With or Without Musharraf – A Mohajir’s Perspective
Salim Chauhan April 11, 2007
#735 Posted by mkamd on July 27, 2009 7:50:03 pm
Mohjir means group of people who are being hated by every single linguistic group of Pakistan weather big or small. Every province thinks that taking away the wealthe wealth generated in Karachi is their right as it was true for slaves in ancient times when slave wealth was considered a just right for their lords.
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#734 Posted by saharanpuri on February 24, 2008 6:24:18 am
I am reading this prophetic clairvoyant piece beautifully written by Salim Chauhan after the elections and found the content even more relevant.Now muhajirs be prepared for more bloodshed and brutality from fellow pakistanis.
#731 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on April 27, 2007 7:24:46 am
#730 His Excellency {``If you`re opposed to military role in politics and dominance of political parties by a few individuals like Benazir, Nawaz and Altaf, then I share your position.
See Punjabis and Mohajirs can agree with each other on national issues :) ``}
Your Excellency,
I welcome this opportunity to engage in a polite and fruitful discussion. I appreciate your ability to take the high road and focus on the real problems afflicting Pakistan. Yes, we both agree on opposition to military rule and domination of Pakistan and its resources by a few greedy and power-hungry politicians. :)
{``I believe Musharraf`s intervention in 1999 was necessary because of the mess Nawaz had created. He has also launched vital mega projects & bolstered liberal forces in Pakistan. But he cannot sustain these reforms by staying in uniform forever. An alliance between all the moderate forces of Pakistan (e.g. PPP, MQM, ANP, some PONM parties) is necessary to give these reforms permanence. Moderates will only hurt their own cause if they indulge in petty provincialism or ethnic politics.``}
Again, sir, you and I are in complete agreement about the need for SHORT TERM intervention by Musharraf and the somewhat successful results of his LONG rule. With their past records of using state resources to further their own selfish agenda, their blatant resort to mass corruption, and the ill will generated by their ethnic bigotry, I don`t think that PPP and ML(N) parties have any capital left. A national reconciliation, accompanied by public and sincere apologies would be a good start. I honestly think that Bezamir, Besharif, and Altaf need to take their exit bows and leave the field to less tainted and more acceptable young alternatives.
{``Let`s not underestimate the organizational capability and unity of Islamist parties. Even after 5 years, the MMA has held together in NWFP. In contrast, MQM and PML(Q) started bickering with each other in Sindh after just 3 years.
Can the moderates overcome their petty differences to regain Baluchistan and NWFP from the Mullahs? That is the real issue. ``}
While I am in strong opposition to MMA, their tactics, and their extremism, I have less faith and trust in the so-called ``liberal`` elitists of the PPP and the ML(N). Without repudiating the past, without apologizing for their misdeeds, and without a sincere desire to help Pakistan, I see these losers as adversaries rather than allies in the fight against extremism. The recent visit to London by Maulana Fazloo and attempted collaboration with Bezamir and Besharif are certainly measures in the wrong direction.
The popular Emir of Seville in 11th century Muslim Spain, confronted with choosing between Christian Crusaders and Muslim extremist Almoravides, is reported to have said:
``I would rather be a camel herder in Africa than a swineherd in Castile.``
See Punjabis and Mohajirs can agree with each other on national issues :) ``}
Your Excellency,
I welcome this opportunity to engage in a polite and fruitful discussion. I appreciate your ability to take the high road and focus on the real problems afflicting Pakistan. Yes, we both agree on opposition to military rule and domination of Pakistan and its resources by a few greedy and power-hungry politicians. :)
{``I believe Musharraf`s intervention in 1999 was necessary because of the mess Nawaz had created. He has also launched vital mega projects & bolstered liberal forces in Pakistan. But he cannot sustain these reforms by staying in uniform forever. An alliance between all the moderate forces of Pakistan (e.g. PPP, MQM, ANP, some PONM parties) is necessary to give these reforms permanence. Moderates will only hurt their own cause if they indulge in petty provincialism or ethnic politics.``}
Again, sir, you and I are in complete agreement about the need for SHORT TERM intervention by Musharraf and the somewhat successful results of his LONG rule. With their past records of using state resources to further their own selfish agenda, their blatant resort to mass corruption, and the ill will generated by their ethnic bigotry, I don`t think that PPP and ML(N) parties have any capital left. A national reconciliation, accompanied by public and sincere apologies would be a good start. I honestly think that Bezamir, Besharif, and Altaf need to take their exit bows and leave the field to less tainted and more acceptable young alternatives.
{``Let`s not underestimate the organizational capability and unity of Islamist parties. Even after 5 years, the MMA has held together in NWFP. In contrast, MQM and PML(Q) started bickering with each other in Sindh after just 3 years.
Can the moderates overcome their petty differences to regain Baluchistan and NWFP from the Mullahs? That is the real issue. ``}
While I am in strong opposition to MMA, their tactics, and their extremism, I have less faith and trust in the so-called ``liberal`` elitists of the PPP and the ML(N). Without repudiating the past, without apologizing for their misdeeds, and without a sincere desire to help Pakistan, I see these losers as adversaries rather than allies in the fight against extremism. The recent visit to London by Maulana Fazloo and attempted collaboration with Bezamir and Besharif are certainly measures in the wrong direction.
The popular Emir of Seville in 11th century Muslim Spain, confronted with choosing between Christian Crusaders and Muslim extremist Almoravides, is reported to have said:
``I would rather be a camel herder in Africa than a swineherd in Castile.``
#730 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 7:13:38 pm
#729 by Salim_Chauhan
If you`re opposed to military role in politics and dominance of political parties by a few individuals like Benazir, Nawaz and Altaf, then I share your position.
See Punjabis and Mohajirs can agree with each other on national issues :)
I believe Musharraf`s intervention in 1999 was necessary because of the mess Nawaz had created. He has also launched vital mega projects & bolstered liberal forces in Pakistan. But he cannot sustain these reforms by staying in uniform forever. An alliance between all the moderate forces of Pakistan (e.g. PPP, MQM, ANP, some PONM parties) is necessary to give these reforms permanence. Moderates will only hurt their own cause if they indulge in petty provincialism or ethnic politics.
Let`s not underestimate the organizational capability and unity of Islamist parties. Even after 5 years, the MMA has held together in NWFP. In contrast, MQM and PML(Q) started bickering with each other in Sindh after just 3 years.
Can the moderates overcome their petty differences to regain Baluchistan and NWFP from the Mullahs? That is the real issue.
If you`re opposed to military role in politics and dominance of political parties by a few individuals like Benazir, Nawaz and Altaf, then I share your position.
See Punjabis and Mohajirs can agree with each other on national issues :)
I believe Musharraf`s intervention in 1999 was necessary because of the mess Nawaz had created. He has also launched vital mega projects & bolstered liberal forces in Pakistan. But he cannot sustain these reforms by staying in uniform forever. An alliance between all the moderate forces of Pakistan (e.g. PPP, MQM, ANP, some PONM parties) is necessary to give these reforms permanence. Moderates will only hurt their own cause if they indulge in petty provincialism or ethnic politics.
Let`s not underestimate the organizational capability and unity of Islamist parties. Even after 5 years, the MMA has held together in NWFP. In contrast, MQM and PML(Q) started bickering with each other in Sindh after just 3 years.
Can the moderates overcome their petty differences to regain Baluchistan and NWFP from the Mullahs? That is the real issue.
#729 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on April 26, 2007 4:26:42 pm
#724 through #728 His Excellency,
Your Excellency,
You are circumventing the main issue - Mohajir dissatisfaction with the Pakistani Punjabi hegemony over Pakistan. In fact, had this domination resulted in an egalitarian and fair composition of economic, educational, and employment opportunities based on merit, most Mohajirs would have welcomed it. Unfortunately, Punjabis have deemed it necessary to enforce this forceful hegemony with the military might that is curiously only effective against fellow Pakistanis.
Debating whether all Delhiites are Punjabis or Urdu-speakers is pointless. The fact remains that we WILL NOT tolerate a return of the tired and fired and tried and fried practices of Bezamir, Besharif, Bhutto, and Zia. Peace. :)
Your Excellency,
You are circumventing the main issue - Mohajir dissatisfaction with the Pakistani Punjabi hegemony over Pakistan. In fact, had this domination resulted in an egalitarian and fair composition of economic, educational, and employment opportunities based on merit, most Mohajirs would have welcomed it. Unfortunately, Punjabis have deemed it necessary to enforce this forceful hegemony with the military might that is curiously only effective against fellow Pakistanis.
Debating whether all Delhiites are Punjabis or Urdu-speakers is pointless. The fact remains that we WILL NOT tolerate a return of the tired and fired and tried and fried practices of Bezamir, Besharif, Bhutto, and Zia. Peace. :)
#728 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 2:28:09 pm
re: #699 Salim_Chauhan
{{Many Pakistani Punjabis want to stress that Mohajirs have never had it so good}}
Actually that is a Sindhi complaint too. And it is a fact that Mohajirs being an urban community has enjoyed better access to educational institutions and career opportunities than most Sindhis, Punjabis, Pathans and Baluchis.
However, this is not the bone of contention between Mohajirs and non-Mohajirs.
Non-Mohajirs have emulated Mohajirs by moving into cities especially over the last 4 decades. As a result, a lot of new localities have emerged in Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad, Hyderabad and Rawalpindi. In most cities, the changing urban structure did not cause ethnic tensions.
But Karachi was different. This city had a major Mohajir population (some estimate 35-49%). The quota system and increased migration into Karachi threatened the priviliges of Mohajirs in Karachi. They responded by forming their political party and demanded control of Karachi`s resources.
This certainly created ethnic tensions but the MQM polarized Karachi by injecting street violence, assassinations, bhatta/extortion and torture cells into the mix. In the process, the pacifist elements within MQM (e.g. Azeem Tariq) developed differences with Altaf and had to pay with their lives.
If MQM has failed to become a middle-class party in Pakistan, it is largely because of Altaf Hussain`s personality. He has become larger than the party that he jointly founded with many others. Now he is a victim of his past. The party has changed its ideology and is attempting to graduate into a national party, instead of a Mohajir one.
But it is underestimating the amount of goodwill it lost through its sociopath and divisive tendencies during the 1980s and early 90s. Even Altaf`s political allies are uncomfortable shaking his hands on TV. If Altaf had refrained from inflammatory antics and fascism during his party`s heydays in late 80s, he would have been able to fill the leadership vacuum left by Benazir and Nawaz.
{{Many Pakistani Punjabis want to stress that Mohajirs have never had it so good}}
Actually that is a Sindhi complaint too. And it is a fact that Mohajirs being an urban community has enjoyed better access to educational institutions and career opportunities than most Sindhis, Punjabis, Pathans and Baluchis.
However, this is not the bone of contention between Mohajirs and non-Mohajirs.
Non-Mohajirs have emulated Mohajirs by moving into cities especially over the last 4 decades. As a result, a lot of new localities have emerged in Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad, Hyderabad and Rawalpindi. In most cities, the changing urban structure did not cause ethnic tensions.
But Karachi was different. This city had a major Mohajir population (some estimate 35-49%). The quota system and increased migration into Karachi threatened the priviliges of Mohajirs in Karachi. They responded by forming their political party and demanded control of Karachi`s resources.
This certainly created ethnic tensions but the MQM polarized Karachi by injecting street violence, assassinations, bhatta/extortion and torture cells into the mix. In the process, the pacifist elements within MQM (e.g. Azeem Tariq) developed differences with Altaf and had to pay with their lives.
If MQM has failed to become a middle-class party in Pakistan, it is largely because of Altaf Hussain`s personality. He has become larger than the party that he jointly founded with many others. Now he is a victim of his past. The party has changed its ideology and is attempting to graduate into a national party, instead of a Mohajir one.
But it is underestimating the amount of goodwill it lost through its sociopath and divisive tendencies during the 1980s and early 90s. Even Altaf`s political allies are uncomfortable shaking his hands on TV. If Altaf had refrained from inflammatory antics and fascism during his party`s heydays in late 80s, he would have been able to fill the leadership vacuum left by Benazir and Nawaz.
#727 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 2:07:45 pm
re: #699 Salim_Chauhan
{{Mohajirs make a big deal out of the fact that the Pakistani Army Rangers, mostly Punjabis, were cruel, bloody, insensitive, and very biased in the way they occupied Karachi and Hyderabad}}
Couple of corrections... First, Pakistan Army and Rangers are two different organizations. Please provide a demographic background of Rangers so that we may believe they are mostly Punjabis.
Second, the Rangers were ordered into Karachi by an elected Prime Minister, who happens to be Sindhi. The man who led the operation (Naseerullah Babar) is a Pathan. You are merely recycling Awami League`s anti-Punjabi rhetoric from the 1960s to bolster your thesis :)
{{Mohajirs make a big deal out of the fact that the Pakistani Army Rangers, mostly Punjabis, were cruel, bloody, insensitive, and very biased in the way they occupied Karachi and Hyderabad}}
Couple of corrections... First, Pakistan Army and Rangers are two different organizations. Please provide a demographic background of Rangers so that we may believe they are mostly Punjabis.
Second, the Rangers were ordered into Karachi by an elected Prime Minister, who happens to be Sindhi. The man who led the operation (Naseerullah Babar) is a Pathan. You are merely recycling Awami League`s anti-Punjabi rhetoric from the 1960s to bolster your thesis :)
#726 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 12:02:59 pm
re: #723 Salim_Chauhan
If Liaqat was Punjabi, why was he contesting elections in UP? Who is more likely to get more votes from an Urdu-speaking constituency? An Urdu-speaking gentleman or a Punjabi speaking chaudhry??
If Liaqat was Punjabi, why was he contesting elections in UP? Who is more likely to get more votes from an Urdu-speaking constituency? An Urdu-speaking gentleman or a Punjabi speaking chaudhry??
#725 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 11:59:01 am
re: #723 Salim_Chauhan
Since Sikhs conquered Peshawar in 1834, the British conquered Punjab in 1849 and the NWFP province was not created until 1901, I can accept H.S.Virk`s assertion that Punjab extended from Peshawar to Himachal Pradesh & Haryana in 1886.
Perhaps Karnal did become part of Punjab some time after 1849, instead of 1902.
That still does not explain why Liaqat is Punjabi, and Musharraf is not (as you claim). After all, Delhi was also part of Punjab in 1943 when Musharraf was born.
Since Sikhs conquered Peshawar in 1834, the British conquered Punjab in 1849 and the NWFP province was not created until 1901, I can accept H.S.Virk`s assertion that Punjab extended from Peshawar to Himachal Pradesh & Haryana in 1886.
Perhaps Karnal did become part of Punjab some time after 1849, instead of 1902.
That still does not explain why Liaqat is Punjabi, and Musharraf is not (as you claim). After all, Delhi was also part of Punjab in 1943 when Musharraf was born.
#724 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 11:32:24 am
re: Salim_Chauhan
You describe Musharraf (born in Delhi, 1943) as a Mohajir and Liaqat (born in Karnal, 1896) as a Punjabi because Karnal was in Punjab in 1947. Now where was Delhi at that time? Was it in UP? No, it was in Punjab!!! The boundary of UP ended at Meerut which is 72 km north of Delhi.
So even Musharraf is not Mohajir if we take the status of Karnal and Delhi in 1947 as our litmus test :))))
You describe Musharraf (born in Delhi, 1943) as a Mohajir and Liaqat (born in Karnal, 1896) as a Punjabi because Karnal was in Punjab in 1947. Now where was Delhi at that time? Was it in UP? No, it was in Punjab!!! The boundary of UP ended at Meerut which is 72 km north of Delhi.
So even Musharraf is not Mohajir if we take the status of Karnal and Delhi in 1947 as our litmus test :))))
#723 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on April 26, 2007 11:16:14 am
#719 His Excellency {``Liaqat wasn`t born in 1947 and Karnal only became part of Punjab in 1902. Before that it was part of the North Western Provinces of Agra & Oudh. ...Since Liaqat was born in 1896, he was not a Punjabi by domicile. Nor was he Punjabi by descent.``}
Your Excellency,
Wrong again. :)
If Liaquat was born in 1896, as you state, then he was definitely born in the province of Punjab. The bounary of Punjab included Haryana and went west all the way from Delhi to almost Peshawar.``
Proof: Source Saturday, March 6, 1999
He introduced scientific temper in Punjab
A slice of history
By H.S. Virk
In fact, Ruchi Ram started his popular science lecture series while being posted at Simla in 1886. The theme of the lectures was weather forecasting.
The interest and enthusiasm generated all over the Punjab province (its boundaries extended fromDelhi to Peshawar and included the present day Haryana,Himachal Pradesh and Pakistani Punjab)
Your Excellency,
Wrong again. :)
If Liaquat was born in 1896, as you state, then he was definitely born in the province of Punjab. The bounary of Punjab included Haryana and went west all the way from Delhi to almost Peshawar.``
Proof: Source Saturday, March 6, 1999
He introduced scientific temper in Punjab
A slice of history
By H.S. Virk
In fact, Ruchi Ram started his popular science lecture series while being posted at Simla in 1886. The theme of the lectures was weather forecasting.
The interest and enthusiasm generated all over the Punjab province (its boundaries extended fromDelhi to Peshawar and included the present day Haryana,Himachal Pradesh and Pakistani Punjab)
#722 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 11:01:15 am
re: Salim_Chauhan #718
The discussion about Karnal opens a new vista in this debate. The province of UP didn`t exist before 1902. A lot of migrants poured into Pakistan from this state in late 40s and early 50s. But there were also people from Gujrat-Kathiawar, Ajmer, Kerala, Bihar, Hyderabad and Bombay who migrated to Pakistan in late 1950s.
Salim, would you be kind enough to define what you precisely mean by a ``Mohajir``? Is this a linguistic identity or a geographic one? Is it an eternal identity or an ephemeral one?
The discussion about Karnal opens a new vista in this debate. The province of UP didn`t exist before 1902. A lot of migrants poured into Pakistan from this state in late 40s and early 50s. But there were also people from Gujrat-Kathiawar, Ajmer, Kerala, Bihar, Hyderabad and Bombay who migrated to Pakistan in late 1950s.
Salim, would you be kind enough to define what you precisely mean by a ``Mohajir``? Is this a linguistic identity or a geographic one? Is it an eternal identity or an ephemeral one?
#732 Posted by teshah on April 27, 2007 7:45:58 pm
Re: # 722
``Salim, would you be kind enough to define what you precisely mean by a ``Mohajir``? Is this a linguistic identity or a geographic one? Is it an eternal identity or an ephemeral one?``
A very important question indeed but I find no reply to it by Salim.
Will Salim or any MQM man please enlighten us in this respect?
``Salim, would you be kind enough to define what you precisely mean by a ``Mohajir``? Is this a linguistic identity or a geographic one? Is it an eternal identity or an ephemeral one?``
A very important question indeed but I find no reply to it by Salim.
Will Salim or any MQM man please enlighten us in this respect?
#721 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 10:48:18 am
re: Salim_Chauhan
A couple of days ago you stooped to the level of comparing me with a Roman soldier without clothes :)) Now that was personal attacks and character assassination.
I write these lines in the hope that the person reading them is capable of engaging in a mature discussion without getting defensive or resorting to racist remarks :)
A couple of days ago you stooped to the level of comparing me with a Roman soldier without clothes :)) Now that was personal attacks and character assassination.
I write these lines in the hope that the person reading them is capable of engaging in a mature discussion without getting defensive or resorting to racist remarks :)
#719 Posted by HisExcellency on April 26, 2007 10:40:19 am
{``Karnal was in Punjab province at the time of the 1947 partition. It is now in Haryana``}
Salim,
Liaqat wasn`t born in 1947 and Karnal only became part of Punjab in 1902. Before that it was part of the North Western Provinces of Agra & Oudh. The Sikh empire ended at river Sutlej so even Delhi (and Patiala) was part of North Western Provinces. The same North Western Province of Agra and Oudh was named UP in 1902.
Since Liaqat was born in 1896, he was not a Punjabi by domicile. Nor was he Punjabi by descent.
His father Rustam Ali Khan was landlord who lands were spread across UP and part of east Punjab. Liaqat started his political career in 1926 in the UP Legislative Council. All his life he contested elections from UP. Even in the epoch-making 1945 elections, Liaqat won from Meerut (which is in UP).
Salim,
Liaqat wasn`t born in 1947 and Karnal only became part of Punjab in 1902. Before that it was part of the North Western Provinces of Agra & Oudh. The Sikh empire ended at river Sutlej so even Delhi (and Patiala) was part of North Western Provinces. The same North Western Province of Agra and Oudh was named UP in 1902.
Since Liaqat was born in 1896, he was not a Punjabi by domicile. Nor was he Punjabi by descent.
His father Rustam Ali Khan was landlord who lands were spread across UP and part of east Punjab. Liaqat started his political career in 1926 in the UP Legislative Council. All his life he contested elections from UP. Even in the epoch-making 1945 elections, Liaqat won from Meerut (which is in UP).
#718 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on April 26, 2007 7:25:21 am
#717 HisExcellency {``Instead of recognizing facts, the author pursued his agenda of distancing Mohajirs from this era. Even silly statements were made. For example, the author informed us that Liaqat Ali Khan was Punjabi. (He was actually born at Karnal in UP).
Your Excellency,
Karnal was in Punjab province at the time of the 1947 partition. It is now in Haryana. Just this one gross mistake on your part is a clear indication of your twisting of geographical, historical, and sociological facts that you have misrepresented to further your ethnic, racist, and bigoted agenda.
If you are caught making such an outlandish representation, is there any point in responding to the rest of your nonsense? Your attempt to classify me as an Indian Hindu or a post `71 Mohajir is merely an admission that your arguments have failed and now you are engaging in character and personal assassination to cause mischief. I categorically declare that I am NOT a Hindu, or an Indian, but a Mohajir from Karachi with a diverse ancestry consisting of Rajput, Iranian, and Turkish grandparents.
Here is proof that Karnal is NOT in UP:
``Karnal is one of Historical Districts of Haryana. It is also known as a city of `Daanveer Karn`. It is known all over the world for production of Rice, Wheat and Milk. It is also known for agriculture research Institutions like NDRI, CSSRI, Wheat Research Directorate, National Bureau of Animal Genetics Resources, Sugarcane Breeding Institute etc.
LOCATION
Karnal is important city on Delhi Ambala Rail Line & Sher Shah Suri Marg (G.T.Road), connected with all important places in the country. It is 123 Kilometer from Delhi & 130 Kilometer from Chandigarh.
Karnal District lies on the western Bank of river Yamuna which once flows about 11 Kilometer. to the east forming eastern boundary of the district. The river Yamuna separates Haryana from Utter Pardesh. The Karnal Distt. including Panipat lies between 29`09`50`` and 29`50` North latitude and 76 31` 15`` and 77 12`45`` East longitude, its height from sea level is between 235 and 252 meters. The Karnal Distt. is surrounded by Kurukshetra District on its north-west, jind & Kaithal Distt. on its west, Panipat Distt. on its south and Utter Pradesh on east.``
Karnal
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses of Karnal see Karnal (disambiguation).
Karnal, Haryana, India
Karnal
Coordinates: 29.42° N 77.02° E
Time zone IST (UTC+5:30)
District(s) Karnal
Coordinates: 29.42° N 77.02° E
Karnal pronunciation (help·info) (Hindi: करनाल) is the headquarters of Karnal District, Haryana, India. Karnal is said to have been founded by the Kauravas at around the time of the Mahabharata epic for the king Karna, a key figure in the epic tale. It is 123 km from Delhi on the National Highway NH-1 (also called the GT Road) and 126 km from Chandigarh. Karnal is known for the manufacture of shoes, the production of basmati rice and for its many agricultural research institutions.
...
Geography
Karnal is known for its lush greenery. It is roughly equidistant from New Delhi and Chandigarh and lies not only on the NH-1 road but also on the Delhi to Ambala railway line. The city is divided into several sectors, colonies and mohallas. Due to its geographical location several group housing companies like Sahara, Narsi Village, Palm Residency and Ansal Royale have built new luxury apartments and villas in the city.
Your Excellency,
Karnal was in Punjab province at the time of the 1947 partition. It is now in Haryana. Just this one gross mistake on your part is a clear indication of your twisting of geographical, historical, and sociological facts that you have misrepresented to further your ethnic, racist, and bigoted agenda.
If you are caught making such an outlandish representation, is there any point in responding to the rest of your nonsense? Your attempt to classify me as an Indian Hindu or a post `71 Mohajir is merely an admission that your arguments have failed and now you are engaging in character and personal assassination to cause mischief. I categorically declare that I am NOT a Hindu, or an Indian, but a Mohajir from Karachi with a diverse ancestry consisting of Rajput, Iranian, and Turkish grandparents.
Here is proof that Karnal is NOT in UP:
``Karnal is one of Historical Districts of Haryana. It is also known as a city of `Daanveer Karn`. It is known all over the world for production of Rice, Wheat and Milk. It is also known for agriculture research Institutions like NDRI, CSSRI, Wheat Research Directorate, National Bureau of Animal Genetics Resources, Sugarcane Breeding Institute etc.
LOCATION
Karnal is important city on Delhi Ambala Rail Line & Sher Shah Suri Marg (G.T.Road), connected with all important places in the country. It is 123 Kilometer from Delhi & 130 Kilometer from Chandigarh.
Karnal District lies on the western Bank of river Yamuna which once flows about 11 Kilometer. to the east forming eastern boundary of the district. The river Yamuna separates Haryana from Utter Pardesh. The Karnal Distt. including Panipat lies between 29`09`50`` and 29`50` North latitude and 76 31` 15`` and 77 12`45`` East longitude, its height from sea level is between 235 and 252 meters. The Karnal Distt. is surrounded by Kurukshetra District on its north-west, jind & Kaithal Distt. on its west, Panipat Distt. on its south and Utter Pradesh on east.``
Karnal
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses of Karnal see Karnal (disambiguation).
Karnal, Haryana, India
Karnal
Coordinates: 29.42° N 77.02° E
Time zone IST (UTC+5:30)
District(s) Karnal
Coordinates: 29.42° N 77.02° E
Karnal pronunciation (help·info) (Hindi: करनाल) is the headquarters of Karnal District, Haryana, India. Karnal is said to have been founded by the Kauravas at around the time of the Mahabharata epic for the king Karna, a key figure in the epic tale. It is 123 km from Delhi on the National Highway NH-1 (also called the GT Road) and 126 km from Chandigarh. Karnal is known for the manufacture of shoes, the production of basmati rice and for its many agricultural research institutions.
...
Geography
Karnal is known for its lush greenery. It is roughly equidistant from New Delhi and Chandigarh and lies not only on the NH-1 road but also on the Delhi to Ambala railway line. The city is divided into several sectors, colonies and mohallas. Due to its geographical location several group housing companies like Sahara, Narsi Village, Palm Residency and Ansal Royale have built new luxury apartments and villas in the city.
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