Ayaan Ali Hirsi and the Big Bad Wolf

#107 by ballukhan

What that verse means is spanking their bottoms is ok! But I`m sure masadi has a better interpretation ...

#97 krishna: Congratulations. With your weasly defence of the glorious Modi the Muslim Killer (``Modi would be a criminal in my eyes, if he is found guilty in a court of law. ``), you have just become another specimen for me to refer to when some Indian comes to chowk talking about how hindus dont make heros out of criminals.

Now run off to your cage. I dont discuss things with lab specimen.

zeemax #113 greetings to this board. you claim that 9/11 did not have ben laden behind it. krishna (see #114 below) claims that gujerat murders did not have modi behind it. Why do some people shut off their common sense and start defending rogues and troublemakers just because they happen to belong to their own community?

Food for thought, no??

Two creative geniuses ...

#115 by tahmed32

Food for thought, no??

Actually no. Modi`s involvement is a matter of some official record and therefore the commission, whil Bin Ladin`s involvement is because Bush says so and Tahmed32 and his neighbour says so .... but this contention has been soundly defeated on the other board, no? Besides, this will be digressing from the subject of Ms. Ali and her likes, indeed her mentors, as seen in the pic below!

Bina Shah: You pick on Hirsi lying to get a visa, but ignore the related and much, much more serious crime of the brutal murder of Theo Van Gogh for daring to exercise his right to speak his mind. This is just another example of how many people shut off their common sense just because something relates to their own community.

See #114 and #115 below and you may wish to reflect upon just how easy it is for some people to become biased in favor of their ``own`` communities.

Food for thought for you too, no?? :-)

zeemax: You didnt chew your food for thought!! You spat it right out back out!! very bad!! go back and think some more. :-)

Re: # 116
Zeemax, Padma Lakshmi is supposed to be a good cook. Food for the stomach, no?

#116 by zeemax

[Two creative geniuses ... ]

So which one is Two-Lee and which one is T₃₂?

#121 by bjk

Well actually, the one on the right has a striking resemblance with hamidm ....

#83 by Urstruly on July 2, 2006 4:50pm PT



As the freedom struggle in Muslim lands will intensify the sore losers in Western societies


They could put a special tax on muslims..a ``support the war against freedom struggles in muslim world`` tax..the bullets to shoot the ``freedom fighters`` don`t make themselves..

of course, that would be in addition to the taxes you already pay...

maulana urstruly: the only thing that surprises me about your post is that you haven`t included the jewish conspiracy angle into it...losing touch? too much goat milk last night?

#120 by swarrier

Yep ... that`s what inspires the great man to inspire poor somali desperate housewives looking for asylums ...

Re: # 101

Ballukhan sahib

English translation of Ayath 4:34 posted by you seems to have been taken from Yusuf Ali who happens to be more of a moderate when compared to Mawdudi`s interpertations.

Quranic verses have been subject of discussion and controversies for centuries, as a matter of fact the first controversy regarding inclusion and exclusion of Quranic ayaath and their mode of delivery rose in the time of Hazrat Abu Bakr`s Khilafat. Even then, immediately after the Prophets death, there were problems within the followers when Qureish tribal chiefs asserted their authority over Quranic injunctions and interpertations.

Enclosed is a translation of 4:34 provided by Dr Shabbir Ahmed:

4:34 Men are the protectors and maintainers of women. They shall take full care of women with what they spend of their wealth. Allah has made men to excel in some areas and women to excel in some areas. Men must see to it that women are provided for, and that they are able to stand on their feet in the society. So, righteous women are obedient to Allah’s Ordinances and guard their moral values even in privacy, the Values that Allah Commands to be guarded. If you experience rebellion from women, and they stand up against you, apprise them of possible consequences. Next, leave them in their resting places apart from you. And keep admonishing them with examples that they stop rebelling. If they pay heed to you, seek not a way against them. Allah is Most High, Great.

As you can see from the above post, there is a stark difference in how Quranic ayath can be translated. Where others choose the word `beat` to describe `Dharb` Arabic word used in Quran, Dr Shabbir translates it as `give example`, linguistically speaking both can be correct, it eventually comes down to the translator and their vision.

Having said that, try reading the Holy Bible or Talmud and then judge Islam based on comparative studies, you will find Islam far more palatable and civilized. I hope that satisfies your query.

#125 by rf786

And Pickthall translates it as ``and scourge them`` in the same verse ...

anil mian,

you ask ``Why can Musharaff not do it through an ordinace he has done many things through the ordinance including coming to the power. If he serious, he should just do it... let those who oppose come out and let the world see them.``

....... but then you go on to answer your question yourself in the next post ........

.................. you are absolutely right - the spectrum of opinions amongst the believers is very very narrow and when it comes to questioning some of the fundamental beliefs of their faith there is very little daylight between peaceful muslims like tahmed and flaming jihadis like urstruly ........... sitting safely half way around the world, you could coax tahmed to admit that the koran and the sharia should not be dumped as the source of law making, but move him back to pakistan and the best you could hope for is some mealy mouthed support for `ijtehad` to come up with a more modern interpretation of wat to do with women who have sex outside of marriage .......... at the end of the day, there will be no difference between him and urstruly and the best the poor women can hope for is a `light` beating instead of a full-fledged public flogging ..........

.......... so the reason musharraf cannot disband the cii, or throw out the hadood ordinance, or stop institutionalized discrimination against ahmedis and women and pigs, is because he cannot find more than fifty people in all of pakistan who will publically support him because of .............. islam is a totalitarian ideology which does not tolerate dissent and which has a complete and suffocating grip on the psyche of its followers unlike any other that exists today ......... the majority of muslims fervently believe in the notion that islam is a `complete way of life` and are not about to change in the near future ....... as a matter of fact, we will see further regression before we see any improvement ............. that is why, like fascism and communism, islam must be totally defeated, disgraced and discredited in the eyes of its follwers before they accept change and move past the seventh century .............. right now they are all still hoping for a taliban victory, a resurgence of islam, and a return to the glorious days of the abominable four .............

hamidm #127 ``you could coax tahmed to admit that the koran and the sharia should not be dumped as the source of law making, but move him back to pakistan and the best you could hope for is some mealy mouthed support for `ijtehad` to come up with a more modern interpretation of wat to do with women who have sex outside of marriage``

I am getting a little tired of your deliberate mis-speak (to put it gently): You know quite well that I write what I stand for, not because of anything you ``coaxed`` out of me.

When the time came for my father to die a few years ago, he told me that he did not want a professional priest to lead the funeral prayers. And I made sure that was the case, and per his wishes we had a non-maulvi lead the prayers. And this was in Pakistan, not the US!!

You on the other hand, sitting in the US, couldnt convince your wife to have your children read the Quran on their own, and allowed a maulvi come to your house to teach them. And you pretend I am some kind of a wishy-washy ``apologist`` and that you could ``coax`` me into changing my views!! When I say that the concept of an Islamic state is a violation of Islam, I say that out of conviction. Not because your highness on chowk ``coaxed`` me into thinking this!!

You and Urstruly are two sides of the same coin - making up your own convenient stories and claims without any basis on reality.