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Venus, Earth, and Mars - The Untold Story

Muhammad A Hussain January 23, 2007

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#13 Posted by nasah on January 27, 2007 6:13:17 pm
and yet if we find life on Mars -- which I don`t think we will -- because it was life that made earth what the earth is today -- so diffferent from Mars -- not vice versa -- and not the water -- water was abundant on Mars for billion of years and is present even now and -- yet Mars is barren.

how life ended up on earth is yet another subject for argument......

but anyway if the impossible to improbable happens on Mars -- life will not become more precious -- it will become even cheaper than what it is right now on earth....under the creepy anti-environmental kyoto-killer kreatures like the George Bushes of the world....
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#12 Posted by Saroya on January 27, 2007 5:05:15 pm
Re: # 11

`Science` is merely a `word` that describes an ability to produce a solution to a problem.

In the broadest sense of the word, Science, refers to any system of OBJECTIVE knowledge.

The operative phrase here is `objective knowledge`; in other words, knowledge UNDISTORTED by EMOTION or PERSONAL BIAS; knowledge based on OBSERVABLE phenomena.

The author is motivated by a desire TO UNDERSTAND WHY THE WORLD IS AS WE SEE IT AND HOW IT CAME TO BE and captivated by the age old question `where did we come from and could life, as we know it, exist elsewhere`.

It is as obvious that the author is inclined to be objective with respect to views and beliefs that differ from his own, as it is obvious, by your response, that you are inclined to be subjective and therefore unprepared to contribute to the discussion.








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#11 Posted by nasah on January 26, 2007 9:58:42 pm
Life is not DNA , RNA, lipid, carbohydrate and protein, carbon, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, sulfur, phosphorus, methane, other hydrocarbons, or carbohydrates, -- life cannot exist without most of them even in the presence of water -- also life cannot be created with all these constituents mixed together in high concentrations in the presence of water -- no matter how many times the scientist zap it with electricity or irradiate it with the UV light x-rays or gamma rays.

no scientist worth the salt has succeeded in creating life in a test tube though they have created almost all the constituents of a living cell -- except life itself by the methods mentioned above.

the scientist can go on making and mixing the soup and shaking the bottle till hell freezes but no self perpetuating creature is going to crawl out of that biochemical goo out of the bottle -- ever.

Life does not follow Godly spontaneous generation/regeneration -- YET these over enthusiastic bio-challenged scientist are practically asking for `spontaneous regeneration` of life on Mars or on the moons of Jupiter just because there may be water there!

Now once life is created -- it can adapt itself to survive even in Hell.
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#10 Posted by Akbarhussain on January 26, 2007 4:16:47 am
#8
The importance of water for the existence of life can be underscored by the fact that certain places in Atacama Desert (the driest place on Earth) are lifeless. The sands which do not have any trace of moisture for hundreds or thousands of years are essentially sterile. No matter how optimum is the amount of oxygen, temperature, atmospheric pressure, sunlight, or other essentials of life, these places do not harbour life. On the other hand, microbes called extremophiles, live and reproduce in places where there is water, regardless of the fact that the rest of the conditions are extremely unfavourable, as I mentioned earlier. The main question is: Is life unique to Earth, or it is also found elsewhere? There are two components of this question. One is, if there is a place outside Earth, with somewhat favourable environmental conditions to support life, is there or had there been spontaneous evolution of life? The second is, can life be supported outside Earth if similar conditions are artificially created, like terraforming of Mars? Mars and Jupiter`s moon Europa are main candidates for this dream. Scientists are completely clueless about these questions at the moment.
Avoiding statements is a safe way to explain something about which not enough conclusive evidences are there.
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#9 Posted by Saroya on January 26, 2007 3:44:54 am
Re: # 6, # 8

[The current adage that wherever there is water there will be life (as we know) is a bunch of science (fiction) bull].

Not science fiction, H2O = water

Combustion of Hydrogen with Oxygen = water.

HYDROGEN – Atomic Number 1

A colorless, highly flammable gaseous element, the lightest of all gases and the most abundant element in the universe, used in the production of synthetic ammonia and methanol, in petroleum refining, in the hydrogenation of organic materials, as a reducing atmosphere, in oxy hydrogen torches, and in rocket fuels. Atomic number 1; atomic weight 1.00794; melting point −259.14°C; boiling point −252.8°C; density at 0°C 0.08987 gram per liter; valence 1.

[French hydrogène : Greek hudro-, hydro- + French -gène, -gen.]

OXYGEN – Atomic Number 8
A nonmetallic element constituting 21 percent of the atmosphere by volume that occurs as a diatomic gas, O2, and in many compounds such as water and iron ore. It combines with most elements, is essential for plant and animal respiration, and is required for nearly all combustion. Atomic number 8; atomic weight 15.9994; melting point −218.4°C; boiling point −183.0°C; gas density at 0°C 1.429 grams per liter; valence 2.
[French oxygène : Greek oxus, sharp, acid + French -gène, -gen.]

WATER
A clear, colorless, odorless, and tasteless liquid, H2O, essential for most plant and animal life and the most widely used of all solvents. Freezing point 0°C (32°F); boiling point 100°C (212°F); specific gravity (4°C) 1.0000; weight per gallon (15°C) 8.338 pounds (3.782 kilograms).
From a biological standpoint, water has many distinct properties that ARE CRITICAL FOR THE PROLIFERATION OF LIFE that set it apart from other substances.
It carries out this role by allowing organic compounds to react in ways that ultimately allows replication.
ALL KNOWN FORMS OF LIFE DEPEND ON WATER.
Water is vital both as a solvent in which many of the body`s solutes dissolve and as an essential part of many metabolic processes within the body. Metabolism is the sum total of anabolism and catabolism. In anabolism, water is removed from molecules (through energy requiring enzymatic chemical reactions)in order to grow larger molecules (e.g. starches, triglycerides and proteins for storage of fuels and information). In catabolism, water is used to break bonds in order to generate smaller molecules (e.g. glucose, fatty acids and amino acids to be used for fuels for energy use or other purposes).
WATER IS THUS ESSENTIAL AND CENTRAL TO THESE METABLIC PROCESSES.
Water is also central to photosynthesis and RESPIRATION.
Photosynthetic cells use the sun`s energy to split off water`s hydrogen from oxygen. Hydrogen is combined with CO2 (absorbed from air or water) to form glucose and release oxygen.
All living cells use such fuels and oxidize (burn) the hydrogen and carbon to capture the sun`s energy and reform water and CO2 in the process (cellular respiration).
Water is also central to acid-base neutrality and enzyme function.
References
Cited references
1. ^ http://www.unep.org/vitalwater/01.htm
2. ^ Physical Forces Organizing Biomolecules (PDF)
3. ^ ``Discover of Water Vapor Near Orion Nebula Suggests Possible Origin of H20 in Solar System [sic]``, The Harvard University Gazette, April 23, 1998.
4. ^ G8 ``Action plan`` decided upon at the 2003 Evian summit
5. ^ ``Drink at least eight glasses of water a day.`` Really? Is there scientific evidence for ``8 × 8``? by Heinz Valdin, Department of Physiology, Dartmouth Medical School, Lebanon, New Hampshire
6. ^ Drinking Water - How Much?, Factsmart.org web site and references within
7. ^ Dietary Reference Intakes: Water, Potassium, Sodium, Chloride, and Sulfate, Food and Nutrition Board
8. ^ A Chronology of Water-Related Conflicts
9. ^ Water consumption indicator in the OECD countries
10. ^ ``Golf `is water hazard```, BBC News, March 17, 2003.
11. ^ ``Ogallala aquifer - Water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
12. ^ ``Mexico City - Water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
13. ^ ``Water shortages `foster terrorism```, BBC News, March 18, 2003.
14. ^ ``Major aspects of scarce water resources management with reference to the Arab countries``, Arab League report published for the International Conference on water gestion and water politics in arid zones, in Amman, Jordan, December 1-3, 1999. Quoted by French journalist Christian Chesnot in ``Drought in the Middle East``, Monde diplomatique, February 2000. - French original version freely available here.
15. ^ See 1994 Israel-Jordan Treaty of Peace, annex II, article II, first paragraph
16. ^ a b c See Christian Chesnot in ``Drought in the Middle East``, Le Monde diplomatique, February 2000. - French original version freely available here.
17. ^ ``Analysis: Middle East water wars, by Abel Darwish``, BBC News, May 30, 2003.
18. ^ ``Israel - water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
19. ^ ``Israel - water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
20. ^ ``Turkey - water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
21. ^ ``Ganges river - water hot spots``, BBC News, ?.
22. ^ ``Bolivia`s water wars coming to end under Morales``, Mercury News, February 26, 2006.
23. ^ ``Water privatisation: ask the experts``, BBC News, December 10, 2004.
24. ^ Sura of Al-Anbiya 21:30
• John M. DeMan (1999). Principles of Food Chemistry 3rd Edition.
• Vickie A. Vaclavik and Elizabeth W. Christian (2003). Essentials of Food Science 2nd Edition.
General references
• OA Jones, JN Lester and N Voulvoulis, Pharmaceuticals: a threat to drinking water? TRENDS in Biotechnology 23(4): 163, 2005
• Franks, F (Ed), Water, A comprehensive treatise, Plenum Press, New York,
• Property of Water and Water Steam w Thermodynamic Surface
• PH Gleick and associates, The World`s Water: The Biennial Report on Freshwater Resources. Island Press, Washington, D.C. (published every two years, beginning in 1998.)
• Marks, William E., The Holy Order of Water: Healing Earth`s Waters and Ourselves. Bell Pond Books ( a div. of Steiner Books), Great Barrington, MA, November 2001 [ISBN 0-88010-483-X]
Water as a natural resource
• Gleick, Peter H.. The World`s Water: The Biennial Report on Freshwater Resources. Washington: Island Press. (November 10, 2006)| ISBN-13:]
• Postel, Sandra (1997, second edition). Last Oasis: Facing Water Scarcity. New York: Norton Press.
• Anderson (1991). Water Rights: Scarce Resource Allocation, Bureaucracy, and the Environment.
• Marq de Villiers (2003, revised edition). Water: The Fate of Our Most Precious Resource.
• Diane Raines Ward (2002). Water Wars: Drought, Flood, Folly and the Politics of Thirst.
• Miriam R. Lowi (1995). Water and Power: The Politics of a Scarce Resource in the Jordan River Basin. (Cambridge Middle East Library)
• Worster, Donald (1992). Rivers of Empire: Water, Aridity, and the Growth of the American West.
• Reisner, Marc (1993). Cadillac Desert: The American West and Its Disappearing Water.
• Maude Barlow, Tony Clarke (2003). Blue Gold: The Fight to Stop the Corporate Theft of the World`s Water.
• Vandana Shiva (2002). Water Wars: Privatization, Pollution, and Profit. ISBN.
• Anita Roddick, et al (2004). Troubled Water: Saints, Sinners, Truth And Lies About The Global Water Crisis.
• William E. Marks (2001). The Holy Order of Water: Healing Earths Waters and Ourselves.









Congratulations Muhammad Akbar Hussain on an excellent article.

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#8 Posted by nasah on January 25, 2007 4:18:04 pm
There are too many `may haves` -- not enough `may not haves` in this article -- as far as life and its complexities are concerned.

The current adage that whereever there is water there will be life (as we know) is a bunch of science (fiction) bull.
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#7 Posted by Akbarhussain on January 25, 2007 4:03:27 am
#6
You are quite right. However quoting references would have meant an article double that size. Therefore, I have tried to keep the article as simplified as possible.
Most of the knowledge we have about the Universe is quite speculative of course. From Big Bang, to the birth of the Earth and Moon, and so on. But these are not wild guesses. Whatever we infer about the Universe is based on joining bits and pieces of whatever we know, till a time it is proved or disproved by conclusive evidences. Science is a self correcting phenomenon.
You are correct about sustenance of life under extreme conditions. We have ready examples of extremophiles. They have been found at the bottom of deepest ocean trenches, living and reproducing up in the clouds, at the bottom of the 4km ice sheets of Antarctica, in the boiling waters of geysers full of harmful chemicals...they are everywhere. So they can be everywhere. And the Earth billions of years ago was quite a different world than it is now, but it was a very slow transition. But abrupt changes do take their toll.
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#6 Posted by malikjahanzeb on January 24, 2007 5:27:27 pm
Nice article. Since most people here are unfamiliar with astronomical knowledge, the writer should have put down references to support the assumptions. Without that, the writing looks highly speculative.

Another thing I want to differ in is the notion that life cannot sustain in unfavorable circumstances. On the contrary, I think the definition of `favorable conditions` is not capped by evolution to be the one derived from earth`s conditions. An organism might not need oxygen or it might only thrive in 450 degrees Celcius. If only evoution is slow enough, life will be dragged with it to adopt technologies that can sustain those conditions.
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#5 Posted by AhmadBilal on January 24, 2007 1:54:53 pm
Interesting article. One of the things supporting life on earth is our moon. And some scientific data indicates that it is slowly drifting away. There have also been some interesting recent discoveries about Mars, like the possibility that water still flows there momentarily. If this is true, this can help develop small ecosystems on Mars to sustain human colonies in future. But the most important thing is to preserve our own planet and keep it hospitable for life as long as we can. Arctic ice is melting at an alarming rate due to global warming, and there isn`t anything being done to reverse the damage.
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#4 Posted by Akberm on January 24, 2007 9:21:13 am
Nice info... any knowledge about other universes? Sun is nearest star to our solar system, there could be other stars closest to some other solar system ... After all GOD is beyond our imagination :)
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#3 Posted by Inquirer on January 24, 2007 7:59:51 am
Good article. However, one has to grant a few key assumptions, viz., the Sun has heated up and the possibility of the runaway greenhouse effect. Too bad the masses of Venus and Mercury are not exchanged. Definitely, the Earth`s balance should not be disturbed and we have to take a comprehensive look. Nevertheless, it is possible that the change of earthy parameters will be uncontrollable by humans. In that case we would have to resign to be obliterated from earth hence the Universe.

Meanwhile, let us keep hope high and vision clear and refrain from aggravating the situation.

I would be interested in learning about the basis of heating up of the Sun.

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#2 Posted by mohar11 on January 23, 2007 10:56:48 am
interesting...
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#1 Posted by batman on January 23, 2007 10:52:17 am
Quite informing...
Sorry but the thought coming into my mind is a little different....
Shabe-e-afab, shab-e-mehtab
I wonder why not...
Shab-e-Miriech (mars)
Shab-e-Zuhra (Venus)
Shab-e-Atard (Mercury)
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Interact Index

    #13 nasah
    #12 Saroya
    #11 nasah
    #10 Akbarhussain
    #9 Saroya
    #8 nasah
    #7 Akbarhussain
    #6 malikjahanzeb
    #5 AhmadBilal
    #4 Akberm
    #3 Inquirer
    #2 mohar11
    #1 batman

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