Allama Iqbal- Is he still relevant?

Re: # 30 Chennai

``..What makes you think that Pakistan will not be a secular country.........like India..``

60 years of history (and 15 years of Pakistan prior to that) staring you at your face (with Bangladesh formation thrown in to boot!). Can you ignore that deliberate edifice of ignorance? I`ll put it another way as well: How much of your own money will you put on that happening in the next 5 years, given that it has not happened in the previous 60? If you give an answer more than USD 1000, contact me -- I will be happy to bet against you and we can get down to business
CIAO

Re: # 29

Hello PewResearch,

You seem to have a crystal ball + ability to read from it.........What makes you think that Pakistan will not be a secular country.........like India..:)

Re: # 28 Ballukhan

``...Just struggle for turning Pakistan into a secular and multi cultural nation.,,``

That is Mission Impossible VI

My advice to those who want to re-imagine afresh the Pakistani nation`s identity.

Forget about Jinnah, forget Partition, forget Iqbal.

Do not think that re-construction of Pakistan would imply some sort of a reconstuction in Islam.

Do not waste your energies in trying to strengthen some theological principles whose fresh exegesis cannot match those of the mullahs.

Just struggle for one notion- i.e. secularism.

Forget all those illusions about some imaginary leadership of ummah - only then can one think about re-imagining Pakistan`s identity as a modern state.

Just struggle for turning Pakistan into a secular and multi cultural nation.

Re: # 32

Not really......We would prefer Pakis doing it for us........

Re: # 32 Manto

``...I have said my part and I am done here...``

Aw...come on! Spew forth some `wisdom` so that we can chew it!

Here is a crystal ball prediction: Now this will turn into a discussion amongst Indians trying to massage their own egos.

I have said my part and I am done here. Have a nice day.

HE #9 makes an important point: Iqbal`s ambivalence toward democracy is understandable. The 1920s and 30s were traumatic for the democracies because of the Great Depression...Perhaps if he had lived to see the end of WW2, this choice would have been easier to make for him.

And indeed, it is important to keep in mind a key advantage the average person has today over the most profound thinkers of the past - experience with what works and what does not. That is why it is important to use one`s common sense first and foremost, and not get carried away by the words, however inspiring and emotionally satisfying, of poets and philosophers of the past.

Naqsh #4 Most people in most societies--i.e. the common masses are simply too dumb to know what`s good for them and are like sheep and follow whatever their peers say.

Funny you of all people should say this - after all, arent you always referring to your spiritual heroes as if they are little gods.

Some kind of qualification (maybe an IQ test of some sort with those scoring less than 100 barred) needs to be built in so that ability and not just numbers are taken into account. After all the opinion of 100 morons does not have the same weight as one Einstein but in pure democracy the views of 100 idiots would hold sway.

The past 60 years of experience in Pakistan present good case studies on which to test your hypothesis: Thus, today, the ``morons`` of Pakistan instinctively understand the importance of the Rule of Law and thus turn out in the thousands to cheer the Chief Justice, while the ``elite`` Musharraf has proven to be deceiptful, lawless indivdual whom you could not trust with 5 rupees, leave alone the reins of power to the entire Pakistani nation.

This is the worst article I have ever read on Iqbal`s poetry and political thought process. I think ylh has to eductae himself quite a bit before writing on the topic.

#32 by Mantolives on June 22, 2007 5:09am PT

yes..I need my ego massaged because India is seen as a politically unstable jihadi hotbed..

oh wait...that`s not India...it`s pakiland...

From article:

``While in my view this idea is inherently flawed but it is clear that a majority of Muslims around the world agree with Iqbal`s idea, what they don`t agree with is Iqbal`s liberal interpretation of Islamic law and his readiness to do away with what they consider to be the central motif of islam.``

My question: And what is that central motif?

Re: # 45 Zee
Bottom line up-front: The average profit margin of a security on the Bombay Stock Exchange is 3 % points higher than on NYSE or . Follow the money, and you will get it! Everything else is talk. Cheap talk.
CIAO

Abey pukeresearch/achootennai etc,

Is this the bharat you idiots jump up and down about?

India Without the Slogans

I came to India looking forward to a place with a sense of momentum and hope. I knew India was still poor and frustrating as well as fascinating and exciting and full of great stories. I have found all those things, but I have also realized that parts of Africa have better services and infrastructure than India, and just as good prospects for development. It`s just that Africa hasn`t yet come up with a catchy slogan to sell itself. I hope it doesn`t. Better to be surprised than disappointed.

manto, can you comment on iqbals vision for pakista vis-a-vis jinnahs? to me it appears iqbal seems to inspire those with a vision differing from that of jinnah. this offcourse with caveat that i dont think jinnah really had much of a vision for pakistan, it was more like a legal brief, prepared to bolster his clients case.

Re: # 48

Your ideas are in a way incorporated in Election law presently. Nobody can stand for election unless college graduate is towards that direction as laws made by general. So atleast elected people are not dumb though people who elect them may not be bright.