Justice, Judiciary and Journalist

GT/jang #: ......I think the politicians are all being quite opportunistic......I suppose that is part and parcel of politics......They are waiting to see which way the ball bounces and the cookie crumbles.......You may have noticed that none of the major politicians of the govt. have openly supported Musharraf either.......

.......I think they are all waiting for the SJC decision.......If it is in favor of the CJ, then it will set in a process where the courts will, themselves, weaken Musharraf.....And the politicians (read PPP) can then put him under extreme pressure and get all the cases dropped against BB and take power......

........If the SJC rules in favor of Musharraf, then an agitation might occur, at which point I think various political parties will try to lead that agitation.......That is when MMA will start burning KFCs.......

........The MQM and the ruling PML(Q) will quitely roll over as they see the tide turning and join whomever they think will be in power.......The day Musharraf is weakened, the MQM will, en masse, dump him.......And the PML(Q) politicians will, one by one, apologize for their sins, and try to join some other party.......

......The main party is really the PPP.......MMA doesn`t have a strong enough base in the country......Whichever way PPP rolls is the way the politics will role.........One would have thought that it would be on the forefront of this event, as it is the biggest victim, historically, of Army rule........However, I think the personal interest of its leader (Benazir) is taking precedence over its workers` direction........Had the PPP been led by Aitezaz Ahsan (a PPP minister and lawyer of the CJ), I think it would agitating at the moment........Keep in mind, the Musharraf govt. really went after various PPP leaders. They were kept in jail, without trials for years........One of its top leader was only recently released, without trial, after five years!!....I am quite sure they would all want to go after Musharraf........

``So the judiciary is still divided and the politicians are still divided, which is why the Army still remains strong, as it is undivided......`` (Bulleya)

are u sure it is?

Re: # 34

yes Jang -- the CJ is about to do Indira to Musharraf -- even without an election -- from Musharraf side the time tested delay tactice is in full swing to avert the collapse.

reminds me of indira gandhi and allahabad high-court verdict...the whole country was on strike..railways, trade-unions, RSS wallahs, JP Narain and his bihari students.

Even the perenial constitutional pimp of pompous ass coup makers -- Sharifuddin Pirzada, has expressed his inability to represent the government in the Supreme Judicial Council -- this time.

poor Musharraf -- being kicked by his own when he is down.

Two other government lawyers have already refused to represent Musharraf government in SCJ reference case!

nasah #: ...I am quite sure about the politicians being divided and opportunistic.....Not 100% sure about the judiciary at this time........This is the first time, their own CJ has actually taken on the military.....Previously, those who took on merely resigned......So now maybe the rest of the judges will get some backbone also......

``Even the perenial constitutional pimp of pompous ass coup makers -- Sharifuddin Pirzada, has expressed his inability to represent the government in the Supreme Judicial Council -- this time.``

...Yes this is actually more historic than anything else......If Sharifuddin Pirzada can refuse the govt`s. offer, then, really, anything can happen.........

bulleya:

Yes, it seems that something is happening. But I do not know how things will evolve. Need more info from the ground. What is happening to interactors from Pakistan? manto says that internet access is down. Can something be done Romair?

Re: # 40

bulleya;

I meant ... can something be done about the internet access. In any case, if it is just the lawyers and the media then nothing much is going to come from it. Some patching up here and there and that will be about it. If the disgruntled army faction gets in or/and the MMA leadership gets in things may turn worse. But IF the unwashed masses get excited and brush aside leaders and simply air THEIR views then irrespective of whether Musharaf survives or not, only good can happen.

GT#: ....I am in the final days of moving back to the Pakistan area......I didn`t realize my arrival would instigate such a ruckus :-).......Wish I was there, right now......One cannot miss such important historical events.......Sure beats a 9-5 job.......Due to this, I am spending quite a bit of time getting info from Pakistan......However, someone who is actually on the ground would know better........Perhaps Manto....

......What I do know is that I have never seen so much, across the society, support for any one person, i.e. CJ........every site one goes to, everyone one talks to is on his side due a combination of three issues, in which he is directly and indirectly involved:

- America should not be allowed to bomb and kill Pakistanis in Waziristan
- Govt. should not be allowed to pick up people, without a trial, regardless of USA`s GWOT
- CJ should be a figure of higher authority than the COAS

.....This is across the board, from maulvis to IT executives....Only the very pro-Western tiny elite is not supporting this.....Even expats are on the CJ side.......Though perhaps not the USA expats.....

One thing I must say, which I have been saying for the past six months, after spending six months in Pakistan doing research for a book, last year......I discovered that there were only two groups in Pakistan, who took on the govt., without fear: the media and the lawyers.......this conclusion has proven true.....

AndI also discovered that the civil judicial system in Pakistan still has some level of competence......And that people still have some respect for it.......More respect than they have for the police and other govt. depts........Kind of like the respect, they use to have for the military at one time......

I think Musharraf may well be able to ride this out, through a deal with certain politicians and help from USA......But he is permanently damaged........and I think beyond repair......Uptil this time, I think he viewed himself as a figure who was assisting the, ``enlightened`` part of the society against backwardness etc........The English language press, generally and subtely supported him........However, now even the most enlightened parts of the society: lawyers, media, private sector etc. are against him.....

He only has the military supporting him........And I can tell you for a fact, that there is a great amount of disgruntledness in the military against Musharraf for his actions in Waziristan.......this is something else I discovered last year......And the USA is pressuring him to, ``do more``.......

He is truly stuck........

now listen to this latest from Musharraf -- he is backing down -- says Chaudry is still the CJ -- the coward now blames Shaukat Aziz for the firing.!!


ISLAMABAD: President Gen Pervez Musharraf has said the “manhandling” of suspended Chief Justice Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry by security personnel and police was an “unfortunate incident”.

The president said this at a meeting on Wednesday night at which all aspects of the judicial crisis following the chief justice’s suspension were reviewed, a federal minister told Online on condition of anonymity on Thursday.

The president expressed disappointment at the manhandling of the chief justice while he was being taken to the Supreme Court building on Tuesday, the sources said.

He said the incident had bought shame to Pakistan and that Justice Chaudhry must be treated with respect and honour, as he is still chief justice of Pakistan.

He added that he had not issued any directives to withdraw the chief justice’s privileges. He said there was no ban on meeting the chief justice.

Gen Musharraf said that he took the decision to file a reference against the chief justice on the advice of the prime minister and now it was up to the Supreme Judicial Council to decide the case.

The government would not interfere in this matter, he said, according to the sources.(Daily Times)


Uzre Gunah budtur uz Gunah....The `incident` has not brought shame on Pakistan -- Musharraf has brought shame on Pakistan. Iss sadgee peh kaun nu mur jai ai khoda...

yes Omair u may be right -- looks like the Pirzada did it -- his refusal to defend Musharraf pull the rug under Musharraf`s arrogance -- yet the deluded man thinks he is above the `incident`....!

Re: # 43

Chauhan sahib:

Our own manto is marching there in black and white ... his statement in BBC was far from stupid. But yes, one does hope that the protest is not hijacked by the MMA leadership. On the other hand if it is hijacked by the unwashed masses then great.

These foolish liars in black and white, who are marching up and down, throwing bricks, and giving stupid and illogical interviews to foreign news services (I am talking about Mr. Paracha :) ) are paving the path to their own destruction. They are accelerating the rise of the Paki Tally Ban and MMA. Then, one day we will see them shouting, marching, throwing bricks against having to grow a long beard in only two weeks.

GT Sahib,
Mushy is just a puppet and a facade for the Paki Punju Paindoo feudal.military establishment. MMA is waiting in the wings. Mohajirs are fed up with all of them. What the lawyers in black and white are doing is the sudden softening of the liberal cause. While Mohajirs and liberal Paki Punju Paindoos fight, the die-hard sworn TallyBan among the Wana Wana NWFP Lallas and Paki Punju Paindoos (like Urstruly, Atif2, and Ali1) will take over the land. Then, no one will be able to watch Shipa Shetty strut her stuff in the Land of the Pure. :)

#40 by bulleya on March 16, 2007 10:29am PT


Sure beats a 9-5 job


The last time you said that was in the days after 9/11 when you were dying to quit your job and join the american attack on afghanistan....t-shirt with paki flag and all..how times change..now you`ve gone from the US to canickistan to pakiland....

Folks,
Nothing new here. It`s the age-old Paki Punju Paindoos vs the rest of Pakistan fight.

Paki Punjus vs Bengalis 1971
Paki Punjus vs Sindhis 1979
Paki Punjus vs Mohajirs 1990 - 1996
Paki Punjus vs Kashmiris - 1948- 2007
Paki Punjus vs Baluchi 1974, 2006
Paki Punjus vs Pathans 2005, 2006, ...