Musharraf Stirring the Pot in the Tribal Area—Why?

Re: # 16 by zeemax on November 20, 2006 0:29am PT

``Gen Musharraf has declared that the war against Taliban ................``

First you threaten the rest of Pakistan with Arab-style suicide bombing, and now you are quoting / agreeing with Gen. Musharraf?

Are you agreeing (or denying) that Bajori Mullah Liaqat was a Talibanic meance?

#17 by taikonaut

Noone threatened anyone with bombings before this event. Did they? What`s happening is a reaction to the totally uncalled for extra judicial massacre of Pakistani citizens who were never a threat to Pak. It may well be that they were going back and forth to fight with Taliban on the other side but even then, so what? The tribals do NOT recognise the Durand line, and consider South Afghanistan their home as much as their side of the border. For them, there is simply no border and it is included in their constitutional freedoms that they can go back and forth without any travel documents but just a local card. Perfectly legal.

And Gen Musharraf has only learnt the bitter lesson in Waziristan therefore back to the negotiating table and therefore this statement. Further, this statement has unwittingly provided the proof that it wasn`t the Pak`s doing but the usual american heavy-handedness which Pak had no chopice but to cover-up.

Re the Bajori Mullah Liaqat, no doubt he was a local Taliban. But you have to understand that Taliban is NOT a terrorist outfit and merely represents deeply religious tribal people on both sides of the border. Why do you find it beneath your dignity or so difficult to talk to them? Why do you want to kill them all? These are your own citizens BTW. Do you want to repeat the same mistake you made in E.Pak?

Re: # 18 by zeemax on November 20, 2006 6:53am PT
sez ``repeat the same mistake you made in E.Pak?``.

Here comes E. Pak.

Ok dude, just two questions for ya!

Who is going to to do the bidding for Hindus this time?
Are you going to be the Sh. Mujib?

Anyone lecturing us with B`Desh, should remember that Sh. Mujib, his family`s men, women, kids, everyone was turned into a pile of minced meat. Only one member survived. And yes! the bad deed was done by none other than the BDeshis themselves.

Sh. Mujib was a hero and a leader in Pakistan. Had he played his cards right, had he been a little patient, he would have been the leader of a a large country. Instead he embarked on the politics of terror and mayhem, and ended up under a lot of rubble soon after Pak army left BDesh.

And why to go back to the past? Look at the present. Just pick up the newspapers and see what`s happenin in Sonar Bangla these days.

So do not threaten us with 1971. You may get what Sh. Mujib got.

#19 by taikonaut

Where does India come in on this? Hey ... you`re getting delusional. The last person the Tribals want to have anything to do with is India. Don`t you know? Sh. Mujib yes ... looked towards India and got what he deserved, and after him the Indians pulled up even the rail tracks in B`Desh and sold them for scrap. So that`s the lesson B`Deshis learnt that pak was levying taxes on petrol in W. Pak for them in their time of distress while their liberator India stripped them naked without mercy.

And now, my friend, I know as a personal fact by associating with B`Deshis in my line of work that they go to great lengths in reminding us they were at one time part of Pak. Surprising, but true. We try to avoid the painful subject but they keep coming out with this E.Pak thing in trying to show kinship.

But we`re not talking about E.Pak. We`re talking about the FATA. Let`s keep these valiant patriots on our side. If you don`t, you will live to regret it. Think my friend. They have Afghanistan to go to because their friends the Taliban will prevail over there, but we`ll lose our friends FATA, and gain fearless enemies.

Sh. Mujib yes ... looked towards India and got what he deserved, and after him the Indians pulled up even the rail tracks in B`Desh and sold them for scrap. So that`s the lesson B`Deshis learnt that pak was levying taxes on petrol in W. Pak for them in their time of distress while their liberator India stripped them naked without mercy.

And now, my friend, I know as a personal fact by associating with B`Deshis in my line of work that they go to great lengths in reminding us they were at one time part of Pak. Surprising, but true. We try to avoid the painful subject but they keep coming out with this E.Pak thing in trying to show kinship. ..

I have never seen a more shameless, dishonest, utterly despicable person on this planet befoe this AH. At least be a man and admit what your so called faujis perpetrated in Bangladesh. Don`t try to whitewash it like a castrated coward...

Read all about what caused the bengalis distress you shameless SOB...From your own chowk no less...

Operation Searchlight

#21 by CoolAL

CoolAl, I respect your emotional abuse. It is but an emotional subject. Yes, Pak did commit atrocities, I never denied that. Pak did kill university intellectuals and dumped them in mass graves ... and there were raped bengali women, and kids shot to death. I don`t deny any of it.

What I`m saying is that the Bengalis now know the larger picture. Their independence got them nothing except loot and plunder by India whom they believed to be their saviours. Now they know it was General Yahya`s army and the kala-angrez bureaucracy at the time who carried out the pogrom against Bengalis, and not the Pak people; which thrust them into the Indians lap who raped them even worse. They realize very well that Pak people still cry tears of blood over this. Bangladeshis, in case you didn`t know, are an extremely intelligent people.

My argument is that we all know who is the enemy. India in short. If you don`t know that remaining on these boards, you never will. Unless of-course you`re an Indian. In that case, good luck. I mean that.

Re: # 22

If Pakistan had granted East Pakistan maximum autonomy or even independence India would not be in the picture. In any case India is not occupying Bangladesh.

Zeemax sahib,

The Bdeshis hate India so much that a million of them cross over to come to India every year.

Regards

Re: # 23 Dear Babu Raam, Abraham Lincoln didn`t give ``autonomy`` to the South, nor is SriLanka giving independence to its Tamil region. Look what Tajik and Uzbek Generals did to Afghan Pashtuns. 1000`s of Pashtoons were killed in overstuffed containers. Still Afghanistan is a country.

Countries whether democratic or autocratic usually are not in the business of handing out autonomies. Hello! That is why they are called countries and not UNO.

Just ask your chaha Nehru as to why he was so constipated about Kashmir. Every piece of a country be it next door or next mile, is atoot ang. UK didn`t let Faukland go out of its hand, nor do Russians treat Chechnians ``autonomically`` (my word).

So forget about broadcasting this charade about Hindipendance from Hindustan.

East Pakistan was an internationally recognized region with specific borders and demarcation. Pakistan tried to hang on to it as long as it could, while Hindustan sent in 60,000 guerrillas to help improve ``peace and harmony`` in East Bengal. Just read the what Manikshaw had to say about Indira`s black role in perpetrating atrocities during the dark days of 1971. Moreover India could not have been able to digest it. The price would have been too big.

The bottom line is that Sh. Mujib was a leader (sometimes in jail but still in good health and ``alive``). While the same Sh. Mujib, his boys, his girls, his uncles, and aunts everyone was turned into a pile of minced meat right in the middle of BDesh. Only Husina survived. Who are you going to blame the total annihilation of Sh. Mujib and his family. I am sure you would blame Hindustan for that.

You can smirk about 3 million dead. However you won`t be able to produce a single gas chamber, even a tiny concentration camp, or Hutu-Tutsi style floating corpses. Bengalis who died in those days mostly died in Hindustani camps. So the blame goes to whomever was controlling those camps.

Pakistani and Hindustani armies come from the same stock and they are known for their discipline the world over. There may be one bad apple in Kashmir, or Sierra Leon, or may be BDesh. However no one can accuse Pakistani or Indian army for genocide and rapes.

So let these lectures reserved for your own oppressed people from Nagaland to Kashmir. And please let us sort out issues on our side of the border. Thank you.

Raam Raam Babu Ji.

#22 by zeemax

Now they know it was General Yahya`s army and the kala-angrez bureaucracy at the time who carried out the pogrom against Bengalis, and not the Pak people; which thrust them into the Indians lap who raped them even worse.

And just how did Indians rape B`deshis worse than Pakis did?

Re: # 26 ``And just how did Indians rape B`deshis worse than Paks did?``

Because most of these Bengali deaths and rapes occurred in the Hindustani camps. So many years have gone by and no one has produced mega-mass-graves, or even tiny concentration camps. Hutu-tutsi debacle produced one million corpses in the rivers. There was no such equivalent even though the reported deaths in East Pakistan were 3 times larger.

It is time that we did a serious research of deaths and rapes. At least we need to find out via DNA analysis as to how many BDeshis are the product of those ``millions`` of rapes. Unless off course Pakistanis were firing ``blanks``.

BTW Hrish_hyd are you from BDesh?

#27 by taikonaut

Because most of these Bengali deaths and rapes occurred in the Hindustani camps. So many years have gone by and no one has produced mega-mass-graves, or even tiny concentration camps. Hutu-tutsi debacle produced one million corpses in the rivers. There was no such equivalent even though the reported deaths in East Pakistan were 3 times larger.

Funy how you`re asking for evidence of mass graves to exonerate the Paki Army from charges of genocide, yet allege without any proof whatsoever that most Bengali deaths happened in Indian camps.

#27 by taikonaut

Because most of these Bengali deaths and rapes occurred in the Hindustani camps. So many years have gone by and no one has produced mega-mass-graves, or even tiny concentration camps. Hutu-tutsi debacle produced one million corpses in the rivers. There was no such equivalent even though the reported deaths in East Pakistan were 3 times larger.

Funy how you`re asking for evidence of mass graves to exonerate the Paki Army from charges of genocide, yet allege without any proof whatsoever that most Bengali deaths happened in Indian camps.

Re: # 29 sez

``yet allege without any proof whatsoever that most Bengali deaths happened in Indian camps``

Look Harish, allegations would fly that Indira Gandhi had 40,000 of our troops as POWs. How many of them were tried for war crimes? Gen. Niazi and all the officers down the line must have had all the proof needed for millions of rapes and deaths. That was the time to conduct DNA tests on these officers and Bangla woman and the kids born after the fateful year of 1971.

As I said there was no smoking gun. No proof. Otherwise Indira would have run a Nuremberg style courts and dragged every Pak army POWs through it.

Here is one possible explanation for you. Indira knew that she will be equally (if not more) implicated for the death of Bengalis. She too will be dragged into crimes court and so too would Shah Beg and other leaders of Indian terrorists helping Mukti Bahini.

Look don`t believe me? Read what Manekshaw had to say about Indira`s deep involvement in the pushing 60,000 terrorists into a sovereign country called East Pakistan.

So don`t shout about, and lay low. Pray to whatever god you pray that war crimes tribunals won`t get setup. If that happens, the gloves will come off and Indira will be hanged (posthumously) for her crimes against Bengali people.

p.s. You didn`t tell us if you were a Bengali.

Looks like taikonaut is right on the dot!!

Just happened upon this on an interactor/author`s iLog page dated 18 November:

http://www.chowk.com/show_interactor_page.cgi?membername=TanS

quoted from:

http://indianterrorism.bravepages.com/RAWterrorism.htm

US report details direct RAW involvement in East Pakistan secession
The News Intelligence Network

By Aslam Khan


ISLAMABAD: A sensational American report has confirmed the Research and Analysis Wing (RAW), India`s most powerful intelligence agency, was directly involved in the secession of East Pakistan into Bangladesh, and is currently engaged in similar activities. RAW has a long history of activity in Bangladesh supporting both secular forces and the area`s Hindu minority, masterminding the break up of Pakistan in 1971, says the report made available to the News Intelligence Network (NIN) The report has been prepared by the innocent sounding Federation of American Scientists (FAS), a group which is however engaged in analysis and advocacy on science, technology and public policy concerning global security, especially about countries which have nuclear capability.

It is a privately funded non-profit policy organisation, whose Board of Sponsors includes 55 American Nobel laureates. FAS was originally founded as the Federation of Atomic Scientists in 1945 by members of the Manhattan Project, who produced the first atomic bomb. RAW is extensively engaged in disinformation campaigns, espionage, sabotage and terrorism against Pakistan and other neighboring countries, reveals the sensational secret report. It also gives details of the truly alarming involvement of RAW in terrorist activities in Pakistan. The report reveals the involvement of RAW in Bangladesh dating from the 1960s, when it promoted dissatisfaction against Pakistan in the then East Pakistan, including funding Mujibur Rahman`s general election in 1970 and providing training and arming to the Mukti Bahini. The report claims an estimated 35,000 RAW agents have entered Pakistan at various times between 1983-99, with 12,000 having worked in the past or working presently in Sindh, 10,000 in Punjab 8,000 in North West Frontier Province and 5,000 in Balochistan. ``As many as 40 terrorist camps are currently operating at Rajasthan, East Punjab, [occupied] Kashmir, Uttar Pradesh and other parts of India and are run by RAW`s Special Service Bureau [SSB],`` the report reveals. The report further confirms that throughout the Afghan War, RAW was responsible for the planning and execution of terrorist activities in Pakistan to deter Islamabad from supporting the Afghan liberation movement against India`s ally, the Soviet Union.

``The assistance provided to RAW by the KGB enabled RAW to arrange terrorist attacks in Pakistani cities throughout the Afghan War,`` the report says. ``The defeat of the Soviet Union in Afghanistan did not end the role of RAW in Pakistan, as it established training camps in East Punjab, [occupied] Kashmir, Uttar Pradesh and Rajasthan where agents are trained for terrorist activities,`` it reveals.

It further says that RAW has become ``an effective instrument of India`s national power, and has assumed a significant role in formulating India`s domestic and foreign policies.`` RAW, according to the report, has enjoyed the backing of successive Indian governments in these efforts. Working directly under the Prime Minister, the structure rank, pay and perks of the Research and Analysis Wing are kept secret from parliament.

``Current policy debates in India have generally failed to focus on the relative priority given by RAW to activities directed against India`s neighbours versus attention to domestic affairs to safeguard India`s security and territorial integrity,`` the report says. It points out that RAW has had limited success in dealing with separatist movements in Manipur and Tripura in the northeast, Tamil Nadu in the south and Punjab and Kashmir in the northwestern part of the country.

RAW, it adds, has failed to neutralise freedom fighters in Kashmir and similar indigenous movements in Kerala, Karnataka and other places, along with economic and industrial espionage activities in New Delhi and Bombay. Giving a background of the intelligence agency, the American report says RAW was set up in 1968 ``specifically targeted on Pakistan``.

Pakistan, the report says, has accused RAW of sponsoring sabotage in its Punjab province, where it has been supporting the Seraiki movement, ``providing financial support to promote its activities in Pakistan and organising an International Seraiki Conference in Delhi in November December 1993``. It adds: ``RAW has an extensive network of agents and anti-government elements within Pakistan, including dissident elements from various sectarian and ethnic groups of Sindh and Punjab.``

According to it, India is funding the current upsurge of terrorism in Pakistan ``and has been behind the sectarian violence between Shias and Sunnis, which has resulted in thousands of deaths in the last few years.`` Terrorist activities in Pakistan attributed to the clandestine activities of RAW in the report include:

A car bomb explosion in the Saddar area of Peshawar on 21 December 1995, which caused the death of 37 persons and injured over 50 others.

An explosion at Shaukat Khanum Hospital on 14 April 1996, claiming the lives of seven persons and injuries to over 34 others.

A bus traveling from Lahore to Sahiwal was blown up at Bhai Pheru on 28 April 1996, causing the deaths of 44 persons on the spot and injuring 30 others.

An explosion in a bus near the Sheikhupura Hospital killed nine persons and injured 29 others on 08 May 1996.

An explosion near Alam Chowk, Gujranwala on 10 June 1996 which killed three persons and injured 11 others.

A bomb exploded on a bus on GT Road near Kharian on 10 June 1996, killing 2 persons and injuring 10 others.

On 27 June 1996, an explosion opposite Madrassah Faizul Islam, Faizabad, Rawalpindi, killed 5 persons and injured over 50 others.

A bomb explosion in the Faisalabad Railway Station passenger lounge on 8 July 1996 killed 3 persons and injured 20 others.

Another startling claim made by the American report is that it was RAW that was behind the hijacking of an Indian airliner to Lahore in 1971, ``attributed to the Kashmiris, to give a terrorist dimension to the Kashmiri national movement``.

#22 by zeemax on November 20, 2006 11:02am PT


They realize very well that Pak people still cry tears of blood over this.


sure peemax...I see photos of pakis out on the streets demanding the prosecution of the paki armymen who killed all those people..

oh wait...that`s for the danish cartoons....