Remembering a great Pakistani: Sir Zafrullah Khan

Harish,

If Mountbatten`s opinions/writings/memoirs/correspondence cant be accepted then why shud we accept that of Wavell, who was a proven cohoot of Muslim League and Jinnah?

Wavell was in fact sacked unceremoniously few months b4 the expiry of his tenure. Tr of Power didn`t give the details for his ouster.

You can have ur own guess why a person is sacked from his office. Derilection of duty OR moral turpitude OR biasedness OR any proven record of malfeasance. What else cud be the reason?

Then u can judge whether we can take the accounts, opinions of this delinquent Wavell.

Re: # 505

My Friend,

>>>>>1. Nope. They are not. And sadly you are insisting on something that is contrary to logic.<<<<<

They are from the Memoirs of Suhrawardy. I swear on my Mother ( I am sorry to say as a last word). I am not a liar. It`s not in my blood.

>>>>>2. Nothing has been added to ``Freedom at Midnight`` since its original edition. If you bought it in 2004... it is a reprint. All books are reprinted... but ofcourse to someone as illogical as you, such simple truths don`t matter to you. <<<<<

You mean Jinnah and Muslim League were absolved.........Why invent History?.....pervert! For u truths mean inverting and inventing facts???????????

>>>>>>>>3. Warped logic and completely irrelevant to our discussion.<<<<<

Pl read Tarka Sastra...the ancient book of Logic, if u cant understand what is modern logic. Pl start from the beginning of Logic. For u logic is defying fatcs and truth??? Ha Ha.........

>>>>4. If only claims were actionable without evidence. Yes a few like you have... Stamping me a ``liar`` may give you or others like you some satisfaction but the truth that who ever has interacted with me knows full well that my facts and sources are true to the bone. Unlike you I don`t reaffirmation from liars of my truth. God and my conscience are enough for me. <<<<<

Need no comment.....You are a stamped liar. Ha Ha.......

>>>>Here you are caught red handed trying to pass off something you picked up from some website (inconclusive as it is) as Suhrawardy`s memoirs. <<<<<

I cant reproduce the whole book for you. You can read it. It was published by the Dhaka University. For that matter I cant produce all the books I quote from........only relevant portions matter......

Hope u best of luck and we can start on a new board.......BTW, I conrgatulate u on getting 10K hits plus 500+ posts. You manage this by diverting the topic on Gandhi and Jinnah, always...........not on the topic u write. Coz, u cant stand the heat of ur compatriots on Qadianis........Good Luck.


Best of Luck.

Dear Harish mian

``Prove it``

Pick up the book. Check the source. There was an earlier volume that was copy of the detailed interivew ... which then became the basis for the book- and the authors acknowledge this in their foreword. Insinuating nonsense about my track record or abusing me is not going to change the facts.

``Wolpert``...

And just because he wrote a book on Jinnah as well, we ought to accept his point of view. Still even if we do, does it absolve the Congress goondas of their responsibility.

Now yet another opportunity for you to learn something of the English Language:

Let us consider Lord Wavell`s statement taken from Transfer of Power Papers:

I`ve found no evidence of muslim league involvement in calcutta killings and appreciably larger number of Muslims died than Hindus

Had this been ``because`` it would be supporting evidence. Instead to a normal reasonable person, this statement means that there was no evidence proving Muslim League`s link to the Calcutta Killings And an appreciably larger number of Muslims died.... had this ``And`` been ``Because`` you would have had a point... But as things stand you don`t have a point.

And before you go around thinking you are some sort of judge ... please tell us if you`ve decided to fess up on the tailor issue yet? And then you claim you are a champion at winning arguments.

#500 by Mantolives

Collins and Lapierre`s book was entirely based on Mountbatten`s views...

Prove it. Just because you say it doesn`t mean it is true. And we all know your track record.

Jinnah of Pakistan is by Stanley Wolpert- an American, .....

Wolpert in his book Gandhi`s Passion says it was Muslim mobs that started the cycle of violence in Calcutta on August 16th.

I`ve found no evidence of muslim league involvement in calcutta killings and appreciably larger number of Muslims died than Hindus

So how is the fact that more Muslims died evidence of the ML`s innocence?

Tomes have been written about how the ML`s provocative language and Jinnah`s aggressive overtures could lead to violence. Almost every newspaper foresaw what was going to happen. Suhrawardy, Jinnah`s blue-eyed boy, declared a holiday to the Police despite the tense atmosphere on August 16 and Jinnah did squat about that. The man himself was sleeping on the floors and didn`t speak a word to his constituency about stopping the violence until after 5 days when the violence had died down.

And yet Yasser thinks Jinnah was innocent...sure...

Dear VRV,

1. Nope. They are not. And sadly you are insisting on something that is contrary to logic.

2. Nothing has been added to ``Freedom at Midnight`` since its original edition. If you bought it in 2004... it is a reprint. All books are reprinted... but ofcourse to someone as illogical as you, such simple truths don`t matter to you.

3. Warped logic and completely irrelevant to our discussion.

4. If only claims were actionable without evidence. Yes a few like you have... Stamping me a ``liar`` may give you or others like you some satisfaction but the truth that who ever has interacted with me knows full well that my facts and sources are true to the bone. Unlike you I don`t reaffirmation from liars of my truth. God and my conscience are enough for me.

Here you are caught red handed trying to pass off something you picked up from some website (inconclusive as it is) as Suhrawardy`s memoirs.


-YLH

Re: # 503

Manto,

1. You are to free to have ur delusions. Those words are from memoirs of Suhrawardy. I am not a liar like you to tell lies. Not quoting page numbers doesn`t take away the truth.

I need not prove u anything nor I am interested to prove you anything. I am writing for the people who see merits or demirts in our arguments/posts. As I said, u are free to ur delusions.

2. I had a copy of Freedom of Midnight which I bought in 2004.

3. Poor comprehension makes things difficult for you. Role play is what we do in our lives. You seem to play the role of a lawyer even while discussing history??????? Every profession is noble but we do not mix our role plays.

4. Whoever interacted with you stamped you as Liar on your forehead. What else proof does one need to know who is lying who`s not?

Dear VRV,

1. We`ve already conclusively proved that you did not quote any memoir. You claimed you did, but you actually didn`t. Tell me what first memoirs are in third person. You didn`t even quote any page numbers... and besides the ``quote`` itself doesn`t prove anything.

2. I am merely suggesting that Lapierre and Collin`s book is not sourced. You may buy a copy of it and see for yourself. Besides the book came out in 1976. Transfer of Power Papers were released in the 1980s... besides... I just quoted some 15 odd authors who wrote on Jinnah and praised him as great man... and none of them were Pakistanis. So it shows that Collin`s complaint that Jinnah`s high achievements have been not been recorded has been rectified.

3. Just because you can`t argue on facts, doesn`t mean you take potshots at my profession.

4. Lets leave this discussion of whose life is worth what to god. So far in my view you are the only ``soulless liar`` here.

Manto,

Pl read as:

1. Liars see liars everywhere! The words are indeed from Memoirs of Suhrawardy.

2. You belittle the research and book of Collins and Lapierre? You are a pseudo-historain.

3. We do role play in our lives. Father to children, Master to subordinates, husband to wife, Lawyer to a client etc.... Perhaps you live, eat and sleep with your lawyer`s costumes.

4. You live life that`s not worth a dime as a human being. A soulless human being, a congetial liar.

What else can I say abt you??????

Manto,

1. Liars see liars elsewhere! The words are indeed from Memoirs of Suhrawardy.

2. You belittle the research and book of Collins and Lapierre? You are a pseudo-historain.

3. We do role play in our lives. Father to children, Master to subordinates, husband to wife, Lawyer to a client etc.... Perhaps you live, eat and sleep with your lawyer`s costumes.

4. You live life that`s not worth a dime as a human being. A soulless human being, a congetial liar.

What else can I say abt you??????

Dear VRV,

No point leaning on other people`s shoulders...

Lets recall the facts shall we...

1. You did NOT produce any words from Suhrawardy`s Memoirs. Lying will not change this fact. Your lie was caught when I showed you that the memoir that you were quoting amazingly was not in first person... furthermore, even this quote did not show anything that you wanted to prove.

2. Collins and Lapierre`s book was entirely based on Mountbatten`s views... The book as is came out before the transfer of power papers were made public in the 1980s. Secondly they were right that history written by non-Pakistanis hadn`t done justice to Jinnah, but since 1976, much has been rectified...

Jinnah of Pakistan is by Stanley Wolpert- an American, Secular and Nationalist Jinnah is by Ajeet Javed an Indian, Best Ambassador of Hindu Muslim Unity is by Ian Wells an Australian, Partition of India legend and reality is by H M Seervai an Indian, Jinnah and Gandhi: their role in the quest for freedom is by S K Majumdar an Indian, Jinnah the man of destiny is by Prakash Almeida an Indian, Jinnah a corrective reading of Indian History is by Asiananda an Indian, Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah a life is by Sailesh Kumar Bandhopadhaya....

So people took notice of the statement by Collins ... and they corrected this historical wrong... and wrote books doing justice to the high place his achievements merited.


On DAD...ultimately the objective final judgement is that of the top man - who interestingly was looking for excuses to go back on the CMP promise of transfering power to the party that accepted CMP as is- Wavell was forced to conclude rightly so:


``I`ve found no evidence of muslim league involvement in calcutta killings and appreciably larger number of Muslims died than Hindus``

(Mansergh Volume IX TOPP Page 879)

Pl read as:

Re: # 496 & 497,

Harish,

Manto`s left brain (that process logic) is missing or damaged.

We keep exposing him.......let him commit more mistakes abt the bogus stuff.............coz I know that Chowk is being visited by masters students of history in India and abroad (I dont know abt Pakistan).

Manto,

Curse Be Upon You! I have NOT said that what I quoted is from somewhere or my own. Your comprehension skills are going downhill?!?!?!?!?

I REPRODUCED THESE WORDS VERBATIM from Memoirs of Suhrawardy - confessions of the criminal. As we go, I produce more and more evidence and that wud be enough for the readers to make their own conclusions. I give a damn to ur opinions.

In the meanwhile I quote these portions from Freedom at Midnight by Larry Collins and Dominique Lapierre. Both Collins and Lapierre are Hindus (wink) and Congressmen (double wink).

---

Page 33:

At the dawn on 16 August, howling in a quasi-religious fervour, Moslem mobs had come bursting from their slums, waving clubs, shovels, any instrument capable of SMASHING IN A HUMAN SKULL. They came in answer to a call issued by the Moslem League, proclaiming 16 August `Direct Action Day`, to prove Britain and Congress Party that India`s Moslems were prepared `to get Pakistan for themselves by ``Direct Action`` if necessary`.

They savagely beat to a sodden pulp any Hindus in their path and stuffed their remains in the city`s open gutters. The terrified police simply disappeared. Soon tall pillars of black smoke stretched up from a score of spots in the city, Hindu bazars in full blaze.


Page 34:

The threat that Muslims had been uttering for years, their warnings of cataclysm which would overtake India if they were denied their own state, took on a terrifying reality.

(MANTO, THE AUTHORS ARE WRITING ABT PEOPLE LIKE YOU!)

History, beyond that written by his own people, would NEVER ACCORD MOHAMMED ALI JINNAH THE HIGH PLACE HIS ACHIEVEMENTS MERITED.

---

In the end, it doesn’t matter a rat`s ass if a person like you takes the evidence given (reproduced) for our understanding of the past.

If we talk abt the sum of the Bangla riots, people from Muslims too suffered (subsequent to DAD as Hindus communalists retaliated; you dont expect them to be meek, do u?) where they were in minority.

BUT,

the fire was started by Muslim League on Direct Action Day and the pretext was this irrepressible urge for a separate nation, your Pakistan.

In the hindsight, I wud like to request the people who want these two halves of India (Indian Union and Pakistan) united.........god forbid, no such thing shud happen, for the Muslim communal elements are worse than devils when it comes to communal bigotry.

When there was this bogey of Hindus, Muslims fought us, where there is none (in Pakistan), they turned to each other now. People who inculcate such hate-spirit shud suffer the consequences. If Pakistan is deeply divided or is going to be divided more and more, it`s becoz this enemy bogey embedded in their consciousness. As a chip of that block, I am surprised when u are absolving the Muslim League for DAD.

As they say, those who live by sword die by it. Those who (Muslim League) won by this hate argument/logic, lose by the same.

Prophetic.......? Lets see!

Re: # 496 & 497,

Harish,

Manto`s left brain (that process logic) is missing or damaged.

We keep exposing him.......let him commit more mistakes abt the bogus stuff.............coz I know that Chowk is being visited by masters students of history in India and abroad (I dont know abt Pakistan).

Manto,

Curse Be Upon You! I have NOT said that what I quoted is from somewhere or my own.

I REPRODUCED THESE WORDS VERBATIM from Memoirs of Suhrawardy - confessions of the criminal. As we go, I produce more and more evidence and that wud be enough for the readers to make their own conclusions. I give a damn to ur opinions.

In the meanwhile I quote these portions from Freeedom at Midnight by Larry Collins and Dominique Lapierre. Both Collins and Lapierre are Hindus (wink) and Congressmen (double wink).

---

Page 33:

At the dawn on 16 August, howling in a quasi-religious fervour, Moslem mobs had come bursting from their slums, waving clubs, shovels, any instrument capable of SMASHING IN A HUMAN SKULL. They came in answer to a call issued by the Moslem League, proclaiming 16 August `Direct Action Day`, to prove Britain and Congress Party that India`s Moslems were prepared `to get Pakistan for themselves by ``Ditect Action`` if necessary`.

They savagely beat to a sodden pulp any Hindus in their path and stuffed thei remains in the city`s open gutters. The terrified police simply disappeared.Soon tall pillars of black smokestretched up from a score of spots in the city, Hindu bazars in full blaze.

Page 34:

The threat that Muslims had been uttering for years, their warnings of cataclysm which would overtake India if they were denied their own state, took on a terrifying reality.

(MANTO, THE AUTHORS ARE WRITING ABT PEOPLE LIKE YOU!)

History, beyond that written by his own people, would NEVER ACCORD MOHAMMED ALI JINNAH THE HIGH PLACE HIS ACHIEVEMENTS MERITED.

---

In the end, it doesnt matter a rat`s ass if a person like you takes the evidence given (reproduced) for our understanding of the past.

If we talk abt the sum of the Bangla riots, people from Muslims too suffered (subsequent to DAD as Hindus communalists retaliated; you dont expect them to be meek, do u?) where they were in minority

BUT,

the fire was started by Muslim League on Direct Action Day and the pretext was this irrepressible urge for a separate nation, your Pakistan.

In the hindsight, I wud like to request the people who want these two halves of India united.........god forbid, no such thing shud happen, for the Muslim communal elements are worse than devils when it comes to communal bigotry.

When there was this bogey of Hindus, Muslims fought us, where there are none (in Pakistan), they turned to each other now. People who inculcate such hate-spirit shud suffer the consequeces. If Pakistan is deeply divided or is going to be divided more and more, it`s becoz this enemy bogey.

As they say, those who live by sword die by it. Those who (Muslim League) won by this hate argument/logic, lose by the same.

Prophetic.......? Lets see!

Dear VRV,

I am glad you`ve acknowledged that the said quote was not from Suhrawardy`s memoirs. Besides saying that DAD was the first day in Muslim emancipation is hardly any evidence at all. Here is the irony- only harish hyd thinks the evidence was ``conclusive`` (forgetting that Sir Francis Tuker equally blames all parties)...

Meanwhile the man who was to make the final decision and who wanted to justify his invitation to the Congress to form the interim government declared:

``I`ve found no evidence of muslim league involvement in calcutta killings and appreciably larger number of Muslims died than Hindus``

(Mansergh Volume IX TOPP Page 879)

Unfortunately... you guys are unable to accept the fact that Congress planned and carried out violence, using the excuse of Muslim League`s direct action (Ironically the first person to the term ``direct action`` ... was none other than Gandhi... who explained in his essay in 1919 how direct action was a beneficial thing... I`ll quote it sometime later)...

Violence in Calcutta lies squarely on the shoulders of the party that carried it out and that was the Congress Party.

#495 by VRV

Yaar VRV, thanks for that valuable and conclusive piece of evidence from Sir Francis Tuker. Even the Time magazine and Stanley Wolpert in his book `Gandhi`s Passion` say that it was the Muslim mobs that started the violence. In addition, many newspapers were warning in the days before that Jinnah and his Muslim Leaguers were being provocative and there would be violence.

Yet, typical of Yasser, he fails to see the obvious. I have yet to understand his contention that because more Muslims died, it was the Hindus who started it. LOL!

FOR THOSE INTERESTED IN HISTORY OF DIRECT ACTION DAY:

Sir Francis Tuker on Direct Action Day (relevant portions are culled for the sake of brevity): Mr. Tuker is in-charge of the army of Eastern command.

---

Direct Action Day speech by Suhrawardy:

.........Direct Action Day would prove to be the first step towards the Muslim struggle for emancipation..............


Sir Francis Tuker :

Our intelligence patrols noticed that the crowd included a large number of Muslim goondas, and that these slipped away from the meeting from time to time, their ranks being swelled as soon as the meeting ended. They made for the shopping centres of the town where they at once set to work to loot and burn Hindu shops and houses.

---

* For the brain-dead scums this is a collateral damage:

On closer inspection of the bodies in this area we found that many were horribly mutilated and in one particular place a man had been tied by his ankles to a tramway electric junction box, his hands were bound behind his back and a hole had been made in his forehead so that he bled to death through the brain. He was such a ghastly sight that it was a wonder that the soldiers who were ordered to cut him down and cover him with a nearby sack, were not ill on the spot.

Manto,

Curse Be Upon You! I am not a liar like you to splice falsehoods here, pl mind that. These words are not of citation but portions I culled (relevent) to focus the torch of truth on your dark, satanic mind.

I am quoting from the book of Suhrawardy`s Memoirs.

Direct Action Day is the Muslim League Plan and the call was given by Jinnah who also explained why the DAD for and what the aim of it and what they are going to do on that day. Btw, Congress`s NOT asking for Pakistan! They were already invited to form the govt!

If they teach that Congress planned violence to get Pakistan, it shows, how Pakistan`s educational system is flawed and the kind of man u are. Ah!

I quote from Suhrawardy`s Memoirs if u have NOT read that before:

IT CLEARLY SHOWS WHO DID WHAT ON THAT DAY AND THEREFORE MUSLIM LEAGUE IS SQUARELY RESPONSIBLE.

---

MEMOIRS OF SUHRAWARDY
University Press Ltd ,Bangladesh

Pl hear this from Horse mouth:

Background to DAD:

At this time, betraying the Muslim cause, the Viceroy called upon Pandit Nehru to form an interim government which he did, but the Muslim League refused to participate in it Jinnah even cancelled his talks with Lord Wavell, the Viceroy, and proclaimed 16 August as Direct Action Day.

On Why DAD was active in Calcutta not elsewhere:

The one-member majority Muslim League government in Sind, formed after the assassination of the Congress Chief minister Allahbux, was also asked, but, because it was a shaky government, its Muslim League members could not be trusted. So, all the risks of the Direct Action Day fell on the Bengal government On that day Muslims were expected to gather in large numbers to proclaim their adherence to the concept of Pakistan Shaheed Suhrawardy declared a holiday for that day in Calcutta

Suhrawardy`s explanation to Wavell on bloodshed:

The Viceroy wanted to know from Prime Minister Suhrawardy how he could be held responsible for the riot. Suhrawardy explained that the riot was a consequence of the formation of the interim government without Muslim League representation.......

Replication of DAD in other states? Read this.....

He further warned that what had happened in Calcutta would repeat itself all over India unless the British government changed its policy.

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