A Failing State in a State of Denial

HP:

and you guys still wonder how Pakistan was created? It`ll always be a hindu who will send you scurrying back into the open & welcoming arms of a mulla (fanatic or no fanatic).

In the historic & profound words of Qiad-i-azam (R.A):

Pakistan came into existence the very first day a hindu inter-acted on ANY Chowk``.

#221

This is another blatant attempt by insignia-wearers to push the topic of discussion completely off track and to attack individual bearers of bad news!

Why should somebody being a “shia” be an issue here?

Or for that matter, why is one’s place of origin (even as the attackers wistfully lust for those very same places) germane to this topic?

The hate pots continue to fill-up, to overflow and to bubble over – cheered on by all-puffed-up wanna-be cheerleaders (though perhaps lacking physical attributes of the same) in positions of authority who take dictatorial powers as God-given rights!

Is it just here or does the attitude just permeates the hearts of dil-e-Pakistani – the hearts that bleed so profusely in ignominy that it is absolutely touching!

Chowk’s choicest examples of dil, dil, Pakistan!

While those minds grope helplessly and cry in anguish and reveal them for what they truly represent!

Dim, dim Pakistan!

Re: # 214

why should afgans leave pakistan?... They are the ones who brought the territory into muslim fold by defeating hinud kafirs... today pakis invoke afgan heroes to protect themselves from kafir hinuds..... they have named missiles after the afgans....

#214 by kaalchakra
Salim, Zeena

“When the demand is raised in Pakistan for Afghanis to leave, does it include Afghanis living in Peshawar?”

Kool guy,
Though they are ethnically the same but Afghan refers to people from Afghanistan. The Pakistan side is referred as “Pathan”.

But…
You addressed your post to a forty years old lucknow born Indian shia, who also masquerades as jaipuri rajput beside having some irani, torani, sistani, turkistani, isphani, and pandaani strains.

The person’s knowledge of Pakistan is as good as BJ biharis knowledge of Pakistan with the exception that he may have visited Pakistan a couple of times like many other Indian Muslims do.

Don’t be fooled by Pinocchio.

Hooni ko unhooni karday, unhooni ko hooni,
Ek jagah jab jamma hoay, jaipuri, turkey and Lunknaviiii…

Ras, 219

“Any country that spends such a large amount on defense and so little on health, education and welfare is not planning correctly.”

Ras, I never said Pakistan plans “correctly.” I said it doesn’t know how to execute its plans.

You are talking about plan priorities, and I am talking about plan execution. But I do agree with you. Starting in 1947, Pakistan did not plan its future correctly. It is 2006 and I think Pakistan still doesn’t know its priorities.

RE:#211 by godot wrote:

``Ras, 210
Pakistan has never failed to plan (look at the latest FATA plan.) However, plan is important but is not the key, execution is.``

I disagree godot. Any country that spends such a large amount on defense

and so little on health, education and welfare is not planning correctly.


Ras

It might be of someinterest to some.....

its Titled : EXCLUSIVE...Noam Chomsky on Failed States: The Abuse of Power and the Assault on Democracy


http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/31/148254


Bottom Line....

... Its all perespective...., personal, of cloaked under some Mumbo Jumbo Organization.

and you can cook up.... Indexes....and LEAD to conclusions.... and mostly it appears to be politically motivated....

... Mushy seen as spent up Force, patience wanning thin......and you want to create Some Justifications...... , to Kick the ``.....poodle .....`` , your poodle.... YOUR way...

... By the Way... No One came one with any explantions , and I mean logical explantions of all those high sounding.... Indexes.....there only justification seemed to be , the claim that they have consulted too many publications, too many opinons......etc...etc.....
Not a single concrete quantifiable Index.... excepts claims and more claims.... plus ONE year of such research....



any way..... and in the mean while .... READ Mr Noam Chomsky .....!!

By the way ...who has seen the Future.....!! Maybe USSR Did.....!!

It might be of someinterest to some.....

its Titled : EXCLUSIVE...Noam Chomsky on Failed States: The Abuse of Power and the Assault on Democracy


http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/31/148254


Bottom Line....

... Its all perespective...., personal, of cloaked under some Mumbo Jumbo Organization.

and you can cook up.... Indexes....and LEAD to conclusions.... and mostly it appears to be politically motivated....

... Mushy seen as spent up Force, patience wanning thin......and you want to create Some Justifications...... , to Kick the ``.....poodle .....`` , your poodle.... YOUR way...

... By the Way... No One came one with any explantions , and I mean logical explantions of all those high sounding.... Indexes.....there only justification seemed to be , the claim that they have consulted too many publications, too many opinons......etc...etc.....
Not a single concrete quantifiable Index.... excepts claims and more claims.... plus ONE year of such research....



any way..... and in the mean while .... READ Mr Noam Chomsky .....!!

By the way ...who has seen the Future.....!! Maybe USSR Did.....!!

Salim bro

All this is speculation, but it may be that Afghanistan is already exacting more than its share of revenge from Pakistan. For instance, instead of Pakistan gifting Taliban to Afghanistan, Taliban may become Afghanistan`s gift to Pakistan. Instead of Pakistan controlling Afghanistan, Afghanistan may be steadily transforming the natures of both Pakistani life and Pakistani nationalism. And instead of Peshawar being an historical Afghani city held by Pakistan, it may represent the great arm of the Afghani nation tightening its future grip on Pakistan. Inch by inch, a determined Afghanistan may be pulling Pakistan`s center of spiritual gravity away from Karachi toward Peshawar....

---

geez! Excuse me, salim bro, I have been in a foul mood today, and must be seeing ghastly things at this late hour....:(

#All interactors

Before this whole population starts singing the chorus - ``I will love you forever and life is utter butter ...`` - with Kaal providing the moral guidance and Chauhan the latest recruit dancing steps of the Mahatma and preaching the path of understanding for one and for all, let me put in a couple of words to put this whole thing into perspective!

The manner in which Zeena and others attacked the author and his Afghan background was absolutely pits! It was a gutless attempt to attack the messenger for not liking his message!

The manner and the callousness with which chowk allowed that outrage to take place is beneath all contempt. They should hide in shame - chulloo bhur paani mein doob maro! Yeah! In my opinion, they should be taken to chowk bazaar and given such a whipping that they can never forget!

Not a single word of apology has been seen from any of the culprits! Instead, all we have seen are attempts to obfuscate and to distract by the hate pots of the world!

I am not falling for this charade!

I am all for understanding among people and such platitudes like ``I respect your viewpoint``! There are viewpoints and then there is the yellow stuff - sometimes brown stuff! Just serving the yellow stuff on a plate does not make it acceptable! It is utter cowardice to say that ``I respect your viewpoint to eat the yellow stuff!`` and it does not make the stench go away!

The Nazi propaganda on the Jewish people was like that. Versey`s scathing attack on Kashmiri Pandits was along the same lines. So is Zeena`s attack on Afghan refugees! Scapegaters, that`s all they are! Anybody who tries to pin ``respect`` to such viewpoints needs some serious talking to.

Crap should be called what it is! Anybody who calls it otherwise is little better than a sneaky lying weasel - and this interactor does not care if anybody ``respects`` that opinion, or not!

Screw the respect! Yeah!

#214, Kaal bhai,
I would have to defer to Zeena or Ahmadzai for their expert opinions. I think the key word is ``Afghan.`` While most of the refugees in Pakistan are Afghan Pathans as are there kin in NWFP, including Peshawar, I have sensed a general resentment by Pakistani Pathans against all Afghans. Perhaps, Zeena and Mr. Ahmadzai can explain their take on this issue. I just know of some issues such as chopping down of trees near Peshawar and some business areas where the two types of Pathans have clashed. Hekmatyar is definitely Afghani, however, being a Pashtoon, his appeal has always been strong in Pakistan`s NWFP.

I can only speak for Karachi, which had become a destination for many Afghans. I think the people of Karachi, especially Mohajirs, don`t try to distinguish between NWFP Pathans and Afghan ones. All they want is for people to stop violence, drugs, and sale of girls. Most of my relatives complain about the ``Kalashnikov culture`` introduced to Karachi by these refugees. There is no mass movement for their expulsion - in fact, people of Karachi were initially very generous in their support for the Afghans.

Salim, Zeena

Some questions about the internal politics of Pakistan. When the demand is raised in Pakistan for Afghanis to leave, does it include Afghanis living in Peshawar? Historically, Peshawar appears to have been always an Afghan city. And, Hekmatyar, is he considered a Pakistani or an Afghanistani? Is he still a persona non grata in both countries?

Zeena #198, {``Salim sahib
This shows that you are unaware of the exact facts attached to the destruction , Afghanistan.
Let me make it more clear...... ``}

Zeena,
I am in partial agreement with you. Pakistan has done quite a bit and has paid a very high price for trying to help the Afghans as they failed to sort out their differences. They failed much like we in Pakistan have always failed to sort out our differences - first with the Hindus/Sikhs, then with the Bengalis, and now with each other in what`s left of the country.
My point was that in dealing with the people of Afghanistan, Pakistani government has played a dirty game of skimming off the top, backing Pukhtoons against Tajiks, Hazaras, and Uzbeks, and not modernizing them while they sought refuge in Pakistan. This is just my point of view and I respect yours. Thanks.

on contrary - pakistan is working just as ``planned``... the plan has always been to practice exclusive ideologies - islam this, islam that ... muslim good, kafir bad .... sunni good, ahmedi bad... what you have now is what you have wished for all along...

What you need is complete turn around in the plan... secularism, pluralism, democracy should be put in ... islam, mullah, military have to be put out...

Start with the textbooks...

Ras, 210

Pakistan has never failed to plan (look at the latest FATA plan.) However, plan is important but is not the key, execution is.

States don`t plan to fail

They fail to plan...