Raiwind IX

tahmed32
#56
I apprecaite your intervention on behalf of abu_safwaan, but you are pathetically biased. Being an elder and self styled moderator amongst the community, you ought to have shown more neutrality.

abu_safwaan started this tit for tat by using a particular word in #8. Some saner person who happened to be Indian questioned him and he just let loose and tit for tat began. Now you appear to be taking sides in a dirty game the precursor to which was abu_safwaan.
Secondly, if you all are so religious, howcome you write or support filth on the same page where Quranic Ayaats appear. Have a heart.

Do you wish that Pakistanis like me move to better moderated boards because of some zealots want to marginalise everyone other than their brand of beliefs and intellectuals like you support them.

Nicely written NFP :)

Inzi seems like a really nice guy- it`s a pity this Tableeghi bunch got their claws into him. And if refusing to toe the religious line is why Shoaib is out of the World Cup, then Pakistan have bigger problems than who`ll use the new ball?

abu_safwaan sounds suspiciously like porkershark from UP!

Re: # 66

Interesting...I am familiar with most of it. The stories of the prophet cannodling with the young Coptic slavegirl much to the annoyance of his wives is no news to me. Neither is the promise of young boys in heaven or Arab imperialism masked as a faith.

Hey Abu here is a link on the long history of pederasty in the Islamic world:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pederasty_in_the_Islamic_lands

Your holy prophet himself warned about the temptions of beardless youth. Part and parcel of the sexual hypocrisy that Islam perpetuates. The criticism of western licentiousness is a joke...Muslims societies have long been considered a gay man`s heaven. A lot of the Orientalists were drawn to Arabia for this very reason. Kind of explains how a group of men can sustain themselves in remote hidden caves. I mean are they actually celibate?

Last question Abu, so please remind us who have your ancestors been riding? Or should I ask who is riding you :)?

Guys

Go and read my ilog.

Re: # 68

All people regardless of religion are equal as per Quran? That`s news to me! You mean agnostics, atheists, Taoists, Buddhists etc...? So according to the Quran if my Persian friend converts to Christianity after marrying a Chinese Christian she is not supposed to be stoned to death? According to her that is the prescribed punishment and its exactly what the highest moral authority would decide in Iran let alone other Muslim nations. Egregious crimes, mob rule, fanaticism, intolerance, racism, elitism exist everywhere. I think Islamic nations are unique in having their highest moral authority sanction the death sentence for apostasy. Oh and the equality bit...please you have got to be kidding. Go to the Gulf states and look at their labor laws.

ijaz_gul: I came into this discussion a bit late, and had not read abu_safwan`s post #8. So, please dont assume that I have read every post on this board - hell, i havent even read the article yet, and I just jumped in when I saw one of hamidm`s entertaining posts.

I have read #8 now that you mention it, and I see that you are referring to a_s reference to christians as ``bhangis``. I am not obliged to make my views known on every single thing any poster writes, because please understand that would then require me to spend 100 hours each day on chowk.

Nevertheless, not that I owe you any comments on anything anyone else wrote, I can say that I have in the past seen such language used for christians and have in fact spoken out against it. Specifically, I have on such occassions noted that all individuals, regardless of religion, are equal per the Quran (and indeed a truly ``educated`` person does not need the Quran to understand this simple proposition). The fact that many Pakistanis persist in looking down upon sweepers and servants and so forth, and for using the term for sweepers (``bhangis``) to ridicule christians simply reflects shortcomings in their own character.

You also refer to me as a self-style moderator and thus swing the other way from accussing me of not making comments on what someone wrote. I do of coure comment on posts written by others - but that is no more than what everyone else and does not make me a ``self-styled moderator``. For inappropriate language (which you also refer to), please be more specific my cutting and pasting what you found objectionable.

A boo boo Safainwala,

That`s wrong to sidetrack the issue here. Pl stick to the point(s) raised by Nadeem.

Re: # 71

Q: What`s a multinicker?

#68 by tahmed32
So the lesson learnt is to never comment on an issue without having deliberated. It suits the multinickers but not you.

Though there is a passing reference to a particular word in #8, there has been a spate of blasphemous remarks on Hinuism and Islam including the pasting of a cartoon. As a Pakistani well aware of the perils of Pakistan Penal Code Section 295C, I find it strange that shady Characters like Abu_Safwaan can ingnite such hatred and then tolerate it.

Is sab kuch se to mujey bhi sharam atti hai.

Cheerios

Re: # 73

Well I have never been active on this site before. It might comes as a suprise but most of my views are shared by a large constituency of progressive mined people from ALL walks oflife and varying faiths and ethnicities. NOT confined to Indians or Hindus. I guess this is particularily hard to digest. That is why I choose to participate.

Eik aurat, hazar khasam.
Same individual with many IDs. So if one gets banned, he still keeps appearing.

Re: # 78

The reason I am so irate has partly stems from my frustration with people who want tolerance but often unwittingly are themselves agents of intolerance. In the 1980`s there was a large migration of Bahia`s, members of probably one of the most enlightened progressive religions in the world. Do you know who the mullahs executed with fury? Well the first female surgeon of Iran for example. This was way before 9/11, Irag (complete miscarriage of justice) and Muslims feeling scorned for their faith. In Egypt everyone has to carry an identity card and they can choose only one of three faiths: Christian, Jewish or Muslim. Please give me one example of Muslim outrage and subsequent collective action to demonstrate and protect minority rights. I have countless examples of the reverse.

Lastly: Why are Muslim countries the ONLY ones in the world who think it is totally normal to kill someone because they want to leave Islam? I am really skeptical that the majority of Muslims have a problem with this which really creeps out the rest of the world.

Re: # 77

eastmwest:

Why are you so upset. You say that you are a liberal and yet you stereotype Muslims. Look at chowk. Lets take some of the sensible Muslims here: Hamid, tahmed and masadi. Heck they disagree on everything. If schools of Islamic thought prescribe something what can most Muslims do. These schools won`t even let a guy like masadi near them. As far as zeemax and urstruly are concerned they may only accept their donations and nothing else. I do not want to go into it again but even Mr. Bin Laden is opposed to most of these schools (I am not saying that BL does not support death for apostasy .... I do not know).

So please do calm down. And also do not force poor old tahmed to repeat his thoughts again and again. If you are interested in his individualistic Islam just check his earlier posts.

I wish you well ... and welcome to chowk.

Re: # 76

I think I posited a legitimate reply to your assertion that everyone, regardless of their religion is considered equal as per Quran. So my Persian friend is wrong? I am curious to hear your reply.

If Islam so egalitarian and tolerant as you seem to suggest, why is it the only religion that specifies death for apostasy. Most schools of Islamic thought support this. Please spare me the bit about no compulsion in reilgion. That was the tagline when it was a weak. I really want to understand why so many Muslim countries specify death for apostasy.

ijazgul: you my friend, are a gentleman. i still remember the wonderful manner in which you responded to last years earthquake by organizing your own relief truck to go to the affected areas.

f chowk was a moderated board, you would have only intelligent, self-respecting individuals posting on chowk. However, chowk has proved incapable and/or unwilling to implement its interact guidelines. As a result it has stagnated, and instead of attracting large numbers of people of your caliber while getting rid of those who see it as a safe and secure forum to insult others, chowk serves to attract a handful of individuals ranging from true ladies and gentlemen to individuals who can only be described as lab specimen and/or clinically insane.

cheers. :-)