My Ramadan
Fiza Asar October 5, 2006
#119 Posted by zeemax on October 7, 2006 10:14:43 pm
#117 by masadi
Asadi Saheb, God bless you for this personal account ... but do you realize you may have given more ammunition to these low-lifes for Ad-Hominem attacks on you?
Asadi Saheb, God bless you for this personal account ... but do you realize you may have given more ammunition to these low-lifes for Ad-Hominem attacks on you?
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#118 Posted by masadi on October 7, 2006 9:58:13 pm
bjkumar writes <<< Any religion can have that type of situation, true! The unique thing that appears (at least to this ignorant individual) to be the case for your religion is that it discourages you from questioning whether it is okay to make your own judgment >>>
This is utter and total BS. If there ever was a ``religion`` that is based on reason and questioning and logical argumentation, that ``religion`` is Islam. Those who have not read the Quran, and those who have dogmatized Islam because of illiteracy are the only ones who will make such an ignorant comment. Regarding his other assertion where he states ,
<<< And when there is any confrontation – the vast majority of Muslims take sides not based on the merits of any particular issue – but on the basis of whether one side is Muslim or not! >>>
You mean to say if Pakistan and India confront each other, the Hindu masses stop and do some thinking about whom to side with? You apparently have no clue about crowd behavior, the crowd develops dynamic norms- contrary to all reason- of its own, this is regardless of the label or the belief the crowd carried before, whenever attacked by an external or hostile enemy, in group solidarity grows, there is no court of justice mentality shown by any crowd whatsoever so if Muslims behave that way, it is quite normal.
You on the other hand, by having only negative things to say about Islam, on all occassions, acting as an individual sitting at your computer display all signs of the ``us versus them`` mentality and bigotry.
This is utter and total BS. If there ever was a ``religion`` that is based on reason and questioning and logical argumentation, that ``religion`` is Islam. Those who have not read the Quran, and those who have dogmatized Islam because of illiteracy are the only ones who will make such an ignorant comment. Regarding his other assertion where he states ,
<<< And when there is any confrontation – the vast majority of Muslims take sides not based on the merits of any particular issue – but on the basis of whether one side is Muslim or not! >>>
You mean to say if Pakistan and India confront each other, the Hindu masses stop and do some thinking about whom to side with? You apparently have no clue about crowd behavior, the crowd develops dynamic norms- contrary to all reason- of its own, this is regardless of the label or the belief the crowd carried before, whenever attacked by an external or hostile enemy, in group solidarity grows, there is no court of justice mentality shown by any crowd whatsoever so if Muslims behave that way, it is quite normal.
You on the other hand, by having only negative things to say about Islam, on all occassions, acting as an individual sitting at your computer display all signs of the ``us versus them`` mentality and bigotry.
#117 Posted by masadi on October 7, 2006 9:18:05 pm
behram writes <<< And yes, their is no free government free cheese for your infested intellect. >>>
For the record, I have not consumed one penny worth of government benefits, even when I was out of a job for six months one time, on the contrary they cut over 22% of my gross pay (which falls in the lower 25% of pay scales by the way) in some tax or the other including this damn city that takes more taxes than state tax. Neither do I live in a basement. I rent a nicely furnished room, even have my own private bathroom, paid for by my hard work in a dead end job, where the mobility of white males with lesser education is much quicker, with a second part time teaching job. Like most others in America, I have to work 2 jobs to make ends meet, if I was unfortunate to have a family here and godforbid a kid, I would fall below the poverty line for sure as many do, or would have to pick up a third job, given the nature of the new low paying jobs being created- fortunately for now, I end up with a surplus, so I can buy more non-government cheese. That is the reality for most in the mass society in the usa.
For the record, I have not consumed one penny worth of government benefits, even when I was out of a job for six months one time, on the contrary they cut over 22% of my gross pay (which falls in the lower 25% of pay scales by the way) in some tax or the other including this damn city that takes more taxes than state tax. Neither do I live in a basement. I rent a nicely furnished room, even have my own private bathroom, paid for by my hard work in a dead end job, where the mobility of white males with lesser education is much quicker, with a second part time teaching job. Like most others in America, I have to work 2 jobs to make ends meet, if I was unfortunate to have a family here and godforbid a kid, I would fall below the poverty line for sure as many do, or would have to pick up a third job, given the nature of the new low paying jobs being created- fortunately for now, I end up with a surplus, so I can buy more non-government cheese. That is the reality for most in the mass society in the usa.
#116 Posted by masadi on October 7, 2006 9:02:29 pm
behram writes <<< You are a liar, a deceiver, a trickster, and you would scoop so low. >>>
There you have it boys and girls, take your pick again, facts versus the only response they have of Ad Hominem and insults. Like echo sahib has said, it is very gratifying to hear these kinds of responses from these damn fools, that tells me they have nothing except bs to sell.
There you have it boys and girls, take your pick again, facts versus the only response they have of Ad Hominem and insults. Like echo sahib has said, it is very gratifying to hear these kinds of responses from these damn fools, that tells me they have nothing except bs to sell.
#115 Posted by echoboom on October 7, 2006 8:57:28 pm
Ramdhan observance and celebration
The joy of Diversity & pluralism.
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The joy of Diversity & pluralism.
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Islam`s appeal spans many cultures
CHINO - When the sun finally sets and the fast of Ramadan ends for the day, Luqman Malik joins the faithful at the Baitul Hameed Mosque for a feast of chicken, rice, potatoes.
And Mexican food.
Islam is a tapestry, Imam Shamshad A. Nasir says, a religion that attracts men and women of many cultures.
More Latinos are embracing the faith, said Hussam Ayloush, a Corona man who is spokesman for the Southern California chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations. While he has has no exact numbers, he said the shift is clear.
``Go to the mosque in downtown L.A. and you`ll see a large number of Latinos,`` he said. ``People are seeking a place where they feel the spirit of peace.``
He said they are willing to make sacrifices to find that peace.
That includes Latinos like Malik, a Catholic by birth, who found solace in Islam in the days after Sept. 11, 2001. He was in college, and didn`t like the way his Muslim friends were being treated. ``People were saying they were not good people,`` he said. ``That`s not true.``
It made him want to learn more about Islam, and he found himself drawn to its teachings and traditions. After much study and thought, the 26-year-old Chino man decided to convert. Malik comes from a traditional Catholic family.
For complete reading of this uplifting article:
http://www.whittierdailynews.com/news/ci_4454856
And Mexican food.
Islam is a tapestry, Imam Shamshad A. Nasir says, a religion that attracts men and women of many cultures.
More Latinos are embracing the faith, said Hussam Ayloush, a Corona man who is spokesman for the Southern California chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations. While he has has no exact numbers, he said the shift is clear.
``Go to the mosque in downtown L.A. and you`ll see a large number of Latinos,`` he said. ``People are seeking a place where they feel the spirit of peace.``
He said they are willing to make sacrifices to find that peace.
That includes Latinos like Malik, a Catholic by birth, who found solace in Islam in the days after Sept. 11, 2001. He was in college, and didn`t like the way his Muslim friends were being treated. ``People were saying they were not good people,`` he said. ``That`s not true.``
It made him want to learn more about Islam, and he found himself drawn to its teachings and traditions. After much study and thought, the 26-year-old Chino man decided to convert. Malik comes from a traditional Catholic family.
For complete reading of this uplifting article:
http://www.whittierdailynews.com/news/ci_4454856
#114 Posted by Behram1 on October 7, 2006 7:27:10 pm
Re: # 113 by masadi on October 7, 2006 7:01pm PT
Dear masadi:
As usual you are off base with your diatribe. You must not have read the latest edition of The Economist wherein they cite the lack of talents in the coming decades. All they mention is for intellectuals to develop their knowledge for the new global world. And yes, their is no free government free cheese for your infested intellect.
{That is how this society is rigged. Use the facts and learn or you`ll be chasing a pipe dream with lots of disappointment at the end, especially if you happen to be non-white and female.}
How sad that you are deceiving your future generation into hatred for the enlightened. You are a liar, a deceiver, a trickster, and you would scoop so low. Shame on you.
{Of course the geniuses like hamid and tahmed will tell you the shape of the basement I reside in and the kind of food I eat, their only argument against Krugman was that he is a `liberal`, labels not facts guide their discourse.}
Not only that, this chowk has debuncked your intellect, because you had none. All you had was your hatred towards anything that is not within your myopic view of this world. Most of us were successful in destroying your theory of elitism, and your crazy notion of conspiracy against the muslim world. You are naked on this chowk and you have no clothes whatsoever to hide.
{Take your pick, Fact of a caste society or the Horatio Alger Myth... } Yes, I hope they will work towards enlightenment, and not be stuck with some ill conceived intellect like yours.
Respectfully submitted,
Dear masadi:
As usual you are off base with your diatribe. You must not have read the latest edition of The Economist wherein they cite the lack of talents in the coming decades. All they mention is for intellectuals to develop their knowledge for the new global world. And yes, their is no free government free cheese for your infested intellect.
{That is how this society is rigged. Use the facts and learn or you`ll be chasing a pipe dream with lots of disappointment at the end, especially if you happen to be non-white and female.}
How sad that you are deceiving your future generation into hatred for the enlightened. You are a liar, a deceiver, a trickster, and you would scoop so low. Shame on you.
{Of course the geniuses like hamid and tahmed will tell you the shape of the basement I reside in and the kind of food I eat, their only argument against Krugman was that he is a `liberal`, labels not facts guide their discourse.}
Not only that, this chowk has debuncked your intellect, because you had none. All you had was your hatred towards anything that is not within your myopic view of this world. Most of us were successful in destroying your theory of elitism, and your crazy notion of conspiracy against the muslim world. You are naked on this chowk and you have no clothes whatsoever to hide.
{Take your pick, Fact of a caste society or the Horatio Alger Myth... } Yes, I hope they will work towards enlightenment, and not be stuck with some ill conceived intellect like yours.
Respectfully submitted,
#113 Posted by masadi on October 7, 2006 7:01:23 pm
hamid writes <<< boy`s and girls, don`t listen to masadi, listen to me, if you want to live the american dream instead of living in a basement and eating government cheese >>>
By all means boys and girls, listen to hamid if you want to gamble your lives away, you have a greater chance of riches in this system by pulling yourself out of school and trying your luck at the lottery than you will ever have to reach the top through your hard work. That is how this society is rigged. Use the facts and learn or you`ll be chasing a pipe dream with lots of disappointment at the end, especially if you happen to be non-white and female. Of course the geniuses like hamid and tahmed will tell you the shape of the basement I reside in and the kind of food I eat, their only argument against Krugman was that he is a `liberal`, labels not facts guide their discourse. Take your pick, Fact of a caste society or the Horatio Alger Myth...
By all means boys and girls, listen to hamid if you want to gamble your lives away, you have a greater chance of riches in this system by pulling yourself out of school and trying your luck at the lottery than you will ever have to reach the top through your hard work. That is how this society is rigged. Use the facts and learn or you`ll be chasing a pipe dream with lots of disappointment at the end, especially if you happen to be non-white and female. Of course the geniuses like hamid and tahmed will tell you the shape of the basement I reside in and the kind of food I eat, their only argument against Krugman was that he is a `liberal`, labels not facts guide their discourse. Take your pick, Fact of a caste society or the Horatio Alger Myth...
#112 Posted by bjkumar on October 7, 2006 6:55:15 pm
Look yaaran, since Fiza did not answer, let me just have my say.
(Note: I did not have the patience to read all the interacts (I am getting tired of the same old crap, anyway), therefore, my apology if any parts of this are already covered.)
There is nothing wrong with a bit of fasting and a bit of discipline associated with that fasting – it is perhaps, medically speaking, even beneficial to the body (and those who have read some of my i-logs are aware that the Lord knows even I could lose a few pounds – which is a LOT harder than it looks)!
Gandhiji did fasting. Lalbahadur Shastri did it. Countless number of Hindus and those of other faith do it all over the world – on a variety of occasions!
In the same vein, there is nothing wrong in being faithful in your own heart and mind to whatever bhagwan or allah you guys and girls believe in – hey, whatever floats your boat! – even Angelina Jolie (or perhaps in an extremely depraved situation, perhaps even the Versey!) – hey, by all means feel free to go do your ibaadat, or bhajan, or saashtanga pranama or even a full-fledged routine of circus acrobatics – if that is what pleases you.
There is nothing wrong with any of that, because it is harmless stuff and it only affects the individual.
The problem starts when a bunch of guys (or gals) get together and start reinforcing each others’ bhakti streak. Then it seems to become a peer pressure thing – and somehow, each one tries to outdo the other!
What one feels inside oneself ceases to matter – it takes the back seat and in fact it becomes even unnecessary. The desire to show off that you are more “faithful” than the rest seems to start predominating!
And before one knows it – it becomes a clique – and those who are not members of the clique are looked down upon. And then people start whipping themselves to “prove” their excessive religiosity. And then they start killing people to prove that they are true to their faith. And it becomes an “us versus them” thing.
And from clique, it becomes a larger community – it engulfs whole societies and nations!
It becomes “us” Muslims versus “those” kafirs!
At that point, it is only a matter of time before confrontation develops! Name me one country which has a sizeable Muslim population and there is no confrontation with other religions (unless those other religions have already been chased away)?
And when there is any confrontation – the vast majority of Muslims take sides not based on the merits of any particular issue – but on the basis of whether one side is Muslim or not!
Any religion can have that type of situation, true! The unique thing that appears (at least to this ignorant individual) to be the case for your religion is that it discourages you from questioning whether it is okay to make your own judgment – you practically have no leeway on that score. Therefore, Muslim scholars that show even the slightest degree of openness of ideas are sidelined faster than a racehorse with a broken leg.
For over a year I have been asking this crowd – is there or is not there a “Muslims are exclusive” feeling among Muslims – especially Pakistani Muslims? A very simple question!
Nobody dares to give me a straight answer – even though the answer is so darn starkly obvious – are you or aren’t you all the children of a people who disowned your own motherland of birth to plead allegiance to a religion from far-away lands?!
You guys and gals went and built up a whole country strictly based on your “golden” religion! Yet all kinds of atrocities keep occurring in that “holy” land of yours – where is the “religion” that you keep feeling so exclusive about figuring in all of this?
You wear this “religion” shawl on rather tightly – and make too much a virtue out of being a Muslim – at least on the outside. Just the way for some people patriotism is the last refuge – for you guys and gals, your religion seems to have become the last refuge. However, for those people all over the world for whom patriotism is the last refuge – they are called scoundrels! But when it comes to Pakistan – if you started admitting that – it seems to demolish too many underlying myths behind your very existence – so everybody wimps out – dear Fiza being the latest namoona!
And yet you all wonder why so many people all over the world mistrust you?!! And then start convincing yourself – hey, there must be a conspiracy against Muslims!
I mean, come on – how dense can one be to understand the irony of such a question?!!!
#111 Posted by FizaPK on October 7, 2006 5:06:39 pm
Re: # 108
hehehe just a funny incident i wanted to relate got nothing to do with the article
in college one of my best friends was a tamil and this one day we were talking about how my parents were from india originally...she is like where in india..and i usually like telling ppl just to see the reaction from them so i told her...she goes ``whattt call urself pakistani and we indians will love u but dont say bihar again...ure not bihari!! ure pakistanii!!``
hehe then next yr with this other best friend of mine from delhi, i was like ``u dont wanna know where my parents are from?`` she is all like ``haha how bad can it be...are they from bihar??``
hahah lol
(sorry for wasting time...just thought it was funny)
hehehe just a funny incident i wanted to relate got nothing to do with the article
in college one of my best friends was a tamil and this one day we were talking about how my parents were from india originally...she is like where in india..and i usually like telling ppl just to see the reaction from them so i told her...she goes ``whattt call urself pakistani and we indians will love u but dont say bihar again...ure not bihari!! ure pakistanii!!``
hehe then next yr with this other best friend of mine from delhi, i was like ``u dont wanna know where my parents are from?`` she is all like ``haha how bad can it be...are they from bihar??``
hahah lol
(sorry for wasting time...just thought it was funny)
#110 Posted by FizaPK on October 7, 2006 5:01:07 pm
Re: # 109
it happens every weekend during ramadan outside my house and also a couple of other places near my house...i am sorry to hear u havent seen been seeing it more recently
it happens every weekend during ramadan outside my house and also a couple of other places near my house...i am sorry to hear u havent seen been seeing it more recently
#109 Posted by aquaris on October 7, 2006 4:26:13 pm
Re: # 107
sorry to ........interupt...
if my memory serves me right......
this Cricket in Ramzan..... started with Super Cup.... which was played during Ramzan..at the Eidgah ground , Nazimabad...... Maybe back in 80 or 81.
it was a 20 over each side affair, played on cemented wicket, .......and players like
Taslim Arif, Afzal Ahmed, Asif Mohammed, Liaqat Ali, .....etc....etc... were a regular feature.... it used to be played after 3 PM.... and usually used to end ...just before
Iftari..... and it was played with proper Hard Ball.....
....then some how....... it took to streets.......
and they started playing at night...... the first One I remembered was played in North Nazimabad. `` A `` Block``........ and it was played with Tennis Ball...... taped with cellophene to make if faster and bouncy........with Lights being arranged from the houses..... around the street , on which it was played...
then it took on.... and became a craze....and they started playing it every where....
it would normally start after ......`` Taraweeh ``.....and continue till the time of `` Sehri ``
at least till 1988 .....when things were relatively calmer in Karachi.....
Now I have rarely seen ........ such cricket being played...in karachi...
sorry to ........interupt...
if my memory serves me right......
this Cricket in Ramzan..... started with Super Cup.... which was played during Ramzan..at the Eidgah ground , Nazimabad...... Maybe back in 80 or 81.
it was a 20 over each side affair, played on cemented wicket, .......and players like
Taslim Arif, Afzal Ahmed, Asif Mohammed, Liaqat Ali, .....etc....etc... were a regular feature.... it used to be played after 3 PM.... and usually used to end ...just before
Iftari..... and it was played with proper Hard Ball.....
....then some how....... it took to streets.......
and they started playing at night...... the first One I remembered was played in North Nazimabad. `` A `` Block``........ and it was played with Tennis Ball...... taped with cellophene to make if faster and bouncy........with Lights being arranged from the houses..... around the street , on which it was played...
then it took on.... and became a craze....and they started playing it every where....
it would normally start after ......`` Taraweeh ``.....and continue till the time of `` Sehri ``
at least till 1988 .....when things were relatively calmer in Karachi.....
Now I have rarely seen ........ such cricket being played...in karachi...
#108 Posted by harimau on October 7, 2006 4:20:02 pm
Ref FizaPK #72
[Re: # 69
hahaha lolz u just lost out there sweetie...how do u know im not bihari hahaha...
well i am and very muchhhh pakistani indeed!!!]
Sweetheart, here was Zeemax waxing poetic about [If Fiza`s article is not about the love, unity and beauty of those of the Ummah, what else is it about?]
My point was about the couple of hundred thousand Biharis stranded in Bangladesh for 35 years now who want to exercise their rights as citizens of Pakistan to go live in Pakistan.
Zeemax would have nothing to say about that.
Just like Zeemax had nothing to say (on another board) about why Hindu Sindhis and Punjabis were driven out of Pakistan while shedding tears about how European Jews drove the Palestinians out from what is now Israel.
[and sorry u know what maybe ure sensitive cos i didnt mention indians there...an edited version of this article thats published every where else has indians too....i wrote the article in a hurry ... sowwieeee...]
You SHOULD have mentioned Indian Muslims. It would have soothed the soul of a guy named bulleya (otherwise known as Chowk`s Military Correspondent as well as Business Sections Editor with Special Interest in IT) who has been unable to find Indian Muslims anywhere in the USA (actually, the Bay Area was his former location) or Canada (his current).
Happy fasting. Or breaking the fast. Or whatever! One doesn`t know what to wish when the other party is experiencing severe pangs of hunger.
PS. Considering that such a nice person as you have come out of Bihar, I apologize for my earlier comments elsewhere that Bihar ought to be nuked. bjkumar, please note this.
[Re: # 69
hahaha lolz u just lost out there sweetie...how do u know im not bihari hahaha...
well i am and very muchhhh pakistani indeed!!!]
Sweetheart, here was Zeemax waxing poetic about [If Fiza`s article is not about the love, unity and beauty of those of the Ummah, what else is it about?]
My point was about the couple of hundred thousand Biharis stranded in Bangladesh for 35 years now who want to exercise their rights as citizens of Pakistan to go live in Pakistan.
Zeemax would have nothing to say about that.
Just like Zeemax had nothing to say (on another board) about why Hindu Sindhis and Punjabis were driven out of Pakistan while shedding tears about how European Jews drove the Palestinians out from what is now Israel.
[and sorry u know what maybe ure sensitive cos i didnt mention indians there...an edited version of this article thats published every where else has indians too....i wrote the article in a hurry ... sowwieeee...]
You SHOULD have mentioned Indian Muslims. It would have soothed the soul of a guy named bulleya (otherwise known as Chowk`s Military Correspondent as well as Business Sections Editor with Special Interest in IT) who has been unable to find Indian Muslims anywhere in the USA (actually, the Bay Area was his former location) or Canada (his current).
Happy fasting. Or breaking the fast. Or whatever! One doesn`t know what to wish when the other party is experiencing severe pangs of hunger.
PS. Considering that such a nice person as you have come out of Bihar, I apologize for my earlier comments elsewhere that Bihar ought to be nuked. bjkumar, please note this.
#107 Posted by anil on October 7, 2006 4:12:55 pm
Fiza:
Your memories must be very beautiful to have expressed them from Karachi to Berkely. Mid night cricket must be wonderful to watch.
Anil
Your memories must be very beautiful to have expressed them from Karachi to Berkely. Mid night cricket must be wonderful to watch.
Anil
#106 Posted by aquaris on October 7, 2006 4:06:11 pm
Ramzan
just an excercise in being Good...... at attempt on trying to be good, disciplined, and of course........ with thoughts.......or having earned a few SAWABs.....
Personally I don`t care about EARNINGs .....SAWABs ... this way... but any how...
How much goodness it brings out , out of you.... depends on How really good you are....in the first place.....!!
...any artificiallity............ will show through..... only you will have to look at .....it.....
Properly....
#105 Posted by JayJay on October 7, 2006 3:53:57 pm
``Ramadan`` or ``Ramzan`` -- 99% Pakis still call it Ramzan. Why Arabicise away your lives?
``Reverted to Islam`` -- what a crap? It only reflects compulsive self-righteousness of the Muslims all over the world.
``Reverted to Islam`` -- what a crap? It only reflects compulsive self-righteousness of the Muslims all over the world.
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