India, Pakistan and the Kashmir dispute

Re:ferozk#43

[..The situation in Pakistan is fluid and it is unsettled because the nation is in the process of changing; changing from the policies of the past....]

That is an interesting point. Given that you live in Pakistan, I will take your word that Pakistan is in a state of flux.

The real question is the following - what is the Pakistani establishment`s long term vision of its relations with India, given a compromise on Kashmir? Assuming that a compromise in Kashmir satisfies only halfway the aspirations of the Pakistani establishment, will it truly bury the hatchet? Will it give up rivalry with India and open up trade, travel and transit rights to Central Asia? Will there be complete normalization? I am not sure the answers to these questions are a ``Yes`` any time soon.

The only way to move forward is to adopt the China-Taiwan model. Put aside the Kashmir dispute, give it the perfunctory lip service and focus on normalizing relations otherwise. If Pakistan is willing to fully normalize relations with India like any two sovereign countries, that will send the strongest possible signal to India that there is real change happening in Pakistan and as such, it is worthwhile to compromise on Kashmir.

Dear BJ,

yASSer goes `there` (u know that from Dr. Hoodbhoy board) unconsciously all the time. Now he remembers his family profession nautanki (whilst referring to Sadna). Prolly he`s a product of napaaki Heera Mandi of LaWhore. You know it`s easy money from that profession. He`s able to go to Rutgers with easily gotten money. However the genes - family and national - wont go away that easily.

Dear VRV,

Nautanki is a form of Indian street theatre and has no ``red light`` connotations as far as I know. Sadna is the one who popularised this term by using it for everyone she couldn`t respond civilly too. It turns out that the biggest nautanki in this cyber-town is hers.

But thank you for showing us your auqaat and dragging my family into it. I could venture similar guesses, and from the looks of it I`ll be on the dot. But I am just not going to stoop to your level- because thank god I don`t share your ``genes`` whether ``national`` or ``familial``.

Sometimes I wonder if the Kashmir issue was actually resolved, god forbid, where would 50% of the news on all those Indo-Pak news channels come from, and what would happen to those hordes of writers/reporters/journalists devoted to this very cause?
It might sound stupid, actually it dies, but this whole issue appears to me as some sort of a media conspiracy - a contorted form of the `divide and rule` strategy. lol!

PS: BJKumar is no stranger to such abuse that VRV has put up ofcourse. If an Indian (especially a woman) dares disagree with the mighty BJ... he very liberally describes that woman as a ``whore``.

So maybe this is a national psyche.... infact a severe psychological wound on the Indian male`s psyche, borne from some deep rooted sense of inadequacy as well delusional narcissistic megalomania. It is for this reason that the Indian male more readily drags his female family members as well as others as object of ridicule. Since a woman is the axis of ``social and moral`` values of the Indian male, it makes perfect sense to make her a goddess or make a whore or burn her at the stake. Sati-ism, as I like to call it, is Indian culture... for Pakistanis sadly it is also cultural lag.

Yasser,

Nautanki is a UP+Bihari art just like Mujra. Rest of India has nothing to do with it. Dont disown those two (nautanki and Mujra) coz u have mujras in Pakikstan as well.

2. Urdu is also an Indian language which u took as ur own.

How can u disown Nautanki, Mujra and Urdu as napaaki?

As for `levels`, u are not a holyman. For that to be clear read ur own posts.

U dont know India`s diversity. India is not UP and Bihar.

PS: HP is no stranger to such abuse. If an Indian (especially a woman) dares disagree with HP... he very liberally describes that woman as a ``whore``. He did once for Sadna.

Ref tolkinin #36

[Women have now most rights than dead jessica lal]

If you know the Jessica Lal story, she was shot dead and her killer, a relative of former President Shankar Dayal Sharma, got convicted of murder despite tampering with evidence and an earlier aquittal.

Yeah, Pak women have more rights. Any Hindu girl under 14 years of age in Pakiland has the ``right`` to freely convert to Islam and marry a Muslim man 35 years old whom she hasn`t seen before.

Pak Muslim women get their Canadian visas very easily: they don`t have to provide evidence of financial support while in Canada; they don`t have to give valid reasons for seeking admission to Canada. According to President Pervez Musharraf, all they have to do is get gang-raped... which is not too difficult in Pakistan despite the Koran`s admonition to men to keep their gazes lowered. Yeah, I know, the Koran didn`t say anything about keeping your penis lowered.

What is this paki/napaki buddy... I was not aware that Nautanki is a form of mujra. Thanks for telling us that Sadna`s abuses have a sexual/red light connotation at some level.

#56 by harimau on December 19, 2006 5:32am PT


Pak Muslim women get their Canadian visas very easily: they don`t have to provide evidence of financial support while in Canada;


In fact, the financial assistance is built into the visa....didn`t el-presidente say something about a million $ or so...

I wonder what chowk strategic thinkers think of this development. Connect this dot to the naval facilities the Chinese get at Gawadur and you get the picture: In addition to fighting terrorism (a concern for China too in its western sinkiang province), this also provides China with a short-cut to the middle east. And Pakistan gets strong support against domestic terrorists as well as revenues from use of Gwadar and from providing ``warm water access`` to China - something the Russians dreamed of for centuries and came close to accomplishing until they were pushed out of Afghanistan. The Great Game - 21st century style.

Meanwhile - Mushy plays his cards exactly right by rapprochement with India on Kashmir and close ties with the US while building up on a half-century of close ties with China.


ABBOTTABAD - December 18: Chinese soldiers participate in the concluding session of the Pakistan-China joint military exercises held here on Monday.—PPI