Wahabism in Centers of Learning

#141 you are almost right on the small picture. And dead wrong on the big picture.

Small Picture: that the vast majority of people in pakistan use irrational means to fight disease. You got that right.

Big Picture: billions of other people across the world - in every continent, of every religion, nationality and race - do the same.

So, you are as wrong in claiming that islam is the problem as the echobooms of pakistan are wrong in claiming that their jehaliyat (which they incorrectly call islam) is the solution.

The only solution is common sense and being able to get the big picture.

Re: # 141

SR,

...... i admire your nobility, humanity and altruism in wanting to take the moral high ground and trying to reason with these vicious beasts ! .......... it is like the jews trying to argue with their prophet at khandaq or, many centuries later, trying to argue with the nazis in warsaw - it doesn`t work with people who believe that they are right and everyone else is wrong ............. there is no room for dialog

Way back in 1953 when MAulana Maududi was arrested he was called the ``most dangerous man`` in Pakistan...................now his followers have multiplied and populated themselves all over Pakistan turning it into the most dangerous place on the world..............

Re: # 138

A lot of perversion has taken place in the name of ``Classical Scholarship`` . Who decides what is `Classicial `` and what is ``Heretical`` Scholarship? Maududi Saheb`s works was indeed the paradigm of ``Classical Scholarship`` - why do you not ask the Jamat followers?
OTOH some of the new tafsirs may turn out to be path breaking. Most pious muslims and modern Mufassireen are realizing the need for modern tafsirs that are in sync with the modern times.

The message is indeed final but not the interpretation !!...............with the modern education you can do better than quoting over and over again from the ``Classical Scholars`` after all the almighty indeed shows the signs everyday to you and you can `read` them with your modern knowldge than ask the ``Shaykh`` all the time what these signs mean..............

Re: # 140

Hamidm Sahib:

``3.PESHAWAR: Peshawar High Court (PHC) Chief Justice Tariq Pervaiz Khan has ordered women lawyers not to wear veils in courtrooms, .... ``

May be you should send this to that teacher in England who wanted to teach in the class weraing the veil.

Anil

Dengue Fever ... and proposed ``Quranic remedy``

In recent weeks there have been some reported cases of Dengue in Karachi. Understandably, hemorrhagic fevers invoke fear and anxiety and are a serious public health concern. Pakistan has a fourty year history of outbreak clusters of hemorrhagic fevers... Ebola, Dengue and whatnot... Each episode is followed by an anxious convulsion and media burst that soon dies out until next time. Very little co-ordinated effort (let along any long term comprehensive plan) is made following these sporadic episodes. There is malaise and complacency at all levels.

So, what is my point?

This malaise and complacency is somehow linked to a chronic sickness of the mind. Either its the cause or the effect, I cannot say. But each such outburst is followed by widespread suggestions of various ``Quranic remedies`` the mere recitation of which ostensibly confer protection aganist the biological agent`s assault. This would be bad enough if it were merely being advocated by some self-appointed, self-righteous, illiterate in some village outside Mardan. But no. It appears in the main stream, high circulation, urdu news papers.

Obviously, the editorial board members and other opinion makers in society must subscribe to such counter productive notions (unless they are calculating and cynical villians). This is the mindset that needs to be confronted and defeated in the ``war of ideas`` and not through economic opportunism, exploitation and violence.

...SR

Re: # 141

I am sure Hamid Saheb is no recommending daisy cutters for all of us........he certainly prescribes it for the literalists wahabists............the real problem are these chest thumping , sword brandishing ``pious`` type individuals who think they own the Pakistani constitution because they can quote from that choutiya Maududi.............they certainly need to be sent tp lunatic asylums - call these asylums as Gitmo or Commie style ``Correction Centres`` or whatever you want .........we need to send these mullahs (and some of these ``Peers`` and ``Shaykhs`` as well ) out of the civil society of Pakistan...........

Re: # 140 hamidm {``.... it would be [a] mistake to put away the daisy cutters and shut down guantanamo yet ....``}

This is where we have a major point of departure.

All the ills of primitivism, barbarianism, discrimination, fanaticism, militancy and homicidal psychopathology that you decry and condemn the anachronistic reactionary elements for, are valid in principle. But then you turn around and, in the same breath, propose very similar violent and ``primitive`` remedies as antedotes to this ``chronic disease`` [your term].

The world needs to see clearly that the impact of the actions of one side are in sharp contrast to the other. One side, the side that claims moral high ground, ought to be able to visibly demonstrate, not through apologitic rhetorics but through action on-the-ground, as measured, objectively, on the basis of its NET IMPACT on the lives and well being of the innocent multitudes.

Otherwise, how does a man from Mars make a moral distinction between the two sides?

If, for instance, the Bill of Rights has to be suspended in order to ``save`` it, then what difference does it make whether it was Abdul Wahab, or John Calvin whose zealotous followers destroyed that sacred document and all it once promised and stood for? Is it not the same thing as a military strongman suspending the civilian constitution in order to ``save`` the country?

...SR

islam in action - subhanallah !

.... it seems that real islam (aka wahabism) is well and alive in the pakistan ...... these savages might not understand the concept of indoor toilets, personal hygiene, and sex with members of the same species, but they lead in the application of sharia as directed by their bedouin prophet ........... they might not be able to read or write or do simple arithmetic, but they are experts in law and jurisprudence ........... mashallah !

1. WANA: A Pakistani tribal council shaved the head of an alleged Taliban commander Friday and paraded him through a town bazaar as punishment for stealing cars, officials and residents said. Mohammad Nazar’s house was also destroyed and his belongings set on fire after the 30-year-old was blamed for a rash of vehicle thefts in South Waziristan district in the past few months, they told AFP.

2.MIRANSHAH: Local Taliban in North Waziristan beheaded an Islamic cleric for allegedly spying for the United States in Afghanistan, officials said on Friday. The decapitated body of Maulvi Salahuddin, 50, was found on Friday morning in Makeen area, 75 kilometres south of Miranshah. A note attached to the body warned: “The Maulvi was an American spy and all of you will face this (fate) if you follow him.”

3.PESHAWAR: Peshawar High Court (PHC) Chief Justice Tariq Pervaiz Khan has ordered women lawyers not to wear veils in courtrooms, saying they (the women lawyers) could neither be identified nor assist the court well in veils. Ms Anjum told Daily Times that there was a difference of opinion in the judiciary on the issue. “On one hand, Peshawar Sessions Judge Hayat Ali Shah tells women lawyers to wear veils when coming to his court, while the PHC chief justice wants women lawyers appearing in court without veils.”

............ it would be mistake to put away the daisy cutters and shut down guantanamo yet .........

#137 by Naqshbandi

[No, it is true. It is one of the rewards which *all* Muslims will get in Paradise]

Wow. That sounds fantastic! Houris AND Ghilmans! No wonder Ahmadiyyas like Manto want to force genuine Muslims to accept them as true Muslims! They want Houris and Ghilmans just like a true Muslim! NO WAY they are getting any. I don`t think they can fool Allah!

Thanks for your response.

So, what is the reward for pious Islamic ladies like Zeena etc. What do they get?

I did not find anything about thaqt in the Koran. So I would appreciate if you would let me know.

Thanks..

Re: # 122
not conspiracy theory i`m afraid but fact

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once you get rid of classical scholarship you open the door to wahabism which leads to terrorism.

Re: # 126

No, it is true. It is one of the rewards which *all* Muslims will get in Paradise.

Re: # 123

echo bhai, i have already suggested this in an earlier thread.

Uh hh - who put chilli up these two pakis`?..... :) All of a sudden disco mian is flopping up and down like monkey.... faisal mian is running round and round to catch his own a88....

I mean - arjun mian posts one article, and suddenly pakis are already burning up.... :)

re:arjun2

The wahabis thinks dogs are unclean but have no problems with making Pakiland their own female of the canine species

Exactly.. maybe that is the reason why in middle east have more number of indians who are ready to work 1/4 the salary of an average labour and are ready to clean arabs shit without pay. I have personally seen 10 indians living in an small room..and i mean 1 room.

Its a tragedy that we are ruled by dictators who portray themselves everyday as a national heroes. Musharraf ang his gang one of them. Therefore there is not need to tell us what they are, we know they are moron and traitor to their country. chill and relax lets see the end game.

the more things change...

top leader of hindu al qaeda admits that macacas are beybus much like their ancestors.

http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/001200611021219.htm

``Forgive me, but that is the reality. There is no other option but to continue its policy with Pakistan that it has, and therefore India would have to continue to pay a price,`` he added.