It is Never OK to Hit a Woman

Re: # 158

Please do not mind him. His was a typical hidu-loser response. THis should tell you the collosal challenge we as Muslims have to face to bring humanity out of darkness, ignorance and petulance and show them Light. Please be patient and composed.

#158

And no amount of kissing the ass of the automated computer program called ``chowk staff`` will change anything!

Re: # 139
So tell me how do you rise above it all?

Uh uh, Beej? :(

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saimarana, you will need to be patient, lady. Even takeninhand is a very new website. And most humanists have absolutely no clue about what so many men and women really desire.

#161 Trully mian

I am THROUGH being nice to creepy fundos like you! I am going to tell you and your two-bit chelas exactly like it is!

Just because that woman`s mind has been screwed up by the likes of you just as the body of countless Muslim women was screwed by opportunistic males (hot penis-wallas) as per your sanction does not mean that the rest of the world can merely watch without telling you like it is!

Kaal,

Do you EVER stop kissing ass of these fundos?!

It is not worth it, I tell you!

It only makes you look like a nincompoop!

POOP, I said!

These sala fundos....

They stone their women!

Cut off their clioris!

Then show up here to lecture on the virtues of beating them up!

Kuttey kahin ke!

Re: # 165

I wish you peace, tranquility, and guidance. Please calm down, anger is the most self-destructive of human emotion. I pray that may Allah save you from your anger. I you think, that we Muslims are doing something wrong, then help us understand. The great Muslim jurist Abu Hanifa once said: I know that you are wrong but there is chance that you might be right and I know I am right but there is a chance that I might be wrong.

Re: # 159 dear urstruly sahib wrote;

[The modern philosophical thought and Islamic thought process are at the opposite extreme of a spectrum and the reconciliation that you are suggesting is impossible]

i dont agree with you that both these ``extreme`` are irreconcilable.they are not exactly opposite to each other in the strict sense.In fact they are complementary to each other if we look into them carefully.

The problem with modren westren philosophy is that it has accpeted the skepticism.it no longer claims to have absolute knowledge.
the two main epistemological aspects of this thinking are ,reason and experiment[in the technical sense].they have accpeted that not only both of them are inadequate but the conflict between both of them is a basic of fact of our mental life.

islamic philosophy ,on the other hand, picks the thread from here.it already claims that reason and experiment[or acquired knowledge] alone can not give certain knowledge and thus incapable to solve the problem of modren mind.

it claims to provide a third epistemological dimension [Imaan]which not only reconcile both the dimensions but also provide a creative vision to look at reality.

Quran considers IMaan[imeediate comprehension] to be equaly important[along with reason and experiment]in unraveling the mystery of being.

Quranic epistemology is the mixture of all three dimension.Quran never undermines the faculty of reason and experiment,in fact it exhorts man to use these faculties.

Quran is against any kind of blind faith.Imaan is not same as ``belief``.imaan is a living assurance of being.

we can learn so much from westren thinking but only if we reconcile them according to islamic temperament.coz westren thinking uncertan and inadequate.

but i think we can formulate it in such a way which wont be harmfull to our faith,in fact it would make islamic thinking more accpetable to the westren mind which is desparatly looking for a epistemology which is able to recocile all those facters in one system.

we know islam is exactly that but we will have to present it in their own terminologies.
regards

Easy, Beej!!

Getting upset is so unhelpful. Urstruly has an excellent point. Strong emotions, of love and hatred, defeat understanding.

And understanding is necesary no matter what your own interests may be.

Philosopher sahib,

One question that you may ignore if it is too personal.

Is the chairperson of your doctoral committee a Muslim or a liberal? What about other members of the committee - any with a training in social sciences?

Re: # 171 kaalchakra sahib, aadaab

aaraay hazoor-e- waala aap kiya karein gey jaan kar?

one thing i can tell you for sure no one worship the CoW.SO by that standard no one is liberal among them.

lol,just kidding plz dont mind.

Re: # 169 Philosopher,

So I see that we are basically in agreement on our assessment of Western and Islamic philosophical thought process. But lets agree to disagree on the reconcilliation aspect of it. In this regard my stance is how can be a reconcilliation possible between Tauheed (One Absolute Truth) and Kufr (No Absolutes). These two ideals are mutually exclusive. However, I would like to explore how and why do you think there is a reconcilliation possible.

As far as your thesis on Qura`n is concerned, you or other readers may find these statistics quite amazing:

No. of times Rights of Allah are mentioned in Qura`n = 193
No. of times Rights of Man are mentioned in Qura`n = 673
No. of times Qura`n urges human beings to explore this universe to discover Him= 750

In other words, there is far more emphasis on exploring Cosmos to find God than to just blindly obeying into a belief system. Such confidence, such assertiveness, and such challenging directness can only come from One Absolute Truth. How can then be hope and faith reconcilable and equal to disbelief and doubt. How can hope compliment utter hopelessness?

#168 by Urstruly on January 20, 2007 3:46pm PT
[... I know that you are wrong but there is chance that you might be right and I know I am right but there is a chance that I might be wrong.]

Ama yaar, I must give you your due!

I NEVER said you don`t have a sense of humor!!

Just like Begum Saima rana (hopefully still with her genitals uncut (unlike you, my friend!)) does have a sense of irony - comparing Karva chauth to getting ass-whipped! Indeed!

I am sorry I used harsh words to you. But harsh reality from Iraq - in the news item I provided below - has not gone down well with me.

How about this - you agree to the following:

(1) Stop blowing up people like me and others not of your faith all over the world.

(2) Stop cutting female genitalia, beating the females, raping them in the name of ``honor``, and stoning them, and approving of ``enjoyment`` marriages.

(3) Accept the essential equality of all people - Muslim or non-Muslim.

Do those three things for starters, and then I will start agreeing that Islam CAN BE practiced indeed as a religion of peace - a stance which our very own GWB is so fond of reiterating in every speech!

That`s OK, philosopher sahib. The question, in any case, wasn`t specifically about you or your doctoral committee, so apologies are due for the personal tone of the query. Cheers.

Re: # 173 urstruly sahib wrote;

[my stance is how can be a reconcilliation possible between Tauheed (One Absolute Truth) and Kufr (No Absolutes). ]

the answer is very much in the assertion you yourself have presented if you look into it closely.

the one absolute [tauheed] encompass every contingent and relative thing in it.the knowledge of human is to recognise its proper perspective.

THE GLORIOUS QURAN exhorts its readers to find the the ultimate truth in the complexity and relativity of ``appearance`` through Imaan.Imaan shows you the path in the illusion of ``appearance and relativity``to comprehend the reality beyond that.

Now if we have Imaan with an existential and vital approach towards relativity, we can find the way in that to reach the ultimate reality where this reality unviel immediatly.we comprehend without applying ``this-therefore-this``or any other systematic demonstration but without[according to Quran} contemplating on the splendid and awe-inspiring phenoumena ,we will only end up with ``belief or dogma``not the true Imaan.

Quran makes a very important distinction b/w ``islam`` and ``imaan`` islam is following ritual or we can say a way of life concerning the appearance.

Imaan is absolute but ``islam``is dynamic it is flexible always there mold itself to the new challenges and needs of the time with a strong sense of Imaan.isam is the path to imaan.

The holy prophet[pbuh] gave us the right to do ijtihaad.ijtihaad is recognising and reshaping of the appearance to make it smoother and clear to see the light of Imaan.

so modification of islam without doing violence to ``imaan``or the basic principle of islam is the duty of MUSLIM.

if we accept westren thinking with that perspective than we can make islam clearer and transparent.after all the greek logic which we have been using to understand our religion is also the product of west.

so why cant we borrow more relevent methodology from the modren west to solve our intellectual problems.

the principles are absolute but the contingent part can be reshaped.recociliation doesnt mean the reconcialiation of the basic principles of both of them but only the surface part of them.

well as for as facts about THE GLORIOUS QURAN tha you have mentioned ;what can i say?

THE GLORIOUS BOOK is the LIGHT[NOOR] of ALLAH.