Q Isa Daudpota May 31, 2006
#17 Posted by masadi on June 1, 2006 2:46:22 am
If by education we mean the ability to think consciously and be socially responsive then people in the developed countries, especially America are the most uneducated of the human race, considering how they are destroying the earth due to ``bureaucratized`` mass consumption and tolerating the militarized economic system of their elite. When modern education becomes a status-quo promoting, fitting-in, enhancing mass consumption tool rather than one that enhances human consciousness, not only is it worthless, it is much more ideological and dangerous than religion.
C.W. Mills who did a lot of work on higher learning institutions in the US, wrote the following, which should be a lesson to those who recommend blind imitation:
``...``...This citizen cannot now see the roots of his own biases and frustrations, nor think clearly about himself, nor for that matter about anything else. He does not see the frustration of idea, of intellect, by the present organization of society, and he is not able to meet the tasks now confronting `the (so called) intelligent citizen.`...Educational institutions have not (made him see) these things and, except in rare instances, they are not doing them. They have become mere elevators of occupational and social ascent, and, on all levels, they have become politically timid. Moreover, in the hands of `professional educators,` many schools have come to operate on an ideology of life adjustment` that encourages happy acceptance of mass ways of life rather than the struggle for individual and public transcendence.
There is not much doubt that modern regressive educators have adapted their notions of educational content and practice to the idea of the mass. They do not effectively proclaim standards of cultural level and intellectual rigor; rather they often deal in the trivia of vocational tricks and `adjustment to life`-meaning the slack life of masses. `Democratic schools` often mean the furtherance of intellectual mediocrity, vocational training, nationalistic loyalties, and little else.`` (C. Wright Mills, The Power Elite (1956)
Politics implies how you are going to live and how you are going to die. It should never be excluded from education. The purpose of education is not to fit into the corporate marketplace as a hired hand. Its purpose should be much higher than that, it should have a ``human`` purpose, and by excluding what is important in human affairs, it can never be of much benefit.
C.W. Mills who did a lot of work on higher learning institutions in the US, wrote the following, which should be a lesson to those who recommend blind imitation:
``...``...This citizen cannot now see the roots of his own biases and frustrations, nor think clearly about himself, nor for that matter about anything else. He does not see the frustration of idea, of intellect, by the present organization of society, and he is not able to meet the tasks now confronting `the (so called) intelligent citizen.`...Educational institutions have not (made him see) these things and, except in rare instances, they are not doing them. They have become mere elevators of occupational and social ascent, and, on all levels, they have become politically timid. Moreover, in the hands of `professional educators,` many schools have come to operate on an ideology of life adjustment` that encourages happy acceptance of mass ways of life rather than the struggle for individual and public transcendence.
There is not much doubt that modern regressive educators have adapted their notions of educational content and practice to the idea of the mass. They do not effectively proclaim standards of cultural level and intellectual rigor; rather they often deal in the trivia of vocational tricks and `adjustment to life`-meaning the slack life of masses. `Democratic schools` often mean the furtherance of intellectual mediocrity, vocational training, nationalistic loyalties, and little else.`` (C. Wright Mills, The Power Elite (1956)
Politics implies how you are going to live and how you are going to die. It should never be excluded from education. The purpose of education is not to fit into the corporate marketplace as a hired hand. Its purpose should be much higher than that, it should have a ``human`` purpose, and by excluding what is important in human affairs, it can never be of much benefit.
#16 Posted by sanjay on June 1, 2006 12:34:26 am
The Education Policy of any country in todays world must :-
1. Develop an spirit of competition.
2. Develop individuals in such a way that they can look at the world around them in
an analytical way.
3. The individual must be told about overall world view and the real position of the
country/society in the world.
4. Real History of the country`s people.
5. Overall it should free the mind and soul for independent and objective thinking and
innovation.
Unnecessary jingoism, nationalism, emotionalism, Religiousty etc. will all put brakes on the independent thinking and should be avoided in the education policy atleast.
1. Develop an spirit of competition.
2. Develop individuals in such a way that they can look at the world around them in
an analytical way.
3. The individual must be told about overall world view and the real position of the
country/society in the world.
4. Real History of the country`s people.
5. Overall it should free the mind and soul for independent and objective thinking and
innovation.
Unnecessary jingoism, nationalism, emotionalism, Religiousty etc. will all put brakes on the independent thinking and should be avoided in the education policy atleast.
#15 Posted by aslam644 on June 1, 2006 12:16:58 am
#9 by ajeet on May 31, 2006 2:32pm PT
it is from shakepeare`s work but now days it is used in far right anti-immigration party BNP`s leaflets.
it is from shakepeare`s work but now days it is used in far right anti-immigration party BNP`s leaflets.
#14 Posted by arstoo on May 31, 2006 10:58:36 pm
Ref#5 [Religion should be taught at the university level by the teachers who have a broad-based education and are well grounded in philosophy (not metaphysics only) and science. And religion should be just another field of knowledge and not the predominant field. ]
Dear Freethinker,
You are anything but free thinker. Why do you keep dragging relegion into the uni? Why the relegion should be taught at the unis at all.
My dear sir I pity your way of thinking.
Ghalib said
Jab ki tujh bin nahi koi mojood
phir ye hangama char-su kaya hai
Dear Freethinker,
You are anything but free thinker. Why do you keep dragging relegion into the uni? Why the relegion should be taught at the unis at all.
My dear sir I pity your way of thinking.
Ghalib said
Jab ki tujh bin nahi koi mojood
phir ye hangama char-su kaya hai
#13 Posted by pseudointellect on May 31, 2006 5:16:50 pm
``Apart from good vocational education there are a range of other innovative educational opportunities that ought to be available, and a few such as the Allama Iqbal Open University and the Virtual University could pay major dividends if the quality of these and other sources, as well as the universities, is kept high and under check.``
Both AIOU and VU are following 70`s broadcasting techniques and totally lacking effectiveness or dynamism in their programs.Wakeup dudes,it`s 21st century.
Allowing myself the freedom of borrowing comedian Omar Sharif`s words to cynically portray the distance education ``Nazrin ye tractor hai,ess ke chaar pahiyyay hotay hain.Dau aagay hotay hain aur dau peechhe hotay hain``.
I once accidentally switched on VU channel.A pathetic looking ``bade mian`` with horrible accent was occupying the screen and talking to some imaginary audience.At first i expected that he should be discussing some grand unification theories or talking of bosons,mesons or dark matter etc. but to my utter surprise he started shedding light on highly ``technical`` subject of C++ programming.Simply horrible and a wastage of a highly effective medium and channel.
IIT Roorkee and Madurai Kamraj university have produced much better programs using single camera and much smaller budgets.
Both the students and faculty members are to be blamed for degrading standards at our campuses.Students are non-serious and totally lacking the intellectual qualities,rigour,passion and interest required for higher learning.Faculty members have other side businesses and consultancies to run besides delivering lectures.This is the reason behind the stagnant state of research at the universities.The world finishes for us after two or three technologies or subjects.Any mediocre European or American university offers much bigger range of subjects than whole of our universities combined.
Honestly speaking Higher education has just become a buzz word of our media and education scene with no one exactly knowing what it actually means or how to manage the humongous task and catch the bull by its horns.Coupled with that is the typical leg pulling and back stabbing institutional politics of the learned, portraying own mice as elephants and calling others achievments mere paper pushing or peanuts.
Both AIOU and VU are following 70`s broadcasting techniques and totally lacking effectiveness or dynamism in their programs.Wakeup dudes,it`s 21st century.
Allowing myself the freedom of borrowing comedian Omar Sharif`s words to cynically portray the distance education ``Nazrin ye tractor hai,ess ke chaar pahiyyay hotay hain.Dau aagay hotay hain aur dau peechhe hotay hain``.
I once accidentally switched on VU channel.A pathetic looking ``bade mian`` with horrible accent was occupying the screen and talking to some imaginary audience.At first i expected that he should be discussing some grand unification theories or talking of bosons,mesons or dark matter etc. but to my utter surprise he started shedding light on highly ``technical`` subject of C++ programming.Simply horrible and a wastage of a highly effective medium and channel.
IIT Roorkee and Madurai Kamraj university have produced much better programs using single camera and much smaller budgets.
Both the students and faculty members are to be blamed for degrading standards at our campuses.Students are non-serious and totally lacking the intellectual qualities,rigour,passion and interest required for higher learning.Faculty members have other side businesses and consultancies to run besides delivering lectures.This is the reason behind the stagnant state of research at the universities.The world finishes for us after two or three technologies or subjects.Any mediocre European or American university offers much bigger range of subjects than whole of our universities combined.
Honestly speaking Higher education has just become a buzz word of our media and education scene with no one exactly knowing what it actually means or how to manage the humongous task and catch the bull by its horns.Coupled with that is the typical leg pulling and back stabbing institutional politics of the learned, portraying own mice as elephants and calling others achievments mere paper pushing or peanuts.
#12 Posted by Netizen on May 31, 2006 4:06:30 pm
I have a suggestion:
bury/cremate all the religious books so that for some generations human beings would live without thinking about god but about the miseries surrounding them.
after that no god will be required.
bury/cremate all the religious books so that for some generations human beings would live without thinking about god but about the miseries surrounding them.
after that no god will be required.
#11 Posted by khurram on May 31, 2006 3:32:14 pm
Why even have an education policy? Let the market decide!
#10 Posted by bharath on May 31, 2006 2:54:25 pm
{{{Central to the reform of the education policy should be removal of the two subjects – Pakistan studies and Islamic studies -- from the university}}}
Dear author,
The purpose of my comments is not to belittle your country or you. Mr.Feroze Khan has some valid points-you are making some dramatic and unrealistically sweeping proposals .....like the statement above.
Before we contemplate climbing Mt.Everest we should contemplate climbing the nearby mole hills.
Mole Hills:
How about repealing the Hudood ordinances and the dicriminatory laws against Ahmadiyyas?
regards,
p.s
Many of your comments about the need to develop critical thinking skills etc apply to the Indian education system also. Too much is based on rote memorization.
But we don`t have Indian ideology studies, our school text books are bland on partition. ``Muslim league under the leadership of MAJ demanded partition, and muslim majority provinces were constituted to be Pakistan`` ...that`s about it.
Dear author,
The purpose of my comments is not to belittle your country or you. Mr.Feroze Khan has some valid points-you are making some dramatic and unrealistically sweeping proposals .....like the statement above.
Before we contemplate climbing Mt.Everest we should contemplate climbing the nearby mole hills.
Mole Hills:
How about repealing the Hudood ordinances and the dicriminatory laws against Ahmadiyyas?
regards,
p.s
Many of your comments about the need to develop critical thinking skills etc apply to the Indian education system also. Too much is based on rote memorization.
But we don`t have Indian ideology studies, our school text books are bland on partition. ``Muslim league under the leadership of MAJ demanded partition, and muslim majority provinces were constituted to be Pakistan`` ...that`s about it.
#9 Posted by Ajeet on May 31, 2006 2:32:49 pm
Re: # 6
What you have quoted are, I believe, lines from Richard the second a play by William Shakespeare. What is so British Jingoism about it. All countries have in their literature a praise of the country.
What you have quoted are, I believe, lines from Richard the second a play by William Shakespeare. What is so British Jingoism about it. All countries have in their literature a praise of the country.
#8 Posted by jang on May 31, 2006 1:42:30 pm
#2 by Mantolives
a few points..indian school-books dont ascribe ``religion`` as a reason for pakistan..they are bland and generally dont talk much about it at all. there is no indianiyat study course year after year. so no same-same comparison. indian schooled kids are ignorant of reason for pakistan since the school-books dont talk about it year after year. but then, most school kids are also ignorant of all kinds of history like e.g. chinese or russian. bottomline, focus on the issue, the answers are within your borders..stop looking for a blame across the border as you seem to be doing.
a few points..indian school-books dont ascribe ``religion`` as a reason for pakistan..they are bland and generally dont talk much about it at all. there is no indianiyat study course year after year. so no same-same comparison. indian schooled kids are ignorant of reason for pakistan since the school-books dont talk about it year after year. but then, most school kids are also ignorant of all kinds of history like e.g. chinese or russian. bottomline, focus on the issue, the answers are within your borders..stop looking for a blame across the border as you seem to be doing.
#7 Posted by nasah on May 31, 2006 1:02:18 pm
``1. To inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage.
2. To equip the individuals with the latest knowledge and technology.
3. To provide sufficient base of scientific knowledge to every student and to enable him to contribute in nation building efforts.
4. To promote intellectual faculties and develop capabilities of individuals so that they are able to play their role effectively in the society.
5. To produce highly educated and technically skilled manpower in sufficient number as required by the society.
6. To increase access to higher education by providing places and to advance learning and generate knowledge.``(author)
what crazy pathological obsession with Islam the equally crazy Pakistani ``educationists`` have -- they cannot write even one word on general education without bringing Islam into it.
For them there is nothing like a secular and scientific education -- everything is Islam and protecting Islam and protecting Islamic ideology and preserving the moral values -- as if somebody is always stealing their precious Islamic ideology from them -- and removing the preservative from the can of Islamic moral values --
the world in intellectual Pakistan begins with Islam and ends with Islam -- there is physics of Islam, chemistry of Islam, botany of Islam, zoology of Islam -- anthropology of Islam, paleontology of Islam -- Gynecology of Islam, Gastroenterology of Islam, Cardiology of Islam, Cosmology of Islam, Astronomy of Islam, astrology of Islam...
.....Islam like God is in everything.......
it doesn`t occur to their moronic minds that they have been doing the same ‘protectin’ thing and ‘preservin’ things -- round and round in circles -- that is -- ``to inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage`` -- for the past 60 goddam years with just the opposite results -- getting in return -- a rotting stinking secular scientific education -- that is drowning in the sea of illiterate Madrassas ……
but it is still not enough....Mr. Pota still has to do his protecting of Islam...before he will reform the unreformable….
This article could have been a good critique of the dismal and pathetic condition of Pakistani educational systems with 65% illiteracy -- but no -- it has to start with number ONE priority – `` To inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage.``
……and THEN come the secondary high faluting number 2,3,4,5,6. --
realizing little that the biggest stumbling block standing against the realization of numbers 2 to 6 is the goddam NUMBER ONE.........
2. To equip the individuals with the latest knowledge and technology.
3. To provide sufficient base of scientific knowledge to every student and to enable him to contribute in nation building efforts.
4. To promote intellectual faculties and develop capabilities of individuals so that they are able to play their role effectively in the society.
5. To produce highly educated and technically skilled manpower in sufficient number as required by the society.
6. To increase access to higher education by providing places and to advance learning and generate knowledge.``(author)
what crazy pathological obsession with Islam the equally crazy Pakistani ``educationists`` have -- they cannot write even one word on general education without bringing Islam into it.
For them there is nothing like a secular and scientific education -- everything is Islam and protecting Islam and protecting Islamic ideology and preserving the moral values -- as if somebody is always stealing their precious Islamic ideology from them -- and removing the preservative from the can of Islamic moral values --
the world in intellectual Pakistan begins with Islam and ends with Islam -- there is physics of Islam, chemistry of Islam, botany of Islam, zoology of Islam -- anthropology of Islam, paleontology of Islam -- Gynecology of Islam, Gastroenterology of Islam, Cardiology of Islam, Cosmology of Islam, Astronomy of Islam, astrology of Islam...
.....Islam like God is in everything.......
it doesn`t occur to their moronic minds that they have been doing the same ‘protectin’ thing and ‘preservin’ things -- round and round in circles -- that is -- ``to inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage`` -- for the past 60 goddam years with just the opposite results -- getting in return -- a rotting stinking secular scientific education -- that is drowning in the sea of illiterate Madrassas ……
but it is still not enough....Mr. Pota still has to do his protecting of Islam...before he will reform the unreformable….
This article could have been a good critique of the dismal and pathetic condition of Pakistani educational systems with 65% illiteracy -- but no -- it has to start with number ONE priority – `` To inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage.``
……and THEN come the secondary high faluting number 2,3,4,5,6. --
realizing little that the biggest stumbling block standing against the realization of numbers 2 to 6 is the goddam NUMBER ONE.........
#6 Posted by aslam644 on May 31, 2006 11:34:10 am
#3 conti`d
british jingoism the following is from british A level tex book.
``This royal throne of kings, this sceptre`d isle, This earth of majesty, This other Eden, demi-paradise, This fortress built by Nature for herself Against infection and the hand of war,This precious stone set in the silver sea, This blessed plot, this earth, this realm, this England``
british jingoism the following is from british A level tex book.
``This royal throne of kings, this sceptre`d isle, This earth of majesty, This other Eden, demi-paradise, This fortress built by Nature for herself Against infection and the hand of war,This precious stone set in the silver sea, This blessed plot, this earth, this realm, this England``
#5 Posted by freethinker on May 31, 2006 11:02:14 am
Daudpota`s article is important for its critique of the education policy in Pakistan. The prime objective of this policy should not be ``to inculcate Islamic ideology, moral values and preservation of our religious and cultural heritage.`` Education of religion and religious ideologies should belong ``comparative reigious studies,`` and philosophy. Enforcement of Islamic ideology must not be the objective of the education policy. Inculcation of any kind is not education; it is brainwashing.
One of the reasons why Pakistan has failed to advance in education and research is the undue emphasis on religion and its imposition in every walk of life. Religion should be taught at the university level by the teachers who have a broad-based education and are well grounded in philosophy (not metaphysics only) and science. And religion should be just another field of knowledge and not the predominant field. Education needs to be liberated from the clutches of orthodox religion.
Instruction of religion should not be left to the madrassahs and the mosques. The government should develop a policy to ensure that the Imams at the Jamiah Masjids are the university graduates. Those who do not have a college degree should not be allowed to deliver religious lectures in Jamiah Masjids.
The universities should be completely free (without coercion from the government) in developing their educational plans, the outlines of the various courses for various degrees, and particularly the areas of research in liberal arts, science, and technology. Islamization and Quranization of science should not play any role in education by policy.
The author has emphasized various areas of education but failed to mention philosophy explicitly. It should be taught freely without tethering it to Islamic Philosophy. The western philosphy should form a critical part of education in philosophy. A course on philosophy of science should formally be included in science curricula.
I congratulate Mr. Daudpota for writing a timely and thought provoking article. Similar critical articles should be published in the Pakistani newsmedia.
Mohammad Gill
One of the reasons why Pakistan has failed to advance in education and research is the undue emphasis on religion and its imposition in every walk of life. Religion should be taught at the university level by the teachers who have a broad-based education and are well grounded in philosophy (not metaphysics only) and science. And religion should be just another field of knowledge and not the predominant field. Education needs to be liberated from the clutches of orthodox religion.
Instruction of religion should not be left to the madrassahs and the mosques. The government should develop a policy to ensure that the Imams at the Jamiah Masjids are the university graduates. Those who do not have a college degree should not be allowed to deliver religious lectures in Jamiah Masjids.
The universities should be completely free (without coercion from the government) in developing their educational plans, the outlines of the various courses for various degrees, and particularly the areas of research in liberal arts, science, and technology. Islamization and Quranization of science should not play any role in education by policy.
The author has emphasized various areas of education but failed to mention philosophy explicitly. It should be taught freely without tethering it to Islamic Philosophy. The western philosphy should form a critical part of education in philosophy. A course on philosophy of science should formally be included in science curricula.
I congratulate Mr. Daudpota for writing a timely and thought provoking article. Similar critical articles should be published in the Pakistani newsmedia.
Mohammad Gill
#4 Posted by daudpota on May 31, 2006 10:51:29 am
Re: # 1 The reason you write suggests that you have not lost all hope. There is much wrong with our country but we are far from hopeless. If sufficient number of people can be galvanized into action, things would change, and quite fast! Money is important but there are more important things that can make a big difference and not cost anything. You never know what positive surprises await us. You can be one of them ;-)
#3 Posted by aslam644 on May 31, 2006 10:26:56 am
the sins of pakistani state are many chief among them is the sorry state of education, as i have said many times on chowk before the first school i went to was an open air, i sat on floor. at age 10 i came to uk what a change i couldn`t believe my luck, in the morning we were given free bottle of milk and free meals for the low incomes, twice a year free trips around uk to places of geographical and historical interest.
BTW even here they had jingoism more later
BTW even here they had jingoism more later
#2 Posted by MantoLives on May 31, 2006 9:30:01 am
Excellent article and recommendations.
There is often a confusion when our friends from across the border read these articles. In actual reality, Pakistan Studies mirrors completely and totally Indian nationalist mythology... both ascribe an ideological and religious motive to creation of Pakistani nation state ... whereas bonafide historical works... especially those by the Cambridge School of Historians and those by lawyers like H M Seervai and SK Majumdar show very clearly that it was merely an issue of a breakdown of constitutional negotiations...
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