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Musharraf Spilling the Beans—Why Now?

Karamatullah K Ghori September 26, 2006

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listing 128-144   1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11

#128 Posted by Ranjit on September 28, 2006 5:41:03 am
Re:zeemax #120

[...Pakistan`s `best` interest lies in Taliban control of Afghanistan, and Musharraf has now realized that contrary to all efforts, Taliban will retake Kabul the moment foreign forces leave...]

The Afghan people need to be honored with the world`s dumbest human being award for continuously supporting the Taliban for the past two decades, even after suffering their absurd rule. God only knows what they see in the Taliban, who are worse than animals - a subhuman group of people who destroy everything, keep women as prisoners, hold public amputations and live literally in the stone age. Even sub-saharan africans wont support such a group.

If it is in Pakistan`s best interests to support such people, then that just shows the rock bottom IQ of the Pak establishment. A Taliban run neighbor will ruin Pakistan, which it already did in the nineties and with 9/11. The way things are, the west is not going to tolerate this nonsense for too long. If the Taliban attacks continue, US will start attacking Waziristan and other tribal areas directly bypassing Musharraf. Its inevitable.
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#129 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 5:51:08 am
#128 by ranjit

...continuously supporting the Taliban for the past two decades, even after suffering their absurd rule....

Is there a possibility that they did that because the Taliban rule was not actually `absurd`?
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#130 Posted by masanamuthu on September 28, 2006 5:58:01 am
First, Taliban did not have universal support.. Their support is limited to the pashthu(o) belt.. They inflicted worst treatment on the Shias of the North. In all the years of Taliban rule, its leader Mullah Omar rarely ventured out of Kandahar into Kabul..

Point to note is that Afghanistan is a diverse country and Taliban`s support is limited to the provinces bordering Pakistan. Taliban should try to capture Pakistani border states with the help of the religious parties.. That should be fun..
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#131 Posted by echoboom on September 28, 2006 6:17:41 am
Ahmedinejad - the coolest revolutionary ..with Highest IQ & Guts.



``washingtonpost.com``


NEWS Ahmadinejad`s Gauntlet
The U.S. and Iran Need Each Other Too Much Not to Find Accommodation

By David Ignatius
Sunday, September 24, 2006; B07


NEW YORK -- The most telling moment in a conversation here last week with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad came when he was asked if America would attack Iran. He quickly answered ``no,`` with a slight cock of his head as if he regarded the very idea of war between the two countries as preposterous.

Ahmadinejad`s confidence was the overriding theme of his visit. He was like a picador, deftly sticking darts into a wounded bull. As he moved from event to event -- TV and print interviews, a chat with the august Council on Foreign Relations, his lecture to the U.N. General Assembly -- he displayed the same flinty composure. It sometimes seemed as if he owned New York, dispensing his radical bromides like a tidy, compact version of Fidel Castro. I sensed the same certainty that was expressed by Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini back when this confrontation began in the late 1970s: ``America cannot do a damn thing.``

Over the course of a week`s time, I had an unusual chance to sit with both President Bush and President Ahmadinejad and hear their thoughts about Iran. The contrasts were striking: Bush is groping for answers to the Iran problem; you sense him struggling for a viable strategy. When I asked what message he wanted to send the Iranian people, Bush seemed eager for more contact: He spoke of Iran`s importance, of its great history and culture, of its legitimate rights. He made similar comments in his speech Tuesday to the U.N. General Assembly.

Ahmadinejad, meanwhile, is sitting back and enjoying the attention. He`s not groping for anything; he`s waiting for the world to come to him. When you boil down his comments, the message is similar to Bush`s: Iran wants a diplomatic solution to the nuclear impasse; Iran wants dialogue; Iran wants more cultural exchanges. At one point, Ahmadinejad even said that ``under fair conditions,`` he would favor a resumption of diplomatic relations with the United States.

But if the words of accommodation are there, the music is not. Instead of sending a message to the administration that he is serious about negotiations, Ahmadinejad spent the week playing to the gallery of Third World activists and Muslim revolutionaries with his comments about Israel and the Holocaust. This audience hears the defiant message between the lines: America cannot do a damn thing.

Ahmadinejad is the calmest revolutionary I`ve ever seen. Sitting in a plush easy chair in his suite at the InterContinental hotel, he barely moves a muscle as he makes the most radical statements. His feet don`t jiggle, his hands don`t make gestures, his facial expression barely changes. His eyes are the most expressive part of his body -- sparkling one moment, glowering the next, focusing down to dark points when he is angry.

An interview with Ahmadinejad is an intellectual ping-pong match. He bounces back each question with one of his own: Ask about Hezbollah`s attacks, and he asks about Israel`s attacks. Question his defiance of the United Nations, and he shifts to America`s defiance of the world body. In more than an hour of conversation with me and Lally Weymouth of Newsweek, he didn`t deviate from his script. Indeed, some of his comments in the interview were repeated almost word for word when he addressed the General Assembly a few hours later. This is a man adept at message control.

The common strand I take away from this week of Iranian-American conversation is that the two countries agree on one central fact: Iran is a powerful nation that should play an important role in the international system. Bush put it to me this way: ``I would say to the Iranian people: We respect your history. We respect your culture. . . . I recognize the importance of your sovereignty.`` Here was Ahmadinejad`s formulation, when I asked how Iran could help stabilize Iraq: ``A powerful Iran will benefit the region because Iran is a country with a deep culture and has always been a peaceful country.``

That`s the challenge: Can America and Iran find a formula that will meet each side`s security interests, and thereby allow Iran to return fully to the community of nations after 27 years? Iran can`t achieve its ambitions as a rising power without an accommodation with America. America can`t achieve its interest in stabilizing the Middle East without help from Iran. The potential for war is there, but so is the bedrock of mutual self-interest. The simple fact is that these two countries need each other.




David Ignatius co-hosts with Fareed Zakaria of Newsweek an ongoing discussion of international issues called PostGlobal, athttp://www.washingtonpost.com. David Ignatius can be reached atdavidignatius@washpost.com.
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#132 Posted by Ranjit on September 28, 2006 6:32:34 am
Re:zeemax#129

[...Is there a possibility that they did that because the Taliban rule was not actually `absurd`?..]

Would you support a Taliban type government in Pakistan? Would you like to live under that? If you have women in your family, will they like Taliban rule where they cannot show their faces from the windows of their houses? If not, then why do you wish such an abomination for Afghanistan?

From what I have heard, Pak establishment leads a very ``unislamic`` lifestyle that is both lavish and full of vices including liquor, women etc. Yet the same establishment sees no hypocisy in supporting the Taliban for Afghanistan. Putting morality aside, even from a practical point of view, having a Talibanized Afghanistan will destabilize Pakistan itself by increasing jihadi violence in Pakistan and by becoming a center for international terror - not to mention a completely ruined economy in Afghanistan that would depend on Pak handouts.
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#133 Posted by hamidm2 on September 28, 2006 6:59:12 am
Re: # 92

anil mian,

``I call you to God and to Islam. If you respond to the call, you are Muslims: You obtain the benefits they enjoy and take up the responsibilities they bear. If you refuse, then [you must pay] the jizyah. If you refuse the jizyah, I will bring against you an army of tribes who are more eager for death than you are for life. We will fight you until God decides between us and you.``

....... actually that was the message from khalid-bin-walid, one of mo`s closest buddies (sahabi) and a great muslim warrior, to the king of persia ......... every muslim child knows the story ......... this quote is from `` the history of al-tabari: the challenge to the empires `` ................ it is a great book and there is one left in stock at amazon ...........

........... of course, i am not suggesting that two wrongs make a right - as mushy said it was rather rude of armitage to say what he said .......... i simply wanted to point out to the likes of zeemax and that mad mullah masadi that the shoe hurts when it is on the other foot - not that barefooted cave dwellers know anything about shoes ..............

........... also, i have taken note of salim mian`s attempt to defame mrs hamidm and will respond at the appropriate time ............ however, i must clarify that unlike the wives and concubines of other great muslims, she was not captured in battle and her father and brother are still alive with their heads attached to their bodies ...............
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#134 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 7:23:02 am
#132 by ranjit

Taliban started their country from scratch after complete destruction and will go forward. They are not against progress at all but are completely for it, but not on foreigners` terms imposed on them. They need to be convinced. The entire perception of Taliban is wrong.

They are a very highly principled people, open to ideas, and have no wish to export their form of Government to Pak or anywhere else. It is just their way at the moment because they see the Afghan society as completely corrupted and feel appropriate to take such harsh measures. It`s their country after all. They need to be engaged, not fought, because their views carry a lot of support in Afghanistan and they will not be defeated.

If Afghanistan becomes a haven for anti-west warriors again, it will only be if Taliban are continued to be treated as outcasts and not given the recognition due to them.
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#135 Posted by hamidm2 on September 28, 2006 7:25:50 am
Re: # 134

zeemax,

............ now you have completely lost it ! .......... you want to cut off your nose to spite your face - what is next ? ...... a suicide vest ?
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#136 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 7:28:14 am
#135 by hamidm2

Not at all Hamidm ... why do you think so? Have you ever met any Taliban?
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#137 Posted by bongdongs on September 28, 2006 7:38:17 am
#131
US has retarded growth in Iranian Energy industry by a decade (a least). The cockiness shown by Ahmedinijad, is the cockiness of Musharraf, the cockiness of despots who know they do not have to deal with improving the lives of their people to stay in power.
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#138 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 7:41:07 am
#137 by bongdongs

Abey bongey ... looks like you missed that comment by Kaalchakra that Muslims are never concerned about `bread and butter` issues. That is the sole pursuit of macacas.
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#139 Posted by hamidm2 on September 28, 2006 7:58:43 am
Re: # 136

yes...... half my relatives live in quetta and peshawar ........ ever been there ?
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#140 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 8:02:04 am
#139 by hamidm2

Buddy .. if you had asked if I had ever been to Miranshah, it would have been an appropriate question .. !
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#141 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 8:04:00 am
Or better yet .. if you had asked if I had ever been to Jalalabad and Kabul would have been an even better question ...
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#142 Posted by bongdongs on September 28, 2006 8:20:54 am
To further add to my views on Iran. Economic performance should be measured by the standards of what is possible for that country. Iran is a blessed country today, a young well-educated workforce (with incresing numbers of women in workforce). A massive endowment of natural wealth not just in oil but in the emerging gas trade. In addition to LNG, GTL Iran should be a natural hub for all energy intensive industries like Aluminium. Oil/Gas pipelines from CA states should be criss-crossing Iran on their way to massive oil terminals/LNG plants at Bandar Abbas and onwards to India/Pakistan.

But watch the difference between US allies like Qatar and UAE (countries with little intellectual capital) and Iran and see how much of a an influence America still has on the world.
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#143 Posted by zeemax on September 28, 2006 8:36:29 am
#142 by bongdongs

True. Only that Iran will never import russian and chinese streetwalkers to encourage foreign investment. But you obviously don`t know what I`m talking about.
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listing 128-144   1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11

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