An Empowering Verdict!

Post 16 – tahmaed32:

Dear tahmed32:

Yes. You make fair points in your post. Thank you.

But the real focus of my post that you might have overlooked was the last line:

I am not sure how CJ’s protests have fundamentally altered any of the socioeconomic dynamics of the country that forms the bedrock for tradition, law and institutions.

Would you kindly elaborate how current events impact or are indicators of socio-economic dynamics of the country? I think (and studies support it) that it is the socioeconomic underpinning that drives cultural and attitudinal changes in a society.

If such indicators of sustainable change are there that I am not much aware of, it will be a pleasant surprise and a much desired reason for optimism.

Kind regards.

Re: # 14 joieya: The months ahead should indeed prove significant. Musharraf is in a sense cornered - if he steps down from power, he faces a barrage of lawsuits; and if he "stays the course", he faces forcible removal by his own generals (like Ayub Khan). The best he can hope for it seems is to seek immunity from future prosecution in return from doing what he had promised he would do 9 years or so ago - play the honest broker in the next elections.

Re: # 15 you say "Democracy is never a product of one issue like CJ. I am not sure how CJ’s protests have fundamentally altered any of the socioeconomic dynamics of the country that forms the bedrock of tradition, law and institutions?"

The support for the CJ, paid for by the lives of peaceful demonstrators on May 12, are what has defeated the military dictator. He knows quite well that the Pakistan army itself will refuse to fire at peaceful demonstrators - which is what happened with Ayub Khan. He could read this writing on the wall three months ago.

Also: the importance of issues on which the CJ took a stand - habeas corpus, free and fair elections - are fundamental to a civilized society. So rest assured that the people of Pakistan are more "enlightened" than the self-proclaimed "enlightened moderates" on the one hand and the islamic fanatics on the other.

What a misguided optimism in the article!

The way people of Pakistan, from ordinary citizen to judiciary, had flocked around current military chief when he grabbed civilian power is reminiscent of the times of previous military dictator and as a matter of fact, of those who were before him too. Chief Justice who has come to face General Musharraf as an adversary had once conferred legitimacy upon military rule.

Judiciary is the arcane pillar of democracy. Neither should it involve in sloganeering nor sociopolitical activism for it better suits administration and other political institutions. Pakistani judiciary has shown interest in both, unfortunately.

CJ victory is symbolically important but anybody who thinks of CJ reinstatement is a sign of fundamental change for democracy in Pakistan lives in fools paradise. Administration and opposition in Pakistan almost always wore same stripes and have always been involved in politics for gaining power at the expense of political philosophy.

Democracy is never a product of one issue like CJ. It is an attitude, a mind-set and social frame work that develops alongside socioeconomic fabric of the society. I am not sure how CJ’s protests have fundamentally altered any of the socioeconomic dynamics of the country that forms the bedrock of tradition, law and institutions?

Re: # 13

Yes and let’s cross our hands for the upcoming events, uniform and election of Mr. Musharraf by the sitting rubber stamps. Judiciary has to be very shrewd and organized to outplay the tyranny.

joieya: Well said. Musharraf can no longer flaunt himself as being the "enlightened moderate" in Pakistan, the lesser of two evils with maulvis being the only option.

The Supreme Court backed by the brave people of Pakistan have "fired the shot heard around the world", and proved that the third option is alive and well in Pakistan - the option of a lawful, civilized society.

Re: # 9

You have got a wrong mindset. Its negative to be fair to your post. There is no ethnic bias in this case which you are reffering to.

Hamidm: That is good advice from Mr.Madani, i.e. Too much thinking and too much college makes you miserable aqnd more stupid.

I realize you and musharraf are the enlightened ones while the rest of us unwashed Pakis are... well... washed, but with lotas. And of course we are so stupid as to have respect for our religion. But nevertheless - this is a great day for Pakistan. The greatest day for Pakistan as far as I can remember. And the Supreme Court of Pakistan fired the shot heard around the world!!

Re: # 7
Mr.H you have point. But you and Jaybahadur too logical. Do not think but enjoy cj restoration. People who think too much are never happy. Ignorance is bliss. Too much thinking and too much college makes you miserable aqnd more stupid.
Enjoy moment, they pass fast.

Re: # 8
There was politics played in judgement.
When General put new chief justice in charge Javed Iqbal things were going pretty his way. Note general is native of Sindh. Rana Bhagvandas was in India when he kicked CJ. When he return from India ( He is also native Sindhi) he had some discussion in India with local judges and they made plan. When he returned he took charge and slowly turned all against another sindi and stabbed him in back as earlier he was not made chief justice by president.
This classic case of Sindhi stabbing sindhi, this reason Sindhis are backward community in Pakistan.
Personal politics.

Well, this is a landmark judgment by Supreme Court of Pakistan against a military led government. The honorable judges deserve salute from a nation which is practically deprived of basic civil rights. A best decision under the circumstances.

But Pakistanis should not waste the zing of this legal and constitutional movement. They have to be more organized and a great responsibility lies on the shoulders of judiciary now. They have made an example for other civil institutions and they must carry on.

....... i hate to be a wet blanket, but the madrasi, jay bahadur, does make a valid point ........ with the federal sharia court, the council for islamic ideology and the special terrorism courts in place it is not really clear - at least to me - how much weight the cj actually carries inspite of his fine moustache ...... what if tomorrow he is accused of the unislamic practice of washing his butt with his right hand or posessing his woman with his left hand?.......... will the federal sharia court be able to sentence him to a public stoning ?

....... it might be phyrric victory, but let's enjoy it anyway .......

Re: # 3 Are you unhappy for your neighbourhood getting more lawful ?
Indians want in pakistan military rule or Mullacracy for then their system appears better?
Only bad thing is army chief is diminished when he is about to assault Al Queda fanatics. But strong support of usa and coming billions of dollars in tribal areas from usa can change fanaticsm to more civilised rule. Which is good for A.Stan and India. Indians wish bad luck to pakistan is real think

July 20 will no doubt go down in history. A great day for all sane people in the world, Pakistanis or not.

nice to see good news about pakistan for a change. a very hopeful sign indeed.

Bulleya,

In pakistan there is no concept of the rule of law and that is why the military takes over. Your notion that it has got nothing to do with the guns is nonsense, they are the implementors of law and order in pakistan.

The judiciary is nothing, it has no guns to implement. Howmany habious corpus orders of the judiciary has gone with out any action. How many murders have net been investigated because no charges are file.

Pakistan being an islamic republic only the mullas count. See the hue and cry about lal majid. When 50 people were killed in Karachi when the CJ was visiting, no one cared about filing a single murder charge.

CJ case is nothing in pak history. After every military coup the military has changed so many of the laws of pakistyan and they all have been ratified by the judges, the law of inevitability.

Your talk of judiciary having power has to precede some concept of people created legal system in pakistan.

When the sheria court is the supreme law ratifier in pakistan, that has up held the hoodood and blasphemy laws, there can be no significance to this case of a single CJ.

Go out to the streets, the jihadis are roaming them, and they recognize no law of the CJ