shobig sifar November 2, 2006
#23 Posted by Urstruly on November 5, 2006 7:54:09 pm
Naqshbandi & Shobig
I also know many people who studied in USSR during 70s and even early 80s. Everyone of them have attested that the standard of living was quite high as compared to what Western propaganda machinery led the rest of the world to beleive with their lies.
I also know many people who studied in USSR during 70s and even early 80s. Everyone of them have attested that the standard of living was quite high as compared to what Western propaganda machinery led the rest of the world to beleive with their lies.
#22 Posted by shobig_sifar on November 5, 2006 6:57:27 am
#16 Glad you liked it Naqshbandi sahib. The younger gneration, as I have stated in the article, is much more genial and welcoming compared to the older one. But I won`t go as far as saying they are polite, and my doing so could rather be attributed to my obliviousnes to their language and social gestures. Indeed, exceptions are everywhere.
I neither experienced nor witnessed any acts of violence throughout my sojourn, so can`t say much in that respect. There was one little incident I encountered on a subway, but even that didn`t have any recial undetone to it. However, since the economic conditions have declined abruptly and this fact is pretty conspicuous, I would naturally expect the crime rate to soar. One reason for this being that the police, much like the case in the subcontinent, is notorious for its co-operation with the criminals and its ripping apart of the tourists. But, speaking for myself, I walked alone on the alleys and in the subway stations until as late as 1 a.m., on most of the nights, with an SLR hanging around my neck, and still have managed to return in one piece.
The Moscow State University IS fantastic, nobody is doubting that, with all the facilities that you`d expect in a cosmopolis, but again it is not very well maintained. In fact, I developed the same notion about almost every thing there. It looked as if the Russians, as if in an instant fit of glorification, accumulated a lot of wealth and initiated a brisk wave of progress in every walk of life, but then suddenly, as if they lost interest it would seem, left everything in the middle, to look after itself. There`s everything there; it`s just outdated!
And Atif is spot on in #20 that Russians are some of the brainiest people in the world. They would venture into things in the fields of Mathematics and Physics that the rest of the world won`t even dare even tread close to. But the downward spiral has played its part here too, despite teh fact that they have managed to maintain some standards. For example, this conference that I went to, was the first one in Physics to be organised in Moscow in a span of about 30 years! That is a real tragedy for a country that has been the heart of excellence in pure sciences and whose pople have contributed more to its various deciplines for decades than perhaps the rest of the world combined!
I neither experienced nor witnessed any acts of violence throughout my sojourn, so can`t say much in that respect. There was one little incident I encountered on a subway, but even that didn`t have any recial undetone to it. However, since the economic conditions have declined abruptly and this fact is pretty conspicuous, I would naturally expect the crime rate to soar. One reason for this being that the police, much like the case in the subcontinent, is notorious for its co-operation with the criminals and its ripping apart of the tourists. But, speaking for myself, I walked alone on the alleys and in the subway stations until as late as 1 a.m., on most of the nights, with an SLR hanging around my neck, and still have managed to return in one piece.
The Moscow State University IS fantastic, nobody is doubting that, with all the facilities that you`d expect in a cosmopolis, but again it is not very well maintained. In fact, I developed the same notion about almost every thing there. It looked as if the Russians, as if in an instant fit of glorification, accumulated a lot of wealth and initiated a brisk wave of progress in every walk of life, but then suddenly, as if they lost interest it would seem, left everything in the middle, to look after itself. There`s everything there; it`s just outdated!
And Atif is spot on in #20 that Russians are some of the brainiest people in the world. They would venture into things in the fields of Mathematics and Physics that the rest of the world won`t even dare even tread close to. But the downward spiral has played its part here too, despite teh fact that they have managed to maintain some standards. For example, this conference that I went to, was the first one in Physics to be organised in Moscow in a span of about 30 years! That is a real tragedy for a country that has been the heart of excellence in pure sciences and whose pople have contributed more to its various deciplines for decades than perhaps the rest of the world combined!
#21 Posted by abskii on November 4, 2006 4:30:36 pm
An interesting account, and comparisons between old and new, organised and chaotic.
I like your writing - keep it up!
I like your writing - keep it up!
#20 Posted by atif2 on November 4, 2006 9:08:26 am
naqshbandi # 17 ``He said Moscow State University was fantastic and that living conditions were actually v. good despite Western propoganda``
although i have rarely seen any western propaganda about russian universities, i would say that I have met some amazingly brilliant students from russia. they are some of the sharpest people you find in the fields of maths, science and finance. despite the downward spiral that russia has been in for a while, they still seem to have sustained a decent standard in higher education.
also, i have learned that during the 60s and 70s quite a significant number of pakistanis would go to russian universities for studies. cost of studies in russia were / are much cheaper than in europe and north america. I think that trend fell off after the invasion of afghanistan and the ensuing hostilities between pakistan and russia.
but after seeing what sharapova has done to my emotional well being, i am beginning to give benefit of doubt to communist ideology.
although i have rarely seen any western propaganda about russian universities, i would say that I have met some amazingly brilliant students from russia. they are some of the sharpest people you find in the fields of maths, science and finance. despite the downward spiral that russia has been in for a while, they still seem to have sustained a decent standard in higher education.
also, i have learned that during the 60s and 70s quite a significant number of pakistanis would go to russian universities for studies. cost of studies in russia were / are much cheaper than in europe and north america. I think that trend fell off after the invasion of afghanistan and the ensuing hostilities between pakistan and russia.
but after seeing what sharapova has done to my emotional well being, i am beginning to give benefit of doubt to communist ideology.
#19 Posted by nadeem_sadiq on November 4, 2006 8:03:12 am
I reckon I was there, atleast now :),
A comprehensive and genial insight to unveil some of the aspects, awesome buddy. I wonder the success rate as they launched “Superman Returns”, looking forward as much is still in airs waiting to settle down ;)
“I was allotted accommodation free of cost in the guest house of the Moscow State University. It was like a dream come true, for the main building of MSU has to me always been the most fascinating university building in the world”
When dreams commencing to wear the charm of reality, some believe it’s to start pack-up, anyways keep living your dreams and and and it never stops, having said that, there is something to halt everything.
Hope soon there will be something from you to compel me for visiting CHOWK and CHOWKIES!!!
A comprehensive and genial insight to unveil some of the aspects, awesome buddy. I wonder the success rate as they launched “Superman Returns”, looking forward as much is still in airs waiting to settle down ;)
“I was allotted accommodation free of cost in the guest house of the Moscow State University. It was like a dream come true, for the main building of MSU has to me always been the most fascinating university building in the world”
When dreams commencing to wear the charm of reality, some believe it’s to start pack-up, anyways keep living your dreams and and and it never stops, having said that, there is something to halt everything.
Hope soon there will be something from you to compel me for visiting CHOWK and CHOWKIES!!!
#17 Posted by Naqshbandi on November 4, 2006 7:19:22 am
I used to know a brother from Ghana who lived and studied engineering in Moscow during the 70s. He said Moscow State University was fantastic and that living conditions were actually v. good despite Western propoganda.
#16 Posted by Naqshbandi on November 4, 2006 7:16:58 am
thanks for this article. i`ve always wanted to visit Moscow--the former capital of the other (ex)superpower. Also Russians in my experience are very polite and cultured people and their women are v beautiful (Sultan Suleiman the Magnificient fell for the charms of one such Slavic beauty--Roxana)--BUT according to the British news channels there is an alarming rise in racist violence in Russia at present and if you`re brown it is not safe. Is this true or is Sky exaggerating? One of my Farsi teachers was a beautiful Russian lady! My Iranian-ex lived in Moscow for a year....
You know, I sometimes feel nostalgic about the old USSR. At least then, with both the USA and the USSR locked in a MAD conflict, we had a balance of terror. Now, the US is too powerful and has no effective checks. Bring back the Soviets!
(Although the Russians still have a formidable nuclear arsenal it has to be said...)
You know, I sometimes feel nostalgic about the old USSR. At least then, with both the USA and the USSR locked in a MAD conflict, we had a balance of terror. Now, the US is too powerful and has no effective checks. Bring back the Soviets!
(Although the Russians still have a formidable nuclear arsenal it has to be said...)
#14 Posted by hiren on November 4, 2006 1:23:44 am
liked ur piece. can we connect. how do we do it.
hiren
hiren
#15 Posted by shobig_sifar on November 4, 2006 5:46:38 am
#11 irony, ain`t it ironic that men have a huge capacity to be landed anywhere anytime throughout their lives ;)
#12 That`s an interesting question you ask scout. I`d ceretainly love to go there again, like I said earlier the place had certain feels and impressions exclusive to it; actually any place is good enough to visit at least once in a life time, as long as the visit is by choice and not by necessity. Because in the latter case, even the sweetest of joiurneys would appear burdensome. As for myself, the nomad in me would find it really hard to settle down at one place, just like my mind finds it hard to settle on nb, or aimie .... if you know what I mean! :P
#13 I certainly did, the only thing missing was a Bengali tigress`s company... :|
#14 Thanks Hiren. You can reach me at einsqad2@hotmail.com
#12 That`s an interesting question you ask scout. I`d ceretainly love to go there again, like I said earlier the place had certain feels and impressions exclusive to it; actually any place is good enough to visit at least once in a life time, as long as the visit is by choice and not by necessity. Because in the latter case, even the sweetest of joiurneys would appear burdensome. As for myself, the nomad in me would find it really hard to settle down at one place, just like my mind finds it hard to settle on nb, or aimie .... if you know what I mean! :P
#13 I certainly did, the only thing missing was a Bengali tigress`s company... :|
#14 Thanks Hiren. You can reach me at einsqad2@hotmail.com
#13 Posted by nb on November 3, 2006 11:20:43 pm
Looks like you had a good time, Shobig! I had no idea you didn;t really like red meat. I love the words-giganticness,vautingly..!
#12 Posted by scout_new on November 3, 2006 10:02:17 pm
What a cute little travelogue... but would you ever go back?
#11 Posted by iron_mask on November 3, 2006 8:49:51 am
#10 was it that obvious that shobig needed a landing!
I guess the tongue hanging out......at the sights......
I guess the tongue hanging out......at the sights......
#10 Posted by atif2 on November 3, 2006 8:27:47 am
sandhu #8 ``if only you had more time you could have landed a Russian girlfriend.``
actually, I would put it the other way around...if only he had more time, some russian damsel could have landed shobig payee :(
actually, I would put it the other way around...if only he had more time, some russian damsel could have landed shobig payee :(
#8 Posted by amansandhu on November 3, 2006 6:15:02 am
Shobig,
Interesting read, if only you had more time you could have landed a Russian girlfriend.
Interesting read, if only you had more time you could have landed a Russian girlfriend.
#9 Posted by shobig_sifar on November 3, 2006 6:34:08 am
Re: # 8 You hit the nail on the head! Just a coupla more hours is all I needed...JUST A COUPLE! :(
#7 Posted by bjkumar on November 3, 2006 4:39:21 am
#5 Shobig
[BJ sahib #3: Why so much emphasis on the `and fat` thingy? ]
Ama yaar, you know the connection!
“Rich and fatty
Go together like
Shirt and panty
Ask your
Chowkee brudder….
Can’t have one
Without the udder...”
#6 Posted by shobig_sifar on November 3, 2006 3:06:49 am
Further to my #5 for #1, the 1000 word limit meant I had to make a choice between a description of the various sites and that of my view of the society and the city as a whole. I picked up the latter blending in some elements of the former. But one thing I do regret having missed on this journey is a visit to St. Petersburg. I had plans for that but it turned out to be too much of a rush towards the end.
And indeed, there are some finer details a la my `run into blossoming girls` and especially some pertaining to that last night, that I have had to deliberately skip for the sake of my reputation. We can always get back to them offline! ;)
And indeed, there are some finer details a la my `run into blossoming girls` and especially some pertaining to that last night, that I have had to deliberately skip for the sake of my reputation. We can always get back to them offline! ;)
#5 Posted by shobig_sifar on November 3, 2006 2:06:04 am
Atif payee #1:
``Although I get this feeling that you did not have enough time on your hand to do more sight seeing. And yes, this cyrillic alphabet is a pain.``
I think you are right to some extent. I had a very busy schedule there, since it is the biggest annual conference in the world in my descipline with 700+ participants from across the globe, and had only one week to it. Add to that the money constraint I had (my school`s getting more and more miserly by the day :( ). But I was pretty satisfied with the site-seeing in the end. On the Sunday that I mentioned, the organisers had arranged quite a few excursions to various significant places (of course one had to choose one or at the most two out of them) I opted for a bus-tour around the city. And we did manage to have a glimpe of almost every major site in the central city. Then a boat-trip on the Moscow river more than made up for rest. But to be honest, quite like yourself, the buildings and structures do not really inspire me, and that`s the best you can get in a cosmopolitan city. To me it is the feeling of being there and the apparently petty experiences and endeavors that count more. The best part of that visit for me was my walk to the metro station early in the morning and back to the University in the evening. The campus is located in a quiet corner of the city. And so traversing alone down the seemingly `unbounded` lanes of Moscow, accompanied by the pleasant mist in the air, the soothing breezes, and the serenity in the atmosphere have had a feel that I`d savor for years.
``Usually, cyrillic alphabets are one to one match of english alphbets. This way within a few minutes you can form your key to all road signs. The easiest way of course is to download it from the net, but that takes prior thinking:) ``
And that I inevitably did, albeit not in a few minutes but, blame it on my dumbness, in a couple of days! :D The fact that I hardly took on the road on my own, since I used metro to commute, meant that I didn`t get any chance to familiarise myself with the road signs. But the metro stations did a good enough job for me in that regard. The color -coding of the lines, the simplicity of the map and the efficiency and punctuality of the metro service were a great help and it didn`t take me long to get used to it.
BJ sahib #3: Why so much emphasis on the `and fat` thingy? Mind you, Russian people, particularly the youth, are some of the physically fittest and smartest people I have come across.
And, I did pass on some suggestions and proposals to the authorites regarding various issues, but only in English :) !
Khamkhwa payee #4:
`twas the plot actually!
``Although I get this feeling that you did not have enough time on your hand to do more sight seeing. And yes, this cyrillic alphabet is a pain.``
I think you are right to some extent. I had a very busy schedule there, since it is the biggest annual conference in the world in my descipline with 700+ participants from across the globe, and had only one week to it. Add to that the money constraint I had (my school`s getting more and more miserly by the day :( ). But I was pretty satisfied with the site-seeing in the end. On the Sunday that I mentioned, the organisers had arranged quite a few excursions to various significant places (of course one had to choose one or at the most two out of them) I opted for a bus-tour around the city. And we did manage to have a glimpe of almost every major site in the central city. Then a boat-trip on the Moscow river more than made up for rest. But to be honest, quite like yourself, the buildings and structures do not really inspire me, and that`s the best you can get in a cosmopolitan city. To me it is the feeling of being there and the apparently petty experiences and endeavors that count more. The best part of that visit for me was my walk to the metro station early in the morning and back to the University in the evening. The campus is located in a quiet corner of the city. And so traversing alone down the seemingly `unbounded` lanes of Moscow, accompanied by the pleasant mist in the air, the soothing breezes, and the serenity in the atmosphere have had a feel that I`d savor for years.
``Usually, cyrillic alphabets are one to one match of english alphbets. This way within a few minutes you can form your key to all road signs. The easiest way of course is to download it from the net, but that takes prior thinking:) ``
And that I inevitably did, albeit not in a few minutes but, blame it on my dumbness, in a couple of days! :D The fact that I hardly took on the road on my own, since I used metro to commute, meant that I didn`t get any chance to familiarise myself with the road signs. But the metro stations did a good enough job for me in that regard. The color -coding of the lines, the simplicity of the map and the efficiency and punctuality of the metro service were a great help and it didn`t take me long to get used to it.
BJ sahib #3: Why so much emphasis on the `and fat` thingy? Mind you, Russian people, particularly the youth, are some of the physically fittest and smartest people I have come across.
And, I did pass on some suggestions and proposals to the authorites regarding various issues, but only in English :) !
Khamkhwa payee #4:
`twas the plot actually!
#4 Posted by khamkhwa on November 2, 2006 6:21:28 pm
[And boy, did they oblige!]
...this was what kept me go through the entire narrative and at the end i felt cheated...but being an eternal optimist, i wait for the more juicier next instalment...;)
...this was what kept me go through the entire narrative and at the end i felt cheated...but being an eternal optimist, i wait for the more juicier next instalment...;)
#3 Posted by bjkumar on November 2, 2006 6:09:35 pm
Shobig, from the very first exit sign – you seem to have gotten started on the wrong foot. To have a more pleasant experience the next time around, don’t forget the following take “home” lessons:
(1) The golden rule: when in another country – follow their lead. If they don’t speak English – well, that’s the way it is. Carry a dictionary or at least an alphabet – a rich, fat native speaker friend would be even better.
(2) Do not get miffed because the airport is laid out all wrong – come up with a redesigned proposal and get some money for it. Ask the rich fat guy who should get the proposal. Ask him if HE would fund it.
(3) Do not get miffed if the metro station is shabbily maintained. Come up with some janitorial suggestions. Find the rich fat guy who should get the suggestions. Ask him if HE would fund it.
(3) Do not ask for directions from old creeps – just from the young and lovely Russian daisies. You seem to have figured that already, but here is what you need to ensure – if the young and lovely Russian daisies are rich and fat – they are to be preferred.
(4) Stay for free in the University Guest House. (You got that one, too!) Unless you can stay for free in the house of some rich and fat young and lovely Russian daisy, of course!
(5) When everything else fails, take comfort from the fact that you (probably) had more fun than Delhiwala did in Las Vegas! (Delhiwala may disagree. (Ignore him! (Unless he meets the definition of “rich and fat”, in which case do not ignore him – just cultivate his friendship for the purposes outlined in the previous items.)))
(1) The golden rule: when in another country – follow their lead. If they don’t speak English – well, that’s the way it is. Carry a dictionary or at least an alphabet – a rich, fat native speaker friend would be even better.
(2) Do not get miffed because the airport is laid out all wrong – come up with a redesigned proposal and get some money for it. Ask the rich fat guy who should get the proposal. Ask him if HE would fund it.
(3) Do not get miffed if the metro station is shabbily maintained. Come up with some janitorial suggestions. Find the rich fat guy who should get the suggestions. Ask him if HE would fund it.
(3) Do not ask for directions from old creeps – just from the young and lovely Russian daisies. You seem to have figured that already, but here is what you need to ensure – if the young and lovely Russian daisies are rich and fat – they are to be preferred.
(4) Stay for free in the University Guest House. (You got that one, too!) Unless you can stay for free in the house of some rich and fat young and lovely Russian daisy, of course!
(5) When everything else fails, take comfort from the fact that you (probably) had more fun than Delhiwala did in Las Vegas! (Delhiwala may disagree. (Ignore him! (Unless he meets the definition of “rich and fat”, in which case do not ignore him – just cultivate his friendship for the purposes outlined in the previous items.)))
#2 Posted by atif2 on November 2, 2006 11:23:07 am
What I wanted to say with my example of Sheraton, and which I think I left off completely, is that usually hotel names are written in both english and cyrillic. And once you match all alphabets of Sheraton with their cyrillic alphabets, and you repeat that with some other famous icons, within few minutes you will have your key that you can use for all the road signs which are typically only in cyrillic.
#1 Posted by atif2 on November 2, 2006 11:17:44 am
``From then on, I made a note to approach only the lively and lovely young Russian women for that purpose. And boy, did they oblige! ``
hahaha...I am sure they did. Probably one of them looked u in the eyes and said ``Shobig ji, maiN tay jammee tavanooN rah dassan laee see`` :)
Nice narrative. Although I get this feeling that you did not have enough time on your hand to do more sight seeing. And yes, this cyrillic alphabet is a pain. All I remember from my experiences is that their ``P`` is our ``R``. Actually the best way to decipher if you suddenly find yourself in a cyrillic country (and I think there are only 3 such countries - Russia, Belarus, and Bulgaria) is to look around where you are standing and see if you can spot a hotel, say Sheraton. Usually, cyrillic alphabets are one to one match of english alphbets. This way within a few minutes you can form your key to all road signs. The easiest way of course is to download it from the net, but that takes prior thinking:)
But you missed on one important detail of your trip...your run into girls who were about to blossom :)
hahaha...I am sure they did. Probably one of them looked u in the eyes and said ``Shobig ji, maiN tay jammee tavanooN rah dassan laee see`` :)
Nice narrative. Although I get this feeling that you did not have enough time on your hand to do more sight seeing. And yes, this cyrillic alphabet is a pain. All I remember from my experiences is that their ``P`` is our ``R``. Actually the best way to decipher if you suddenly find yourself in a cyrillic country (and I think there are only 3 such countries - Russia, Belarus, and Bulgaria) is to look around where you are standing and see if you can spot a hotel, say Sheraton. Usually, cyrillic alphabets are one to one match of english alphbets. This way within a few minutes you can form your key to all road signs. The easiest way of course is to download it from the net, but that takes prior thinking:)
But you missed on one important detail of your trip...your run into girls who were about to blossom :)
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