India, Pakistan and the Kashmir dispute

shishapa

Some things in life are grotesque, but yet you can`t look away... that is true here... :)...

So stick around... if nothing else, you will learn more about ``these people`` across the border... it would be an eye-opener...

#372 Yes, surprise. i am a paki too. have a nice life outside chowk.

shishapa: if you despise ``these people`` (i.e. us) so much, all you have to do is to stay away from chowk. excuse me, but your actions are the opposite of what you say.

Re: # 371

tahmed32ji,

Are you amongst these people too? OK, I will heed your warning and do just that.

dostmittar: That is a good point you make about this being a ``muslim only`` struggle, given that non-muslim kashmiris are not in favor. And being exclusionary of non-muslim kashmiris, it is not as deserving of sympathy as one would have.

I cant think of a good argument against it. I shall leave it for HP or Hamidm to come up with one. I shall have tea in the meantime. :-)

hamidm2:
Okay, I am back. I hope that your turkey turned out fine and without any pins in it, as happened to someone on this side of the border.

Back to where I left. You had said that moderate Kashmiris have turned to Islamists just as Palestinians have turned to hamas. This comparison is not quite valid in my opinion. Palestinians struggle was always an Arab struggle in which Christian Arabs were at the forefront: the most militant palestinian outfit was led by a Christian, George Habash; the first palestinian hijacker was Khaleda Aziz, a Christian; the most articulate palestinian was Anan Sharawi, another Christian. Contrast this with the so-called moderate kashmiri separatist outfit, the JKLF; the non-muslim kashmiris were thrown out of the valley during the JKLF insurgency before the Pak-based jihadis came into the picture. And while one can say that Hindu Kashmiris would be like Jews in Palestine and cannot be expected to support ``freedom struggle``, the fact is that even Christian, Sikh or Buddhists have provided zero support to these separatists.

If you can persuade these kashmiri separatists to be as broad-based as the PLO, they would have at least my support. Until that happens, I will never dignify their struggle as ``kashmiri`` movement and call it by its proper character, an ummah inspired Islamist movement. It is up to you whether you want to support a religion-based movement or choose to ignore its religious character and continue to call it ``supporting the kashmiris``.

In these holidays, I have spent quite a lot of time on Chowk and discovered a lot.

Don`t you guys get tired of calling ``Pakis`` and other names?

It seems your creative minds never stop churning out unending stream of theories centered around only one theme, ``Anti-xxxx``. Can there not be a ``positive - xxxxx``.

Where did you all learn it? In my student days in India we never had such ``anti`` exposure. Did school curriculam changed in India?

Re: # 366

Anil and BJ Kumar,

U both raised an issue which I think is a non-issue.

Pak-i-stan can be the monogram of the provinces it was made-up of but it`s also meant that it`s the country of Paki people i.e Pure people. If we stop calling them Pakis, it wud amount to derecognising them as Pure people.

They called themselves as Pakis and if sounds like an abusive word, the blame lies with them, not with us. In figures of speech words convey two different meanings. It depends on the equation between the speaker and listener. I for one mean Pure whenever I use the word `Paki/Paaki`.

Re: # 366

Keep your friends close - and your enemies, even closer :)....

You may have grown up in utopia where there was no need to be anti-anything... but reality is kind of different... in real life - you need to be aware of forces who are against your values and should be able to take actions against it... that means you have to be anti-xxxx...

Jihad is a real threat to any civilized society... you need to be aware of it... you can close your eyes like gandhi`s monkey which saw no evil - but that doesn`t mean evil is going away...

Re: # 374 mohar11

``Jihad is a real threat to any civilized society... you need to be aware of it... you can close your eyes like gandhi`s monkey which saw no evil - but that doesn`t mean evil is going away...``

``civilized society???``

Like the one being discussed on ``An Untouchable Apology``?

LOL...you`re seriously funny

Here`s a not so seriously-funny joke for you ... I hope you can see its relevance here:

A traveling salesman was looking for a room to spend the night in a small city but couldn`t find one. At one of the motels the clerk told him he was welcome to share a room with another guest, if he could bear the other guests loud snoring. The salesman agreed and took the bed.

The next morning he appeared in the lobby all rested and fresh, which surprised the clerk. The clerk asked the salesman how he managed to sleep in that room.

``All I did was to kiss the sleeping man on his cheek and say `Good night, honey``, the salesman replied. ``The man sat quietly in his bed with his eyes wide open for the rest of the night, while I slept like a baby.``

So keep your eye open, mohar..........LOL

BOO

:-)~~

Re: # 382 ntsyed

Good story... but don`t try that with bania... remember, bania always has a knife in his armpit... you will never know what`s going to happen when you are sleeping... :)

Re: # 366

Anilji,

May be terrorism flowered since you were gone? May be people are just
tired of people getting killed, bombs going off, trains and building exploding?
This is probably one way of of getting even by the people who do not pay back
in the same coins like suicide bombings and terrorist activities?
I do not know, just guessing.

shishapa

That`s going overoard .:) On the contrary, one can be quite certain of a very different scenario, IF we keep in mind that continuous improvement - economic, political, social - is absolutely necessary, but by no means sufficient to change the broader contours of people`s thinking, be they Muslims or Hindus or Kashmiris or Ghatis.

Re: # 365

Kaalchakraji,

That is true with normal people. There are certain people, for them, nothing is
sufficient or enough or good enough excpet one thing...
You can`t win with these people. We have experienced such people in the past,
dealing with them now and probably will have to deal in the future.

#361 by shishapa on December 26, 2006 8:55am PT

It`s very possible in Pakiworld™, the magical bizzaro world that pakis live in..

Life in Pakiworld™
If India gives up Indian Kashmir, it`s economy will boom.

Life in real world
India has been growing at around 8% for a long time now..9% in the last quarter..

Life in Pakiworld™
If India gives up Indian Kashmir, Pakiland will open it`s markets to India..something that will benefit India more than Pakiland

Live in the real world
India already has a trade surplus with Pakiland and any more trade can only benefit Pakiland


Life in Pakiworld™
Prophet tahmed(PBUHSRR) adding a smiley icon to his post makes his post funny..

Live in the real world
Indians don`t care for prophet tahmed(PBUHSRR)`s approval....

shishapa

There is definitely a belief amongst us that if we could simply `fix` politics, give enough `justice,` bring greater economic prosperity, offer sufficient `love,` all problems will go away. Gandhi and Nehru in this view, were clearly not fair enough (and Netherlands not liberal enough, Europe not rich enough, and so on and on endlessly).

We will one day become miracle men and women, and sure as sure can be, happiness will be everywhere. :)