Media under siege in Pakistan

hasanmahmood sahib

Now, let me make it very very very clear here on an open forum.

I hate anyone , any party whether PPP, Muslim league or MQM who are involved in any kind of dirty politics. I am not with corrupt PPP, corrutp Muslim league or any other corrupt parties of Pakistan.

I am just a well wisher for the poor innocent people of this unfortuante country, called Pakistan in which MQM, dictators, PPP,
uslim league etc, etc, etc have all done their job very well to make Pakistan # 1 corrupt country in the world.

But, the recent killings of MQM and the open support of MQM for musharaf( the dictator) will always be remembered as the masacre of poor oppressed people.......

Why Musharaf`s govt. was unable to stop killings of those innocent ones? Where was the military when we need the military the most? Where was Pakistani Police?
In all these videos open shottings have had been going on for the whole day...And cruel thing is not even a single person from army or Police came to rescue Karachi`s poor people....Why?

And now you`re comparing MQM`s violent actions with other parties...
C`mon give me a break......

Why do you think Pakistanis are not able to handle democracy? Why?
Why do you look down upon your own fellow country men?
Why do you consider Pakistanis should be treated like slaves under the dictator`s tyranny?

Why do you consider Pakistanis as less of humans?

And since when Pakistanis have been given any chance to taste the real democracy?
Always, dictators have had been enslaving Pakistanis minds, they never let them flourish,b/c it they would then there won`t be any place for them in Pakistan, there won`t be any tyranny.........

Let`s start from 1947....Ayub,Yukhwah,Zia, musharaf.........all these cruel dictators didi their worst jobs to make Pakistan the way it is right now.

All of them came , invaded Pakistan and then looted and plundered and killed innocent people and their next generations are living like kings and queens.......

These are the tragedies of pakistan...
But, it doesn`t mean that pakistanis should give up......they should fight for their freedom from the claws of tyrants like Musharaf backed up by MQM....
They should continue the process of democracy without halting......and at the end by ultrafilteration fair democracy will come out.......

If, we don`t give people chance and strat bombarding them with bombs of martial law and it`s allied parties like MQM, then how come we predict that Pakistanis are unable to handle democracy....

Pakistanis are not mentally handicapped, for heaven`s sake.....

So let me understand this Zeena. Now that the proof is out that PPP was involved in the killing your answer is that Musharaf is evil and MQM supported Zia and Musharaf. First of all that is wrong. Let me tell you why. MQM was formed much after Zia came into power. MQM actually had a meeting with BB and supported her during her first regime. Then after the massacre of Hyderabad MQM decided to go against her. Of course because it was BB and not Musharaf, those Mohajirs probably deserved to die. Ask Abdul Sattar Edhi, how many bodies he had to pick up from thee streets during her regime. Musharaf got the support from MQM because your so called democratic leaders did nothing for Karachi. BB was involved in genocide. Nawaz was involved in looting Karachi`s wealth. Musharaf came and gave Karachi what it deserved. So just because you dont like Musharaf, and MQM please dont say that MQM is evil because it supported the least of the corrupt. Also, yes I know Musharaf is evil and Musharaf is a murderer and because of Musharaf and MQMl; MQM`s own people died, and I know that Pakistan`s poverty, lak of civic sense, and even the electricity problem is only because of Musharaf and MQM but what about the video tape of the killings by PPP cronies. Now what????

Why am i seeing Zeena`s post wherever I go to in Chowk.............Is my computer malfunctioning.......................my eyes failing..............Hmmm..............Or has Zeena done a copy & paste job..........:)

Pakistanis have all the rights to enjoy the very taste of democracy in it`s real sense with all it`s spirits. And why not? Each and every Pakistani is deprived of this taste for such a long time that they even forgot what is the actual taste of real and true democracy is? Majority of them even stopped thinking freely in terms of democracy. All these dictators (the vampires) sabotaged democracy for their tyranny.

Pakistanis should know that the real democracy is for the people, by the people with free judiciary. They should know that the only voice of poor and common people is the voice of democracy.

Army Generals hang democracy with their ruthless claws and suck the blood of poor Pakistanis to make them dead nation and they have partially succeeded in making them zombies with no voice, but, to act and dance at the tunes of army dictators.

MQM has played the major role in establishing Zia and then Musharaf....

So, the right way is to let democracy flourish in Pakistan with all it`s honesty...Army Generals don`t even give Pakistanis any chance to feel this beautiful thing, called democracy and they always are ready to rule Pakistan.....How much more Pakistanis could be stupid?

Pakistanis have become toys in the cruel hands of these dictators....Pakistanis need liberty, freedom from martial law and those ugly monsters, called President/Army chief.

Time has come for Pakistanis to learn tolerance and accept democracy as their savior, the only way they can be safe and free and only way they can progress...and the only way, they can practice their own faiths freely without fear of any kind.....


This is the current situation of martial law in Pakistan, it is just like a volcano...in which people`s emotion get blocked and suppressed and then at the end this volcano bursts and eats up everything in it`s way.....Just wait and see... Pakistanis will eat up this martial law.

Pakistanis run for your lives.......Musharaf will eat you all up.....break this false idol, called musharaf with your unity and discipline.....
Musharaf has already eaten up hundreds of innocent and poor Pakistanis..a wolf in the garb of army dictator.......a sucker....

By the way, it is a lways a pleasure to read posts from all of you. But truthfully, these posts are nothing but a desire to show each other who is a better gora and who can shout democracy the loudest without realizing the repercussions. Musharaff is a neccassry evil brought upon us by Nawaz and Bibi. Nobody disputes that, however the future of Pakistan will never be in those corrupt politician`s hands Inshallah. Hopefully either a Marshal-Law will comes or Musharaf will win the election by hook or by crook. I know that it is the worst thing to hope for but anything and I repeat anything is better than to keep people like BB and Nawaz another chance. I would rather deal with an Army dictator than these corrupt politicians who will take my beloved country back to stone ages. If people are worried about Karachi Massacre now remember the massacre by BB in Hyderabad. Remember the Supreme Court attack of Nawaz. The only difference is at that point we did not even have a voice which we do now. I will hope and pray for Nawaz abd Bibi and their families to die but until then the only thing I can hope for is Musharaf to stay.
By the way do you guys really want Ms. Sheeree Rehman now that the tape is out. Won`t you be brave enought o call her a terrorist now with her supporters and body guards firing on innocent people. And how many of you people actually believe that some other hooligan was actually on her car firing. Come one dont you guys think she will have enough protection. And if it was an MQM guy firing from her car, wouldn`t she be the first one to be fired upon. People people, wake up. Pakistan is your country. It is not just a place which you discuss about in front of your gora friends drinking whiskey and surrounded by prostitutes. Stop and think at least once for your own country rather than blaming everything on everybody else.....

Zeena, nobody is supporting these actions, no matter who is involved. However, will you now go after PPP for the same thing. After all the video tape has been released. of course there will be people who will say that the tapes are lying and the only culprit is MQM. Ubnfortunately we have lived in a country where it is a fashion to blame everything on Mhajirs but do these tapes lie also.

Here is another utube about Karachi on May 12th.......

Courtsey of geo tv...




Those who are supporting mQM`s brutal actions are equally brutal and murderers.....

Re: # 122 Respectfully why you gave this article.
The writer must be foreign writer but he does not know nothing about situation.
The biggest joke by writer

``In the private poll, Pakistanis rated India a more trusted ally than America, though America has given Pakistan an estimated $10 billion in aid, much of it military, since 2001.``

Is this joke oe of Century or what.

If writer is so uninformed why one should give importance what he wrote.

Can anybody answer. Auther is typical ``liberal`` in standard useless form.

Re: # 120

HE

{You Mohajir murderers can`t even tolerate a peaceful political rally in Karachi by lawyers and opposition leaders. And you expect the country`s army to shake hands with those sardars and Bengali terrorists who killed innocent civilians in Baluchistan, Dhaka and Chittagong??}

You Mohajir murderers? If that is not a misprint then it basically shows your desperate, feeble and warped state of mind. If u dont like what u see in the mirror then try changing the way u look instead of blaming others and calling then names.

Those Sardars and Bengali nationalists were first Pakistani citizens but were never treated fairly or given the chance to represent their country simpy because the Punjab dominated Pak army cud not allow nationalist forces gaining momentum. It was always about state security and for the Punjoo small minded leadership it was difficult to comprehend diversity strenghtens state security, same state of mind reflected in your bigoted posts.

A general state of disarray

May 17th 2007 | ISLAMABAD, KARACHI AND LAHORE
From The Economist print edition

A slaughter in Karachi, and a vengeful judge, are signs that Pervez Musharraf is struggling to remain in power

Get article background

ON MAY 12th the port mega-city of Karachi, a great and seething Asian bazaar, returned to the violence that has scarred its modern history. Around 40 people were killed and scores injured in two days of gun battles. Corpses were dragged from shot-up cars and displayed on the tarmac. Along Shahrah-e-Faisal, the main thoroughfare, shop-fronts were smashed and set ablaze. As the carnage spread, 15,000 police and paramilitary troops stood by, unwilling or unable to intervene.

Many reports suggest the violence was perpetrated by Karachi`s ruling party, the Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM), an ethnically-based mafia allied with Pakistan`s president and army chief, General Pervez Musharraf. Its target was an anti-government rally planned for Karachi on May 12th, at which thousands of lawyers and opposition supporters were to protest against General Musharraf`s efforts to remove the head of Pakistan`s Supreme Court, Iftikhar Chaudhry. Mr Chaudhry was due to address the rally.

If the MQM meant to deter General Musharraf`s opponents with violence, it failed. On May 14th opposition parties called a national strike to condemn the slaughter. They included the parties of two exiled former prime ministers, Benazir Bhutto and Nawaz Sharif, and a coalition of Islamists, the Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA). The MMA once backed the general, as Islamists in Pakistan usually have; but not any more. With an election due this year, Pakistani democracy is stirring from the coma it slipped into eight years ago, when General Musharraf seized power.

Its awakening, if that is what it is, may be traced to March 9th and a previously unimaginable event. In the presence of six other uniformed generals, at his army headquarters in Rawalpindi, General Musharraf ordered Mr Chaudhry to resign. The judge—eccentric, vain, some say incompetent—had upset his colleagues on the bench, and had given populist rulings against the government. More audaciously, he had demanded investigations into several of an alleged 400 cases where people have disappeared, mostly from his native Baluchistan, where an insurgency is flickering. These were probably the work of the powerful military intelligence agency, whose boss was one of the generals present.

Indeed, wherever Mr Chaudhry heard so much as a rumour of injustice—for example, in the reports of kidnapping and rape that fill the margins of Pakistani newspapers—he summoned officials and demanded investigations. Yet few seem to have loved Mr Chaudhry, until he refused General Musharraf`s order to resign.

This was an unprecedented event in Pakistan: a civilian telling a bullying general where to get off. General Musharraf, who has no power to sack judges, has filed a complaint against Mr Chaudhry to the Supreme Court. He alleges that the judge has abused his office, for example by currying favours for his policeman son. Meanwhile, Mr Chaudhry has been reborn as a hero of Pakistan`s long-dejected democracy. Egged on by black-jacketed lawyers, who were never so glamorous, he has criss-crossed the country, giving speeches on the sanctity of judicial independence. In a quadrangle of Lahore`s elegant British-built high courts, beside a soothing fountain and surrounded by red-brick colonnades, some of these lawyers are on hunger-strike—or, more accurately, skipping lunch.

Ordinary Pakistanis, too, have been flocking to Mr Chaudhry. On May 5th tens of thousands mobbed his car as it crawled 300km (190 miles) from Islamabad to a rally in Lahore. In the middle of Punjab, the army`s heartland, this was the first significant popular protest against General Musharraf. It was also the first by secular citizens, as opposed to Pakistan`s ever-livid Muslim zealots A week later, the repercussions were felt in Karachi.



A chronology of violence
Mr Chaudhry`s plane landed at noon on May 12th, and the violence began. Club-wielding hooligans charged a crowd of lawyers gathered at Karachi`s high courts. One suffered a broken leg, another a broken jaw, a third had his teeth smashed in. As crowds of opposition supporters, mostly from Ms Bhutto`s Pakistan People`s Party (PPP), marched towards the courthouse, they were fired on with automatic weapons from rooftops and road-blocks.

Supporters of the Awami National Party, which represents Pushtuns, the people of north-western Pakistan, were also attacked. This sparked gun battles across Karachi between Pushtuns and Mohajirs—the MQM`s community, comprising those, like General Musharraf, who relocated to Pakistan from other parts of British India. Most of the dead were Pushtun. Despite a curfew, this ethnic conflict continued into the next day, raising fears of a return to the tribal war that raged in Karachi in the late 1980s.

As bloodied corpses arrived at the city`s main hospital, the MQM held a rally of its own. Ten thousand supporters gathered in Muhammad Ali Jinnah Street, named after Pakistan`s refined founding father, to hear Altaf Hussain, the party`s leader. Not that Mr Hussain was there. He has lived in London for 15 years, evading allegations of multiple murders. But his telephoned harangue was broadcast live. In the words of Farooq Sattar, Mr Hussain`s top representative in the city, “The opposition wants to show that Karachi does not belong to the MQM. We have accepted the challenge.”

At the airport, Mr Chaudhry was manhandled by the police and his retinue of lawyers was ordered to leave Karachi. He returned to Islamabad, where General Musharraf was also addressing a rally. Around 10,000 alleged supporters of the ruling Pakistan Muslim League-Quaid (PML-Q) party gathered in front of Parliament House; some told journalists that they had been made to attend against their will by local officials. After praising his ally, the MQM, General Musharraf said his “heart was bleeding” for Karachi. His hometown`s troubles, he said from behind a bullet-proof screen, were caused by Mr Chaudhry and his supporters. “Do not challenge us,” the former commando warned them, to general applause. “We are not cowards like you, we have the power of the people.”

General Musharraf, who has survived at least two assassination attempts, is certainly no coward. But his hold on power is increasingly open to question. Pakistan`s media, united in horror at the killings in Karachi, mostly blame him, and even before the recent events his popularity was slipping. According to a poll in February for the International Republican Institute, 54.2% of respondents said they approved of how General Musharraf was doing his job; 26% disapproved. When asked which leader they thought could handle their problems best, 32% picked General Musharraf and 25% Ms Bhutto.


Loud opposition is not advised

In another poll, taken around the same time and circulated privately, the general fared worse. Asked which politician they most agreed with, 29% of respondents picked Ms Bhutto and 21.6% General Musharraf. Some analysts say both polls overstate the general`s popularity, since Pakistanis are afraid to speak ill of their uniformed ruler to an unknown questioner. And he is certainly less popular now than when the polls were taken.

But polls are of limited use in predicting his future. General Musharraf does not rule by the will of the people, but dictatorially within a hobbled democratic system. He ostensibly restored democracy in 2002, but meanwhile claimed huge powers for his office. As president, he can dissolve parliament on a whim. As army chief, he controls security policy—from a nasty war against Islamist militants in the northern tribal areas, to the orientation of Pakistan`s nuclear arsenal.

This arrangement is cumbersome to manage. It requires a supplicant ruling party to vote through his diktats as handed down by a loyal prime minister, Shaukat Aziz (or “Short Cut”, as Pakistanis know him). And it requires sympathetic Supreme Court judges to head off any constitutional challenges that may arise. Before inviting the Supreme Court to legitimise his coup, General Musharraf felt compelled to sack half its members. Mr Chaudhry was elevated, in 2000, to fill one of the gaps.

In the coming months the judges will have other weighty business to decide. General Musharraf means to get re-elected as president by the current parliament. If he succeeds, he may then ask the next parliament to let him remain army chief, an office he is constitutionally obliged to quit at the end of this year. Long-winded challenges in the Supreme Court are assured. This is why the general`s failure to rid himself of a troublesome judge is so serious.

If Mr Chaudhry is dismissed, the clamour against General Musharraf will grow. (On May 14th a Supreme Court judge withdrew from the case against his colleague, and a senior court official who was close to Mr Chaudhry was murdered.) Then again, if Mr Chaudhry keeps his job, the general can hope for no love from the Supreme Court in any constitutional battle ahead. Either way, he will have been weakened.

How to tip an election
Even with a sympathetic judiciary, the forthcoming election represents a challenge for General Musharraf. On the last occasion he was hard-pressed to ensure that a supportive government emerged. The election was manipulated in the PML-Q`s favour, yet the PPP won the most votes. General Musharraf`s supporters persuaded ten PPP MPs to cross the floor; but the general was still short of the two-thirds majority he needed to change the constitution, until the MMA provided its support.

General Musharraf would struggle to repeat this performance. The popularity of the PML-Q—a rabble of renegades and opportunists recruited from Mr Sharif`s party—is falling with the general`s own numbers. Meanwhile, the PPP is growing stronger. According to the private poll conducted in February, 22.8% of respondents said they would vote for the “king`s party”, as the PML-Q is known; 31.7% chose the PPP. On May 5th, the day Mr Chaudhry`s caravan came to Lahore, the PML-Q had to cancel a rival rally for lack of support.

Neither can General Musharraf count on the mullahs. His campaign in the tribal areas, which border the MMA`s heartland of North-West Frontier Province, is bloody and hugely unpopular. More broadly, so is the general`s pro-America stance. In the private poll, Pakistanis rated India a more trusted ally than America, though America has given Pakistan an estimated $10 billion in aid, much of it military, since 2001. This puts the mullahs in a bind. The MMA`s bearded leader, Fazlur Rehman, is a lifelong accomplice of the army, a man whose alleged corrupt enjoyment of government contracts has earned him the name “Maulana Diesel”. Yet he is now turning up at rallies for Mr Chaudhry to defy dictatorship and defend democracy with the best of them.

After Karachi, the political situation is unstable and hard to predict. Some pundits predict General Musharraf will be forced to step aside, perhaps by the army itself. Failing this, he faces some distasteful choices. He can rig the election, as he did a 2002 referendum on his rule, though this would be more difficult against a pepped-up opposition. It might also annoy America, where support for him is flagging. According to Gary Ackerman, a Democrat who heads a congressional panel on South Asia, “The truth is, for our goals to be achieved in Pakistan, there should be more than one phone number there to dial.”

Alternatively, the general can amend his political system in one of two ways. He can make it more dictatorial. On May 5th Mr Aziz reminded journalists that the government could declare a state of emergency. (The Karachi stockmarket reacted by dropping 3%.) Or the general can expand his coalition, and so become a trifle more democratic.

He has been negotiating with Ms Bhutto about this for some time. She wants General Musharraf to rid her of the corruption charges, brought by Mr Sharif, that have kept her in exile. She would also like him to scrap the two-term limit that he has imposed on the office of prime minister; Ms Bhutto and Mr Sharif have each held the office twice. For his part, General Musharraf wants the PPP to support his policies as a loyal opposition.

The potential benefits of their co-operation are clear. Pakistan`s military ruler and its most liberal party have a shared vision of a more tolerant society. The king`s party, whose leaders are as conservative as many mullahs, does not. PML-Q has refused to back General Musharraf`s more liberal initiatives, including at first his effort last year to overturn sexist laws of evidence that have ensured that over 80% of women prisoners in Pakistan are convicted of fornication, though many of them have been raped. With the PPP`s support, this law was partially repealed.

Ms Bhutto, despite much noisy bluster about the sanctity of democracy, would have no principled objection to forming a partnership with General Musharraf. Another irony of Pakistani politics is that, under her leadership, the country`s most anti-establishment party has been compliant towards the military establishment. On Ms Bhutto`s watch, Pakistan backed the Taliban in Afghanistan and sold nuclear secrets to Iran and North Korea. Mr Sharif, by contrast, the favourite politician of a former army dictator, Zia ul-Haq, proved stickier for the generals. He drove one army chief to resign and tried to sack another, General Musharraf—at which point, the general launched his coup.

Chaudhry, lionised but nervous

In short, if the tide has not turned against General Musharraf, a marriage between the lady and the general looks convenient. But there is a tiny snag. They loathe each other. And they would have ample opportunities for a quick divorce. If, for example, Ms Bhutto unexpectedly swept the election, she might dump the general. And he could press the charges against her at any time. A deal between the pair would perhaps be more of a dalliance, conditional and undeclared.

But how would Pakistan fare under such an arrangement? It would at least be better than if General Musharraf grabbed power, as he might. According to one of his confidants, the general has developed the usual dictator`s tic of thinking himself indispensable. An alliance of convenience between him and Ms Bhutto might also be preferable to restoring the democracy Pakistanis enjoyed in the 1990s, when Ms Bhutto and Mr Sharif conspired against each other and the army conspired against them both. After a decade of the instability and misrule that resulted, many Pakistanis welcomed General Musharraf`s coup.



The turn of the wheel
Such has been the political cycle in Pakistan: bad democratic government, yielding to unpopular military government and then to democratic messiness again. It is unclear whether the wheel is about to turn on General Musharraf`s rule. But it is a good moment to judge it.

Many of the general`s prescriptions have been excellent. In the management of the economy he has trusted sensible technocrats, including Mr Aziz. They have been blessed with an inheritance of liberal reforms and, above all, by booming capital inflows, not only from America. Yet they can take credit for strong economic growth, predicted to be 7% this year.

In foreign relations, too, right-minded policies have borne fruit. In the past three years Pakistan`s relations with India have been transformed from semi-war to almost-peace. A final settlement of the two countries` problems, and above all the divided region of Kashmir, remains elusive; the rivals` demands are simply incompatible. Yet General Musharraf has perhaps done more than any leader in either country to nudge them into line.

In both cases he made progress because those most directly affected by his policies, investors and the army, supported him. Where, more often, he has had little support for his policies, they have usually failed. In Baluchistan, Pakistan`s biggest and poorest province, where legitimate and longstanding local grievances are stoking an insurgency, General Musharraf`s solution has been to bomb the place. In the tribal areas, where chronic banditry and Islamist militancy are now complicated by drug money from Afghanistan and global jihad, his heavy-handed intervention has fuelled terrorism across Pakistan. On April 28th the interior minister, Aftab Khan Sherpao, was lucky to survive a suicide bomb in North-West Frontier Province that killed 29 people.

Even with more enlightened policies, solving such problems will take time—almost certainly, more time than the general has. Politics cannot be banished indefinitely, as those corpses in Karachi suggest. And neither, perhaps, can Ms Bhutto.

re: #119 by Salim_Chauhan

What makes you think you deserve any respect after shamelessly defending MQM`s massacres in Karachi?? If you act like an ass, people will ride you. At least I have cohorts. MQM Mohajirs like yourself stand exposed and isolated as fascist thugs who shower bullets on lawyers and innocent civilians, many of whom were also Mohajir by the way. Those who don`t respect the lives of their fellow countrymen, only deserve scorn and bullets in return.

re: #115

You Mohajir murderers can`t even tolerate a peaceful political rally in Karachi by lawyers and opposition leaders. And you expect the country`s army to shake hands with those sardars and Bengali terrorists who killed innocent civilians in Baluchistan, Dhaka and Chittagong??

#118 Your Excellency,
It`s bigots and racists like you who cause people to start hating ALL Paki Punju Paindoos. At least you have some cohorts - like Chacha Chaar Sau Bees, Mullah Atif2, Paindoo A Lie, Maulana Urstruly, Brother Peemax. Madame Ass Lame, and Jihadi Ali.

re: #117

New York and California are not different countries. And with you Mohajir murderers running around in Karachi, the Biharis are safer in Bangladesh. MQM`s massacre of fellow Mohajirs in the 1990s and their torture cells are not exactly a secret, you know.

#108 HisExcellency {’’I don’t see why any patriotic Pakistan will take exception to these words. Freedom of movement is one of the key rights enshrined in the consitution. Imagine telling a New Yorker he can’t step foot in California without Gov. Schwarzenegger’s permission.’’}

Your Excellency,
You just provided the strongest argument for the repatriation of Pakistanis ’’stranded’’ in Bangladesh. :) The problem with you Paki Punju Paindoos is that your logic is always suited to support your immediate, myopic, and selfish objective. There is no nation in the world as shameless and as petty as Pakistan that refuses to readmit its own loyal citizens after losing a brutal war. There was so much agony and haste to bring back the surrendering and cowardly POWs, but the PPPs have no compassion for fellow Muslim Pakis. Shame on you!

Pakistani Vampires out dated Dracula on May12th......in Karachi..
All these newly so called pseudo secular 5th grader intellect types aping American society with absolutely NO clue that even in American society things are changing now....an average American is turning towards religion for his/her guidance....they are looking up to those old fashioned family values and majority of them are reverting back to their true family values based on their own religions......

But, these 5th grader intellectuals are still stuck in the past and are unable to recover from their aping habits........they`re blindly aping west...LOL

They have lost the vision to see the difference between right and wrong. We call ourselves civilized on what basis? We act like self righteous all the times while ignoring all the worst corruptions and immoralities happening in our native land, called Pakistan.
They show extreme biased ness, prejudiced and discriminatory attitude against certain groups of people.

These are demons of Pakistani society....these are hypocrite killers of democracy...



What have these self righteous pseudo intellectuals done for the betterment of Pakistan so far?
Sitting in their rooms , writing like 5th grader an essay and posting few pictures making mockery won`t get them far......
Why are their neurons recessed to visualize the difference between wrong and right?

Their eyes are shut and their minds are blank filled with the darkness of their self righteous ignorance.....

Self righteous demons full of hatred and prejudice...happy to murder the innocent humans......



It is my duty as an average Pakistani and as a responsible human being to serve for the perseverance of our cultural values.....It is my duty to attack and break the false ideology of Pakistani Apes who are blindly copying western values and are unable to have their own unique thought process....
Aping west is an easy short cut for them...and then blaming religion for everything.......these are the false and pseudo idols of Pakistani society...these are the main culprits of committing all the corruption of Pakistani society..... He attacks and breaks our society`s false idols, I think it is the time to pull up the curtains of prejudice and hypocrisy that hide the societal truths of Pakistani society that we often choose not to face....and instead start blaming religion......

What`s wrong with wearing burqa?nothing
What`s wrong with burning few CDs? nothing
What`s wrong with eradicating brothels from a shareef neighborhood?absolutely right.....
What`s wrong with trying to close down some music shops which were disrupting the comforts of some people?nothing...

These actions are condemned by every Tom,Dick and Harry kind of 5th grader type Pakistani,but, alas.....
They are unable to condemn an ongoing corruption in the Pak society....actually they are the main characters to bring that corruption, how can they condemn their own production?

They are unable to condemn the killings of innocent Pakistanis @ the hands of MQM backed up by Musharaf........

For these hypocrites.....so, what ,if, few hundreds of poor oppressed Pakistani got killed on the streets of Karachi...at least they`re safe in their heavens.......

These are the demons of dictatorship choking honesty and moral values of civil society....with their support for criminals and murderers...


For them so what, if, hundreds of kids became orphans and will ultimately be forced to beg on the streets or at the most will be their servants to serve in their houses for the rest of their lives.....at least their kids are safe and their kids are going to good schools and eating good meals with good dresses......

For them nothing matters...
But, burning few CDs and closing few Music shops is worst than killing poor people.....

Yes, for them being religious is crime..but, butchering innocent Pakistanis is just mere act of stupidity and out rage....nothing more....

They are equally participating in those murders...they are the supporters of those murders....

In this process they`re forgetting one word,{KARMA}...soon they will realize the meaning of this idiom,``as you sow so shall you reap``...

Soon there will be a marry go round and they will see, what goes around that comes around........
We can call them Pakistani VAMPIRES who sucked the blood of innocent Pakistanis May12th........they out dated dracula....

Re: # 106

{Because the name of this Army is Pakistan Army. You`re the one ranting about Punjabi army, Punjabi soldiers, and Punjabi generals so keep you lectures on Pakistaniat to yourself}

Since Punjab is 65% of Pak population and forms 70%-80% of the army the obvious and logical conclusion wud be its a Punjabi army. Now, if the same army protected the citizens of Bengal in contrast to their acts of barbaric aggression then the impression wud have changed to pakistani army. Similiarly, attacking Baloch nationalists in 1973, Sindhi (PPP) leaders in 1983 and Mohajir nationalists in 1993/94, 1996/97 did not improve their image as Pakistani army.

Re: # 107

{During Gulf War `91, US troops were led by black (Colin Powell) and German-American (Norman Schwarzkopf) generals. By your twisted logic, can we then conclude that only blacks and Germans killed Iraqis... and no Italian-Americans or Jewish-Americans were involved? }

When Germany lost the war, it was the Generals who paid the ultimate price, Hitler committed suicide while his generals were tried, found guilty and hanged. Rest of the German army was disbanded because they were simply following orders. Same principle applies in all other cases where army generals exceed their limits and are found guilty of crimes against humanity. But then again, u cannot see it from that prism cause it hurts your jaundiced view of life. Pak army generals at the time 1971 were never tried or punished for reasons known to all.

Re: # 108

{ don`t see why any patriotic Pakistan will take exception to these words. Freedom of movement is one of the key rights enshrined in the consitution. Imagine telling a New Yorker he can`t step foot in California without Gov. Schwarzenegger`s permission. }

Give this sermon to your Taliban, Pukhtoon, Baloch and Sindhi friends. If they let u live after that and welcome your divine message then, Mqm will have no choice but to support your message of peace and tranquility.

Re: # 102

HE

{Now that`s a more responsible statement. Instead of parroting anti-Punjabi fairy tales, it is high time educated Urdu-speaking citizens of Pakistan realized how Altaf is tarnishing their image and hurting their interests. The issue of CJ`s dismissal has evoked an unprecedented response from the masses all over Pakistan. In this moment of crisis, we ceased to be Pathans, Sindhis, Muhajirs, Baluchis or Punjabis... and became Pakistanis.}

Condescending, dismissive and opinionated. Please pass your message to the ANP (Pukhtoon), BNP (Baloch) and PPP (Sindhi) allies since they have always chosen their ethnic identity over national issues. Even in this CJ issue, all political opposition parties and many interactors on this forum have played the Mohajir/Punjabi angle to score points, mind u well b4 the Karachi episode.

{What was so wrong about that? What was so wrong about protesting the CJ`s dismissal? Why couldn`t the MQM join the protest especially since independence of judiciary is on its manifesto as well? Why did it send policemen unarmed? Why did Altaf exhort the MQM activists to violence over the loudspeakers?}

If people can protest in favor of the CJ then they can also protest against the CJ, that is the basic law of free speech and democracy which u have completly missed in chest thumping chauvinism.

Why did the opposition parties choose violence over peaceful protests? Why was Liaqat Baloch and Hafiz Salman Butt know goons of JI from Lahore university sent to Karachi?

I would only like to comment on the title of this article since I don`t have the time to read the details. I think it is slightly naive to believe that it`s only the media under seige in Pakistan. The appropriate title would have been, Pakistani masses under seige in Pakistan.

Inclusive, apt and reflective of the current state of affairs.

re: #109 khurram

PML(Q) is the largest party in Lahore and MMA swept Peshawer. But these parties didn`t fire on opposition rally. Not a day passes without Altaf taking jabs at MMA, yet the mullahs proved that they were more civilized than the so-called secular muhajirs running Karachi.

The gross over-reaction on May 12 just confirms that MQM is losing grip over Karachi and fears any successful public rally in that city will weaken MQM`s position. Moral high ground belongs to PPP now, and if it plays its cards correctly, it can sweep Sindh as well as Punjab in the October 2007 elections.

If PPP manages to attract some of the other voters in Karachi, it can close the gap between MQM and itself... and remove MQM appointees from Karachi metropolitan departments and Sindh govt. This will spell doom for MQM, because it cannot survive in opposition for 5 years. MQM has been running Karachi for most of the last two decades, during which it filled various Karachi metro jobs with MQM appointees. These people provide the core of MQM support. Deprived of Karachi`s city govt, the MQM will alienate its core constituency and lose the ability to terrorize the city with its militant cadres.

That`s the only hope for Karachi... A clear cut PPP victory at the polls!

2002 National Assembly Election Results from Karachi

Total votes cast: 1,746,813

MQM: 712,310 (40.78%)
MMA: 471,337 (26.98%)
PPP: 211,269 (12.09%)
Others: 351,897 (20.15%)

re: #104

I don`t see why any patriotic Pakistan will take exception to these words. Freedom of movement is one of the key rights enshrined in the consitution. Imagine telling a New Yorker he can`t step foot in California without Gov. Schwarzenegger`s permission.

Your leader Altaf behaves like Idi Amin but expects the world to respect him like a Mandela. :))

re: #103

{{Yahya Khan, Tikka and Niazi were......}}

During Gulf War `91, US troops were led by black (Colin Powell) and German-American (Norman Schwarzkopf) generals. By your twisted logic, can we then conclude that only blacks and Germans killed Iraqis... and no Italian-Americans or Jewish-Americans were involved?

re:#103

{{Mohajir military officers right up there with their fellow Pakistani faujis.....why is it so difficult to utter the word Punjabi and Pukhtoon soldiers}}

Because the name of this Army is Pakistan Army. You`re the one ranting about Punjabi army, Punjabi soldiers, and Punjabi generals so keep you lectures on Pakistaniat to yourself.

re: #75 dost-mittar

It`s sad to see a good leader fall from grace like this. Many Pakistanis including myself admired him for turning the economy around, opening up public discourse, challenging the Mullahs & mending Pakistan`s relations with U.S.

Eight years ago, people supported him because he was unable to uphold the constitution and mend the economy simultaneously.

Now things are different. He is capable but unwilling to uphold the constitution & sustain economic growth. CJ Iftikhar Chaudhry rarely defied Musharraf. In fact he was one of the judges who legitimized the military coup of `99. But even this docile man is being shunted out because he could block Musharraf`s ``re-election`` as President-General this year. Musharraf`s systemless system is now directed at self-preservation, not at Pakistan`s betterment.

Re: # 100

This is what u said:
{MQM only governs Karachi. It doesn not own Karachi. What makes Altaf think we need his permission for entering Karachi or holding political rallies in this city? The same goes for any part of the country. Freedom of movement is every Pakistan`s right. WE WILL NOT TOLERATE ANY ``NO GO`` AREAS IN PAKISTAN. PERIOD. THIS IS A PRINCIPLE THAT WE ARE WILLING TO UNDERSCORE EVEN WITH BULLETS IF NECESSARY!!!}

That sums it up.

Re: # 99

{That`s a fairy tale that Mohajir elders tell their children just to wash their own guilt. Mohajir military officers were right up there with their fellow Pakistani faujis in East Pakistan. Musharraf, Moinuddin Haider, Khalid Mehmud Arif, Aslam Baig and Usmani didn`t join the army after `71}

Mohajir military officers right up there with their fellow Pakistani faujis.....why is it so difficult to utter the word Punjabi and Pukhtoon soldiers whereas Mohajirs are Mohajirs. Speaks volumes of your Pakistaniath that was reflected in 1971 when Bengali Pak soldiers were Bingos and the rest were honorable soldiers.

Yahya Khan, Tikka and Niazi the pussy tiger were......??? Real culprits who have never been punished or bought to justice simply because they belong to the army leadership plus their son of the soil pedigrees. You need to get your facts straight.

re: rf786

{{Altaf Hussein has probably made his biggest political mistake and the same goes for Musharraf.}}

Now that`s a more responsible statement. Instead of parroting anti-Punjabi fairy tales, it is high time educated Urdu-speaking citizens of Pakistan realized how Altaf is tarnishing their image and hurting their interests. The issue of CJ`s dismissal has evoked an unprecedented response from the masses all over Pakistan. In this moment of crisis, we ceased to be Pathans, Sindhis, Muhajirs, Baluchis or Punjabis... and became Pakistanis.

What was so wrong about that? What was so wrong about protesting the CJ`s dismissal? Why couldn`t the MQM join the protest especially since independence of judiciary is on its manifesto as well? Why did it send policemen unarmed? Why did Altaf exhort the MQM activists to violence over the loudspeakers?

#98 in which case, permit me to suggest to you, there is a better way to live.

re: rf786

{{Karachi, Sindh and now Balochistan is home to migrating popoluations from Punjab and Frontier for economic reasons. These populations have now reached critical mass, large enough to help the economy yet create ethnic tensions.}}

The May 12 rally was not a Punjabi rally, unless of course you`re a MQM Mohajir in which case every national cause is a Punjabi cause. And besides there was no firing in Peshawer or Quetta. Sindh lawyers have boycotted SHC and SC proceedings too in solidarity with CJ Iftikhar Chaudhry.

I think your response sums it all. MQM is an anti-Pakistan party that depends on ethnic divisions, hatred of non-Mohajirs and denial of freedom of movement for survival. Those who support this party can only turn into sociopaths like Milosevic. They will never integrate into Pakistan society.

re: rf786

{{Lets get one thing straight, it was not the Mohajirs who divided Pakistan}}

That`s a fairy tale that Mohajir elders tell their children just to wash their own guilt. Mohajir military officers were right up there with their fellow Pakistani faujis in East Pakistan. Musharraf, Moinuddin Haider, Khalid Mehmud Arif, Aslam Baig and Usmani didn`t join the army after `71.

The man who sentenced Mujib to death in the Faisalabad sedition case was a Mohajir, a certain Lt.Gen.Rahimuddin Khan who later became Zia`s all powerful governor of Baluchistan.

Get your facts straight.

Re: # 96

{you keep making all kinds of accusations about panjabis and at the same time claim you dont consider panjabis your enemies!! if this is how you address friends and people you consider to be one of your own, then i can only wonder what you have to say about your enemies.}

Plenty.

...not one urdu speaker has denied or admitted to #64...posted below...got cold feet?

#64 by khamy1 on May 15, 2007 4:31pm PT
... how many mohajirs on chowk believe in dismantling pakistan and getting back to the fold of bharat mata...salim chauhan has been dreaming of that day. let`s see how many more mohajirs think like him...

rf #95 you keep making all kinds of accusations about panjabis and at the same time claim you dont consider panjabis your enemies!! if this is how you address friends and people you consider to be one of your own, then i can only wonder what you have to say about your enemies.

as for your specific claims (e.g. blaming panjabis for bangladesh), please try to be fair so you dont start believing your self. things are not so simple or black and white - and merely blaming panjabis and ignoring other factors which i think you know as well as i do will not do anyone any good.

i am glad you dont want karachi to form a separate state. but then you need to take a step forward and see yourself as a part of a bigger nation than your ethnic group. and as you yourself say, you are a ``muhajir and a secularist``. shouldnt you be saying you are a ``pakistani`` who wishes to see a peace and prosperity and basic freedoms (including freedom of religion) for all pakistanis? the latter is what the rest of the nation (other than the religious and ethnic fascists) is struggling for.

Re: # 94

{If you think altaf hussain and musharaff missed the boat on this one, why are you so determined to do the same? you are without thinking treating panjabis as your enemies, when in fact panjab has always been divided on ideological issues (right wing vs socialist) and not on ethnic or provincial lines. ethnic politics are played only by primitive mindsets that do not understand the dynamics of todays world.}

Here u go again, I do not treat or think of Poonjabis as enemies. Yes, there is an element of Punjabi chauvinism that rears its ugly head once in a while to the detriment of the country, case in point East Pakistan. When u have such a large population, fertile lands and rich history there will be such tendencies, it will be unnatural to expect otherwise given the level of education and still very tribal based value system of the society in general.

Issue is not about Punjabis or Mohajirs, its about the ideological frontiers of Pakistan unfortunately Mqm has made a grave mistake thus the entire debate has shifted to mqm and anti-mqm which basically degenerates into provincial and ethnic suppositions.

Being an ethnic minority and then being accused of acting like a separate state, doesnt that sound gibberish? What is not practically concievable is being politically engineered by Mqm opponents knowing very well that it is not possible or concievable, unless of course something happens on the macro level that changes the big picture.

rf #92 you write Agreed. Being a mohajir and secularist this was extremely disappointing, Altaf Hussein has probably made his biggest political mistake and the same goes for Musharraf. For me this is a point of extreme disappointment and pessimism whereas for the Fundos and traditionalist politicians a moment to rejoice, for them it means back to their ways of running Pakistan. Same old Taliban style of religious indoctrination, mohajirs are once again disfranchised from the political process that leaves the Tablighees an open political arena.

If you think altaf hussain and musharaff missed the boat on this one, why are you so determined to do the same? you are without thinking treating panjabis as your enemies, when in fact panjab has always been divided on ideological issues (right wing vs socialist) and not on ethnic or provincial lines. ethnic politics are played only by primitive mindsets that do not understand the dynamics of todays world.

as for the idea of karachiites needed visas to get out of their enclave seeming like gibberish to you - perhaps it is sounds like gibberish only because you think you can have your cake and eat it too. that is, act like a separate nation while having the benefits of being the same nation.

Altaf shot himslef in the foot!

Musharraf played footsie with MQM (Mush`s blood brothers). Punjab saw its first (?) anti-Mush protests & effigy burning. Punjabis at last saw Mush as a Mohajir. It`s like the climax scene in Sarfarosh where the willing Naseeruddin was ticked-off as a mohajir by the ISI officer.

The of-late bonhomie MQM found with the native Sindhis and Punjabis was floundered by Altaf. Despite what MQM site tries to propagate the video footage shows the local police were looking away when the flag-bearing MQM fellas shooting. This is a replay of Gujarat to me.

Punjab and MQM wud never meet except when a mohajir is the dictator (Musharraf roped in the lackeys in the form of Chowdharies for legitamacy as the ruler of Pakistan).

MQM can now forget abt contesting in Punjab, NWFP and other provinces.

Re: # 88

{rf: just to add to what HE #85 writes, dont think you will achieve anything by making karachi a mohajir-city:}

I have no intentions niether ever suggested otherwise, this is an absurd, baseless allegation concocted to demonize ideas that contrast with a preconcieved notion.

{1. the same fascism that mqm is inflicting on non-mohajirs in karachi today will be applied to mohajirs. by attacking those calling for the rule of law and siding with an individual who is obsessed with staying in power by hook or by crook, mqm leadership has demonstrated a complete lack of vision or respect for democratic traditions.}

Agreed. No sane, civilized person supports fascist tendencies no matter where they are applied, Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad or Wana.

{2. karachi will be reduced to an enclave, and incur losses even greater than the ones resulting from mqm`s lawlessness. pakistanis will simply switch to gwadur as their port city, and karachi will lose its entire hinterland. it will be overshadowed by mumbai to the east, dubai and (with time) gwadur to the west.}

Gwadar vs Karachi? Simplistic and flawed assumption. Karachi is a well established, thriving port whereas Gwadar u guys cannot even find property rights and are facing stiff Baloch opposition. In any case, as they say in the investment business, if its beyond five years, then its not worth discussing. Your investment outlook exceeds 10years at the best.

{3. karachiites trying to come to pakistan will require visas, and will lose the free access they have to settle wherever they like (as, per HEs post, more and more mohajirs have done in recent years in lahore and pindi in the face of political turmoil brought about by mqm in recent years.}

What kind of gibberish is that? Karachiites coming to Pakistan will require a visa!! Better change the name to Punjabistan, then I wud agree with your thesis. Using your argument Poonjabis and Pukhtoons may require visas to enter Sindh and Balochistan! Absurd to say the least.

{4. pakistan on the other hand will retain its strategic position - adjoining one of india`s richest provinces, the panjab, and sitting at the cross-roads between south asia, central asia, china and the middle east.}

Keep living in your wet dreams of Indus river strategic position, what u basically mean is that Poonjab will continue to retain its strategic position. Why not, its quite possible, but there u go again, its always about Poonjab then Pakistan.

{mqm would have been much better off if it had truly acted like the nation-wide party it had been seeking to become the past 15 years, and instead of merely jumping to help out a ``fellow muhajir`` had advised musharraf to drop his obsession with clinging to power and permit proper elections next year. it could then have called for greater devolution of state functions to local governments, and had the best of both worlds. but all that the mqm leadership seems capable of seeing is somehow becoming the chief ghoondas of karachi where no one can enter without mqm permission.}

Agreed. Being a mohajir and secularist this was extremely disappointing, Altaf Hussein has probably made his biggest political mistake and the same goes for Musharraf. For me this is a point of extreme disappointment and pessimism whereas for the Fundos and traditionalist politicians a moment to rejoice, for them it means back to their ways of running Pakistan. Same old Taliban style of religious indoctrination, mohajirs are once again disfranchised from the political process that leaves the Tablighees an open political arena.

Re: # 85

{There are plenty of Sindhis and Mohajirs settled in Lahore, thanks to the ethnic violence sparked by MQM in the late 80s. You stand alone and exposed. Spare your ethnic hate speech for your fellow MQM supporters. Rest of Pakistan stands united on this and will not provide mohajirs of your variety with an excuse to divide and rule Pakistan.}

At partition, Lahore was 60% Muslim and 40% non-Muslim, today that ratio is 99% Muslim and 1 % Non-Muslim. Lahore became home for immigrants across the border and still is home for many non-Punjabi speaking people. But u missed the point. Karachi, SIndh and now Balochistan is home to migrating popoluations from Punjab and Frontier for economic reasons. These populations have now reached critical mass, large enough to help the economy yet create ethnic tensions. Compare that to the migrants in Lahore or Peshawar, none of these minorities can challenge the indigenous population.

If you do not comprehend this reality then you are either deliberately ignoring reality which makes u intellectually dishonest or you are the usual ignoramus that has always emphasized the majority view for personal gains at the cost of truth, fairness and provinical harmony.

Lets get one thing straight, it was not the Mohajirs who divided Pakistan, it was the Punjab army and its supporters ie JI that contributed to the breakup of Pakistan in 1971 and once again are pushing the country to another point of no return. If there is an element that still clings to Jinnah`s Pakistan it is the well wishers of secularism ie Mohajirs.

I guess this gentlemen didn`t like the ``India Shining`` extended DVD version...

End Of A Love Affair With India

By Luke Harding

The Guardian
16 September, 2003

I can identify the moment I fell out of love with India quite precisely. It happened at the end of last February. Riots had just broken out in the western state of Gujarat, after a group of Muslims attacked a train full of Hindu pilgrims, killing 59 of them. In Gujarat`s main city, Ahmedabad, trouble was brewing. Hindu mobs had begun taking revenge on their Muslim neighbours - there were stories of murder, looting and arson. Arriving in Ahmedabad from Delhi, I found it impossible to hire a car or driver: nobody wanted to drive into the riots.

But the trouble was not difficult to find: smoke billowed from above Ahmedabad`s old city; and I set off towards it on foot. There were rumours that a mob had hacked to death Ahsan Jafri - a distinguished Indian former MP, and a Muslim - whose Muslim housing estate was surrounded by a sea of Hindu houses. A team from Reuters gave me a lift. Driving through streets full of burned-out shops and broken glass we arrived half an hour later outside his compound, surrounded by thousands of people. Jafri had been dead for several hours, it emerged. A Hindu mob had tipped kerosene through his front door; a few hours later they had dragged him out into the street, chopped off his fingers, and set him on fire. They also set light to several other members of his family, including two small boys. There wasn`t much left of Jafri`s Gulbarg Housing Society by the time we got there: at the bottom of his stairs I discovered a pyre of human remains - hair and the tiny blackened arm of a child, its fist clenched.

Two police officers in khaki told us the situation was dangerous, and that we should leave; they seemed resigned or indifferent to the horror around them, an emotion I had encountered before during what would turn out to be more than three years of reporting on India for the Guardian. Later that afternoon, in the suburb of Naroda Patiya, we watched as a Hindu crowd armed with machetes and iron bars attacked their Muslim neighbours on the other side of the street. All of the shops on the Muslim side of the road were ablaze; smoke blotted out the sky; gas cylinders exploded and boomed; we were, it seemed, in some part of hell. ``We are being killed. Please get us out,`` one Muslim resident, Dishu Banashek, told me. ``They are firing at us. Several of our women have been raped. You must help.``

When we asked a senior policeman to intervene he merely smirked. ``Don`t worry, madam. Everything will be done,`` he told a colleague from the Times mendaciously. We left. It was too dangerous to stay.

The causes of the rioting - India`s worst communal violence for a decade - became clearer the next morning, when I returned to Naroda Patiya - now a ruin of abandoned homes and smouldering rickshaws. Virtually all of the Muslims had fled: I found only a solitary survivor, Narinder Bhai, standing by the charred interior of his home. ``Everything is finished,`` he said, showing off his ruined fridge. ``Many people have been killed here. My wife and children have disappeared.``

Just round the corner, down an alley, I spotted a neat bungalow that had apparently escaped the chaos. It was only on closer inspection that I saw its owner: the charred and mutilated remains of a Muslim woman had been laid out in the front garden and framed by a charpoy. Round the back I found an address book - which identified the woman as Mrs Rochomal; next to it, the Nokia phone she had used in a doomed attempt to summon help. Her son`s washing was hanging on the line, in the morning sunshine; inside there was a neat kitchen and black-and-white family photos. Mrs Rochomal`s flip-flops were still by the front door, next to a swing-seat.

Five minutes later, her mobile phone rang. I didn`t answer it. Her body was less than 60 metres away from the local police station. The police had not, it was obvious, bothered to rescue her: they had, I was forced to conclude, been complicit in her death.

Fifteen years earlier I had visited India for the first time as a backpacker, only dimly aware of the country`s inflammable religious politics. I knew that India was a Hindu-dominated, though officially secular country. I also knew it had a large Muslim minority, which had failed to migrate to Pakistan at the time of partition. But the charming aid workers I spent four months with in the cool hills of Tamil Nadu, Madam Preetha and Babu Isaac Daniel, were eccentric and devout Christians; while the family friends I visited in Bombay were wealthy Parsis. It seemed also that India`s Congress party - led by the secular Rajiv Gandhi - was destined to stay in power for a long time; the party had, after all, governed India for most of the period since Britain left the subcontinent.

Two years later, however, an arms corruption scandal forced Gandhi out of office and a new ideological movement began to dominate the political landscape - the Hindu nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP), or India People`s Party. The BJP rejected the idea that India should be secular; its more extreme supporters wanted to turn the country into a Hindu state, a sort of Indian version of Pakistan, an India-stan. By the time I arrived in New Delhi for the Guardian, the BJP was firmly established in power; and the multi-faith India of Mahatma Gandhi and Jarwarharlal Nehru, India`s first prime minister, was, it seemed, in big trouble.

Mahatma Gandhi still appeared on India`s banknotes, of course. But nobody seemed to talk about him any more, and his vision of an inclusive India was under threat from something darker and arguably fascist. Driving last year around Ahmedabad, in Gandhi`s home state, I found a group of Hindu men standing jubilantly around the ruins of a small brick tomb. They had just demolished it. The tomb had belonged to Vali Gujarati - Muslim India`s answer to Geoffrey Chaucer, and the grandfather of Urdu poetry. In its place, the Hindu youths had erected a tiny petal-strewn shrine to the Hindu monkey god, Hanuman. ``We have broken the mosque and made a temple,`` one of them, Mahesh Patel, told me. What should be done with India`s Muslims, I wondered? ``They should not live in India. They should go and live in Pakistan,`` he told me. This is clearly a tricky proposition: India has 140 million Muslims, out of a population of more than a billion. It is, paradoxically, the world`s second-largest Muslim country after Indonesia. The Muslims I talked to during the Gujarat riots pointed out that they were Indian. They said that they didn`t want to go anywhere.

Returning to Delhi after a harrowing week in dry Gujarat, where it is almost impossible to get a drink, I found dozens of emails from incensed BJP supporters in Britain and elsewhere. Like most commentators I had heaped blame for the riots on Gujarat`s BJP government, and its chief minister, Narendra Modi. I wrote that Modi had condoned and encouraged what was in effect an anti-Muslim pogrom by instructing his Hindu police force to do nothing. The hate mail came flooding in. One email accused me of ``anti-Hindu sentiment``, and announced that dozens of demonstrators would gather outside my flat in the leafy Delhi colony of Nizamuddin the following day.

They didn`t show up. Another pointed out, correctly, that Britain had chopped the subcontinent in half and looted ``trillions of dollars in goodies from India`` - including the Kohinoor diamond. He signed off: ``I piss on your dead whore Queen Mother.`` More ominously, though, I was summoned to meet Mr Kulkarni, a special adviser to India`s ostensibly moderate BJP prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee. As dusk fell, we sat on wicker chairs in the garden of Kulkarni`s government flat, just opposite the prime minister`s bungalow in Race Course Road. I had failed to understand the nature of Hindu society, he politely suggested over a cup of tea.

It would, perhaps, be an exaggeration to say that the worsening Hindu-Muslim divide in India threatens to tear the country apart, but certainly relations between the country`s two major communities are as bad as they have ever been. Indian Muslims are now in the unenviable position of being cast as fifth columnists for Pakistan, India`s Muslim neighbour and - for most of the time - its enemy. Nehru`s India appears to be dead. Islamic extremists inside India, meanwhile, are taking their own form of bloody revenge - killing more than 50 people, for example, last month in two gruesome car bombings in Bombay.

The origins of the violence ultimately go back to Ayodhya, a small, sleepy temple town in north India, where cannabis grows in the ditches, and sadhus, or Hindu holy men, mingle with large gangs of monkeys. It was here in 1992 that Hindu zealots tore down a mosque on a site they claimed was the birthplace of Lord Ram, Hinduism`s most important deity. The episode propelled the BJP to power, provoked widespread communal riots and severely damaged India`s secular credentials.

The issue of whether a temple should be built on the disputed site - and India`s hostile relationship with Pakistan - continue to dominate Indian public life. In the meantime, little attention is paid to the plight of the country`s 400 million poor. Late last year I travelled to Baran, an impoverished district in Rajasthan, where dozens of low-caste tribal people had reportedly starved to death. I found plenty of villagers who were still eating grass; the rumours of starvation were true. There was, it transpired, plenty of food in government warehouses - it was merely that corrupt local officials had taken it for themselves.

In his latest book, India in Slow Motion, Mark Tully blames India`s problems on the ``neta-babu raj`` - the alliance between politicians and bureaucrats to hang on to power. Tully is probably right. But it is not just in rural India that the pace of change has been slow. Faced with bankruptcy in the early 90s, India embarked on a programme of economic liberalisation. Delhi now boasts Marks & Spencer and Pizza Express. The biggest change in Delhi during my tenure in India has been the arrival of the coffee bar, and the admirable coffee chain Barista. It is now possible to buy a latte or espresso in India`s big metros - in a country famous for its tea. But in general, India`s infrastructure is as creaking and run-down as ever. During the monsoon, the phone lines crack up; and in the infernal summer months, the power fails. Maintaining electrical appliances - fax machine, water purifier, back-up power supply - is a full-time job. In the quiet periods after last year`s Gujarat riots I thought often of Mrs Rochomal, lying burned and mutilated in her neat front garden, and of the horror of her last few minutes. Did her children stumble on her body? Did the people who killed her feel any remorse? I shall return to India, but not for a while.

With `liberated` Bangladeshis shutting out Tata and feasting Pakistan`s Dawood Group instead, and New Delhi too busy fighting a losing battle in Kashmir, India looks like a country in desperate need of real victories...

India`s Naxalites: A spectre haunting India

GANESH UEIKE, secretary of the West Bastar Divisional Committee of the Communist Party of India (Maoist), seems a gentle, rather academic, man, who does not suit his green combat fatigues or clenched-fist “red salute”. He shuffles dog-eared bits of paper from a shabby file in his knapsack and writes down the questions he is asked. He answers them in slogans that he gives every appearance of believing. He wants to “liberate India from the clutches of feudalism and imperialism”.

...His party, he said, was facing renewed suppression, because “the resources of finance capitalism are facing sluggishness in their development, and are looking for new routes,” such as the mineral riches of this forest.

Mr Ueike did not mention that, just a few hours beforehand, at the edge of the forest, in a place called Errabore, his comrades had fought back. Several hundred had mounted a co-ordinated attack on a police station, a paramilitary base and a relief camp for displaced people. They killed more than 30 of the camp`s residents, mostly by hacking them to death with axes. The scholarly Mr Ueike did boast that his army relied on “low-tech weapons”.

This was the latest battle in a year-long civil war in Dantewada district, in which more than 350 people have been killed, and nearly 50,000 moved into camps such as the one at Errabore...

On August 15th, in his National Day speech in Delhi, India`s prime minister, Manmohan Singh, linked Naxalism with terrorism as the two big threats to India`s internal security...

P.V. Ramana, of the Observer Research Foundation in Delhi, estimates the Naxalites now have 9,000-10,000 armed fighters, with access to about 6,500 firearms. There are perhaps a further 40,000 full-time cadres.

In nearly 1,600 violent incidents involving Naxalites last year, 669 people died. There have been spectacular attacks across a big area: a train hold-up last month involving 250 armed fighters, a jailbreak freeing 350 prisoners, a near-miss assassination attempt in 2004 against a leading politician. “Naxalism” now affects some 170 of India`s 602 districts—a “red corridor” down a swathe of central India from the border with Nepal in the north to Karnataka in the south and covering more than a quarter of India`s land mass.

This statistic overstates Naxalite power, since in most places they are an underground, hit-and-run force. But in the Bastar forest they are well-entrenched, controlling a large chunk of territory and staging operations across state borders into Andhra Pradesh and Orissa. In the tiny, dirt-poor villages scattered through the forest, the Indian state is almost invisible.

Naxalite attacks are not random...Their leaders are thinking far into the future, taking a 20- to 25-year view of their struggle. “Liberated” areas, such as their part of Dantewada, would be expanded until they pose a threat even to India`s cities.

Nepal`s Maoists, with whom the Indian party has “fraternal” links, are a model of how such a strategy can work. Having managed to exclude the state from virtually all the countryside, and waged war for a decade, the Maoists in Nepal are now negotiating, from a position of some strength, their share in government—a decision their Indian comrades quietly deplore, despite a pretence of solidarity.

...The tribal peoples among whom they find most of their new recruits are among India`s poorest: “the most exploited, the bottom rung”, according to Ajit Jogi, a tribal leader and former chief minister of Chhattisgarh. Typically, they live in forests and have no rights to their land. A law to remedy this is under consideration, but resisted by conservationists. According to the 2001 census, about three-quarters of Dantewada`s 1,220 villages are almost wholly tribal; 1,161 have no medical facilities; 214 have no primary school; the literacy rate is 29% for men and 14% for women.

Brigadier Ponwar, who joined the Indian army as it went to war in Bangladesh in 1971, says he spent the rest of his career fighting terrorists at home. After fighting low-intensity wars on its periphery for a generation, India risks having to endure another, in its very core, for the next.

rf: just to add to what HE #85 writes, dont think you will achieve anything by making karachi a mohajir-city:

1. the same fascism that mqm is inflicting on non-mohajirs in karachi today will be applied to mohajirs. by attacking those calling for the rule of law and siding with an individual who is obsessed with staying in power by hook or by crook, mqm leadership has demonstrated a complete lack of vision or respect for democratic traditions.

2. karachi will be reduced to an enclave, and incur losses even greater than the ones resulting from mqm`s lawlessness. pakistanis will simply switch to gwadur as their port city, and karachi will lose its entire hinterland. it will be overshadowed by mumbai to the east, dubai and (with time) gwadur to the west.

3. karachiites trying to come to pakistan will require visas, and will lose the free access they have to settle wherever they like (as, per HEs post, more and more mohajirs have done in recent years in lahore and pindi in the face of political turmoil brought about by mqm in recent years).

4. pakistan on the other hand will retain its strategic position - adjoining one of india`s richest provinces, the panjab, and sitting at the cross-roads between south asia, central asia, china and the middle east.

mqm would have been much better off if it had truly acted like the nation-wide party it had been seeking to become the past 15 years, and instead of merely jumping to help out a ``fellow muhajir`` had advised musharraf to drop his obsession with clinging to power and permit proper elections next year. it could then have called for greater devolution of state functions to local governments, and had the best of both worlds. but all that the mqm leadership seems capable of seeing is somehow becoming the chief ghoondas of karachi where no one can enter without mqm permission.

Hi-tech terrorists baffle Indian Army

Terrorists sneaking into India from across the border are increasingly using global positioning system devices in their ventures, posing problems to the army, which has no equipment to track them.

According to the soldiers manning the Line of Control in north Kashmir`s Kupwara sector, terrorists now depend on the satellite-based GPS instead of human guides to infiltrate into the Valley.

``Terrorists have gone hi-tech as they are using sophisticated devices to find their way into our side of the Valley,`` said a top army official, adding, ``The incidents, where militants rely on GPS to sneak into the Valley, have increased in the recent past.``

A GPS device can be as small as a mobile phone and is available as little as Rs 3,000-5,000. It can be used by anyone with a little technical knowledge.

Earlier infiltrators relied mostly on `not always trustworthy` human guides who used to take hefty sums in crossing the border but now the hi-tech equipment has taken over as it can easily remain untraced.

``Earlier we used to track mobile conversations between infiltrators and their guides but now we do not have any resources to track GPS signals,`` said another official.

``A person sitting kilometers away can easily guide the infiltrators and we cannot trace the signals,`` he added.

Sources in the army told PTI that training in GPS equipment have been made mandatory for terrorists operating on the other side of the LoC.

``We have apprehended some militants with these devices and subsequent interrogation revealed that it was mandatory for them to train in the use of these equipments. Every group that prepares to cross the LoC has an expert to handle these devices,`` they said.

#79

why, has the hindu army returned from kashmir?... next stop jharkand anyway... 18 years and still bleeding... now thats a real haemorrage unless you`re an hindian in which case ``india is rising``.

re: #83

There are plenty of Sindhis and Mohajirs settled in Lahore, thanks to the ethnic violence sparked by MQM in the late 80s. You stand alone and exposed. Spare your ethnic hate speech for your fellow MQM supporters. Rest of Pakistan stands united on this and will not provide mohajirs of your variety with an excuse to divide and rule Pakistan.

Re: # 77
thank you for your kindness...now tell that to your champion salim chauhan...

Re: # 60

{MQM only governs Karachi. It doesn not own Karachi. What makes Altaf think we need his permission for entering Karachi or holding political rallies in this city? The same goes for any part of the country. Freedom of movement is every Pakistan`s right. WE WILL NOT TOLERATE ANY ``NO GO`` AREAS IN PAKISTAN. PERIOD. THIS IS A PRINCIPLE THAT WE ARE WILLING TO UNDERSCORE EVEN WITH BULLETS IF NECESSARY!!!}

How many Punjabis do u c in Peshawar leave alone Wana? How many Sindhis do u c migrating to Punjab or Frontier province? Poor Balochi is finding it hard to hold on to his ancestral land simply because it will NOT BE TOLERATED.

Harsh words for ethnic minorities while soft gloves are used for the dominant Pukhtoons, and the reason is very simple, Pukhtoons can make life miserable for the Punjab dominated army/establishment whereas the Sindhi, Baloch and Mohajir are minorities therefore do not matter.

If the use of bullets or doctrine of neccessity is sanctioned according to your stated principles, then there is no reason or stopping the other party from using force to protect their principles (no capital words means this is not a threat, but a simple argument). Maybe some folks that enjoy numerical superiority believe minority can be suppressed through force, that will be their biggest mistake. many have tried in the past and failed, have your day in the sun and see how it feels.

Musharraf did not ask people before usurping power and he is not going to leave
power because people are asking him to leave.
He obviously does not think like an common Pakistani, that is why he is not a common
Pakistani.
He has a mission and vision for Pakistan in his mind and thinks he is the best person to
deliver that and so he is going to persist, no matter what because he thinks he is right.
I guess you and me does not think that way, that is why you and me are not
Pervez Musharraf and the position he is in right now.

Zeena #78 If musharraf had done what he originally promised to do - i.e. have elections and leave power, he would have been a national hero. He could have run for elections if he wished and would have generated support from all over Pakistan.

Instead, he chose to become a dictator, and is now stuck with what the ex-US Ambassador Milam calls the ahab-like obsession with being a ruler and a serving military officer at the same time, and all over pakistan people are telling him to go. And in doing so, he has presented Pakistan with the twin menace of religious fascism on the one hand and ethnic fascism on the other.

dear madras, i mean chennai #77: i dont know why you assume people in pakistan (with a few odd exceptions that prove the rule) have any interest in joining india. this is simply not an issue anyone is interested in.

#74 by HisExcellency on May 15, 2007 8:57pm PT

nope...that sound is the collective orgasm of 160 million pakis waking up after a kashmir banega pakistan wetdream...

kashmir banega pakistan....HAHAHA...

Nero(Mushy) was playing his fiddle,while Rome(Pakistan) was burning....

Yes, I watched Musharaf`s addressing a rally in Islamabad and it was quite obvious that the rally was a pre planned Mushy`s chamchaa rally (funded by govt. @ the expense of poor Pakistanis taxes). This man, musharaf( the dictator) was just doing a kutputlee tamasha with a dugduggi in his hand, he reminded me of an acrobatic and juggler trying to make his puppets dance on his own dictatorial tunes.......
He calls himself President of Pakistan, well, he is NOT...he has just hijacked this the most prestigious and honorable status by hook or by crook..........He was never given that honor by the people of Pakistan. He just looted and plundered the People of Pakistan, ransacked them and became Pseudo President of Pakistan....
He also calls himself, Chief of Army staff..Well, he was given that prestigious status by Pakistani Army, when his role was meant to defend Pakistan @ the Pakistani borders.
He was merely a servant of the people of Pakistan being fed @ the taxes of Pakistani citizens...............

But, that was then...Now,by becoming dictator and tyrant...he has lost his original title as Army general technically b/c Mary chief of staff is supposed to be the security guard for their countries, NOT a tyrant like Musharaf.....

While he was addressing his own khabees chamchaas...he was acting weird, bizarre and like a third rated street style gangster who has lost his identity and didn`t know what was he uttering ...his words were just incoherent....he was wearing shalwar qameez..LOL
And was trying to imitate his close political lotas..........or he was trying to be the leader of Pakistan( father of the nation)....LOL...

Yes, he is father of nation....My foot.
He was absolutely not in his right mind, he was in his own state of confusion...just praising himself.....he was just jumping here and there on the set stage.....exactly like an acrobatic monkey...........All he was saying was just a big slap on the faces of all Pakistanis.........he was actually bullying all Pakistanis...but, in reality he was bullying himself...........he was smiling and laughing with some up beat music...........

And @ the same time Karachi was burning, Karachi was turning in to another massive grave yard, another Beirut.....Peshawar was burning......

Musharaf reminded me of Nero, playing his fiddle while Rome was burning...........
Musharaf was playing his monkey tamasha, while Pakistan was burning...........



In Pakistan only Musharaf`s life is important, everyone else is just flesh and bones, so what, if, they got killed innecessantly .....
And I started laughing, too...may be I wanted to cry, but, seeing his acrobatic drama...instead I laughed and specially when he started advising lawyers to stop playing politics......

So, General sahib is NOT playing any dirty politics...LOL
Look who`s talking?.....

After seeing innocent people being killed on the streets of Pakistan ........
I can only wish,if, someday someone could drag Musharaf out of his black staff car and keep him dragging on the streets...how will he feel?

Honestly, all the dictators deserve such dragging..........

Musharaf days are over....Musharaf era is gone......he has had enough looted all Pakistani money and now his next seven generations will live like queens and Kings...No problems....

Just like prior dictators, Ayub Khan, Zia ul Huq, etc, etc....their generations are living like kings and queens......and now Mushy`s turn.....

Let`s see, Pakistani people will remain sleeping or will wake up out of their slumber.....

This is a big slap and gift from Musharaf for Pakistanis...this is a big wake up call and an eye opener.........

Musharaf,you have to exit.......but, not via proper door....you have already closed that proper front door.....run as far as you can....via back door, if, any left........or why don`t you get a Canadian visa( the way you suggested it for other Pakistanis).....remember..I hope you don`t have dementia.....

Musharaf,``you have to add one last chapter in your book(in the line of fire) or may be you wish to change the name in to,``Mushy playing fiddle while Pakistan was burning in the line of fire.``

Very true.........sigh*

Re:
``#64 by khamy1 on May 15, 2007 4:31pm PT
... how many mohajirs on chowk believe in dismantling pakistan and getting back to the fold of bharat mata...salim chauhan has been dreaming of that day. let`s see how many more mohajirs think like him...``

Khamy, you will be surprised to know that a majority of Indians do not want any reunification with Pakistan. In another Interact by a Pakistani Punjabi who said Pakistan will not survive by 2020, the majority of Indians did not want any truck with Pakistan.Mine was the minority voice but I too have changed my mind!

correction:

His position has become quite untenable.

Truly sad days for Pakistan and Pakistanis. I think that the time has come for Musharraf to go before he is pushed out, maybe by his own colleagues. His position has become quite tenable. He has done a lot of good for Pakistan but the longer he stays from now on, the more he will be remembered for the mayhem pervading in Pakistan now than for the good he did during his time ......kind of like Ayub after 1965.