The Day We Killed Bob Woolmer

it was shocking to hear he had died and he did well for pak cricket but isn`t it a bit too much of conspiracy theory madness to accuse someone of poisoning him? who would do it? why would they?

let`s wait for the coroner`s report shall we?

Artcile`s headline screams: The Day We Killed Bob Woolmer

To wake up in the morning and log into chowk with bleary eyes, and get the shock of your life that you are one of the person charged with killing Pakistani team`s coach is, well, not pretty. Its good thing that I used the bathroom before reading the headline of this article, or else I would have peed in my pajamas.

As if charging people for murder was not enough, the author goes into even speculating the method of killing, as he writes - ``I along with many believe he was poisoned. Why else would one be lying in a pool of their own vomit and blood. ``

So now author has identified the killers and the method of killing. All that is left for Inspector Zarrar to do is to find a motive.

Boy, I already feel author breathing down my neck ~shudders~

Woolmer had a pre-existing heart condition I believe, and depression over the defeat took him over the edge. This is sad, and his commitment to his team deserves respect. But lets not get carried away and start falling on our swords or start self-flagellating (like the geniuses do on the streets on muharram).

Very interesting piece. I`m curious as to statements like, ``Pakistan needs an autocratic ruler...``, not sure whether these notions are based in anything more than opinion.

Bob Woolmer was one of the best coaches we ever had. He put his life and soul into improving Pakistani cricket, and barring a few one-day matches, his efforts did pay off in test matches. It is such a tragedy that this extremely likeable Englishman died for the cause of Pakistani cricket. My thoughts go out to his family. Rest in peace, Bob Woolmer. We will miss you.

It appears that he was the only one in the sqaud of suckers who had a sense of honor, the team does not even have the capacity to lose honorably and gracefully; he could nt bear the shame. Inzmam and others are thick skinned to feel much.

Re: # 6

Inzi;s resignation speech indicated this as much and the level of self-absorbtion present in the team members....sad...sad that they cannot respect a human being

The way the Tableeghis were influencing the team you never know if some crazy Tableeghi puts the blame on a white christian coach who may be deemed to have a `bad` influence on the team`s faith? Could some Tableeghis be monitoring the team`s performance and then taking their `corrective action` after finding the weakest link.?
Anything is possible with these mullahs` sense of justice.
you never know if somebody like Danish Kaneria is next on the line!!

#3 by tahmed32 on March 19, 2007 4:42am PT

``Woolmer had a pre-existing heart condition I believe, and depression over the defeat took him over the edge. This is sad, and his commitment to his team deserves respect. But lets not get carried away and start falling on our swords or start self-flagellating (like the geniuses do on the streets on muharram). ``

Tahmed ji you donot seem to be that dumb toturn the topic of this thread again to religious sectarianism so much easily. Do you have any problem with the shias flagellating in the streets during moharram. Please refrain from manipulating this sports board to your inner meaness and culpritness which you show from time to time and do ethnic crimes. In that term you are no better than Zeemax, Catchy, kaptain etc. who have swords in their hands of religious extremism. Its not falling on swords but it shows our great sorrows and resistance against enemity and hatred.

Bob Woolmer death is really a shock. I hope the clarity of reports and tests tell was he under stress or was poisoned. In anyways it is really Shameful. We cannot deny incompetency of our team, poor leadership and religious conspiracies that affected the sports criteria in large. Show some truthful logic and donot burn fields if it reaps weeds. Sow something and then expect the effects of your cause. This religious baiting wouldnt make things better in your Pakistan sitting thousands miles away.

Great article -- worthy analyses and interesting recollections. What spoiled it, of course, was the conspiracy theory at the end.

re. the statement ``It doesn`t take a genius to figure out heart attacks don`t cause vomitting``, it would be fantastic if the author were half as well-informed of symptomns of myocardial infarctions as he is of cricketing subtleties. :-)

But thanks for an otherwise well-written, and `honourable` obit.

Re: # 8
Sir, please refrain from making political statements. Write an article against intolerance and extremism elsewhere, and I will fully support you. But let this be a place for people to honour the memory of a good man. Thank you.

quioin #9 . I am sorry if I offended your religious feelings. However, I find sunni customs (e.g. sacrificing of sheep in order to ``bribe`` Allah!!) and other ``muslim`` rituals (e.g. thinking that doing the hajj will wash away their sins) to be as ridiculous as self-flagellations of shias.

you write ``Show some truthful logic and donot burn fields if it reaps weeds. ``

Well said. The above-mentioned rituals are the weeds. The truthful logic is simple: take responsibility. Woolmer death (no doubt triggered by his depression at the loss) provides an example of such responsibility - where did this come from if not from his cultural background. We muslims can look to such examples to learn this ``truthful logic``, or we can understand the message of islam to learn this ``truthful logic``.

I hope this makes more sense to you.

tahmed ji:

Self flagelating is different than sheep sacrifice unless you take sheep as humans too and vice versa, but you had very onesidedly attacked shia ethnicism being a wahabi preached and hadeth and tafseer interpreter with your own set of biased mind!

However matter closed as you have shown disrespect to all ethnicites of islam and proclaimed yourself disbeliever.

I feel sorry for Mr. Woolmer. May God bless his soul. As a coach he was directly responsible for the pathetic performance of Pakistani team in WCup but not quite. The facts state for themselves that if a country cannot find a coach locally for its team then how polarized and politicized cricket is in that country. I grew up watching hockey and cricket teams of Pakistan; witnessing the time when both teams had all the world titles simultaneously. Then came in Sharjah circus, which gave rise to betting and speculating and since then everything has been downhill. Endemic corruption has eaten away sports as well just as every other institution in society. God save Pakistan.

Before the news about Bob Woolmer`s initial unconsciousness, Geo TV was constantly presenting very bad insulting remarks of common audiance about Bob Woolmer, Inzimam and others, including the team as a whole. Those remarks were not making any proper sense and sounded very bad to me. I didn`t watch the match with Ireland, but the highlights were showing that Ireland, although was a new team, but was not any bad team at all. One factor behind our losing the match might be that we under-estimated a good team. Now try to think about all those who were putting insulting remarks against individuals, including Inzimam and Bom Woolmer; were they also not committing the same mistake...??? Were they mistakenly not under-estimating a good Iresh team...??? Then for why they were so badly criticizing the team with third-rate insulting remarks. And why Geo TV was presenting those third-rate comments? I did not see other TV channels, but Geo TV`s behaviour was really very immature.

If we lost the match, then it means that we as a Nation also had lost the match. Why to blame only team? We should try to evaluate our own behaviours and attitudes also. If we are not mature in our thinking and we openly present third-rate comments against our own individuals before International media, then how can we be mature in stadium...??? What International audiance might have got the message out of such remarks that our team was better model than players? Obviously, we do not pay any proper respect to our ownselves. Why should others respect us then...???

Bob Woolmer, our Coach, has died. Now we should stop our useless criticism on individuals. We should take some care of self-esteem of those individuals whose talents have been internationally recognized. If their own nation treats them so badly then how it is possible that they can get any psychological strength, which is vital for their performance...???

Bring the best player before me. I shall tell him, ``You are bad player. You cannot play well. You are out of form. Your good days have gone. Your Coach is alien. He may not be sincere with you. Instead of playing, you should retire, etc. etc.`` ... and then let that player participate in World Cup match. My question is: What shall be his performance...???

At the risk of prolonging the needless talk about the supposed ill-effects of the religious influence(s) on the team, I wish only to point out that in a tribute to Mohammed Yusuf, Mr Woolmer averred the former`s religious conversion, saying that Yusuf had gained a certain calm and balance that newfound spiritual centeredness often brings. (Not his words)

I remember his saying in another interview that the new religious-mindedness in the team was, on the whole, positive, for its fostering camaradarie and team-spirit. Can anyone doubt this?


So it would seem that the author`s contention that ``the group’s religious fervor and influence from the Raiwind extremists must have struck a nerve`` isn`t well-supported by Woolmer`s own statements.

It`s a little pathetic to be giving the man`s death a religiously conspiratorial slant, with no evidence as such.

PM,

I am no supporter of such allegations like extremist`s influence etc. But try to think over your own post. Why Woolmer had to favor those beliefs which were not his own...??? Can a relaxed person do it...??? A relaxed person would favor his own beliefs. Your own statement is indicating that might be Woolmer was in some sort of stress due to extremists, due to which he could not openly express his own beliefs.

quioin #13 there are no sects in the Quran, and as such those who ascribe to sects are not following the Quran. matter closed.

Re: # 17

I think extremist tableeghees were not behind woolmer`s murder becuase if they were they would have committed suicide-poisoning and half of the team would have been dead as well. The forensic evidence has all the hallmarks of a secular crime - the vomit, the blood on walls, and subject found in toilet....the works you know.

My murder conspiracy theory is that, Woolmer was assassinated by Indians. They hired a sikh assassin for that purpose; who killed Woolmer after the Pakistani team was already out of world cup for obvious reasons. It has been pointed out to Indians time and again that sikhs make bad assassins and intelligence operatives. Remember two days after 9/11 Indians started screaming that their plane was ``missing``. It turned out later that the whole debacle was caused by a sikh intelligence operative who was ordered to place a bomb in the plane and jump out of it midair using a parachute. When the time came the sikh-007 put his parachute in the toilet and tied the handbag containing bomb around his waist and jumped out of the plane, for obvious reasons.

Re: # 11

I apologize if that remark upset you. I am more upset with those Tableeghis and know what they are capable of. But I would not discount such a possiblity because it appears some blood stains were found which is possible if he was poisoned or was forcefully made to injest some drugs and then smothered.
I doubt any one at his level of career or with his extent of experience in international cricket would die of ``stress`` because of some cricket match loss.
Yes, but some Tableeghis who have infilterated the Pakistani cricket team would consider this as a defeat in their Jehadist battle against the world would certainly spill some blood to avenge it.

The lack of sensitivity and callousnes shown by some people here is very disappointing.

Author,

It doesn`t take a genius to figure out heart attacks don`t cause vomitting.

Are you kidding? Severe Nausea is one of the symptoms of an impending heart attack.

Noone killed Woolmer. It was his heart condition. Noone had blamed him for the loss, and he had the choice of not even returning to Pakistan because as far as I know his contract was only till the WC. It was unfortunate timing. That`s all.

Re: # 20

urstruly,

that was in poor taste, even for a tableeghi ............shame on you and the camel you rode in on .......

Re: # 9 - Thankyou for remembering me.

Anyways, religious attachment has nothing to do with the conspiracy of killing Woolmer. It is high time Naseem Ashraf is brought before the panel and quizzed.

While, interestingly, Waseem Bari, the supposed hot shot and head hunter of players refuses to resign. Why?
In the Europe and the West, over a train accident, the chief usually resigns and decides to keep his / her reputation protected and not to be thrown over the board to be trampled.

Pakistan Cricket Scene needs an Imran Khan, finally. And he must be grinning of course.

#15 by khuram,

I agree with you re ``Bob Woolmer, our Coach, has died. Now we should stop our useless criticism on individuals. We should take some care of self-esteem of those individuals whose talents have been internationally recognized.

But you must also acknowledge that it was a `b` team. Without your main penetrating attack bowlers who would have knocked out Ireland in below a hundred on that bouncy wicket, and without Razzaq to anchor when top and middle collapsed, what kind of result did anyone expect?

The only thing I blame is the structure of domestic cricket in Pakistan. I`m sure it will be redesigned now on the lines of county cricket with a constant stream of talent so that backups are always available like the aussies or the brits.

This calls for an autocratic yet a short tempered and authoritative person above all at the top like Imran Khan.
I would have said too of him being short tempered, but finally this calls for a purpose from his side.

Pakistan Politics and Cricket present the same view and facet. Both are riddled by gore politics.
Waseem Bari, the head hunter for players refuses to resign. Why?

Its high time, one and all should realise, Imran had the potential to drive the cricket team to the top. And he has to drive the country as well.

If ever we listen as a nation.

Re: # 24

yes I know your phuppha is dead but tell me what monkey knows about good and bad taste, hain?

``I along with many believe he was poisoned..``

Should have at least waited for the autopsy results before making this claim.

Rest of the article was a nice tribute to Bob Woolmer. He did a remarkable job in keeping the focus on cricket and improving the team`s performance, especially in Tests. And, PM is right, Woolmer was not bothered by the team`s religious activities. He did not interfere and stuck to his job.
From the England tour onwards, repeated injuries to key key players depleted the side. And then, the Oval fiasco, the captaincy mess and doping scandal, all made it difficult to keep the focus on cricket. Woolmer must be credited with trying his best given the unusually trying circumstances. A very sad ending for a good and decent man. may he rest in peace.

``It reminded me of a Hollywood movie where Sidney Poitier tames a group of cynical students.``

The movie was called ``To Sir, With Love``.

The movie was about respect; giving it and earning it. It seems that Woolmer repected the fact that he was seconded by Inzamam and Inzi was making all the decisions. Woolmer respected his degraded position, but the question is did Inzi respect the words of a coach who only wanted the best for his team and including his captain?

Zarrar, I am not a doctor by profession but I have known many incidents of heart attacks that were preceded by vomiting and in fact, vomiting and nausea is a sign of an impending heart attack. Your conclusion on the poison scenrio was in poor taste.

On GEO, this morning, there was a news item on the Pakistani cricket team`s defeat and people, on the street, were being asked their opinions. There was this man and in Punjabi he said Woolmer`s death was sad because he died in place of a man who should have died!

Ciao

I think this allegation of murder by the author is really callous. Just imagine if Bob`s family learns of this. How would they feel?

Bob Woolmer really was never allowed to function. A coach has to be fully in-charge. Here it was always a tug-of-war between the board chairman, the selectors, the manager, the captain, and the player power. There wasn`t much the poor guy could do, but he tried his best. Each was pulling in his own direction with the coach to take the blame.

R.I.P Mr. Woolmer.

ferozk There was this man and in Punjabi he said Woolmer`s death was sad because he died in place of a man who should have died!

Seems like his death took some newspaper attention away from the other `b` team we have - the one running the country.

Re: # 30

``On GEO, this morning, there was a news item on the Pakistani cricket team`s defeat and people, on the street, were being asked their opinions. There was this man and in Punjabi he said Woolmer`s death was sad because he died in place of a man who should have died!``

---

How pathetic is that Geo TV presents all the non-sense before International audiance.

#30 by ferozk,

There was this man and in Punjabi he said Woolmer`s death was sad because he died in place of a man who should have died!

Not to wish death upon anyone, but the fault clearly lies with Inzamam. He was never a good captain. It was clear in his haphazard and untimely bowling changes and field placements. Besides, he is an introvert and never led from the front or inspired his players on the ground with constant prompting like captains are supposed to do. He was a great batsman, but that`s all. He should never have been made captain. This is the bane of Pakistan cricket. Moin Khan was a natural leader and in any case, wicket keepers always make good captains because it doesn`t detract from their concentrating on their main task.

Re: # 20 Urstruly

Lolz...truly, good theory. Great.

#33 dont worry about the audience to the nonsense. worry about the nonsense - e.g. the nonsense involved in a military general firing the CJ, then backing off and pointing fingers at his staff when faced with riots. not to mention the nonsense of generals routinely taking over the government and then staying put until kicked out one way or another.

Re: # 36

achha jee

re: tahmed32 # 36; khuram # 37 amd zeemax # 34

I believe that person who said the quote in Punjabi meant ``shame`` in the sense that Woolmer died from shame and the person, Inzamam, who should have been ashamed by his performance, did not seemed to have been too bothered. I have been thinking about that man and his words all day and I do not think that he wished ill, but I agree that GEO should have clarified the context of his views and at the very least, should have followed strict guidelines in allowing that quote to be aired.

Freedom of press in Pakistan is still too immature to realize what responsibilities come along with freedom of press.

Tahmad sahib, I agree with your observations and to add to it if I may, Pakistani cricket mirrors Pakistani politics in more ways than one; there is no accountability; there is no transparancy of decisions; there is no structure of an organization and everything is Adhoc and there is no owning of individual responsibility, but there is desire for fame and glory at the expense of others.

To rub salts into the wounds, Canada scored 228 runs against England!

Ciao

Re: # 38

``Freedom of press in Pakistan is still too immature to realize what responsibilities come along with freedom of press``.

Very true.

And this applies to posting on message boards also.

#36 by tahmed32

tahmed, surprisingly noone has blamed the tinpot musharraf. After all he`s the chief patron, had first appointed his fauji corp commander successor on top of cricket, then a has-been diplomat of princely persuasions, and then this stupid medical doctor from amrika who had played some cricket in Khyber Medical College. Does noone think that`s where the buck stops?

#38 by ferozk,

Yeah. In fact a girl subordinate in my office said the same thing too. And when she saw the shocked look on my face, she said ``I mean ... doob kar mar jaana chaye tha`` .. so I guess that`s what the TV man meant. But still, Bob Woolmer was a great guy and nothing else is more important than condoling him in a dignified manner.

After the Irish match, Inzimam was fined 90% of his match fees for slow over rate and the rest of the team 20%.

This is just another indicator of how bad things were for Pakistan on St Patricks day.

I was fortunate enough to meet Bob Woolmer, very briefly but found him to be a very poliet and amiable person. After hearing all the interviews from the Akhters, Asifs of the team and other officials, Bob Woolmer passing is a great loss for Pakistan and the cricketing world.

Imran Khan had a very interesting thing to say post match and before Woolmers news, that Inzimam had become all powerful and had stopped listening to anyone else. Woolmer had understood the situation and had taken a backseat waiting for his contract to finish. Sadly, it ended in the most unfortunate manner. May his soul RIP.

Re: # 38

That person may not have any serious ill will. But those words were stupid enough that should not have gone on air. When we directly insult someone and that someone, althought might have been broken in innerself, behaves as if he doesn`t bother, it means that he/ she is having strong nerves. To have strong nerves is a positive quality. To die of defeat, or of any other emotional stress, is a negative quality because it is sign of weak nerves.

We should learn from past happenings and should not try to promote negative attitudes. Death of Bob Woolmer on one side may be the symbol of his intense sense of responsibility that could not be successfully met. On the other side, he should not have died just because of a defeat. It is another thing that then our own nation (through Geo TV) would not let him live with proper peace of mind. If you don`t give peace of mind to performers, how will they perform...???

the poor man probably died bemoaning the moment when he decided to become coach of that bunch of overpaid, overhyped, tossers aka the pakistani cricket team.

about inzi. he is not a good captain but he is a great batsman. he is too nice to be a good captain. pakistanis only understand one language: dandah. so you need someone who will regularly verbally abuse them and kick their useless behinds if you want them to do something. imran khan understood that.

maybe younis khan should be captain. he seems to have the toughness required. he is also from peshawar so if they don`t listen he could ask them to bend over and drop their trousers. after all, a lot of the team are lahoris who are used to that kind of thing.

i hope bob woolmer is given proper respect by the govt of pak. he tried his hardest.

re. khuram (with one `r`)
``Why Woolmer had to favor those beliefs which were not his own...??? Can a relaxed person do it...???``

Yes. I do it all the time. And Woolmer was an educated person, not given to seeing in black and white, as you suggest. Not everyone sees (other) religions as necessarily unfavourable.

re. Zeemax #various: Couldn`t agree with ya more!

re ``Inzamam, who should have been ashamed by his performance, did not seemed to have been too bothered.``

Yeah, but Inzi never seems to express much emotion either way-- win or lose. Like the good Muslim he is, for better or worse, he believes there`s no point in crying over spilt milk, when the spilling was `written`.

I`m not caricaturing anyone or their religion, mind you. Maybe it`s just Inzi`s intrinsic nature (and re-inforced by his religion) to be kinda stoic. Maybe that`s what makes him such a bloody cool customer with bat in hand. And maybe that`s what keeps him from being the kind of captain that Pakistan needs and most of us here want.

#46 by PM

Maybe that`s what makes him such a bloody cool customer with bat in hand. And maybe that`s what keeps him from being the kind of captain that Pakistan needs and most of us here want.

You`re spot on re Inzimam. This analysis is what I could not pinpoint in a previous post.

Re: # 45

Dear, if a person favors others beliefs, it means that either he is under stress or he is really a broad-minded person. And to favor other`s beliefs is included in the belief of broad mindedness. So if a broad minded person favors other beliefs, he actually doesn`t go against his own beliefs. But whoever shall really go against his real (i.e. personal -- not necessarily religious) beliefs, he cannot be relaxed. So if being broad minded person, Woolmer favored others beliefs then he may not be under any stress. I can accept therefore that there may not be any extremist`s pressure on him. I already said that I am not supporter of extremist`s pressure theory.

However, I do not think that a broad minded person can favor unnecessary restrictions because restrictions are opposite to the aim of broad mindedness. If you are a broad minded person, can you stay relaxed under unnecessary restrictions? I think you, being broad minded person, cannot be relaxed then. Because now the situation is against your real beliefs!

Regards!

I must have written a slightly emotional article. But I don`t mean to raise the issue of how Bob died. But instead want to celebrate how he lived. Dont want to start any conspiracy. Nasim Ashraf has resigned. That fucker, along with other PCB money hungry mongrels should be taken out for an afternoon of electric shock. Once we have a proper organization in place for our cricket we won`t have such irresponsible behavior ever again. And it is true. We are all responsible for Bob`s death. Why didn`t we speak up before?? We are to blame. If you were Bob`s son or wife what would you think. Wake up PCB and Pakistan Cricket... you are murderers.

Re: # 49

Well said about that chamcha Nasim Ashraf; what an incompetent piece of....

[Discipline was Pakistan’s problem and will be for years to come. The fact that the majority of the team has never had a complete education (academic or otherwise) explains their erratic behavior. With discipline comes composure. And with composure, you don’t chase wild deliveries outside off when your side is struggling to put up a total! With that said, Bob Woolmer could not be blamed wholly for Pakistan’s demise. ]

Very well said!

On Naseem Ashraff: If its an Official News thn I don`t think he has resigned mainly because of the performance of our team, as today he himself said on a local tv channel that he did`nt want to bring changes just before the World-cup, and that he should be given time to improve. The reason for his resignation is Bob Woolmer, chiefly because I guess he`s more concerned about the Autopsy Report, one never knows, sorry If I am bringing up the issue of conspircy again, but still, how coward, running away from the whole Issue of his death.

Bet, if woolmer hadnt died, I am sure, this guy would`ve never resigned

---

not atleast on the performance let alone since he became Chairman few months ago.

Re: # 8
Abay Ballu! Chup Hoja. Itna na Pharak! Abhi Bangladesh nay Kutoon ki tarhan peeta hai Hiduoon ko jo teray bhai lagtay hain. Aur Bola na to sala itna maraingay Pakistani aur Bangali kay poori duniya kuch bhi dekhanay laiq nahi rahay ga.
Jo tera kaam hai woh kar. Which is singing like a buffalo would only from its ass.
But loosers like you who are probably living on charity in India (jo jisnay pheka khaliya)
would always be loosers.
India is loosing like crazy and here you are critising Pakistani cricket. First fix our own house, then critise others. But even in your own house vermin like you are treated like vermin. And vermin you shall be!
This article is about something else. Go and j@ckoff somewhere else againt Pakistani politics and its countrymen. Try to post only related comments over here!

Re: # 53

Adarang Bhai,

Do you recall the words of your own composition :

``Sachi kahat hai Adarang to,
Nadi Naav Samjoog.....

Kaun kisis ke aave jaave ,
daana paani kismat laave,
Yehi kahat sab loog....``

It is all in the destiny , you cannot send me any where , my destiny is to speak the truth.........your is perhaps to deny the truth........

By the way this composition was composed by you in Raga Desi.

The betting angle will probably never be explored. A whole bunch of people lost a LOT of money when Pakistan did a ``Sub se pehlay`` exit from the world cup. FInancial ruin can also cause a lot of stress.

My good friend K-A from India has some interesting insights to share about our cricket mania. The following is from an email he sent to me on the day Pakistan and India lost their respective World Cup games to the Irish and Bangladesh teams. Hope you folks will find it interesting.

-- Essensaur


de Clerambault`s syndrome and India’s Cricket fans

We often read in Indian papers that a boy has made advances towards a girl, claiming eternal love and, on being rejected, has thrown acid on her. This is a strange kind of love. Either you love someone or you do not, one would think. And, if you do love someone, throwing acid is surely not the way to prove it. However, the behaviour of our cricket fans proves that it is possible to love and not to love at the same time. This is the most selfish love of all, which says, I adore you but if you do not meet my expectations, I am willing to do violence towards you.

The psychologists have a word for something very similar. It is delusional erotomania or de Clerambault’s syndrome named after Gaetan Gatian de Clerambault. The behaviour of our cricket fans is very akin to borderline erotomania. In this, no delusion is present but an extreme attachment is apparent in pursuit of the love-object. This also has potential for violence if this love is unrequited.

To a great extent, India (and, for that matter, Pakistan’s) cricket fans can be likened to stalkers. It is not physical stalking, of course, but stalking through the device of modern media, conveniently indulged in while sitting at home. We live and breathe our beloved cricket and cricketers. Talking heads on TV go on and on incessantly about relevant and irrelevant details before, during and after every match. Our cricket stars, through their antics, endorsements and larger than life image, play the role of a scantily clad woman who cannot be blamed for the stalking but who does tend up exciting the passions unduly.

The result is that when the Indian cricket team performs well the fans are almost orgasmic in their excitement. We see the players mobbed, fireworks lit and holidays declared. When the cricket team loses, we burn effigies and threaten to do violence to the players. This, indeed is borderline erotomania.

If we are truly in love, we do not stop loving someone if he or she falls ill, or has a bad day. We offer a lending hand and are supportive so that the object of our affection can do better. If we really cared for Indian cricket and not for our own short-term till-the-next-match fix, we would support our Indian team through thick and thin. Then it would be true love. Till this happens, we should not delude ourselves by thinking that we love cricket. We only love the high that comes from winning, even if it is winning by proxy and our only contribution has been to use our TV remote control.

#55 by okhla99 on March 19, 2007 7:15pm PT

If the match was set, the people who ``set`` it are sure to have made a lot of money betting against Pakiland...the ``setters`` never lose...that`s the whole point...

#53 by adarang on March 19, 2007 4:25pm PT


But loosers like you who are probably living on charity in India (jo jisnay pheka khaliya)
would always be loosers.


I`m sure Indians can be charitable and donate a dictionary to pakis who obviously need one...you seem to have loost yours....

People should hold their verdict on something serious like the death of this gentleman Mr. Woolmer until at least the autopsy results are available. The author could have written a dignified, sentimental article emphasizing the positives of Mr. Woolmer, as indeed he did for most of this piece – but chose to spoil it in the end by falling prey to that peculiar “Pakistani” weakness for meaningless theatrics and by trying to invent justifications for his own sensational headline whose captive he became!

Whatever it may be... Giving a fit and final vrdict on Bob Woolmer right now, is too early. True, his contribution to the game of cricket has been immense. South Africa has evolved as a strong team and they are largely indebted to Mr. Woolmer for that.

But wait a minute, even before appointing bob Woolmer, the PCB should have taken some historical aspects in mind. First is that Pakistan has never performed well when they have had foreign coaches. What happened with Richard Pybus?? Geoffery Boycott was hired for a mere fifteen days as a coach ahead of Pakistan`s last tour to New Zealand, except for that one face saving double century of Mohammed Yousuf (then Yousuf Youhanna), nothing on the tour went (even remotely) Pakistan`s way. Boycott was paid fifteen thousand pounds for those fifteen days!!!!

If Pakistan has ever performed, then that has only been when the entire hierarchy is composed of retired Pakistani cricketers. Throughout the 1970s, until the cricket coup led by Mr. Tauqeer Zia, Pakistan`s performance was generally good. This was not only because we had had fighting champions like Imran Khan, JAved Miandad, Wasim Akram, Waqar Younis, Saeed Anwar and Moin Khan (whome I consider to be better than Rashid Latif), but also to the top PCb hierarchy which had seen people like Zaheer Abbas, Haroon Rasheed, Asif Iqbal, Wasim Bari and Majid Khan at the top hierarchical levels. No wonder we did not have a full-time coach at the time when we qualified for the World Cup finals of 1992 and 1999.


It was by and large PCB`s mistake to ignore the fact cricket comes naturally to Pakistanis, just as Soccer comes naturally to the Brasilians. Keeping this reality in mind, the board should have known that foreign coaches have always aggravated our problems and made our issues more complicated rather than trying to solve them. The board should have realised that those thousands of pounds would have been better utilised if they would have been used to fund domestic cricket and local cricket academies like the one of Rashid Latif. Everyone knows about how domestic cricket is dealt with. The board should have known that our players only do well when their coaches are renowned, but retired Pakistani cricketers. Why does the board/President not look forward to offer contracts to Wasim Akram, Waqar Younis, Asif Iqbal, Majid Khan, Saeed Anwar (ignoring his tilt towards religion), Javed Miandad, Ramiz Raja, etc. not only as coaches, but also in the senior positions of our cricket board?

The other thing which would have taken a toll on Woolmer is that our entire cricket board is run on an ad-hoc basis, there is no permanent set of rules being followed and no democracy at all.

Woolmer`s frequent tussles with the board cost him his life. The PCB`s arrogant mistakes are the ones which took Woolmer`s life. The PCB should have already acknowledged that he is not the man for Pakistan. The politico-bureaucrat-soldiers of the PCB, i.e. Tauqeer Zia, Sheryar Khan and Naseem Ashraf, along with their supporters down the authoritative heirarchy, are responsible for the alleged poisoning of a cricket genius!

Well im not sure how much woolmer contributed towards pakistani cricket, considering that a number of changes are expected once the team reaches pakistan, but yes his contribution towards cricket in general is immense.
as for woolmer being poisoned (by whom? a ninja maybe, dressed in black, coming out of the shadows?) well that seems far fetched to me, but i would not be surprised if it turns out to be a case of OD
maybe he drank a bit too much and popped a couple of sleeping pills to help him relax and that had a violent and destructive reaction.
whatevr, one thing is for sure, it is a sad day in the history of pakistani cricket.

The white man seldom cries over ``inferiors`` (all coloreds according to him) being thrashed by those of the white race, he seldom stresses or loses sleep over that either. Woolmer`s stress, if that is what caused his heart attack, was that he saw his career in the ``coaching`` field coming to an end. Which team will ``hire`` him with such a ``resume``....that more than why some ``inferiors`` got thrashed by the Irish better explains his anxiety...

Masadi,

You are a disgusting human being... if we can call you that.

Re: # 63

masadi,

...... you have just proven that you are indeed an `inferior` being ........ what a waste of skin !

Re: # 63 Masadi to respond to your interact would be an insult. However there are somethings which should not be allowed togo without challenging...have you checked woolmers record as pak coach his series wins/draws etc in tests and ODIS. It is very good. You know didly about the game and yet you mouth off. may be time you spent introspecting your venom.

Anyway here is something which should warm your heart (about woolmer`s death - the caribs are smelling a tableeghi rat like yourself)

Woolmer mystery deepens
Tuesday, March 20, 2007 12:00:14 pm

Top sources close to the investigation in to the death of Pakistan coach Bob Woolmer have told TIMES NOW that Jamaica`s top sleuthing unit has been pressed into probing the case.

Deputy Commissioner of Police, Mark Shields has gone on record to say that the overdose angle is being looked at very closely and that the police are treating Woolmer`s sudden death as a homicide.

Shields said that Woolmer had received death threats from Pakistani fans and there was plenty of motivation for a crazed fan to perhaps physically harm Woolmer. Sources close to the probe have said the police is questioning persons who met with Woolmer before his death.

Woolmer retired to his room at 7:00 that evening and did not have dinner with the team.

Sources said that the police was probing why it took one hour to get Woolmer to hospital when the hospital was only 15 minutes away by car.

According to sources, the walls of Woolmer’s room were covered in vomit, blood stains were detected in the bathroom and police discovered signs of diarrhoea, leading investigators to believe that Woolmer may have struggled in his last moments in the hotel room.

Reports suggest that Woolmer died of an ``accidental prescribed drug and alcohol overdose``, which coupled with deep stress caused by Pakistan`s ouster from the World Cup created a lethal combination for him.

Meanwhile, accepting moral responsibility for the team`s shocking early elimination from the World Cup, Pakistan Cricket Board Chairman Naseem Ashraf has offered his resignation.

According to PCB sources, Ashraf has submitted his resignation on Monday (March 19) to President General Pervez Musharraf, who is also the chief patron of the board. His resignation is yet to be accepted.

Truly sad.In death,pakistan found out about his commitment.Being diabetic and hypertensive, he probably knew the dangers of alcohol and medication.

I am presuming before all the conspiracy theorists have their say...but it seems he probably drank a bit too much in that lonely hotel room...i bet he wasnt unconscious at all, but already gone.

The poor man.His ashen face told it all at the press conference.Now all the people baying for his blood are bleating`` we aren`t worthy``

Yes,Pakistan being beaten by Ireland is a sporting disgrace, but it can happen.This need not have.
On the other side of the border,the insanity is paralleled.Effigies, houses being vandalized.

Its a sad day for all of cricket and a pointer to the price of stress.

Poor ,Good man.All your wailing will bring cold comfort to his bereft family.

Re:masadi#63

Masadi, that was a terrible thing to say, especially when the man is dead. You are so blinded by racist and religious bigotry that you have lost all sense of balance. For God`s sake, get some psychiatric help.

#68 masadi`s inability to see anything good in anything is unfortunately not out of place on chowk. why are so many desi babus so full of negatives for other people all the time??

hamidm: you mean masadi-skin shoes would sell for less than snake-skin shoes? at least snakes shed their venom for some purpose, namely to feed and protect themselves. but chowk-venom has no purpose other than to bring temperory relief from some perpetual internal itch some desi babus seem to suffer from.

Re: # 63

masadi, you are a disgrace to humanity.

I used to have some respect for Masadi, but he has shown himself to be nothing more than a spiteful cunt

Re: # 68

ranjit,

don`t worry .....people like masadi eventually work themselves up into a frenzy and end up with their heads a few hundred feet from their torsos - unfortunately, they also kill a lot of innocent bystanders when they end their own miserable lives ..........

Masadi,

Whats wrong with you? Comparing your thoughts to that of a sick mind would be unfair to the memories of Bob Woolmer and his achievements. Those comments were totally inappropriate.

Re: # 63

Massaddi Mian:

Is this what you were trying to teach when you got fired from your previous job in Pakistan?

I can see how masadi`s comments could be deemed offensive to a person of religious persuations (belonging to any religioun) but I think almost all of the the munafiqs and atheists here are only pretending to be offended because his comments put people of white skin, their masters, in bad light. What is the concept of izzat and be`izzati for those who cannot differentiate between a father and a m/c and a brother in law and a b/c.

The level to which some people on this board are willing to degrade themselves is unbelievable.

Re: # 63 masadi bhaijan, thank you for this. You are very well versed in the Koran and know all the things there. Philosophy of islam known to you. From this you can see the nefarious deeds of the others with an open mind purely from an islamic view point.

Brother, you are truly great.

#76 by Urstruly on March 20, 2007 8:24am PT


And what makes you think I was offended?

And really..what does izzat have to do with religiosity...you`re a religious nutjob and you have no izzat..if you did, you wouldn`t be sitting meekly in detriot while the ``great satan`` was doing zulm on your homies...

Re: # 79

You don`t count, but since you asked, I thought, when you read my post you might be wearing your Catholic hat while juggling with the two other hats - hinduism and atheism. You know, a white man has just died and most of them are usually christians.

Pakistan:

#1 in Hockey in late 60s/early 70s.

#1 in Squash throughout 70s/80s/early 90s i.e more than two entire decades.

#1 in Cricket in most of 90s.

What happened now? Surely there`s something seriously wrong with the sporting set-up. We can`t blame the players. There is still enough gifted talent to kick ass in any sport.

once a funeral passed by Allah´s Habib and he stood up for it. Some of the people said, ´Messenger of God, it was the coffin of a Jew´. ´`Was it not a human soul?´replied The Best of Creation.

Masadi mian, comments like yours are unbecoming of you.

You know with so much money betted on pak cricket, a lot of powerful people would have had a lot of money on pak doing well in the cup and would have lost a lot when we got kicked out. perhaps these people blamed woolmer for it and hence had him whacked. remember it happened to that colombian footballer in the world cup in 1990.

Re: # 81

in cricket we were never number 1 in the 90s but number 2. for the early 90s it was still WI.
after that it was the aussies. we were on a par with them when was and waq were at their peak but didnt have the overall strength to be number 1.

Jamaican Police Treats Pakistan Coach Bob Woolmer’s Death As Unexplained And Suspicious

He said as the death was unexplained it was being treated as suspicious.

``We would always treat any sudden death - even in the UK - as suspicious until we can prove otherwise,`` Shields added.

#82 by Naqshbandi,

Yes I`m surprised at Masadi Saheb`s comment as well .. but I will not criticise him out of tremendous respect for him. Maybe he`ll explain when he wishes.

zeemax: I think you should in fact only criticize those whom you respect - no one is perfect. and criticism helps them gain even more of your respect. The only person you dont criticize is someone whom you think is beyond hope. The ancient Greeks used to pay people to criticize their works.

Thus, I have sometimes criticized you when I notice a gap (even a teeny weeny gap) between your posts and perfection. :-)

#86 by tahmed32,

tahmes saheb, honestly I was disturbed by that remark ... but I know Masadi Saheb is not like that .. and who am I to throw the first stone?

Maybe Masadi Saheb will come forth and relieve us of the cruelty of his remark which has agonised many interactors.

#86 by tahmed32

The only person you dont criticize is someone whom you think is beyond hope.

Yes ... you`re right.

Just for this, a small and a very sad poem for you:

You always hurt, the one you love;
... the one you shouldn`t hurt at all.

You always take, the sweetest rose;
... and crush it till the petals fall.

You always break, the kindest heart;
... with a hasty word you can`t recall.

So if I broke, your heart last night;
... it`s because, I love you most of all.

Regards.

tahmed,

..... well, i am surpprised that zeemax is surprised at masadi`s uncouth remarks ...... after all, masadi is the quintessential jihadi who is so admired by zeemax and others of his ilk ............

#89 by hamidm2,

That`s the extent of your wisdom. Masadi is not a Jihadi. I am a Jihadi. Can`t you tell the difference?

#90 by zeemax on March 20, 2007 1:30pm PT

haha...you`re on a jihad for what? setting the record for being on public dole the longest?

Get rid of that evangelical Inzi -- the deluded hirsuit is more interested in players piety than in Sport`s strategy-- he is not doing cricket he is doing Islam and then eating like a pig -- he is getting fatter by day -- can`t run fast with that big belly and an extra load of beard.
Time to retire him on a lean diet.

Like other human being,very same sad morning , i read the news .
later i saw this article and learned how he was poisioned ,killed after conspiracy,that was unvieled by sherlock holmes (Mr Zarrar) clues were so evident that neither his wife nor any one else ,pointed out the team or pakistan borad,but Mr Zarrar who was so close to the team and alone with Mr woolmer ,that he happened to read the``black diary`` of the coach ,in which the name of the KILLER was highlighted under the date of the incident.
I am amazed how a death of a coach ,who worked hard on my Pakistani team, was painted as a homcide case,and worst of all, mullah`s and tableeighi`s are acussed.
it is the hatred of writer and the commeterians ,that a simple death of a person ,is all along linked to mullah`s all of a sudden, what a bigotry!!! i say
I wana ask , can a person simply die in this world ,with out mullah`s being guilty for it ,especially in CHowk!
i wonder ,one day Marlyn Monroe`s death would be linked to mullah`s as well.
may be one of the chowkies ,has already started something about it .!!

Re #93

... No. Marilyn Monroe`s death, like everything else, was a job of the Zionists. They did it to make the ummah look bad ... so that they can grab more of Palestine ...

{`` Yes… it is true, we killed Bob Woolmer. Pakistani cricket is to blame for the demise of one of the most influential personalities of the sport. I along with many believe he was poisoned. Why else would one be lying in a pool of their own vomit and blood``}

Zarrar Sahib,
Really? I am sorry to hear of the sad demise of this capable sports personality. I am rather disgusted by your playing Sherlock and Masadi Sahib and Maulana Urstruly playing the roles of UBL and Ayman Zawahoori respectively, though not very respectfully. Is an inebriated Hamidumdum2 Sahib the best that Pakistan has to offer on FP? Can you imagine if he too went on the wagon? If Pakistan has to choose between a brick throwing lawyer and a brick shitting hypocrite, we may as well beg Gen. Jagjit Singh Arora to save our ``ghazis`` once more. :)

Ref zeemax #87

[tahmes saheb, honestly I was disturbed by that remark ... but I know Masadi Saheb is not like that .. and who am I to throw the first stone?]

This from a man who is ready to throw the first boulder at blasphemers, adultresses, and those who are even thinking of asking questions about the Koran!

I am surprised, nay, shocked at your moderation!

For the life of me, I can`t see what`s so offensive about Masadi`s #63 that has everybody`s chaddis in a twist. Seems to me the goatherd in his usual semi-literate style was just making the point that the humiliation of losing to a third-rate team compounded Woolmer`s heart problems causing him to collapse. Bringing in the goraa angle is second nature to guys like Masadi, but it`s hardly offensive.

I found Zeemax`s post on another board (directed to Doc Gill) MUCH more offensive.

pool of blood, vomit... hmm... doesn`t sound like a heart attack to me or even poisening, sounds more like ODing to me.

also.. education does not necessarily teach discipline, don`t blame the teams lack of discipline on lack of education. Lack of discipline is generally the pakistani culture. Our nation is very lazy.

Re: # 63

Masadi,

A bit extreme...yes he might`ve had career worries too..which high paid executive does not?but to stereotype racially is an act of ignorance.It is a human tragedy.Please do not see it as Black or white,Muslim or christian.

Re: # 94hahahahahahaha!!!!Too Good!!

Re: # 100

Before you wonder why I was laughing so much,it was about the comment linking MArilyn Monroe `s death to Zionists...

Nothing funny about Woolmer`s death.

Re: # 92

Re:No 92

Anybody remember Inzi mark 1992?The sultan of Multan?One of the best batsman of all time.Now that he has gone anyway...remember his best and not his worst.
Remember Woolmer`s life and not his sorry death.
Moderation?Anybody heard of that word in the subcontinent?
If India gets eliminated, 1 billion nitwits(well at least a large number of them) will feel ``national Pride`` relinquished.Here we go again...

Zeemax writes <<< Yes I`m surprised at Masadi Saheb`s comment as well .. but I will not criticise him out of tremendous respect for him. Maybe he`ll explain when he wishes. >>>

Zeemax mian, it is absolutely amazing to hear the outrage at my explanation for what better explains Woolmer`s cause of stress (not his personality) given how Europeans and most living under a system of organic solidarity are socialized.

These illiterates cannot take any remote insult against their lords, the white man and his system and think it is akin to insulting God. The fact is that human beings though similar organisms with a psychic apparatus are become how a particular social structure molds them, and race superiority is institutionalized into the white psyche especially of white males. So you want to tell me that that person ``died`` for Pakistan when his kind whom he would support at all cost in the case of war or invasion have killed dark skinned people as if they were cockroaches? No rather the economic/status concern is of greater value to such people in producing stress than is loss of whom they consider ``inferiors``. We are the victims of their racism and bigotry as objective fact and when we challenge that, the peons of the West make big noise as if their gods have been insulted. This proves how this global mythology of white supremacy has been so ingrained even in these so-described ``inferiors``.

Shame on you all for condemning obvious facts by sloganeering and for others for not understanding simple english.

james maxwell writes <<< Re: # 63

masadi, you are a disgrace to humanity. >>>

Still better than being considered sub-human as the white man considers darker skinned folk, formalized in the form of written documents as well as practice. Regarding your evaluation, I don`t give it the value I`d give a rat`s fart....and that value is not much

But Masadi saheb how would we be inferior when he was on our payroll?

#96 by harimau,

Being a gora is not a sin. Being a horrible hindoo is :)

Besides, I don`t remember if woolmer ever blasphemed, or committed adultry (though that`s not actually included in my list of stone targets), or asked stupid questions about the Koran when the sole purpose of the questions was to defame! Quite unlike the hinjews ... :)

re. masadi #whatever: ``So you want to tell me that that person ``died`` for Pakistan when his kind whom he would support at all cost in the case of war or invasion have killed dark skinned people as if they were cockroaches?`` (emphasis added)

Masadi Logic 101

Major Premise: Coloured men have been subjugated by white men. (Never mind that they were also done over by their own, coloured kind)

Minor Premise: Bob Woolmer was a white man.

Conlcusion: Bob Woolmer would support at all cost a perpetuation of that subjugation.

Q.E.D!

---

At least we know just how much import I should give to the rants of this joker now.