My Ramadan

GT writes <<< As far as my understanding goes I believe that Americans think that hard work and knowledge are neither necessary nor sufficient for power. Yes, with hard work, they do believe that, one gets a shot at fame, power, what have you. >>>

You can`t have it both ways, if without hard work you don`t get a shot at fame, power, wealth but only get government cheese than you cannot say that Americans think that hard work is not a necessary condition to attain wealth and power. Of course as the economy is changing and people, like those in the ghetto discovered long time back, are discovering that they stay at the same level or fall below regardless of hard work, they are adjusting their feelings. Traditionally this hard work power/wealth link has been strongly adhered to by the US public, and it still is revealed by surveys conducted regarding social welfare, most feel that ``hard work is the best way to improve your lot``.

bulleya writes <<< only in america!!.............. >>>

True, like a Las Vegas Casino, few win big, (with hard work and knowledge playing no part), the vast majority lose, the powers that be (the Casino owners) regardless of the few winners, always walk away with the biggest pie. My point exactly.

Read <<< The Horatio Alger tales are myths >>>

as, The Horatio Alger tales are myths for the vast majority given aggregate statistics and as such don`t prove anything about this society and system.

GT writes <<< By your own account, you worked hard - someone noticed and helped you get a scholarship - now you are teaching - you seem to be proud of your achivement - and so more power to you too. >>>>

That is exactly the opposite of what these ``work hard and you will make it in America`` crowd says. The person who gave me a shot was neither groomed by this system nor defines it, that is why his decision was more of an exception than the rule. Most people in the US, as revealed by mobility stats, regardless of hard work and increasing productivity, stay at the same level and never progress, those that do, are a very tiny percent, do so over generations and only incrementally. The Horatio Alger tales are myths. Regarding Mills, like I said he is merely taking the assertion of Hamid 2 pack to its logical conclusion which does indeed lead to equivalence, ``ideal type`` analysis of every kind can similarly be equated. What he is simply stating is that it is prepostrous to define power in terms of knowledge, or wealth in terms of knowledge. Very simple statement, you want to pick at its molecules to discredit what he says which is quite disingenuous.

Re: # 241

romair,

``i think us foreign policy has now reached evil proportions, which is one of the reasons i left that country.`` ........... nonsense !........ if you did, you are a bigger fool than arjun makes you out to be ..........

......... every time i go to the valley i am overwhelmed - personally, as a life time day laborer working at daily wages, i don`t think i could handle the pressure (besides, i am too old) .......... however, i have a lot of admiration for the tireless men and women who work there - they are truly amazing ! ..........

Re: # 238

aslam,

....... one of my friends was the project director and then general manager for best cement ...... sir anwar pervez was able to do it because he had never heard of this character c. wright mills and masadi ........ and there are many others like him all over the world ......... it is always better to work hard instead of whining about the system - unless you are shameless and like government cheese .........

hamidm/zeemax#.......anil is probably the best person to comment on silicon valley, as he wheels and deals with those who sit at the top of this pyramid.........however, i have had an opportunity to wheel and deal with a group one or two levels, below that........

i arrived in the usa with two semester tuition money and no future in pakistan (as an unemployed military officer, with a useless math degree)..........seven years later, i was a part of a company, in silicon valley that had around 175 employees and was sold for over $600 million.......i was employee number 75 or so.........you can do the math on how much each person was worth........

i cannot think of any other place in the world where this could have happened, other than the usa.......in fact, even in the usa, i cannot think of too many other places this could have happened, than silicon valley.........

with me, arrived around nine other or so, students from middle class karachi - all graduates of ned type universities.........one of them hit it big in cisco, through stock options, and owned a small mansion by the time he was 30.......the others struggled along......then three of them started their own companies............two out of these three designed their own chips that are used in wireless equipment.......another authored security software for wireless equipment..........one has around $70 million of funding, the other has around $10 million of funding.......the former`s company is set for a huge expected ipo......the third sold his company and now is a vp in the company that bought his, and has employees under him from israel to mountain view.....all these guys are still in their mid-30s............

most of these guys barely owned a car in pakistan........one of them was my roommate briefly, in college, when we had a broken down shack with no furniture - we use to sit on the floor to eat......at this point, half of them own luxury houses in prime silicon valley areas - a few with swimming pools.........

once again, i cannot think of any other place than silicon valley where this could have happened.........now all these guys are becoming a small group of angel investors......they look for promising ideas, pool in their money and connections and fund others.........

i suppose there is a flip side to it also.........the company that i was a part of that got sold eventually didn`t amount to much........the .com bubble burst and the buyer was left with quite a few products that were unmarketable.........the buyers probably paid over $500 million more than they should have......not to mention my options went down to a fraction of what they originally were..........however, it was a great feeling to be quite rich for a while (even on paper)...........

only in america!!..............

i think us foreign policy has now reached evil proportions, which is one of the reasons i left that country........however domestic usa, especially in the more liberal states like california still has a lot to offer...........

Ref hamidm2 #208

[...... after many years i ran into a iranian guy who had flunked out of engineering school, then flunked out of business school and finally flunked out of sociology school to start an electronics retail business ........... i asked him how things were going and he said: `` things are going great - i buy something for a 100 dollar, sell it for 200, make my 2% and i am happy ``]

Iranian guy selling electronics goods? Heck, I always call them rug merchants, never Iranians!

Ref echoboom #223

[.... an intelligent man... cannot afford to be a non-muslim.]

The entire world has about 85% non-Muslims.

All useful inventions have come from non-Muslims. Such as the telegraph, telephone, television, computers, rockets, satellites, vaccines against diseases, etc.

Hopefully someone will invent a vaccine against Islam.

The only thing Muslims can teach the world would be about humping camels.

PS. You got to admit that the last line is a great pun.

hamid
you must have heard about sir anwar pervez a potohari from gujar khan he came to uk with £5 in his pocket worked as a bus driver in bradford, then went on to build the second biggest cash&carry group in uk the bestway group. i believe he`s also building cement plants in pakistan.

echo,

did you notice who was in the nba finals last year ? ....... and do you know why? ..........arn`t you amazed at what mark cuban has accomplished so far (and it ain`t over yet) ........ now, tell me, what did mills accomplish in his usleless lifetime other than publishing rubbish to torture generations of college sophomores and provide material for sophomoric delusional professors at community colleges who think they are the successors to plato and einstein .......

another good news for masadi. zidane never did a head butt on that italian player. that was all all a trick of the evil media. ha! ha!

this is what the media reported



this is what actually happened.

Zeemax & Mr. Masadi:

These guys who feel so frustrated and inadequate when they veer into your arenas is that these guys are the ``practical and ``pragmatic`` types [this I am saying with all the contempt, derision, and detestation I have for such kind]. They are like the gadget users whose knowledge about science is limited to the manual & owner`s guide. If you start discussing
theoritical physics with them they will feel lost & disoriented.

There is no money in it. To them it is useless knowledge. No wonder a Bill Gates appears
to them more important than a Stephen Hawking or Linus Pauling (a man hounded by these
vultures lolling in vulgarity & vice but adorning it with the Sainthood of ``Progress``.

Majority of the people are their kind. These people are what we call masses, commoners,
avaam. The only trouble is that when some of them get some money, status, and power they get this notion in their empty heads that they are more important to society than a Chomsky, a Mills, a Hawking, a Whitman, or a Rousseau.

John Maynard Keyes said something very profound , a long time ago, that the techie types; the shopkeeper types, in short-the material movers as compared to mind-movers--[ this is my coinage] have very little clue who truly runs their life. Who makes the decision in their lives & how then they go about doing whatever they are doing--and these are the poets, the philosophers,which includes mullahs/priests.

Mr. Masadi`s only fault is that he consorts with such kind and tries to play chess with those who only excel at contact sports.

Re: # 228

zeemax,

..... i don`t know about ICQ, but as a professional powerpointologist i love ms word and excel which work seamlessly with powerpoint - i have no complaints ....... lotus, visicalc and many others were fine stand alone products in their day, but they lost out to better products ....... lotus lost out when it failed to cope with transition to 32 bit applications running on windows 95 - lotus smartsuite was a day late and a dollar short ........... but notes/domino is still vey much alive and the lotus brand is still thriving under ibm ........... most of the 4000 odd employees made out like bandits when ibm bought the company in the mid nineties ......... i am sure manzi and mitch kapor are not hurting either as venture capitalists ...........

........ and reardless of what mills says there are more important things than the internet - did you notice who was in the nba finals last year ? ....... and do you know why?

Re: # 231 by zeemax

Zee:

I have no problem with commercialization. I do have a problem with monopolies (or a few oligopolists) though. And monopolies can be checked by careful and intelligent de-regulation and for certain cases by increasing regulations.

You say:

``So beware. Your freedom of internet is not going to last for long. ``

If it comes to that then I shall live with it.

Got to go ....

....contd....#231

......missed that the difference between usenet and www is that to access usenet you had to pay for software but not the content. With www, the access is free but you have to pay even now, and much more later, for content.

Actually, www killed usenet and IRC for this very purpose. I don`t know if anyone gets my point.