Thank You Bob, Thanks Inzi!

ok here is stepping it up to the plate. According to Dawn...
On another front, though, a bunch of disgruntled players requesting anonymity, voiced their concerns regarding the religious drills they were made to go through on the short stint in the Caribbean and during the trip to London.

“At times some of us questioned ourselves whether we have come here to play cricket or on a religious mission. We were not really focused. Just before the parade during the opening ceremony, our assistant coach asked us to line-up for prayers while other teams participated in the official turnout,” narrated one of younger players in the side.

“Before taking the flight to London the assistant coach once again asked us to congregate at the Kingston Airport lounge for prayers and during the flight to London, despite objections from the cabin staff, a number of us were asked to offer prayer in the aircraft gallery as the rest of the passengers watched in bewilderment.”

Is this reason enough. If not then let me ask you this question. You say that Rana was the better choice. Why. He performed horribly in South Africa. Even the commentators were baffled at his inclusion. Then he was included again in thee world cup. Why not play yasir Arafat or Gul or Rao or Azhar instead of him like they did when they sat him in one of the games. Why keep giving him chances. You are talking about Imran nazir. Why Imran and not Salman Butt. Here is the link for batting and bowling by PCB. Look at the rankings and then you decide why not those players but Rana And Imran.

http://www.pcboard.com.pk/Pakistan/Features/Domestic_FC_Batting_Rank.html
http://www.pcboard.com.pk/Pakistan/Features/Domestic_FC_Bowling_Rank.html

It is very easy to say that PCB did the right thing but looking at the facts you will see the difference. At least Salman Butt is not scared of the fast bowlers. Are you going to come back with the 160 Imran scored against Zimbawe. Let me tell you, he gave at least 3 chances (one in the beginning of his innings) and he had no pressure to perform anymore. Plus if he could not even score against Zimbawe then he should just quit Cricket. I am unable to also locate an article which states that Slaman Butt was not included because of his refusal to join tableeghi jammat. Also if you remember Shahid Afridi was in hot waters with Inzi untikl he finally came around and decided to join Tableegh to save his career.

You assertion that Inzi has a great average is correct. By the way I never said Inzimam was a bad player. I said he is no longer even a good player let alone a great one. He WAS a great player. WAS being the operative term. WAS meaning that he is no longer capable of performing. He stayed in Cricket a year too long. And the only reason he stayed was not his desire to win or play cricket but to teach the players to tableegh. Now that he has a few players following his example he is all of a sudden at peace with himself and is ready to quit. What has he given us in the past 2-3 series.

The last point about you claiming that Woolmer was happy with how that brought team cohesion and spirit is wrong. You should mention that before then Woolmer complained how team was not listening to him but only to Inzimam and he finally gave in. Also Junaid Jamshed is a joke. He is not an expert in pshychology or religion. He is just a member of these religious fanatic party who was there to spread his version of Islam. Your team is in such state because deserving players were not given any chance. Any player who was a shia, or who did not believe in tableegh was thrown out. Any coach for that matter had no say. A prime example of Mushi is in front of your eyes. How is he capable of teaching young fast bowlers anything about bowling which will be better that what Waqar taught them. Please give me a reason to believe that Mushi was a better coach then Waqar.
Now after all these facts let me see what you come back with. You must have something to back up your points after you challenged me.

PM Sahib or Mr PM,
Please allow me to respond.

Inzimam`s batting stats for the past two years have been mediocre if not just average. Not a single century and lack of any material impact on team performance. Highest score of 81 vs England inm Pakistan followed by 79 vs India in the UAE (friendly). We all know and recognize what a class act Inzimam is, this clearly shows a person with other priorities.

Saying selection was based on religious association will be speculative because we are all making observations based on our interpertations of events. Having said that, there is ample proof from insiders who claim otherwise. Shaharyar Khan`s article talks about the religious transformation and how players revered Inzimam as their religious talisman. This environemnt wud have been positive had this religious phobia been restricted to private lives and not used to impose ideas on those who did not wish to particiapate or were uncomfortable with this public display of religion. PLayers like Hasan Reza (Shia) and many others who wud not have agreed with Tablighee virtues cud not survive with the culture imposed by Inzimam and his cohorts.

As for Junaid Jamshed, he is no way qualified to be the team spiritual or psychological leader. Its exactly the same mentality that was used to put Mushtaq (MiniMe) as the Asst Coach at the expense of losing Waqar Yunus and other professional coaches. JJ is a fame seeking charlatan who has made a career out of plagiarism and is using the same ideas in religion. More importantly, there are multiple faiths in Islam, how can A view advocated by JJ and his types be used for the entire team of fifteen?

You mentioned Bob Woolmers acknowledgement of improved team spirit but failed to mention the paragraph before that where he complained to management how players were not responding to his guidance. Yes, team spirit improved but there is no mention of improved training conditions. We all know now that the team continued to resist new ideas or professional training because their progression depended upon the spiritual leader`s happiness and not their cricketing capabilities.

I have much more to say, but this is probably getting a little tiring.

Thanks

hasan,
I don`t take issue with anyone suggesting Inzi was not suited to the captaincy. But as far as his batting goes, let`s see how he performed in the two years since, according to you, he was allowed his devotion to affect his game.
Inzi`s ODI batting stats for the past two seasons

>>>>>>>>>>Mat ..... I ... N.O ... Runs .... HS1 .... HS2 ... HS3 ..... Ave .... 100 ... 50 ... 0

career ......... 378 ... 350 ... 53 ... 11739 .. 137* ... 123 ... 122 .... 39.52 ... 10 ... 83 ... 20
last 2 seasons 35 ...... 31 .... 7 ...... 857 .... 81* ..... 79 .... 51 ...... 35.70 ... 0 .... 3 .... 1

I wonder if you would be able to provide some evidence to support your contentions that team selections were made based on religious association. Also, would you kindly suggest who, in your opinion, would have been better options than Rana Naveed and Imran nazir, based on performace/form.

Could you also please spell out the problem re. Junaid Jamshed`s travelling with the team, given that many professional outfits nowadays employ psychologists on a full- or part-time basis. (And I`m sure that you would not deny that, given the psychological make-up of most of the Paksitani team, any inspirational speaker would be qualified to do that job.) I`m sure Woolmer`s own words (as reported by Shehryar Khan-- not exactly the best friend of the tableeghis) about the religiousness being tolerable because it fostered a useful team spirit, are not words that you would dismiss lightly.

Hassan, I am as wary as the next person of the harmful effects of religiosity. `thing is, all i hear in this regard is speculation-- which, btw, often overlooks ahrd facts and stats. If someone is willing to provide hard evidence (or even `soft) of nepotism or coercison/arm-twisting by the religious-minded cricketers, I`d be happy to listen.

Will you step up to the plate now?

i wonder how ppl share such crap on chowk .........
man no need to beat about the bush ....the thing is we `ve lost the match and thats it ....
no matter how talented Inzi is or was ..... its all about performance and everyone knows wht he did so he must quit cricket and thats what he did ....so Thanks Inzi
no issuses that he was a man of crises ...he did alot for Pakistan but the thing is now he can`t(coz he is over-age) ....you can`t compare Inzi with Hogan(who enters in the Arena and crowd starts shouting ) because its not WWE ..its cricket dude ...
nywayzz about Inzi leadership sorry to say he was not a good captain ..... i think Kaptain Mirza could b more fruitful than him ......so face the relaity and lets stop sharing all those silly excuses ....
`ve fun
n keep chewing Pan ....

All I have to say regarding this article is -- thank you Bob no thanks Inzi.

No matter what you say dude ... Inzi is not a `LEADER`, he simply does not possess leadership skills. There is always a body language of a captain ... A captain has to be aggressive and someone who constantly motivates the team etc ... Even if the batting failed, Pakistan is a strong team to bounce back with the bowling attack ... Inzi simply lost the game before the start of the batting... The team spirit runs with the body language of the captain ... Inzi was a dead meat in the field... his face indicating to the batsman that yes have lost ...

Are you freaking kidding me that we should give a hero`s farewell to this idiot Inzi. You must be out of your mind to suggest that after this display in South Africa, India, and now the world cup we should sing praises for this guy who should have retired from cricket a year ago. Maybe then it would be appropriate. But he stayed in cricket for a year to convert others to his idea of Islam and for no other reason. he had no desire to win and he feels comfortable in retiring now because he has enough of his followers join the tableegh. Stop thinking that Pakkistanis are idiots who should stand up and clap for this nincompoop who should now leave everyone in peace and just vanish.

Ahmer I like your other articles but you and PM are completely wrong. First of all nobody is blaming Islam for Pakistan`s misfortunes. But the problem is them not doing their jobs because they are more interested in their praying than playing. Problem is not Pakistan having the worst day of their life against Ireland but the fact that they looked at peace after losing (they were more devastated after Inzi`s retirement than after the loss). The problem is giving players like Rana and Imran Nazir chances to play world cup instead of deserving players because those two belong to the tableeghi jamaat. The problem is Junaid Jamshed travelling and preaching the player when he knows nothing about competetive cricket. I urge PM and you to understand the difference. Because of people like you two others are always scared to say anything when it comes to religion. These players especially Inzi have hijacked our beloved game and made it into a mockery and you guys are still sitting on your high horse of religion telling everyone that it is OK for them to lose Ireland and it is NOT ok to blame their affinity to religion on this loss. It is the only thing to blame. They dont care anymore whether they lose or not as long as they have daris. That is what most people have a problem with.

I confess I hadn`t read the article before posting the first of my posts here. Having read it now, I think my first post was rather redundant. Apologies!

That said, the author writes: ``If your sicko Molvi Sahab molested you while you were young and you have acquired animosity for Islam because of that, then direct your anger towards that individual rather than the religion itself.``

It`s a little unfair to think that anyone opposing religious exhibitionism or with that they deem religiosity (not religiousness, mind you!) does so for personal reasons. And, Ahmer, you also do no justice to Maulvi Saab by perpetuating a (very) negative stereotype of his character.

But you are right on the money when you write: ``Besides how come no one ever discusses the length of Harbhajan’s beard, is it maybe because after 9/11 all kind of absurd prejudice is fair game ONLY when it comes to Islam & Muslims?``

Oh, by the way, good article, Ahmer!

A little off the subject of the article itself, but hey, guys, when favourites France and Argentina, and Portugal too, exited the 2002 FIFA WC in the very first round (which, like the present ICC WC, featured groups of four teams, two of which would qualify), I don`t think anyone looked for reasons other than bad form (on the day), maybe a little bad strategy, and a modicum of bad luck to explain these ``shockers.``

You have a bad day. That`s life. $hit happens. No one questioned Pakistan`s good performances in England (yes, in England!) and S. Africa not more than half a year or so ago. Nobody then suggested that the religiousness or religiosity of the team was hampering its performance. (And how could anyone make such an assertion, with Yusuf playing like a man... er... possessed!)

C`mon guys... give it a break already. We lost ONE match to a minnow that happened to play very well that day. There`s no shame in that. Cricket is chancy.

By all means, scrutinize the match for evidence of foul-play. (This, because of the known prevalence of match fixing). But let`s get off this high horse that seems to presume guilt until proven innocent, and sees a bogeyman in every instance of public religiousness, or even religiosity.

Re: # 7

I wonder why not the Tableegheezies hold this game of cricket as a satanic pastime (`Lehwo-lehb` in Quranic terms) as Dr. Israr often proclaimed. But perhaps they believed more in the famous Bollywood dialogue ``Namaz meri farz he aur cricket mera pesha``.

Re: # 5
In Pakistan`s case, it has been the Tablighees who have been running the show thus the complete prostration by Pcb management. No one wants to confront these religious zealots which is very clear from the advise Shaharyar Khan gave to Woolmer, do not offend their sensibilities and try to manage your job. Well, we all know how well the job was done and its carribean performance.

Re: # 3

Jang Sahib,
Problem is not with the dummy spokesman but the dumass captain. You can be religious or non-religious that sud be a private matter, nobody`s business. But when we compromise our main objective then there is a problem.

#1 by rf786 on March 26, 2007 3:45am PT

Yasser,

Amer is perhaps responding to Nadeem`s write-up here. I dont think Nadeem has any objection to anybody having his/her religious beliefs but as u agree is with religion being mixed with sport.

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/cricketworldcup2007/story/0,,2042803,00.html

``Six months ago he (Bob) was very frustrated that the team was always at prayer, at lunch-time, at tea-time and after play and he was not able to get through to them on cricketing issues,`` confirmed Khan. ``He was worried that it may affect his ability to interact with the team and the training schedule, but eventually he said it was something he was prepared to live with because it led to bonding in the team.``

If I can share my view on Indian team, Dravid visited RSS headquartes recently. It makes me as furious as u guys are abt Inzi doing what he had been. If both of our teams are effed royally in West Indies I am not surprised. In India`s case it`s more of the case of the players clinging on like son-in-laws and politicians running the game i/o ex-players.

Oz like professional attitude wud never come to our lands.

#2 by Love2love

I`m sure a lot of people would have called for Bob`s head, just as folks in India are calling for Greg Chappell`s. In the subcontinent, a man becomes good after he`s dead, while alive, he`s good for nothing.

Just look at the great Imran Khan. While Bob was alive, he was vociferously demanding Bob`s removal, now he says on NDTV that the coach could have only done so much and that it is the players who have to perform, you cannot expect the coach to go out on the field and play for the team.