Stagnating Pakistan-Iran Relations

If there`s any ehsaan to begin with, it must belong to the Parsees who industrialized that stupid country.

The senseless criticism of Parsees, Banias, Muslims, Hindus, Pakistanis, Indians, is not going to get us anywhere. Gentlemen, I would not mind tendering an unqualified apology for the mad rantings of Behram Atashband that constitute 95% of the body of any of his posts. But then you must seriously think about the remaining 5%. And not needle him into a violent reaction...



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If educated Pakistanis and Indians cannot engage in civilised debate, why should we expect our politicians/ militaries/ mullahs or RSS types to do any better?
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Re all posts concerning Beharami No.1

One is seeing an unfortunate trend of criticising the Parsees. Parsees are one community which has contributed tremendously to India`s development whether in banking, industry, commerce, politics. sports, agriculture, science, education, defence, you name the field an d you will find names of Parsees in a prominent place.

Just because one Parsee behaves like a bhangi on the Chowk let us not paint a great community with a broad brush.

Restrict the criticism to this ehsaan faramosh Parsee bhangi whose only pastime seems to sniff people`s arseholes squatting by the raiway tracks

Re: # 183

Abaiy o! gaando:

Do Hindoos ever had a halal or haraam concept?

{Restrict the criticism to this ehsaan faramosh Parsee bhangi whose only pastime seems to sniff people`s arseholes squatting by the raiway tracks }

Abbaiy bharway, what ehsaan are you talking about?

And it is only the hindoos who are sniffing other hindoos asses. Just look around at this site.

Re: # 185

The language used by you in your ranting and raving just confirms that you are not a Parsee but a thoroughbred bhangi. Moderate your outbursts to prove otherwise.

Here is a news item on iran pipeline.. the ever-alert bania.

http://ia.rediff.com/news/2006/dec/07sheela.htm?q=np&file=.htm

Re:#173 by ranjit on December 6, 2006 4:43pm PT
Re:bawaji#172

Ranjit Hindoo Bharwa:

{[..Killing poor Dalits is what Hindoos do best in Hindoo Land...]
Nope...making fun and teasing bawajis are what we hindus do best. It comes naturally to us red blooded males to tease sissy bawajis like you.}

First you must sing praise to your Harimau:

Harimau kay gaand main gus jao

You mean AIDS infested red blooded Hindoo? huh?

So how many innocent women were burnt due to non-payment of dowry to all those meritocratic Hindoos who are in line to get inside Harimau`s @ss. Would your meritocrats allow 250 million dalits to enter Harimau`s @ss?

Re:subhashjoshi#176 to Austin waley Bawaji

[..Yeh kaam bhi karta hai kya? Main sochta tha tu sirf gandi naaliyan saaf karta hai....]

Joshiji, Bhundram, I mean, Behram Bawaji is a multi-faceted Bawaji from Pakistan. Here is a list of his core (in)competencies -

1. Affirmative Action Engineering - He thinks he does engineering when in reality he cleans gandi naalis aka septic tanks, that too on affirmative action basis. He was boasting big time about being a PE, until I found out about him and totally exposed him on Chowk.

2. Incomplete Manhood - He thinks he is an Iranian when in reality he is an impotent bawaji from Pakistan. The lack of potency and consequently female company has driven him up the wall.

3. Incomplete Mental Growth - He thinks he is very knowledgable on all subjects when in reality he is a foul mouthed, hysterical bawaji who screams and shouts obscenities like a sissy.

4. Raving Jealousy - He thinks he is very successful when in reality he makes peanuts and is pathologically jealous of the success of hindus in every field in life.

5. Patriotic Mania - He thinks he is a very patriotic Pakistani and that all Pakistanis appreciate him for his gung-ho Paki patriotism and anti-hindu vitriol, when in reality they laugh at him as a cartoon character, a comedian if you will. They tolerate him like they would tolerate a monkey in Lahore zoo.

So, all in all, reality is a female of the canine species for Bawaji.

#167 by behram1 on December 6, 2006 10:06am PT

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Tum laoge bahoot ziyada gaan$ main ungly karteh rehtay ho, is liye tumahari sulgana upna to farz ho giya haye.

Yeh hindoo ******* upne aap ko samajtey kiya hain? Hum to ganjeh ho kar inkee gaand main gus jain gay.

Ok, back to naarey baazi

Harimau kay gaa**** main gus jao

---

Man your language truly reflects the ``great civilization`` of Iranian Ayatullahs. Your statements are nothing but ugly copies of Bay-Nijat.

What a shame. What a shame!

Re: # 175 by taikonaut on December 6, 2006 8:51pm PT

Oye! tereh gaand main kiyoun khujli ho raha hain? Kiya tou bhi Hindoo kum zaad ki aulad hai?

[Man your language truly reflects the ``great civilization`` of Iranian Ayatullahs. Your statements are nothing but ugly copies of Bay-Nijat.

What a shame. What a shame!]

Hindoo gaandoon ko eik hi zabaan aata hain, samjahe.

In bahen chodo ko dekho kasey kum zarafi say baat karteh hain Pakistani say. Yeh maa key loron ko tau baat karnay kee tameez hee nahin hain. Hindoo bharwas are just hinding behind nic names.

Wo maa ka laura Lord Krishna kidhar hain?

Re: # 179 Behram1

[......Wo maa ka ***** Lord Krishna kidhar hain?]

Dekh terey peechey khaRa hokar kuchh kar raha hai.

Re: # 180 by subhashjoshi on December 7, 2006 7:54am PT

{Re: # 179 Behram1

[......Wo maa ka ***** Lord Krishna kidhar hain?]

Dekh terey peechey khaRa hokar kuchh kar raha hai. }

Abaiy hindoo bharwa ub shairee bhi seekh rahe ho kiya? Choutia maaloom nahin kay shairee bhi irani eejad hain?

Bharwa geering say thou kub baaz aai gaa?

Re:bawaji#172

[..Killing poor Dalits is what Hindoos do best in Hindoo Land...]

Nope...making fun and teasing bawajis are what we hindus do best. It comes naturally to us red blooded males to tease sissy bawajis like you.

Sporting commemorative scarves and demanding equal rights in India’s hierarchical society, nearly a million low-caste Hindus descended on a Bombay park today to mark the 50th anniversary of the death of Bhim Rao Ambedkar, the champion of the underclasses and an architect of the constitution.

They came from all over the country, riding on trains for as long as three days, to pay homage to the man who campaigned to improve the lot of the Dalits, or Untouchables, the lowest rung in India’s inescapable caste system and a social group still suffering persecution for an accident of birth.

Killing poor Dalits is what Hindoos do best in Hindoo Land, here is the link

Re:Bawaji#170

[...main bawaji nahin houn...]

If it talks like a bawaji and sounds like a bawaji, it is a bawaji. You are a zoroastrian settled in the subcontinent, so you are a BAWAJI.

You should see some hindi moves. Bawajis typically play comedian roles while the hindu heroes always tease them and flirt with their wives. Thats exactly mirrors your comedian role on chowk, while we jiyala hindus make fun of you all the time.

Teasing a bawaji is priceless...for everything else there is Mastercard!! He he....Dont be in denial, bawaji!!

Re:Behram the Austin waley Bawaji#159

[...my great-great-great-great-great grandmas were producing progeny to come ......]

Oye Bawaji, zoroastrians and producing progeny? Ha ha ha!! Good joke!! Do you even know how to create progeny?

Check out the following link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parsi. Your population is declining every year and in fact the number of females are more than men.

Bawaji, the only conclusion is that zoroastrians are partially or fully impotent. A bunch of ``na-mards``. I am sorry but there is no affirmative action for impotence. You can beg the US government to help you out with your love life just like you beg for work. Maybe they will take pity on you and send you discounted Viagra.

But dont worry. We hindus are there to take care of your women. If they get frustrated and drive you nuts, which seems to be the case anyway, just send them to your neighbors i.e. the hindus. We are experts in creating progeny, especially from cute zoroastrians. He he!!

This guy Behram1 reminds me of the Story of the Wise Tapeworm King.

Re:sanatani#157 to Behram the Austin waley Bawaji

[..that Aryans from Iran who became Hindus pushed the Dravidians into a disadvantageous position in India....]

Yikes, so the Bawaji from Austin shares the same ancestry as the railway track squatting, cheating class hindus? But how is that possible? Hindus do not use affirmative action to succeed in the US, but bawaji does that all the time to earn his rozi-roti.

So Bawaji must have had a mutation in his genes somewhere along the way that destroyed his capability to compete on merit. Maybe one of his great-great grandmas slept with some of those semitic arab invaders behind his aryan great-great grandpa`s back. Poor guy. Thats why he gets so crazy at us Aryan hindus. Must be his ``inner`` semitic genes that drive him nuts.

What`s the joke about Bawaji that he is so pissed off about?

Re: # 158 Ranjit

Yaar kyun becharey ko baar baar angul kar rahe ho? Mar jayega.

#155 thanks for the clarification. the clarification also indicates why you need to give some thought to taikanauts poem: I am thinking of the real mochi/lahori gate, the real gulberg and the real issues for pakistanis living there. Your mind is on afghanistan/iran and USA. That is precisely the problem: too many pakistanis get emotional about supposed miseries arabs and afghanis and iranis, when their fellow pakistanis are living in equal, and indeed in far greater, misery. that is why taikanaouts poem is so important for every pakistani - we need to face the real issues that start with our own homes and neigborhoods.

PS: the popular bestseller ``7 habits of highly effective people`` conveys pretty much the same message plus more useful advice. that book stems from the US culture, and like I said, it is this way of thinking that has made the US a world leader that has inspired other nations and attracts the best and the brightest from around the world.

#154 by tahmed32

tahmed, by Mochi/Lohari I meant Afghanistan/Iran ... and of-course you know what is meant by Gulberg i.e. a world apart USA. I think you missed something here ...

zeemax: lets see which analogy fits better with reality:

How many residents of mochi/lohari gate volunteer to clean the streets? as for this setting of fire by arsonists: do you seriously think that the US is the cause of Pakistan`s problems?

Do you think that they lack of cleanliness in public areas regardless of whether it is gulberg/liberty market or mochi/lohari gate is the responsibility of the US? Is the US responsible for the rude and insulting behavior towards domestic servants by the newly rich and even some not-so-newly rich, bonded labor, enslaved peasants in the sindh, the widespread abuse of Islam for personal gain by maulvis, pirs, and this new fashion of dars, the adding of injury to injury of poor women who have been raped and then put behind bars for admitting to being raped, the widespread poverty where young children with twisted feet spend their days in the burning sun hoping to earn enough to keep body and soul together, the lack of respect for rules and regulations and standardsby public servants from generals down to ministry staff, the lack of enforcement of regulations that cause roads to flood or even erode at the first monsoon rain???

Kindly review your model in light of the above realities, and see if you think it still makes sense.

#150 by tahmed32

Good attempt at the analogy. However try the following:

Suppose I live in Bhati gate Lahore. I earn a living, have a shelter if not a big house, I do the best I can to take care of the home and family members, and also take some time off to help clean up the neighborhood (Mochi Gate/Lohari Gate) a bit. But Mochi/Lohari are on fire by some arsonists which is spreading in my direction and I`m busy chatting with my friends in Gulberg about how a Liberty Market can be established in Bhati as well.

Howzzat?

Pakistan has Indus river waters, nukes and a slightly more rational leadership than Iran.

The nukes and leadership thing could change in the future. Other than Iran has more things going for it - huge hydrocarbon reserves, even more strategic location, more educated populace, better identity, fairer skin etc.

Iran main interest is in dominating the Persian Gulf. Shite populations in Iraq, Kuwait, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia is a nice lever to achieve it. USA is the main force that can stop them.

Iran has huge amounts of oil and natural gas. At the current time Pakistan not have $$$ to buy from Iran. It prevents a mutually benefical trading relationship.

#149 I dont think so. here is an example of what taikonaut is saying.

suppose I live in bhaati gate lahore. first step would be to earn a living to make sure i have a home, then take time off to take care of the home and family members. then take some time off to clean up the neighborhood a bit. maybe help out an elderly or sick neighbor by buying groceries for them. if there is still time, then maybe volunteer time for some organization like red cross or as volunteer teacher for poor children. and so on.

how many people in bhaati gate (or in any other place in pakistan where they seem to think they know what is right and wrong around the world) do this?

#148 by tahmed32

I agree it is absurd, but isn`t this what taikonaut is saying?

#145 zeemax: lets see what makes complete sense to you by adding that last line you recommend:

Love your home,
love the street where your home is,
love the city where your street is,
love the state where your city is,
love the country where your state is
But hate your neighbours and love the Goras.

The last sentence makes the poem self-contradictory and absurd and would make sense only to someone who is totally confused. I hope for your sake that you are just trying to be humorous.

behram: i have heard baluch call for an independent baluchistan, but never heard any of them call for joining iran. have you?

Re: # 147 by tahmed32 on December 4, 2006 10:16am PT

Dear Tahmed Sahib:

No, Pakistani Baluchis would not care to join Iran as such. As you know, in the early 1970`s there was a huge element among the Baluch nationalists to side with the Soviets.

Respectfully submitted,

#136 by taikonaut

Love your home,
love the street where your home is,
love the city where your street is,
love the state where your city is,
love the country where your state is.

Let me finish your jingoistically `simple` poem:

But hate your neighbours and love the Goras.

Now it makes complete sense.

Re: stuka # 139
That’s what sucks with muslims these days.

We always end up cowering the wrong person


Regards,

Faruk

Stuka: that is indeed a great injustice!! That ugly man the woman was with is ordered by the court to put on a veil!! :-)

#136 taikanout: that ``poem`` is worth repeating since it has badly needed wisdom that the islamist types (some of them on chowk) truly lack:

Love your home,
love the street where your home is,
love the city where your street is,
love the state where your city is,
love the country where your state is.

To bring this up-to-date in today`s world, I would only add: love the region thy country is in, and love the planet you live in (since this is the only one you have).


While this may sound like motherhood and applie pie, the fact is that it is this basic wisdom that too many grown up individuals never learnt (some chowkies should be able to recognize themselves here). One of the greatest strengths of America is indeed this kind of thinking is embedded in its traditions going back four hundred years!! It is truly heartening to see that this attitude is prevalent among so many pakistanis.

#140 by muqaddam on December 4, 2006 2:36am PT

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No border disputes as of now. Just wait for the citizens of of Pak-occupied Baluchistan to take their uprising to the next stage that is independence from Pakistan and reunification with Baluch territories of Iran and Afghanistan.

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Muqaddam sahib, the danger is always there. However Iran won`t touch Baloch issue for a while now. Iranians are executing, hanging, and torturing Balochis at a much higher level.

http://sarbaaz.com/news/viewtopic.php?t=223

Balochis in Iran are dirt poor even when Iran is an oil producing country.

p.s. Greater Balochistan is being discussed. However success rate for such an idea is pretty slim.

Re: # 141 by taikonaut on December 4, 2006 4:49am PT

You have been a complete failure in activating any response against Iran, and it shows in most of these posts. The wahhabi element is quite obvious in your views. So just shoo away.

[the danger is always there. However Iran won`t touch Baloch issue for a while now. Iranians are executing, hanging, and torturing Balochis at a much higher level.]

Only if you can quantify what higher level you mean. Even during the Shah`s time elements in Baluchistan were not treated well, but my Baluch friends still would consider Iranians a whole lot better than the paindoos in Islamabad. Would you care to understand why?

TAhmed:

``#128 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 8:18pm PT
Stuka: but...you are an honorary Pakistani, remember. :-)

but seriously, do you have any grievances about iran?? the grievance court is now in session.

``

I actually do have a major grievence against Iran. On Friday, I was at a party given by another Indian couple. There was this gorgrous Iranian woman there. SMOKING HOT!! And her husband was a complete moron, and an ugly ass mofo to boot.....my grievance is that how come such a Hot Iranian chick had to get hitched with an ugly ass dude..there has to be something wrong in Iran..

Tahmed sahib,

while the pakistan military remains a well-disciplined force (their tendancy to conquer pakistan every few years notwithstanding).

Even a disciplined force needs exercise once in a while.

Regards

#135 Okhla

[Please translate]
Unlike mian Truly, I WILL oblige! Here you go.

नर ते खर, शूकर स्वान समान कहौ जग में फल कौन जिये.....

Translation: Such individuals are like dogs and pigs - tell me, what point can there be to their lives....

Clearly, I meant no disrespect to the dogs and pigs of the world!

[And yes we need to nip the Wahabi evil with full force. The last thing we need to see is these evil people harassing minorities in Pakistan.]

So when an Ismaili is killed in Chitral, could you easily say that it was some deobandi/wahhabi evil?

Your vitriolic thoughts regarding Iranian influence in Pakistani internal affairs got all the more ammo after the Islamic Conference in 1974, when some of the tin-pot politicians of the Islamic world descended on Pakistan, and wreaked havoc on the land of the pure.

Was that Iran`s fault? Afghanistan, being a sunni state, is not anti-Iran.

#130

I suppose I can answer my own question.

[And what kind of absolute creep stands by and looks the other way]

नर ते खर, शूकर स्वान समान कहौ जग में फल कौन जिये.....

Re: # 132

BJK,
What`s the red thing man ???

Please translate for the rest of us..

taikanout #129 you write ``Soviet Union is gone, but the ugly Mullahs (wahabi) and Ayatullahs (Shia) are still around. If we don`t nip this twin evil in the bud, it would be too late to find out that Pakistan has turned into Islamic Jannat called Afghanistan or worse Somalia.``

I think the evil is beyond the bud stage now. it should have been nipped in the 1950`s when Maudoodi brought his ugly mug over from india - he should have been sent back. now it is in full bloom in pakistan. thats the bad news.

the good news is - this is as far as they can go. because they are too stupid to be able to do anything constructive, and thus have never gained popular support in pakistan. mullahs - like the thugs in india - will in the long run be nothing more than a footnote to history. but then, that is just my two cents.

as for pakistan becoming an afghanistan or somalia - i doubt it. those countries never had a strong government, while the pakistan military remains a well-disciplined force (their tendancy to conquer pakistan every few years notwithstanding).

Re: # 131 TAhmad says

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as for pakistan becoming an afghanistan or somalia - i doubt it. those countries never had a strong government,

---

And how did they lose their ``strong governments``?

Hint hint! When people held tin-pots from Arab and Irani land inspired Islamism more important than their own soil.

Hope my fellow chowkies understand this simple poem!

Love your home,
love the street where your home is,
love the city where your street is,
love the state where your city is,
love the country where your state is.

Only then you will avoid the death and destruction of the Islamic jannat Afghanistan or worse Somalia. And quit holding these despot clowns called Mullahs and Ayatullahs as if they are more important than your country.

#124 Ajeya

Ama yaar, that picture breaks my heart! :(

I am going to have nightmares.

What kind of creep does such acts?!!

And what kind of absolute creep stands by and looks the other way - and lets it happen - and then whines that they are not getting ``respect``!

I ask these morons.

What kind of creeps are you guys - O FAITHFUL ones!!!

Go screw yourselves!

Or perhaps that`s ALL you have been doing!!!

Damm you!

Stuka: but...you are an honorary Pakistani, remember. :-)

but seriously, do you have any grievances about iran?? the grievance court is now in session.

``Unless, of course if you are a Hindoo from the Dravidian race, (those who reside in the south of modern day Hindoo Land) whose @ss was kicked by the invading Aryans.``

HAHAHAHA!!

What if one is a Hindu like me? A Hindu from the Village of Bhaun in the District of Chakwal in the Potohar area of Punjab? Can I then hyperventilate against Iran? Its interesting that though u claim to be a Pakistani, you turn around and accuse a Pakistani of being a Dravidian Indian, the moment he says something against Iran? Same goes for Salim Chauhan, because he is Shia, he is okay with accepting critism of Pak but not Iran?

I disagree with Taikonaut about a 100 things but at least the guy is Pakistani first. That seems to be a rare quality amongst you lot; it`s always Muslim first or Shia forst..how many of you love the soil from which you come from..Ask us who think of that soil even when we are generations removed...

Re: # 127 by stuka on December 3, 2006 8:15pm PT

[What if one is a Hindu like me? A Hindu from the Village of Bhaun in the District of Chakwal in the Potohar area of Punjab? Can I then hyperventilate against Iran?]

And if you have iota of understanding of the culture of that region then you will soon find out that your hyperventilating rhetoric will not get the political mileage whatsoever. Is it no wonder then that most Pakistani politicians are not at all anti-Iran?

[Its interesting that though u claim to be a Pakistani, you turn around and accuse a Pakistani of being a Dravidian Indian, the moment he says something against Iran? Same goes for Salim Chauhan, because he is Shia, he is okay with accepting critism of Pak but not Iran? ]

People of northern Indian sub-continent have consistently been from Persian culture for millennium, and that is all the reason most people from of South Asia have the highest regard of the Persians. As I have suggested in my previous post, it will be very difficult to find Afghanis to be anti-Iran, although most of Afghanis are sunnis.

If you have not figured it out yet, it is the Persian race that takes precedence over religion in our part of the world.

[I disagree with Taikonaut about a 100 things but at least the guy is Pakistani first.]

How can a Pakistani remain annonymous under a presumed nic name of taikonaut? What sort of a Pakistani name is that?

Only dravidian Hindoos from Hindoo Land remain hidden from humanity.

[That seems to be a rare quality amongst you lot; it`s always Muslim first or Shia forst..how many of you love the soil from which you come from..Ask us who think of that soil even when we are generations removed...]

And your Hindoos have consistently attacked Pakistanis on this chowk precisely because most Pakistanis are muslims, and dravidian Hindoos can not bare such a change of soil.

If you claim that you love the soil that is Pakistan today, then you must join me and love the soil first regardless of which religious value is in the ruling elite.

Re: # 134

Behramji,

I do not understand 1 thing so far we were being told (In Indian history as taught in schools by the commies albeit and a Parsi commie was foremost in that Shri RK Karanjia editor of Blitz) that Aryans from Iran who became Hindus pushed the Dravidians into a disadvantageous position in India and so North and Western Indians (i.e. Guj, Goa and Maharashtra) had no right to say that they gave refuge to the Parsis when in fact they were from the same stock and the Parsis had more moral claim to be Indians than these ancient invaders as they had not invaded another country (merely come there as refugees to sweeten the full cup of milk). That the ancient Aryan invaders from Iran were Hindus and had imposed Hinduism on Dravidians and by rejecting Hindi as the national language the Dravidians were reacting against North and Western Indian Hindu Imperialism.

What is the truth please enlighten? Also please for my general knowledge please let me know what was the language of ancient Iran or Persia.

Regards
Sanatani

[Re: # 157 by ranjit on December 6, 2006 7:07am PT
Re:sanatani#157 to Behram the Austin waley Bawaji

#157 by sanatani on December 6, 2006 4:30am PT
Re: # 134 ]

Now we have two types of Hindoo method of triangulation.

One is that Dravidian Hindoo bharwa who has no use of worthy enlightenment. His squatting ugly looking Dravidian hindoo would always want to get acknowledged.

And that Gandoo Hindoo Bharwa goes by the nic name of Ranjit.

For people like him the slogan still remains valid:

Harimau kay gaand main gus jao

[Yikes, so the Bawaji from Austin]

Abbaiy o! choutia, gaand ka lota Ranjit, I never consider myself bawaji, and I am the purest of the pure Zoroastrian and will kick your ugly @ss any day, as I have doing it all along on this Chowk. You can go and Gaand marao with your other ugly Hindoo bogus rail road squatting garbage eating hindoos from Hindoo Land.

[Hindus do not use affirmative action to succeed in the US, ] Yeah rite! These days your Hindoo land government officials are making headline news of how criminal minded the Hindoo of Hindoo Lands are.

[So Bawaji must have had a mutation in his genes somewhere along the way that destroyed his capability to compete on merit.] You Hindoo bharwa, when are you going to stop killing innocent Hindoo women in Hindoo Land just because your autistic myopic hindoo meriticrat was not able to get his expected dowry?

[Maybe one of his great-great grandmas slept with some of those semitic arab invaders behind his aryan great-great grandpa`s back. Poor guy. That is why he gets so crazy at us Aryan hindus. Must be his ``inner`` Semitic genes that drive him nuts.]

Choutia ghaandoo, my great-great-great-great-great grandmas were producing progeny to come and educate your dravidian kaalaa hindoos and gave you guys some religiosity. Your genes is so screwed up that all you guys could do is to produce some more bharwas like yourself to squat on those rail road tracks.

---

#157 by sanatani on December 6, 2006 4:30am PT
[Re: # 134

Behramji, ]

Thank you for being respectful.

[...the Parsis had more moral claim to be Indians than these ancient invaders as they had not invaded another country (merely come there as refugees to sweeten the full cup of milk).]

Those choutia Parsees of India still consider themselves of the genes of ``The Kiyani``. Their whole history has become bogus due to their Living Under Hindoo Influence (LUHI).

LUHI creatures are similar to the Hindoo creatures of Hindoo Land.


[That the ancient Aryan invaders from Iran were Hindus]

What sort of reverse history were you taught? Hindoos have never been able to flow up through Hindoo Kush mountains to the plains of the Caucus mountains. Also, remember shit always flows downhill, and that is where Hindoos always reside to collect the rejected Aryans, to the fold of Hindooism, and they started calling themselves as Brahmins.

[....the Dravidians were reacting against North and Western Indian Hindu Imperialism. ]

Dravidians were just kaala like koila, and had no values to enlighten the invading Aryans.

[What is the truth please enlighten? Also please for my general knowledge please let me know what was the language of ancient Iran or Persia. ]

The language of old Persian was Avesta, which was considered as a sister language to Sanskrit. All Zoroastrians holy words were spoken in Avesta. I consider that as the language of nobility, whereas the Sanskrit was the language of those who were the rejects of the Zoroastrian nobility.

Kinda like Urdu is these days are the language of nobility, and Hindi is the language of the rejects of Hindoo Land.

Respectfully submitted,

Re: # 159 Behram1

[....Choutia ghaandoo, my great-great-great-great-great grandmas were producing progeny to come and educate your dravidian kaalaa hindoos and gave you guys some religiosity. Your genes is so screwed up that all you guys could do is to produce some more bharwas like yourself to squat on those rail road tracks. ....]

Yaar your grandma didn`t produce right progeny despite all the hard work of kaalaa hindoos, so whose fault is that?

Re: # 165 by subhashjoshi on December 6, 2006 9:59am PT

[Yaar tu paagal ho jayega jaldi. Thand rakh. Badaam sharbat pee. Manto ke saath uthna baithna kam kar. ]

Tum laoge bahoot ziyada gaand main ungly karteh rehtay ho, is liye tumahari sulgana upna to farz ho giya haye.

Yeh hindoo bharway upne aap ko samajtey kiya hain? Hum to ganjeh ho kar inkee gaand main gus jain gay.

Ok, back to naarey baazi

Harimau kay gaand main gus jao

You like it don`t you? All the hindoo meritocrats are waiting to get inside harimau, eh!

[Yaar your grandma didn`t produce right progeny despite all the hard work of kaalaa hindoos, so whose fault is that? ]

Abaiy, thaali ka bhaingan, hindoos were shitting on the pasture land in Boisar, India, where Noshir the Parsee zamindar was screwing those hindoo chicks, under the keeno kay darakht.

Now do you understand why I am totally against those LUHI Parsee bawajis.

Re: # 167

[...Yeh hindoo bharway upne aap ko samajtey kiya hain?]

Samajhtey jo bhi hon, lekin rishtey mein tumharey baap lagtey hain.

[...Hum to ganjeh ho kar inkee gaand main gus jain gay.]

Be careful, yeh saaley hindoo ga*** nahin dhotey.

Re:#169 by ranjit on December 6, 2006 3:32pm PT

Abaiy Oye Ranjit kuteh ka bacha Hindoo bharwa: kitni dafa yeh post karoun kay main bawaji nahin houn. Ma chudaney gaye tumahri LUHI Parsees.

[Ha ha ha!!] Ziyada moun mut khol irani lund kahin gus na jain.

---

#168 by subhashjoshi on December 6, 2006 10:47am PT
[Samajhtey jo bhi hon, lekin rishtey mein tumharey baap lagtey hain.] Lauray ki tarah kala hi lagtey hain.

{Be careful, yeh saaley hindoo ga*** nahin dhotey.} Sumbal kay rahio, pehley tumhari gunday gaand ko dholay gain.

Re: # 170 Behram1

[....Sumbal kay rahio, pehley tumhari gunday gaand ko dholay gain. ]


Yeh kaam bhi karta hai kya? Main sochta tha tu sirf gandi naaliyan saaf karta hai.

Re: # 170 Behram1

(Hindoos)....Lauray ki tarah kala hi lagtey hain.


Hahaha...you say this from personal experience.

Bawa Behram spends lots of time roaming in the countryside doing his usual gali-galoj against Hindoos. After one year or so he goes back home. Meanwhile his wife gets regularly laid by neighbors (what else she could do, poor woman?). When Behram knocks at the door, she is with another man.

Kaun Hai?
Main Behram haan, bua khol.

Now what to do? She tells him she just delivered a baby and he should go get some sweets from halwai first.

But lemme at least see his face.

So she shows him this guy`s black dick.

Happily our Bawaji goes to Halwai, and meanwhile this guy runs away.

When he comes back, he finds his wife crying inconsolably.

What happened darling?

Our baby died and I buried him already.

Stunned, Behram is at a loss for words (he never is, at Chowk). Then he says, slowly, Chalo, theek hua. Lauray ki tarah kala hi lagta tha.

Re: # 159 Behram1

Yaar tu paagal ho jayega jaldi. Thand rakh. Badaam sharbat pee. Manto ke saath uthna baithna kam kar.

Re: # 159

we need queen_cut&paste to give our resident snake the runs for his money....wtf is QCP?

[Re: # 160

Re#162 by subhashjoshi on December 6, 2006 8:50am PT

#161 by subhashjoshi on December 6, 2006 8:48am PT
Re: # 158 Ranjit

Yaar kyun becharey ko baar baar angul kar rahe ho? Mar jayega.

Re: #160 by iron_mask on December 6, 2006 7:49am PT

we need queen_cut&paste to give our resident snake the runs for his money....wtf is QCP?]

Myopic autistic Hindoo bharwas from Hindoo Land are back in style:

So let us all begin with our Chowk slogan

Harimau kay gaand main gus jao

wtf is harimau?

#124 how about a few pictures of burnt bodies (sikhs in delhi, muslims in gujerat, missionary children somewhere else, not to mention the thousands of brides burnt by grooms as a form of income generation) from india??

taikanout #118 So we agree on everything it seems. Damn!! How the hell can one carry on a chowk ``discussion`` by agreeing on everything. :-)

Let me ask you though - you seem very concerned about persian mullah threat to pakistan. i dont share that concern though. historically we have gotten along fine - no border disputes, no ideological issues, no ancient grievances. and indeed warm feelings between the two nations, and historically there has been great appreciation for the persian language (although sadly dying off) and literature and art in Pakistan. i dont think the mullahs, even if they wanted, would find it easy to change these historically warm relations between the two countries.

The above is my ranting basically. you and behram can correct me or add to this if you please.

Re: # 125

No border disputes as of now. Just wait for the citizens of of Pak-occupied Baluchistan to take their uprising to the next stage that is independence from Pakistan and reunification with Baluch territories of Iran and Afghanistan.

#125 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 8:10pm PT

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taikanout #118 So we agree on everything it seems. Damn!! How the hell can one carry on a chowk ``discussion`` by agreeing on everything. :-)

---

Yeap! Chowk is turning into big mushy gumball.

---

Let me ask you though - you seem very concerned about persian mullah threat to pakistan. i dont share that concern though. historically we have gotten along fine - no border disputes, no ideological issues, no ancient grievances.

---

That`s what people said about Hitler and his book on Jihad (personal struggle) called Mein Kempf (personal struggle) . When people heard about persecution of minorities, they said oh that hitler is a little joker.

Same Chamberlain-ish ``sub chalta hai`` attitude exists in Pakistan too. Here are few examples.

1. When Lashkre Janghavi butchered innocent Shias, we said oh that is all Hindian drama.
2. When the twin menace of Tehrike Nifaz Fiqh Jafria and Imamia Student Organization spread their sectarian wings, we said oh these are just little brothers.
3. When Soviet bear starting feasting on Pashtoon meat, we said Oh it is not going to hurt.

So T Sahib, take the future of Pakistan and threats to Pakistan seriously. Soviet Union is gone, but the ugly Mullahs (wahabi) and Ayatullahs (Shia) are still around. If we don`t nip this twin evil in the bud, it would be too late to find out that Pakistan has turned into Islamic Jannat called Afghanistan or worse Somalia.

#122 by behram-fundoo-baba

[If you insist to be acknowledged with your presence in these discussions about the Persians, you could just remember that the Persian blood line is in those Hindoo Brahmins as well, who revolve around fire several times to get some stupid hindoo women married]

Don`t try to associate us Brahmins with the Persians. They may have been influenced by us, but that`s where it ends. Check out the achievements of Brahmins through the millenia. Now check out the achievements by Persians. Not even close.

Check out this list of ancient mathematicians. See how many ancient Brahmins there are and how many ancient Persians: http://aleph0.clarku.edu/~djoyce/mathhist/chronology.html

There would be MANY MORE Brahmins on the list, but the Islamic messengers of peace burnt down ancient libraries wherever they could find it.


[...who will more likely be burnt for non-payment of expected dowry, once this Hindoo meritocrat enjoys the first few nights of brand new sexual escapades with an unsuspecting Hindoo virgin, huh! ]

So this is better, eh?





We hindoos have something to learn from you islamists, isn`t it?

Eh?

#121 by behram1 on December 3, 2006 7:17pm PT

---

If your intent is to defame Iran based on religious discrimination then you could have identified the Bahais.

---

hahah! defame Iran? moi?

Look! Ayatullahs and their little pipsqueak midget is doing mighty good job in this department of defaming Iran. A minor discussion in chowk.com can never do in 100 years what bay-nijat can do in 30 seconds. So rest easy my chowki associate! Rest easy!

BTW thanks for adding Bahais to the list of minorities persecuted by Ayatullahtic regime. That simply proves my point, that Iranian leadership are simply nutcases to the core. As long as the current regime is ruling Iran, we can never be their friends.

And yes we need to nip the Wahabi evil with full force. The last thing we need to see is these evil people harassing minorities in Pakistan.

#117 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 1:50pm PT

---

behram: I think you make an important point about parsis setting an example of basically not getting into religious politics. This is certainly very true.

---

Aahhmm! T sahib, it was me suggesting that other minorities should follow Parsi example. Nobody bothers you, and you contributes to your society.

---

While I have a lot of sympathy for ahmedis and shias who have been hounded by the mullah scum - the fact is that both groups were quite aggressive in trying to spread their belief and/or influence,

---

Yeap! anyone supporting ayatullahs today should remember this. Sunnis in Iran will be crushed the next day if they ever start ``Tehrike- Nifaze- Fiqah - Wahabia`` (mirror image of Tehrike Nifaze fiqah Jafria``)

---

#116 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 1:45pm PT
taikanout bro: I am glad you admired the math I put together. Thanks.

PS: As you will notice from the above, I am a simple-minded fellow and sarcasm is therefore lost on me. :-)

---

T sahib, no sarchasm. You definitely left out Ayatullahs out of that equation. Other than than your model was pretty good representation.

behram: I think you make an important point about parsis setting an example of basically not getting into religious politics. This is certainly very true.

While I have a lot of sympathy for ahmedis and shias who have been hounded by the mullah scum - the fact is that both groups were quite aggressive in trying to spread their belief and/or influence, and so ran head-on to the sunni mullahs trying to do the same thing.

taikanout bro: I am glad you admired the math I put together. Thanks.

PS: As you will notice from the above, I am a simple-minded fellow and sarcasm is therefore lost on me. :-)

but seriously - aside from your sarcasm and anger at poor lil general Zia being held responsible for mullahism in pakistan (imagine!!), I dont see you saying anything much of substance. If you do, please state succinctly. Thank you in advance for your consideration.

#109 by taikonaut on December 3, 2006 12:38pm PT

yes..India was socialist for 50+ years..but 15 years of somewhat freemarket system and India already has more major companies and billionaires than you can shake a paki stick at...what does the land of the pure have? not one major company like infosys or reliance and not one billionaire...all you have are the mega-agriculturists growing whatever you`re smoking...

#108 by behram-islamist-baba

[Yes, it is the Iranian culture that you must never forget. And you must never forget who you are as a people, regardless of the rulers of Iran. ]

Yes. How can you forget Iranian culture, eh? Iran gave the following great things to the world:

1) Cuisine: Boiled rice and burnt tomatoes as persian cuisine.

2) Music: Ghazals for romancing little boys in order to bugger them later.

3) Science and Technology: Um... er... nothing....

4) Religion: Ayatollahs....

Re: # 114 by krishna_abcd on December 3, 2006 1:37pm PT

Lord Krishna:

If you insist to be acknowledged with your presence in these discussions about the Persians, you could just remember that the Persian blood line is in those Hindoo Brahmins as well, who revolve around fire several times to get some stupid hindoo women married, who will more likely be burnt for non-payment of expected dowry, once this Hindoo meritocrat enjoys the first few nights of brand new sexual escapades with an unsuspecting Hindoo virgin, huh!

At 77 minutes per hindoo women being burnt in Hindoo Land, or tomatoes being burnt in Iranian cuisine, do you have any idea which one would the civilized world prefer?

#110 by behram1 on December 3, 2006 12:45pm PT

---

The jews were never kicked out of Iran

---

Ayatullahs kicked out hundreds (if not thousands) of Jews. Some of them stayed in Pakistan for many years before moving on to Australia, UK, and USA.

There are family pictures pictures in hour household with some of those families. These pictures along with first hand account clearly shows that Jews were persecuted and kicked out by Ayatullahs.

There is no denying there are still Jews living in Iran. But the same holds for Nazi Germany. There were some Jews left in Germany even after their persecution by Hitler`s.

Re: # 113 by taikonaut on December 3, 2006 1:11pm PT

You are bogus and erroneous on a major count. If your intent is to defame Iran based on religious discrimination then you could have identified the Bahais. Since, you did not; it just shows that you are some Wahhabi implant in these discussions. You should also be knowing that sunnism is far from Wahhabi`s, at least most of my muslim friends tell me so. Hiding inside the cloak of sunnism does not bode well for the modern day wallabies of Islamic Brotherhood. Only wahabis would make a show and tell about how pious their belief system is. Most of my Pakistani sunni friends have nothing to do with these sorts of gamesmanship.

Only Islamic Brotherhood people would tell my muslim friend who greeted him with an Assam-alaikum in a bathroom that it is ``impure (najes) `` to wish salaam to a muslim in a rest room.

When I heard such a ridiculous comment, I asked my muslim friend to ask that idiot from Islamic Brotherhood where does he conduct his wazoo before prayers. Is that lavatory not inside some rest room?

pakis

Don`t worry too much about iran... the way iranians are hurtling towards the confrontation with great satan - soon there won`t be much of iran left to worry about... great satan is already planing for the rediation treatment... :)

[Your assertion fails on many examples. Why were the Iranian Jews kicked out by Ayatullahs even when the Jews do not proselytize?]

The jews were never kicked out of Iran or for that matter from Pakistan. There are still many jews left in Iran. Discrimination against the minorities is ingrained in those societies, regardless who the mojorities are. Muslims definitely continue to discriminate against the minorities, and that must be addressed.

#95 by Naqshbandi on December 3, 2006 8:14am PT


Mr. Zia al Haq and billions of Saudi petro-dollars.


and for the record, the vast majority of pakis were for Zia`s policy in afghanistan..the whole idea of indoctrination of the paki population to produce islamic jihadis...

most pakis were down with it when the policy was bringing them american aid and saudi $$...

now, for the pakis, the afghan policy is like bellbottoms...people who wore them in the 70s completely deny wearing them because it looks ridiculous now...

Re: # 106

[now, for the pakis, the afghan policy is like bellbottoms...people who wore them in the 70s completely deny wearing them because it looks ridiculous now...]

No, you are wrong as usual. Actually, I bought one the other day and I have never denied wearing them in the 70s. Your autism is taking a huge toll on your myopic view of the world.

Did you forget to take your prescription drugs, again?

Re: # 106 Arjun spouts

---

he vast majority of pakis were for Zia`s policy in afghanistan..the whole idea of indoctrination of the paki population to produce islamic jihadis...

most pakis were down with it when the policy was bringing them american aid and saudi $$...

now, for the pakis, the afghan policy is like bellbottoms...people who wore them in the 70s completely deny wearing them because it looks ridiculous now...

---

Look who is talking. These Bihari commie-suckers were selling their mata Ji to Ruskies for 50 years. Now that Ruski rubel is gone, they are desparately trying to be Sam-suckers and be proud of it.

Talk about ideals. Commies turned capitalist as soon as Rubel stopped. Then these Bihari BIMAROU bindi pipsqueaks make monkey faces to Pakistanis. hahahha.

[However we should never ignore the fact that our tiny minorities like Parsis have survived and even thrived in the same environment.]

The main reason Parsees survive is because they do not convert people in to their faith. This is very smart politically. Proselytizing one`s faith has been the major reason of fights and arguments between faiths that go out of their way in proselitization.

Re: #104 by behram1 on December 3, 2006 12:14pm PT

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The main reason Parsees survive is because they do not convert people in to their faith. This is very smart politically. Proselytizing one`s faith has been the major reason of fights and arguments between faiths that go out of their way in proselitization.

---

Conversion plays a role towards inflaming the majority for sure. However there are many other factors.

Your assertion fails on many examples. Why were the Iranian Jews kicked out by Ayatullahs even when the Jews do not proselytize?

Being secular, apolitical, and business oriented are all those factors that help a minority thrive in an alien region.

Shias should have been at the forefront of secularist trends in Pakistan. Unfortunately many of them chose to be the Ayatullah-lackeys. They received money and arms from Iran. Parsis on the other hand do not bring any such ills to Pakistan and that is why they are largely spared.

p.s. Off course many Sunnis chose to be lackeys of Saudi Wahabis. Even now our FATA area is in trouble because many Sunnis there want to align themselves with wahabis.

taikanout; you write ``Mullahs in Pakistan (both Shia an Sunnis) became strong when they got money after Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Should we blame Zia for that Afghan invasion too? ``

The above implies that SI -> Mullahs

where SI=Soviet Invasion of afghanistan that led to the strengthening of Mullahs. This is so simplistic that it is plain wrong.

The corrected formula is described in two steps, as follows:

1. SI -> U/S -> Z -> Mujahadeen -> SR
2. Z -> Mullahs

where U/S are the US and Saudi resources that became available to fight the Soviets, which went to Z (=Zia) who passed them to the Mujahadeen (where in fact the secular Massoud was the leading fighter as I recall from those days) who led to SR (Soviet Retreat).

after the soviet retreat, Zia fomented a civil war in Afghanistan by introducing the Taliban (bred and trained in Pakistan) and helping them win. During this time he also allowed terrorist mullah organizations to spring up in Pakistan.

I am sure you know all this. I am just reminding you of this so you dont start short-circuiting history. If Pakistan is to emerge as a progressive nation, it is important to remain mindful of the facts.

Re: #103 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 11:55am PT

---

The corrected formula is described in two steps, as follows:

1. SI -> U/S -> Z -> Mujahadeen -> SR
2. Z -> Mullahs

where U/S are the US and Saudi resources that became available to fight the Soviets, which went to Z (=Zia) who passed them to the Mujahadeen (where in fact the secular Massoud was the leading fighter as I recall from those days) who led to SR (Soviet Retreat).

---

T sahib, a beautiful rendering of history as a set of mathematical formulas. Simply brilliant!

It definitely holds true for Wahabist Mullahs (with some assumptions + initial conditions).

However your model needs to add few more equations for money flow to Shia fundoos from Ayatullahs. Make sure you get the correct time values and initial conditions. I am sure you an unbiased person when it comes to putting mathematical models together.

---

after the soviet retreat, Zia fomented a civil war in Afghanistan by introducing the Taliban (bred and trained in Pakistan) and helping them win. During this time he also allowed terrorist mullah organizations to spring up in Pakistan.

I am sure you know all this. I am just reminding you of this so you dont start short-circuiting history. If Pakistan is to emerge as a progressive nation, it is important to remain mindful of the facts.

---

Yes Siri! facts are facts. Ignoring them is not going to help. So please remember the Ayatullahs, their money, and arms coming straight to Shia-fundoos all over the world. Hizbullah being the latest example.

Now going back to the ``facts``, your statement ``Zia fomented a civil war in Afghanistan`` is the hight of being lazy with the facts. What happened to all your mathematical skills? Talibanic menace was just one part of the equation. Why to ignore NA-NA (Not available Northern Alliance)? Are you jealous that Taliban were able to bamboozle their way through an alliance supported by Iran, India, Russia, and Turkey?

Post-Soviet Afghanistan was a free-for-all, get-your-bazooka-in-there land. Everyone from Ruskies, to Turks, to Indians, to Iranians had a go at the hapless Afghan body. Why do you pick on Zia only? Is that because his was the biggest? Ayatullahs lost in Afghanistan big time first, followed by Talibans. Why are you angry at Talibans only?

Note how your personal bias is no good for maths, physics, or any other skills that you may acquired on the way.

taiko cat !!!


While I agree with about 40% of what you say, I would advise you to properly interact with the murfker ZEEMAX. He has a lot of substance.

Re: # 100 Okhla sez

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While I agree with about 40% of what you say,

---

Pity! 40% is not going to save you from sectarian hell.

---

I would advise you to properly interact with the murfker ZEEMAX. He has a lot of substance.

---

For chowk, I thought everyone is Murfker (hope you meant Mufakkar - intellectual). Zeema Ji was totally off-base in #93.

Self immolation is trait of Pakistani murfkers second only to being a commie-sympathizer. So blame Pakistan for everything boyz. Blame everything!

Re: # 101

Praajee,

#93 was you and not Zeemax.

#97 by tahmed32 on December 3, 2006 8:54am PT

TAhmed, Naqshbandi, Zeemax, and others.

First thing first. It was a horrible period in Pakistan when minority groups including Shias, Ahmadis, and Christians were targeted by the ruthless Islamists. There is no denying that Pakistani majority Sunnis shamelessly failed to protect our weak, and our disadvantaged groups. I hope we move forward in the positive direction. We also need to go back all the way to 1947 and somehow compensate those who were wrongly persecuted based on religion or ethnicity.

However we should never ignore the fact that our tiny minorities like Parsis have survived and even thrived in the same environment.

Therefore we ought to carefully analyze the root causes of sectarian ills and give the responsibility where it is due.

---

taikanout: I dont think you are right in saying that the sectarian violence in pakistan was fomented by shias. As I recall, it is shia mosques that have been bombed and shia doctors who have been targetted for killing by jehadis in the past 2-3 decades.

---

There is no doubt Shias suffered more. They were minority and in any warfare smaller and or less equipped group suffers more. If Sunnis in Iran accept money from Saudis and form the like of “Tehrik Nefaz Fiqh Wahabi”, they will surely be crushed by dominant party in Iran i.e. Shias.

So learn from Parsis. Minorities should be hall mark of secularism and not Ayatullahism.

---

While no doubt shia nuts are as rabid as sunni nuts, everything i have seen contradicts what you seem to be saying (i.e. that it is the iranian maulvis who are responsible for the sectarian violence).

---

What you saw is the same that everyone else saw regarding sectarianism. However the stuff you see is present, therefore you must read about the past if you believe in thorough analysis.


No one says Iranian Ayatullahs are the only ones who started sectarian violence.

Ayatullahs however did commit crimes in 1979 by supplying arms and money to the Shia fundoos all over the world. Iranian sponsored funddoos became strong immediately after toppling of Shah and subsequent takeover by Ayatullahs.

BTW Ayatullahs deserve all the respect for their religious contribution, however they are petty thugs when it comes to their sponsorship of Shia-terrorism.

---

indeed, it is the political leaders (zab and even more so zia) who are responsible for creating conditions in which the worst segment of pakistani society (the maulvi) gained guns and funds and political clout.

---

Well we can go back to Hazrat Adam and Mai Hawwah and blame everything on them. We can all pick and chose a particular moment in history and commence our analysis.

People who blame Zia for anti-Shia campaign do so because they want to ignore the role of Ayatullahs. And I respect that view however untrue and misguided it may be.

Mullahs in Pakistan (both Shia an Sunnis) became strong when they got money after Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Should we blame Zia for that Afghan invasion too?

Zia and Pakistani society are responsible for one thing. They all failed to band together in the anti-commie struggle. Pakistani academia and newspaper (intellectuals) are the first to get the blame. They are the ones who continued singing commie-praises while Soviet bear feasted on Afghan flesh.

Zia allowed Mullahs only because our educated class was absolutely clueless about Pakistan`s big role in the anti-commie fight. The situation is still the same. Our intellectual orgasms occur only when our academicians and journalists sleep with the likes of Chavez, Castro, and Ahmade-nejat.

With peace to all!
No respect for fundoo supporters.

#95 the links go back to several centuries BC - indeed, the very term ``india`` is a result of these links: areas constituting pakistan were the eastern province of the persian achaemenian empire back in the 4-500 BCs and contributed troops to the persian armies. these troops fought against the greeks (including at marathon i believe), and identified themselves is ``sindhians`` (people from the land of the indus river) to the persians/greeks and any other turkeys they ran into. and so, the entire subcontinent came to be known in the west as the land of indu (or sindu). in german, the official title for gypsy btw is ``sinti`` and is derived from the same land of the indus river (the gypsy language has many similarities with panjabi, including the counting system - ik, do, tin).

so, the links go back to pre-Islamic days!!

taikanout: I dont think you are right in saying that the sectarian violence in pakistan was fomented by shias. As I recall, it is shia mosques that have been bombed and shia doctors who have been targetted for killing by jehadis in the past 2-3 decades. While no doubt shia nuts are as rabid as sunni nuts, everything i have seen contradicts what you seem to be saying (i.e. that it is the iranian maulvis who are responsible for the sectarian violence).

indeed, it is the political leaders (zab and even more so zia) who are responsible for creating conditions in which the worst segment of pakistani society (the maulvi) gained guns and funds and political clout.

The Sunni Shia killings in Pakistan are a recent phenomenon, something completely disgusting, and linked directly to the rise to prominence of the Ahlul Bayt hating, Nasibi, Deobandi-Wahabis who were patronised by Mr. Zia al Haq and billions of Saudi petro-dollars.

Before that, although Sunnis and Shias have always had their religious differences, they lived together in harmony.

I think Pakistan (North Indian Muslims in general) owe such a huge debt to Persia from a cultural and linguistic perspective, not to mention the strategic importance of Iran, that it is imperative for Pakistan to develop good relations with that brotherly country. One illustration of this is that most of the serious religious literature until not to long ago was written in Persian instead of Urdu. Even Ghalib was more proud of his Farsi poetry than his Urdu (considering the latter as mere entertainment!), and Iqbal, Pakistani`s national poetm, wrote 2/3s of his ouevre in Farsi! Hafiz, Sa`di, Jami, Firdausi, Urfi, Khayyam, Ghazali, Hijwiri, Shah Waliullah, Gharib Nawaz, Nizam al Din Awliya, etc. etc., --all these are names any educated North Indian/Pakistani Muslim will be aware of and all of them are Persian. Even Huzoor Peeraan e Peer Sayyidina Abdul Qadir Jilani, Ghaus Paak, the most famous Sufi saint of them all, was Persian speaking!

Re: # 94 Naqshbandi


Sure we owe a lot to the secular Iranian culture. However Ayatullah fundoo culture has nothing to do with those glorious Iran. Today`s Iran is a cesspool, and ayatullahs are the new froggy habitants of this dirty stinky moribund environment.

So don`t go around beating the drums of great Iran and expect us to follow your fundoo leaders. In fact you would be well-advised to sever your links with the fundoos. They are nothing but trouble. You are well placed in Pakistani society. But your fundoo leaders or Ayatullahs will take you down the hate-filled dirty fundoo alley and your future generations in Pakistan will ultimately suffer.

Off course some of you fundoos are settled in America. If you continue importing your Ayatullahs to the West, the predictions are even more dire. Remember, it is the same West that puts its ``suspicious`` minorities in concentration camps.

So my plea to you and others is the same. Say good bye to fundooism, and say hello to a more secular global world. If you don`t change then the future is not that good.

Re: # 96 by taikonaut on December 3, 2006 8:36am PT
Re: # 94 Naqshbandi

[Sure we owe a lot to the secular Iranian culture.]

Yes, it is the Iranian culture that you must never forget. And you must never forget who you are as a people, regardless of the rulers of Iran.

[However Ayatullah fundoo culture has nothing to do with those glorious Iran. Today`s Iran is a cesspool, and ayatullahs are the new froggy habitants of this dirty stinky moribund environment. ]

And you will be hard pressed to find any Iranian in the west that support the current behavior of the current regime. The val