Jaane kahan gaye voh din!

Re: # 55
Zahra
[Swarrier - Poetry, Music, Movies, Art, Literature and other derivates are very taste specific.]

I`m tempted to say that this is true of Physics , Maths et al. I liked calculus and Electrodynamics and Quantum mech, but was never really enthused with number theory or mechanics. -)

What you say is true to some extent? But you know it takes some time and effort to appreciate any form of art. You might hate a Picasso or a Wagner at the first sight or hearing and then you might go back to look at them in a different light later, and begin to appreciate their creations.

I`m sure some of the elders (they sound like they come out of Tolkien) must have lightened up sometime and romped to ``Aana meri jaan meri jaan , Sunday ke Sunday``... -)

The Bahadur Shah Zafar verse in the film Lal Qila was sung by Rafi and the music was by S N Tripathi. It`s been done by a whole lot of other folks too.

Re: # 65

How on earth did this thing get posted twice. I`m begining to believe there are gremlins on the net. -)

Zahra
Thanks for the CD suggestion. I have not heard it and I shall definitely get a copy. I began to appreciate Hindi/Urdu later in life not being a native speaker.

Poetry in my first years in school was a dreadful subject. I always thought as a kid that a person called Anonymous wrote a lot of English poetry that he shouldn`t have.

Music was a different experience. I craved complexity in it. I suppose you could say music soothes the dumb beast. -)

RE: #59
GT
I know very little about Amir Khusro that is not common knowledge.

Re: # 66

swarrier - Interestingly I learned about Kabir by a learned Indian fellow on Chowk. He had just mentioned Kabir to me and I guess the same year I came across this CD and was pleasantly surprised. Besides all the fiascos on Chowk, that`s a good introduction to something very sweet.

GT

I think the Indic view has always been that while religions can be false, or take false steps, there can never be one perfectly true, and certainly not the sole true religion. Any `religion` that made such a claim is, by Indian definition, a patently false religion.

You would, therefore, be hard put to find anybody in long years of Indian traditions ever making such an exclusivist claim.

If DM Sahib disagrees, we could surely listen.

kaal#68:

I think that what GT meant was the tradition of speaking up against false rituals and superstitions which is a time-honoured tradition in India - from Buddha to Nanak and continues to the present day. Kabir was part of that tradition although I am not so sure about Mira Bai being in the same mould. She was more into devotion than religious reform.

DM

True, debate and criticism (shastrarth) of all traditions WAS the Indian tradition, in which every heretic pretty soon became a hero or heroine to some groups of people (until Europe-educated Gandhi and Nehru decided to freeze the Indian mind with their silly insistence that every idea must be respected no matter how illogical and unacceptable it may be).

DM and kaal,

1. Meera opposed rituals and emphasized love (you may call it devotion). Nizamuddin, Khusro etc. did something similar.... don`t you think?

2. kaal you make a very subtle point. Let me go ahead and make a very heroic statement - for the unwashed masses in the sub-continent, Islam was NOT PERFECTLY true by and of itself. Perfection is being imposed by a subsect which has gained new followers - the chattering class or what I call Pakistani aunties. Mr. Bin Laden`s chamchas from the West were amazed at the `rituals` followed by the Afghans and desis. What appaled them further was that these rituals were tolerated in the camps. Furthermore, Mr. BL did not discourage such rituals .... as long as the `ritual` of jehad reigned supreme.

I do not want to disrupt the romance and nostalgia in the air, but I have to express my dislike for Nur Jehan`s voice. I could never stand a single song sung by her. I do not even remember if I ever listened to one complete song by her. I would rather listen to the horrible voice of Mukesh...I am sorry that`s a bad example. Mukesh was even worse. ugh.
Lata was far more tolerable. Aasha B has some spark in her voice.

Re:ZahraJ#72

[...I do not want to disrupt the romance and nostalgia in the air, but I have to express my dislike for Nur Jehan`s voice. I could never stand a single song sung by her.....]

Lahoulwilaquat!! Madam, you are a philistine!! I am sorry to say but you have no appreciation for any of the finer things in life. How can you make such a crass statement? Have you listened to her sing - ``Mujh se Pehli si Mohabbat, Mere Mehboob na Maang``? I think you should just listen to Himesh Reshmaiyaa day in and day out. Sorry to be harsh, but this was just too much to stomach....

Re: # 67

I have a CD with Kishori Amonkar singing some of Kabir`s work. I have not listened to it in almost 10 years but I must dig it up. It was titled after Kabir`s ``Ghat Ghat mein panchi bolta``. There is one bhajan by Mirabai too. I did not think that it was as good as her other works. She is my favourite Hindustani classical vocalist. Her live performances are something to savour.

I used to have strong opinions on Mukesh too. However there is some magic in his voice and one must sometimes sacrifice perfectness for expression. Otherwise I would never be able to listen to any western singer except the classical ones. A large majority of pop , rock and even jazz musicians cannot hold a note to save their lives.

Lata was different. Most music directors kept her singing in the upper register because few people could sing accurately at that pitch and secondly I guess they wanted the heroine to be the good little virginal girl who never grew up. Lata`s voice seemed to have some fo that quality at that pitch. Some of her non film songs that explore the lower registers are superb.

I liked some of Nur Jahan`s earlier works but the later ones were rather limited.

Re: # 73

ranjit - You are more than welcome to appreciate the vocals that I would not even go near. That`s what happens when good poetry is sung by someone you are not very fond of. By the way, who is HR? I do not listen to indian singers or pre-partition singers. So, I guess I never developed the taste. But it seems that HR is a character from Lord of the Rings :) May I please suggest that you keep him in your back pocket...No need to let him out.

Re:ZahraJ

[..By the way, who is HR?....]

Just go to any Indian music channel and they are ALWAYS playing Himesh Reshmaiyya. Every song starts with a deep nasal twang with a ``OOOOUUUUuuuuuuuuuu!!!``, so you can imagine the impact on the ears. He is the modern day Cacofonix!!

#73 by ranjit,

She hasn`t heard her `Sunjey dil waley booey, ajey main nayu dhoey` either.

Philistine is right. And a hypocrite on top of that.

#74 by swarrier,

What you said about Mukesh is correct. He is said to have been `bey sura`, when compared with the likes of Rafi and Manna Dey. But there was indeed a magic in his voice. So it`s not always about the `sur` ... or is it? If it was only the `sur`, there wouldn`t be half the genres there are ...

Re: # 78
No there wouldn`t be. I mean would we listen to rock for example. It`s full of besur vocalists. Look at Eric Clapton singing ``Lay down Sally``, quite terrible vocally but still an odd quality to the voice. Or Mark Knopfler singing ``Romeo and Juliet``. In the begining I tried to listen only to the Dobro guitar and try to forget the vocals. But the song grows on you.
But as Zahra mentioned earlier a lot of it is personal taste. Some of it is the milieu you are born into. For example see the similarities here.

asmahan

and
awaara

The second tune adapted from the first is in the raaga Bhairavi. Most Indians/Pakistanis would like it. Most Arab listeners would love the other.

Dost-Mittar and other old timers,

Sorry to disturb the nostalgic stupor of all of you senior citizens! But I think it is senseless to sing the past for such a long time when there are modern singers of great talent easily available. Problem is that you just don`t want to listen to the latest film music. You are too biased to give an ear to it. Don`t think for a moment that all that is coming out of Bollywood is harsh noise or fake pop music. For a try would you be kind enough to listen to following songs readily available online with Musicindia.com. I assure you on its behalf that it will not desecrate the image and the idol firmly ingrained in your minds. Just you listen to them peacefully with clear heart and open mind.

1)Ya ali by Zubeen from Gangster
2)Kaho na kaho by Amir Jalal from Murder
3)Main yahan hoon by Udit narain from Veer-Zara
4)Chori chori jab nazrain milin by Kumar Sanu and Sanjivani from Kareeb

There are many more but I`ll not waste my time listing all of them. First have some feel of the things new. I am not too sure you will bother yourself even this much.

Samar