On Zillae Huma Usman

#39

[- I am very amused to read that there is so much concern on the assassin`s past victims. I have read mixed reviews. Some said that the murdered women were models and others had different views. Pakistani society, despite it`s so called education, is backward to the last core. To them, a model girl can be equivalent to a prostitute. To them, there is no concept of women in leadership. This concept is more of a western concept and semantics than the naive eastern understanding. In that culture, I do not even think they have started grasping the nuances of career women or even professional women. So, I have sympathy with those who are confused here. May God grant them some wisdom. (Amen) ]

When a lot of the above-mentioned elements carry their repugnant thought process and immigrate to other parts of the world, they take and carry that mentality with them. As a result, they superficially try to assimilate in their new environments but keep on nurturing the negative pieces of ``that`` mindset. No doubt, we have been reading about similar episodes that happen in the rural Pakistan migrate with the immigrants to different parts of Europe and continue the series of embarrassment. But in Europe and other countries the perpetrators get the a$$ whipping, they escape from in Pakistan.

Lest I forget, I want to take a step back. I do not want to sound demeaning to the culture completely and what it entails -- there are elements that I love very dearly, e.g. poetry, art, sufism and affiliated aspects. But it`s the thought process that is real dark. There is simply no concept of individuality. I owed this clarification since I used the term ``Pakistani culture`` loosely. I just wanted to be fair.

#39 by ZahraJ,

To them, a model girl can be equivalent to a prostitute.

`Model` girls in gujranwala? Plenty of rickshaw riding prostitues alongwith thier pimps, yes, but no model girls. I don`t think there`s much of a fashion modelling industry in Gujranwala.

That doesn`t however detract in any manner from the heinous nature of the crimes.

(P.S. For precise definition of begmaat, you can either refer to `Diary of a Social Butterfly` in the weekly `The Friday times`, or perhaps even the cross-dressing Begum Nawazish Ali)

All of you guys who are twisting this matter for this blame game against Pakistan and religion.

In this case I don`t believe that has got anything to do with mullahism. Mullahs do brainwash Paki public, but, even then 95% of Pakistanis hate Mullahs. Pakistani Mullahs has very very less impact on majority Pakistanis.

If we agree with your point of view to blame Mullahs for the murder of this lady, then why 95% of Pakistani women roam around with NO purdah and even most of them wear western clothings, and they don`t have security guards around them, why mullahs don`t come and shoot them all?

And trust me it is so easy to kill them in Pakistan where law and order is not in a perfect position.

Then why I always roam around in T-shirt and jeans in the remote areas of Pakistan where Mullahs are in abundance and where majority of people are poor and illiterate and can easily be brainwashed? think about it.

Now, lets change the whole scenario, If a priest or Hindu extremist murders so many women, I will never blame Christianity or Hinduism for that. Yes, there have had been hundreds of serial killers in the world which have total screwed up psychology with pathological minds.

Serial killers can be religious extremists, computer geek`s, Pakistanis, Indians, Americans etc etc and black, brown or white.....they can be mullahs,liberals, MDs, engineers, politicians......................

And now let me point out another important aspect of my discussion, I am absolutely NOT defending Islam or Pakistan in this case. I am NOT the word Islam here, I am using the word of RELIGION, what does it mean?

It means that those people who are giving this case the twist of blaming it on Islam or Pakistan are just showing their pure hatred and bigotry for Pakistan and a particular religion and INTENTIONALLY DRIVING THIS WHOLE issue towards the blame game as usual to set their own scores against Pakistan and Islam.

And funny thing is they are too, quick to label me as Muslima, I did not use the word Islam in my previous posts.

Let me share with all of you about a survey that I did @ my job. I told all my colleagues about this particular case in detail and asked them to give me the most sincere feedback, whom to blame?

All of them(100%) People told me, of course it has got nothing to do with any religion, the guy was SERIAL KILLER and he should be dealt with seriously and hanged to death without wasting any more time in these discussions. And trust me all these people were pure AMERICANS.

Let me give you a quiz to solve..............

Can U spot a serial killer? I got 7 out of 10.

---

BY LOOKING AT A PICTURE OF A PERSON, YOU HAVE TO DECIDE IF HE

ISA COMPUTER GEEK OR A SERIAL KILLER. GO WITH YOUR GUT FEELING AND CLICK

ONYOUR CHOICE. THERE ARE 10 PHOTOS.



YOUR SCORE WILL BE GIVEN AT THE END.

http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz

Addendum (Post # 31)

- A few years ago around the same time of the year, I was invited to join Mukhtaran Mai for an evening. I have never been to an event like that where the key person has been violated so I was not sure what to expect. It was quite a long drive and I was very half hearted to go to a god forsaken place in Long Island. Not one of my favorite areas. I pushed myself to check it out after work. The ambience was very strange. People were coming and going and consoling her. I was just observing the whole set-up and how the interactions were working. She was covered in a huge chador shawl. Interestingly, quite a few Pakistani journalists were there as well as the media guys. Everyone was dying for a flavor to their story. There were quite a few representatives from the UN who were also there to meet and talk to her. It was more like an open house to come and see Mukhtaran. She was very tired and exhausted with all that attention. One guy who seemed a little reasonable and educated was quite active in preparing for his talk with her. I broke the ice and we shared a few notes.

He: Why don`t you come and join when I interview her?
Me: What are you interviewing her for?
He: I want to get the true story.
Me: I am sorry I am completely removed fom the local Pakistani media and its efforts. What are you referring to?
He: It`s still not proven that she went through what she claimed that she had gone through.
As a media person, I am here to ask her my set of questions. I want to ask her about the whole scene and how she was violated.
Me: Is this even polite to cross examine a woman who has been through a bad experience after a few years and keep on hammering on the bad memories? Why don`t you ask her about the projects she has undertaken and move on?

He (went silent for a few minutes) and left to talk to her.

I guess he spoke to her in Siraiki or whatever language he knew to bond. He ended up making her repeat the whole story and what happened and how it happened and the exact location and situation and everything that she went through. I was observing and I did not want to listen. I was just observing the expressions on both faces. There were quite a few clumsy and weird men also hovering around to hear her talk in Siraiki.

I did not understand their modus operendi, but it was neither polite nor in compliance with basic norms of civility.

He came back to me after his interview with her.

He: I want to carry on our conversation. I know it may not sound nice and polite to ask those questions that I had to, but that`s what a journalist`s job is.
Me: What do you do?
He: I am in media/journalism.
Me: You don`t seem to trust her episode?
He: No, I don`t.
Me: You don`t appreciate her efforts to make a change in the lives of many who would otherwise never accomplish that change.
He: I do. I speak her language and I have also worked in the armed forces in the past. I can tell you that the truth has not been fully uncovered.
Me: You don`t trust her because she is a woman.
He: There are other factors as well. She was under immense emotional pressure and may have forgotten what exactly happened. And may be retaliating to come back at her violators. It is the journalists` job to keep on repeating the questions, let the subject stay fresh in people`s mind and make sure that her story is the same.

I saw something in this exchange that really made me see the dark and ugly thought process. It was time to leave. I decided to say a few words to MM and met her friend who also served as a secretary of all the efforts underway.

Me: I am curious to know if you find all this support morale-boosting and comforting?
The woman translated my question in their local language and the result was, ``Kuch Pataa Toa Naheen Hota.``

I thanked them and wished her all the best in the initiatives. I heard a few stories about Nick Kristoff (the man behind introducing MM to the world). They seemed to like him very much and were indebted to him for his compassion and human concern.


Note - All this boils down to two things:

a. When you don`t let your law and order system be just, then you open yourself to the world for all kinds of speculations, misunderstandings, and action.

b. When you do not grant a woman justice who has been treated unfairly or killed for whatever reasons, then you are supporting those who have mistreated her. I am emphasizing on women because all these episodes revolve around women. As a rule, law should be applicable to all and sundry regardless of their gender.

You do not take care of one issue. And it comes back it you in a very different form jeopardizing the life of another woman. It seems that Pakistani legal system cannot even embrace Islamic law in its true sense. There are pointers in that law that cannot be achieved in today`s day and age. Why convolute the legal system by having so many bloody interpretations that you start jeopardizing the essense of ``justice`` ? If that is the case, then why not revert to the British law and learn something from the American constitution? I guess someone will have to define terms like, justice, fair, equal and rights for the natives to creat real change.

Sorry, I forgot that there has been some commotion in the upper echelons of the legal system and obviously priorities are different.

- I am very amused to read that there is so much concern on the assassin`s past victims. I have read mixed reviews. Some said that the murdered women were models and others had different views. Pakistani society, despite it`s so called education, is backward to the last core. To them, a model girl can be equivalent to a prostitute. To them, there is no concept of women in leadership. This concept is more of a western concept and semantics than the naive eastern understanding. In that culture, I do not even think they have started grasping the nuances of career women or even professional women. So, I have sympathy with those who are confused here. May God grant them some wisdom. (Amen)

- I also read some referral to begmaat . I do not understand where that is coming from and who the bloody hell are these begmaats. Apparently, the men on Chowk who use such terms loosely should care to explain. It is analogous to someone constantly crying over ``elites this and elites that``. What`s the reference to the context?

Re #36:

Most people think the same about Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and your own insanity.

Do you see the miror, pin-head?

So Abu Dawood is not authentic but Bukhari is? Did an angel come to Bukhari to narrate ahadith, but not to Abu Dawood?

Much of Islam has been disfigured on basis of recorded ahadith. This is why I cited issues of apostasy, blasphemy, and adultery … where recorded ahadith negate Quran. And these ahadith have been declared authentic by your ullema! Go figure.

And you sound like a broken record on Mirza Sahib. As I have suggested, first you should “prove” prophethood of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) to krishna_abcd, or SR, or hamidm … then we can discuss Mirza Sahib. Can you handle this? Or are you all hot air?

Re: # 35

no the angel only went to Mirza ghulam ahmed qadiyani and told him that he was a loonie toon, he got all hyped up, he told ur dad and the insanity moves along

Re: # 36

abu-sufyan,

...... please stop spewing nonsense against hazrat mirza ghulam ahmed - he is ``most revered human being for us, someone who is more important for us than our mom`s, dad`s, brothers sisters, our own children`` .......... shame on you

Abu Mian,

You cannot put Quran and recorded adadith in the same category. Some recorded ahadith validate killing adulterers, apostates, and blasphemers … although Quran squarely negates such killings. Furthermore, here’s a recorded ahadith that may amuse you …

+++

Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 38, Number 4348:

Narrated Abdullah Ibn Abbas:

A blind man had a slave-mother who used to abuse the Prophet (pbuh) and disparage him. He forbade her but she did not stop. He rebuked her but she did not give up her habit. One night she began to slander the Prophet (pbuh) and abuse him. So he took a dagger, placed it on her belly, pressed it, and killed her. A child who came between her legs was smeared with the blood that was there.

When the morning came, the Prophet (pbuh) was informed about it. He assembled the people and said: I adjure by Allah the man who has done this action and I adjure him by my right to him that he should stand up. Jumping over the necks of the people and trembling the man stood up.

He sat before the Prophet (pbuh) and said: Apostle of Allah! I am her master; she used to abuse you and disparage you. I forbade her, but she did not stop, and I rebuked her, but she did not abandon her habit. I have two sons like pearls from her, and she was my companion. Last night she began to abuse and disparage you. So I took a dagger, put it on her belly and pressed it till I killed her.

Thereupon the Prophet (pbuh) said: Oh be witness, no retaliation is payable for her blood.

+++

Such ahadith are used to support ``Blasphemy Laws`` even as verses of Quran strike out basis of Blasphemy Laws. So the problem lies not with Islam ... but with ullema`s Islam ...

Re: # 33

Sunnan Abu dawood is not revered as ``SAHIH`` (authentic) so there is a possibility of fabrication, i am not saying that there is one in this hadith because i am not knowledble enough in hadith to render a fatwa here but nice try. You however need to proove to us the prophethood of Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiyani first and foremost before you venture on to the other matters that don`t concern you anyway.

- I am all for brave and courageous women. They provide a good example in a society which has very ``few`` good examples of role models. What is the % of educated women in Pakistan working on initiatives dealing with the public? If you start killing them left, right and center (or even make attempts to do that) then you display your true colors. What is the deep rooted insecurity behind those true colors? Influence of patriarchal culture, influence of god forsaken practices of religion that are only interpreted by the scholars of the world (who have nothing better to do but focus on i.n.t.e.r.p.r.e.t.a.t.i.o.n.s and tweak and twist and manipulate the masses). That itself is a huge undertaking! One must salute those men who are into it!

- A young woman, a mother, a wife, and a daughter who had a promising career and life ahead is gone all of a sudden because of someone`s reckless act. If I talk to a few yogi friends who believe in reincarnation, they will give me a different take on life or I should say multiple lives that we end up having. I do not want to undermine the concept, but I do want to focus on what is here right now. It does matter. Just having a congregation to offer a namazae` janaza ain`t enough. That`s what Muslims love to do.

- I was at a dinner party after attending a thought provoking presentation by a female Pakistani American Scholar in NYC a few weeks ago. I was there to support a fellow KCiite. I have not done that in ages and haven`t attended any Pakistani event for quite sometime. I guess it was the right timing, being Women`s History Month. At the dinner, we ended up having a hot discussion on women in different cultures and this sad topic was brought up. The group was very diverse. A young american dude got really upset on hearing about Zillae`s story. His spontaneous reaction was, ``Why are people so intolerant? Why cann`t they just talk to each and resolve their differences or agree to disagree? Why do they have to remove the person from the scene to make their point? What`s the point? Is the point that worth it to kill someone?``

- When I read about the incident something else occured to me. I am sure Maulvi Sarwar is not the only Muslim male with a name Sarwar. Now, all the Sarwars on this planet will be scrutanized and their names will go through all kinds of investigation when they travel. This is where those who are innocent and have nothing to do with this fellow will suffer. These accidents are not to be taken lightly. It`s a very different world today than what it was decades ago. You mistreat one woman and the media brings her at the front page of all major news to show how muslim societies treat human beings under the garb of religious interpretations. And it`s high time the world needs to see their true picture. Musharaf went nuts when women in DC cross-examined him on the stance of women in Pakistan. He received a befitting response from quite a few in the Washington Post. His stance was, not to wash the dirty laundry out in the world. The women activists and attorneys insisted that you need to take care of that dirt inside before it makes its way outside. Apparently, that matter keeps on coming back right in our face. And I do not want to bore the readership with the content since it`s been out there for a while. It`s unfortunate if you have not had the opportunity to read it. Those of us who happen to wine and dine with people from different cultures in the US do feel real embarrassed to even have this pandora`s box touched. It is shameful that the country of your origin is clueless on the treatment of women. Wherever they find bold, confident and well educated women take a stand, they lose their sleep.

(continued)....
(As time permits)

Re: #31

The anguish ``A young american dude`` displayed is noble, however it isn`t any different from the anguish that we should and must have for any serial killings by lunatics. This Molvi Sarwar guy was a psycopath serial killer, he had killed several prostitutes and was arrested and then released at the behest of one of the leaders of the Q league and he ends up killing one of their own. What irks me is that the life of Ms. Zille Huma is some how more precious hence requires this kind of attention, as compared to the lives of those poor prostitutes. what annoys me even more is that insinuation that Molvi Sarwar was the Owner of Islam and hence all his actions therefore must be associated with that religion.

I am not suggestin that we don`t have our share of uneducated chauvanists who oppress women in the name of religion but this particular incident has nothing to do with religion and it has everythin to do with the fact that this guy was a nutt-job. Bring a verse from Quran or an authentic hadith of the prophet (PBUH) if you must blame Islam for something. Prophet (PBUH) said ``Best amongst you are those who are good in manners with their wives`` of all the things he (PBUH) could have picked as being the pre-req for being the best he selected this, how come we never focus on that? Because everyone has their preconcieved notions and everyone has their agendas, mullah`s have theirs and liberals pander to theirs.

Re: # 32
abu_safwaan

I may not always agree with you, but I do like your spirit. There is certain exuberance that I read in your posts(whenever I have and whenever they weren`t bombarded with religious quotations). I appreciate your feedback.

Out of curiosity, did I mention anywhere that Islam was to be blamed for Zillae`s assassination? Could it be that you misunderstood my stance?

There is a chain reaction here:

1. The legal system is convoluted on how to deal with the killings/rapes of women.
2. The system emphasizes more on what needs to be done in light of the Islamic Law.
3. The Islamic Law has multiple interpretations and nuances. The worst part is that as a result of the interpretations and nuances, the focus gets distracted.
5.You are no longer worried about providing justice to the victim. You are more concerned about making sure all the itsy bitsy teeny toony stuff of the sharia is taken care of.

What happened to that Islam where Haqooq`ul`Ibad took PRECENDENCE over Haqooq`allah?

We have lost the essence!

Let`s offer a collective Namazae` Janaaza on that too.
Inna` lillahae` wa innaa ilahae` rajae`oon.

Regards.

#25 by hamidm2

You can go to hell for all I care.

SR (#13),

Thanks for putting a human face on those wretched prostitutes. It does not surprise me that a great majority of them are sincere souls, simply trying to make a buck …

Atif (#10),

Age of simplicity dawned much before “either you are with us or against us”. Try tracing it back to killing of blasphemers and apostates … core beliefs of the ummah. For sheer entertainment, add to it stoning adulterers. Bush was probably borrowing from works of Bukhari when he came up with his infamous line.

Loss of an innocent life is lamentable … whether innocent children in madrassah, an adulterer stoned to death, a victim of honor killing, or murder of Huma Usman.

Murder of Huma Usman stands out in a sense though. Being a woman in leadership role, she probably was in a better position than most politicians to address plight of women in Pakistan. Her murder was loss of an innocent life, as well as a setback for what could have been a noble cause.