhra riots.

Mohammed Ashfaq (23), who was injured early this morning, died at SSG Hospital later in the day. He was the youngest of three brothers and sisters, and worked as a salesman in a footwear shop in Alkapuri.

Ashfaque, the son of a rickshaw-driver, had just got engaged to be married on Sunday. Friends of this Wadi Moti Vhorwad resident say he had come out of his house to watch the stone-pelting and insist he was killed in police firing.

However, the post-mortem report said Ashfaq sustained injuries during stone pelting and died of haemorrhage. His bother Alif alleged that his body was recovered after three hours by his friends who went out in the night. ?The police attempted to hide the body after shooting him,? alleged Alif.

- - -

Re. why no one has picked on the Gujarat High Court`s orders for demolition, since when has that state`s judiciary become non-partisan? The fact is that its own citizens ask the cases to be shifted from the court there.

By the way Dear Madam Editor-In-Chief , do allow me to express my deepest and heartiest congratulations to the brave and noble muslims of Vadodara- men, women and children , entire colonies and ghettoes, for so courageously raising their voice against the demolition of the sacred 350 year old Dargah , where hindus and sikhs also offer their prayers , and safeguarding the interest of secularism in India - by stabbing to death that nasty Indian Army guy , Subedar Ramchandra Meena (35), belonging to the Patiala unit of the EME while he was on his way to his daughter`s school.

I am sure you would love to join them in the celebration !! What the brave freedom fighters of Kashmir could not do , what the kind and wonderful brothers of Pakistan Army across the border , could not do , the muslim men, women and children of Vadodara did. Together. They got rid of that vermin from the Indian Army. Stabbed him. Again and again and again. Till his intestines protruded out of his bowels. Till his eye balls were removes from its sockets. Till his skin was removed and flesh exposed. They stabbed him in the name of Allah the Merciful.

Allahy Akbar !! Allah is Great !!! Secularism is saved !!!

Shabhash O Muslim Brothers and Sisters of Vadodara , Shabhash !!

ps : I wonder if the good secular non-Modi supporting hindus joined the muslim brothers and sisters of Vadodara in the act of killing that Indian Army vermin, because as Madam Editor-In-Chief insists , the voice raised against Modi`s men and the opposition to the demolition of the Dargah was secular.

Revathy Gopal : ``Burning people alive has become a hallmark of the Hindu Right.``

Bet you feel very secular and sophisticated when you make statements like that. The Hindu Right is represented by not just the organisations like RSS , VHP and political parties like BJP, Shiv Sena and its leaders , but also those who vote for them , either directly or indirectly. At a conservative estimate , the Hindu Right is represented by atleast 350 million Indians. So basically going by your very intellectual statement , burning people alive has become a hallmark of the 350 million Indians.

I can understand , being a secular and sophisticated person , you are deeply anguished at the death of the muslim guy at the hands of those hindutwa goons , but how come you feel no pangs pf sorrow for the hindus killed by your mussalmans ?

Read this >>

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http://in.news.yahoo.com/060502/48/63y75.html

An Armyman on his way to get his children admitted to school, a brother taking the short-cut home from a shop he had newly opened, a young man about to get married, two men returning from work: the victims of yesterday�s Vadodara riots over the dargah demolition, Hindu and Muslim, were ordinary citizens not even aware of the controversy.

Consider the case of Subedar Ramchandra Meena (35), belonging to the Patiala unit of the EME. Following his recent transfer to Bhusawal, he was on training at the EME school in Vadodara until April 29. And on Monday, at around 12.45 pm, while the dargah was being demolished on the Fatehpura-Champaner road, he and his nephew Manoj Meena were on their way to the Kendriya Vidyalaya in Harni to secure admission for his three daughters when they came up against a police blockade.

�We asked around for a shortcut to Harni and entered Yakutpura. First, our motorcycle was stoned from neighbouring buildings and then about a dozen men gheraoed us. They started beating my uncle and confined me inside Minara Masjid. I was rescued by some women from the neighbourhood. When I reached my uncle he was bleeding profusely, I took him to a nearby hospital on my motorcycle,� recalled Manoj Meena.

At the Swami Premdass Hospital, doctors told Manoj that his uncle was no more. A post-mortem report confirmed that Meena had died of stab wounds in his back and stomach.

Today, EME personnel, accompanied by Meena�s wife, daughters and his brother-in-law, came to pick up his body. �We are taking the body for cremation to our native village in Bhilwada, Rajasthan,� said his brother-in-law Bhanwarlal Meena.

Like Meena, Biren Shah (23), another one stabbed to death, had taken a shortcut to his Mandvi residence via Lal Akhara, while returning from his newly opened Waghodia Road shop. �He was attacked with a chopper on his neck and shoulder. His body was mutilated and left on the street,� said his brother Devang Shah.

Biren was cremated on Monday night. Shah�s relatives were asked to give a written representation to a five-member panel from the National Human Rights Commission (NHRC) which, tomorrow, will visit the families of those killed.

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How come I see no statements from you about how stabbing people is the hallmark of the muslim people of India ?

You think Modi was behind the killing of that army man and the 23 year old kid ? Perhaps they were killed by hindutwa rascals disguised as muslims , so that they can damage the reputation of the sweet and innocent and secular mussalmans of India ? Or maybe they just stabbed themselves to death , clever hindutwa agents that they are - just like those malicious hindutwa women and children on that Godhra railway coach who mischievously burnt themseves alive and commited suicide . Dont you think ?

Ref reva315 #159

[......If all communities were fairly represented within the police force, there would be far fewer communal incidents....]

Ah yes; Quotas! The Ultimate Solution for All Problems.

Now that Arjun Singh has come up with Quotas for the Brain-Dead in IITs and IIMs, what we need is quotas for Muslims as the next step. Of course, that was never too far behind considering that Andhra had already instituted a 5% quota for Muslims (people with Alzheimer`s seem to have forgotten that under the Nizam the quota for Muslims in His Exalted Highness`s army was 100%; I suppose the justification would be that reducing the quota to 5% is actually an injustice to Muslims!) and the Supreme Court of India had asked the Government of India what its position on quotas for minorities was.

All we need is a South Indian who grew up in Bombay when the system there was based on merit now recommending quotas for all and sundry and right on cue she pops up on Chowk. But that was actually inevitable. The attitude of ``I got mine and let the devil take the hindmost`` evident in these people`s pronouncements is the same idea behind quotas.

So you blame Modi. Why don`t you blame the Gujarat High Court for ordering the demolitions in the first place?

Farzana, tough words, fighting words and a rigorous rational mind which unfortunately will not find an echo in any communal situation. Burning people alive has become a hallmark of the Hindu Right.
In a few weeks or months, we will hear public officials, even police commissioners come out with their whiny stories about being ordered to act in a particular way by the government, read Mr. Modi. There is no reason for the police to be partisan. If all communities were fairly represented within the police force, there would be far fewer communal incidents. Reform, stringent reform within the bureaucracy and the police and then perhaps the Army would not need to be called in to quell civilian riots.
Revathy Gopal.

FV`s comment on #124 by aisha_sarwari:

[I am convinced we`re at that stage in civilization where our advanced communication within (internally) replaces the old fashioned prayer.]

Uss din ka intezar karenge…

That time came and went with Al-Hallaj centuries ago. He had refused Hajj and said why would he want to visit Mecca when God was within him? As tradition goes, he had built a Kaaba around the corner from his house ...:-)

But yes, the door on enlightenment may yet become ajar.

Re: # 151

Zeena - ur rantings are too amusing for me to comment on all of them
Just one I would like to comment on, though.

> I apologize to all Muslims in general and Indian Muslims in particular for the atrosities ...
Don`t apoplogize. Do something about it. Take away at least one muslim from the free
world - onto an islamic place where you thing they will be safer. Like pakistan.
You will do a favor to one of your own species. You will do us a favour. This is a deal where
everyone wins. wotsayyou ....

May be you can start with yourself :)

But no. Like parasites, you will remain. Shameless and continue .....

Some indian communities want to move on...

http://sulekha.com/news/nhc.aspx?cid=450124

Over 800 encroachments removed from ancient Madurai city

Madurai, pti:

The demolition was carried out following a High Court order on February 3 and the demolished structures included 250 roadside temples.


The roads of this historic temple city, praised in ancient Tamil literature, have got back their original glory with civic officials pulling down more than 800 encroachments including 250 roadside temples, some of them century old.

The demolition of roadside temples was accomplished following a High Court order on February 3 last, to take effective steps to remove all encroachments on public roads.

Civic officials not only razed down temples but even roadside offices of political parties, one or two churches and a dargah.


Police had a tough time in removing the devotees who had squatted inside the temple and refused to move when the bulldozers and procline machines roared to the site.

The officials had to convince the people about the need to execute the High Court order. “We are demolishing all the places of worship, all the houses, flag posts, etc and we don’t discriminate,” the officials said.

Officials also deputed a special team of intelligence to carry out liaison work negotiating with unauthorised occupants and persuade them to vacate the building.

In the case of the temples, the idols and other articles were removed in advance by the persons concerned. While the ground work of police officials helped avert clashes in many places, in some they had to use force to remove the devotees as the talks failed.

Temples in many places had been constructed with the hidden agenda which varied. There were temples which fetched more than Rs two lakh a year to the trustees who celebrated annual festivals.

There were also temples in the bustling market area which helped the traders extend their sun shade on both sides of the temples. In some places people had extended their houses till the periphery of the temple.

However, the demolition of roadside temples and encroachments had been both appreciated and scorned.

Chockalingam, a senior politician said people understand now that public places should not be occupied. The broad roadsides would reduce the problem of parking on roadsides.

Janata Party President Subramanian Swamy said the government had definitely earned the wrath of the people, who were stranded on streets, after providing them legitimacy to live in.

K V R Subramanian, an auditor, suggested legal action be taken against corporation officials who had permitted the roadsides to be encroached.

Many people at the demolition site were sad that the places of worship had been pulled down. Those who had built a roof over their head and run small business and tea shops to eke out their living are now in the street.

All the same, they ask how did the Corporation give them power and water connection and allowed unauthorised roadside temples to come up in the first place? Some temples had been attached to the Hindu Religious and Charitable Endowment trust, and Corporation had been condemned for removing those temples, and now a legal battle is in the offing between the Corporation and the HR and CE Department.

Corporation officials, who had been aggressive in the initial stage of the ‘operation eviction’, have slowed down now after another High Court bench took a slightly different view on March 22 and said the court had not given any blanket powers to the Corporation to remove the encroachments with utter disregard to law. Justice D Murugesan told the officals to follow procedures before demolishing.

When you pray you are essentially talking to your soul. Why, then, let that private conversation become a tamasha?``

My sentiments exactly, In fact so repulsive has some people`s behavior been toward faith and its show, that I am convinced we`re at that stage in civilization where our advanced communication within (internally) replaces the old fashioned prayer.


ROFL.. nice dialogue there..

I thought only the ``Sunni Muslim women`` are not allowed inside mosques and are forced to be in that stage in civilization where they have no other choice but to communicate within.. very funny...