Militarily Troubled Pakistan and Terribly Administered Tribals
Pukhtoon Khan July 29, 2007
#105 Posted by MantoLives on July 31, 2007 5:59:27 am
Mian Adam Khan,
"am talking about the post-reform ashoka"
Selective... like I said.
Ofcourse I know how far Asoka's land stretched (hence the latter part of my comment which you conveniently ignored-again selective). I also know that the chances of Ghaffar Khan's ancestry being Ghaznavi's or Ghauri's soldiers are much higher than it being that of Asoka.
As for Wahabism... surely you mean Deobandiism... as in those like Mufti Mahmood who were in alliance with Ghaffar Khan... as opposed to Barelvi low church that formed the majority of Muslim League's TNTist supporters right? The reason why NWFP sided with the Congress and against Punjab was because of this Deobandi-ism.
Quoting the Bilour family as an example (maybe you can enlighten me about their role in the Congress in 1947) does not matter when you consider that those around Ghaffar Khan were mainly Pushtun Sardars... and Muslim League only won support amongst the "Khaaars" or the city dwellers... the lowly non-Pushtuns ... meanwhile it was the Pushtun of the pure blood in main who supported Ghaffar Khan.
Ghaffar Khan's reverence for Bapu ji can be judged from his famous statement "we only sided with the Hindus against our common enemy" at independence. Presumably this statement was made to justify his sommersault at such late stage in favor of a Pathan/Pushtun state based on Pathan racial identity.
When in 1947, Ghaffar Khan was calling upon Pathans to rise up against Pakistan in the name of Islamic sharia and Pushtun traditions... I doubt that he had "non-violence" in his mind. Did he preach his message of non-violence to Fakir of Ipi for example? I suggest Adam bhai that you realise that Ghaffar Khan was foremost a politician... though he did not succeed in his objectives, but his objective was - as is of all politicians- power... power which he and his brother craved.
If you read the history of India you will find many such local regional leaders- inter alia Allah Bux Soomro, Sir Sikandar Hayat, Sir Fazli Hussain, Iyer, Sir Chotu Ram, Khizer Hayat Tiwana etc who wanted to preserve their fiefdoms... and tried to do so by playing the all India leaders like Jinnah and Gandhi and Nehru against each other... their politics was the politics of preservation of power and prestige and not national politics... be it Indian nationalist or Muslim nationalist etc etc.
"am talking about the post-reform ashoka"
Selective... like I said.
Ofcourse I know how far Asoka's land stretched (hence the latter part of my comment which you conveniently ignored-again selective). I also know that the chances of Ghaffar Khan's ancestry being Ghaznavi's or Ghauri's soldiers are much higher than it being that of Asoka.
As for Wahabism... surely you mean Deobandiism... as in those like Mufti Mahmood who were in alliance with Ghaffar Khan... as opposed to Barelvi low church that formed the majority of Muslim League's TNTist supporters right? The reason why NWFP sided with the Congress and against Punjab was because of this Deobandi-ism.
Quoting the Bilour family as an example (maybe you can enlighten me about their role in the Congress in 1947) does not matter when you consider that those around Ghaffar Khan were mainly Pushtun Sardars... and Muslim League only won support amongst the "Khaaars" or the city dwellers... the lowly non-Pushtuns ... meanwhile it was the Pushtun of the pure blood in main who supported Ghaffar Khan.
Ghaffar Khan's reverence for Bapu ji can be judged from his famous statement "we only sided with the Hindus against our common enemy" at independence. Presumably this statement was made to justify his sommersault at such late stage in favor of a Pathan/Pushtun state based on Pathan racial identity.
When in 1947, Ghaffar Khan was calling upon Pathans to rise up against Pakistan in the name of Islamic sharia and Pushtun traditions... I doubt that he had "non-violence" in his mind. Did he preach his message of non-violence to Fakir of Ipi for example? I suggest Adam bhai that you realise that Ghaffar Khan was foremost a politician... though he did not succeed in his objectives, but his objective was - as is of all politicians- power... power which he and his brother craved.
If you read the history of India you will find many such local regional leaders- inter alia Allah Bux Soomro, Sir Sikandar Hayat, Sir Fazli Hussain, Iyer, Sir Chotu Ram, Khizer Hayat Tiwana etc who wanted to preserve their fiefdoms... and tried to do so by playing the all India leaders like Jinnah and Gandhi and Nehru against each other... their politics was the politics of preservation of power and prestige and not national politics... be it Indian nationalist or Muslim nationalist etc etc.
reply to this interact
write a new interact
add to favorites
flag objectionable content
#104 Posted by zeemax on July 31, 2007 5:53:05 am
dawa-i-dil,
"Woh jo detey thai dawa-i-dil;
Woh dukaan apni barrHa gaye ..." :-)
Your point of Musharraf's fiddling with the ideological axis with disastrous results is quite accurate.
That ideological axis is clear in the constitution, and cannot be changed, and neither should anyone try.
"Woh jo detey thai dawa-i-dil;
Woh dukaan apni barrHa gaye ..." :-)
Your point of Musharraf's fiddling with the ideological axis with disastrous results is quite accurate.
That ideological axis is clear in the constitution, and cannot be changed, and neither should anyone try.
#103 Posted by adamkhan on July 31, 2007 5:31:28 am
Majumdar
Am talking about the post-reform Ashoka.
Mantolives:
I dont have to defend dacoits like Abdali or Ranjit Singh to have a sense of belonging, neither do I have to change sects in order to be part of the "in crowd".
And here is another fact you cool liberal you, Ashoka's land included modern day Afghanistan as well as Pakistan. Now go read up on Wahabism, the way things are changing you might have to switch to that soon.
Am talking about the post-reform Ashoka.
Mantolives:
I dont have to defend dacoits like Abdali or Ranjit Singh to have a sense of belonging, neither do I have to change sects in order to be part of the "in crowd".
And here is another fact you cool liberal you, Ashoka's land included modern day Afghanistan as well as Pakistan. Now go read up on Wahabism, the way things are changing you might have to switch to that soon.
#102 Posted by adamkhan on July 31, 2007 5:20:07 am
Twisting and turning again Mantolives, here are some facts for you, the Bilour Family is hindko speaking, so are some of the other prominent stalwarts in the present ANP. Ghaffar Khan never was a racist, or he wouldn’t have called a Gujrati Hindu “Bapu”. Infact old Muslim Leaguers i.e. the followers of Jinnah and the believers in the TNT in Peshawar, used to taunt the red shirts about this fact. That how a lowly hindu can be called bapu.
Ghaffar Khan urged his followers to redefine the concept of Qasaas in Islam and Badal in Pukhtoonwali to channel their energies in a non violent manner. The revival of this message is desperately needed right now.
If the Talibans were Pukhtoon nationalists then Wali Khan wouldn’t have supported the US invasion of Afghanistan after 9/11. The main reason why this movement is concentrated in the Pukhtoon areas is because of the large number of madrassas that propped up all over the NWFP in the 80s. A move that was vehemently opposed by both Ghaffar Khan and Wali Khan. If the same was done in Punjab I assure you the results would have been the same. There is nothing wrong with the Pukhtoon DNA, we are as much human as the rest of you.
The Barbara massacre was an atrocity and Jinnah turned a blind eye towards it, I hope Manmohan Singh doesn’t follow Jinnah’s example in dealing with the situation in Hyderabad.
Ghaffar Khan urged his followers to redefine the concept of Qasaas in Islam and Badal in Pukhtoonwali to channel their energies in a non violent manner. The revival of this message is desperately needed right now.
If the Talibans were Pukhtoon nationalists then Wali Khan wouldn’t have supported the US invasion of Afghanistan after 9/11. The main reason why this movement is concentrated in the Pukhtoon areas is because of the large number of madrassas that propped up all over the NWFP in the 80s. A move that was vehemently opposed by both Ghaffar Khan and Wali Khan. If the same was done in Punjab I assure you the results would have been the same. There is nothing wrong with the Pukhtoon DNA, we are as much human as the rest of you.
The Barbara massacre was an atrocity and Jinnah turned a blind eye towards it, I hope Manmohan Singh doesn’t follow Jinnah’s example in dealing with the situation in Hyderabad.
#101 Posted by MantoLives on July 31, 2007 5:10:06 am
Majumdar 100,
History and facts are the undoing of the sissy liberal (as opposed to cool liberal like myself) in Pakistan.
But that begs a question - Asoka's violence notwithstanding... why does Adam Khan (if he is so concerned about Asoka) support people who wanted the land of Asoka to become part of Ghaznavi's country i.e. Afghanistan?
Or perhaps he is shooting for Kabul (owing to a stupa here or there) becoming part of good ol' Punjab... in which case, hurray to him.
History and facts are the undoing of the sissy liberal (as opposed to cool liberal like myself) in Pakistan.
But that begs a question - Asoka's violence notwithstanding... why does Adam Khan (if he is so concerned about Asoka) support people who wanted the land of Asoka to become part of Ghaznavi's country i.e. Afghanistan?
Or perhaps he is shooting for Kabul (owing to a stupa here or there) becoming part of good ol' Punjab... in which case, hurray to him.
#100 Posted by majumdar on July 31, 2007 4:47:51 am
Adamkhan sahib,
(The main reason behind this senseless killing is this bedouine plague that has cursed this land and transformed the land of Ashoka into the killing fields of Abdali and Ghaznavi. )
Sorry to disappoint you but apparently Ashoka murdered 99 brothers and also brought about a bloodbath in Kalinga b4 reforming his ways.
Regards
(The main reason behind this senseless killing is this bedouine plague that has cursed this land and transformed the land of Ashoka into the killing fields of Abdali and Ghaznavi. )
Sorry to disappoint you but apparently Ashoka murdered 99 brothers and also brought about a bloodbath in Kalinga b4 reforming his ways.
Regards
#99 Posted by MantoLives on July 31, 2007 4:23:03 am
Re: # 89
Yes by quoting facts of history, I am merely quoting an "opinion". Your abuse on the other hand is entirely factual and not abuse at all.
Tell me why did the Moplahs kill all those Hindus in the Khilafat Movement... when the "TNT-ists" were no where around but infact had opposed the Khilafat movement.
Pakistan will do just fine. You can keep dreaming your pipedreams in the meantime.
Yes by quoting facts of history, I am merely quoting an "opinion". Your abuse on the other hand is entirely factual and not abuse at all.
Tell me why did the Moplahs kill all those Hindus in the Khilafat Movement... when the "TNT-ists" were no where around but infact had opposed the Khilafat movement.
Pakistan will do just fine. You can keep dreaming your pipedreams in the meantime.
#98 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:22:24 am
the problem is that...we have created fight with those people who freed half of Kashmir...this Azad kashmir was all captured by Mahsood tribe ...and other tribl people....
they are one of the bravest people living on the face of earth....
when British were ruling the whole indo pak..and half of the world...even then British made a pact with them..and not ruled upon them...
Russian like super power could not defeat them...
and US and NATO are unble to defeat them....
but due to our Baighairat generals...we have bombarbed our own people there..and in revenge..they have strted suicide bombing..yes..they also did some mstakes...but firing missiles on madrassas is unaccetable ..
and thats why we have burn the fire of hell..in all this tribal area..which has reached inside Islamabad also....
they are one of the bravest people living on the face of earth....
when British were ruling the whole indo pak..and half of the world...even then British made a pact with them..and not ruled upon them...
Russian like super power could not defeat them...
and US and NATO are unble to defeat them....
but due to our Baighairat generals...we have bombarbed our own people there..and in revenge..they have strted suicide bombing..yes..they also did some mstakes...but firing missiles on madrassas is unaccetable ..
and thats why we have burn the fire of hell..in all this tribal area..which has reached inside Islamabad also....
#97 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:22:07 am
in the early days...he started to change the religious axis of pakistan....
his first picture was..in front of PM house with small dog in his hand....to show people he is very moderate....
he lived in Turkey..so he fisrt declared that his most beloved personality is Kamal Attaturk...so..he wanted to transform pakistan into Turkey..and considered himself as Attaturk of Pakistan....
but thanks god...the religious masses of pakistan were so strong that...despite of his 8 years ..efforts..he could not change the pakistan into secular Turkey..and also infleunced the Army to be like Turkish Natinal Army..but he also failed in this regard...
though ..in these efforts..he made enormous losses to whole Pakistan idelogical axis..with a lot of anarchy and suicide bombings...and reactionary efforts of Lal Masjid..etc....
On Basant ..in 6 years..full time ...Baighairti...Shabab-o-Kabab mehfils..mujras..and other things...he himself was in Lahore on basant nights for 6 years..when atlast Supreme court put a complete ban on Basant....
He also tried to secularize the Army by regular basis musicaol concerts in every garrison and Abrar ..and other were invited on night dinners...there..still today....while Zia ul haq..never allowed that...
In his foolish thinking that iNdia will compromise on Kashmir..he turned whole pakistan media into indian culture..Meera going there..there singers and actors..and film stars coming here....but the Indians shown him boots on Kashmir issue..no dialogue at all...
he ordered the music classes in Punjab university..although students protested against that..but his nasha of enlightened moderation was overwhelming him...
PTV ..and other private channels are so much that sometimes they beat even indian channels in nudity and baighairti ..but no check from government at all....
these all are the fruits of this Dictator era...
his first picture was..in front of PM house with small dog in his hand....to show people he is very moderate....
he lived in Turkey..so he fisrt declared that his most beloved personality is Kamal Attaturk...so..he wanted to transform pakistan into Turkey..and considered himself as Attaturk of Pakistan....
but thanks god...the religious masses of pakistan were so strong that...despite of his 8 years ..efforts..he could not change the pakistan into secular Turkey..and also infleunced the Army to be like Turkish Natinal Army..but he also failed in this regard...
though ..in these efforts..he made enormous losses to whole Pakistan idelogical axis..with a lot of anarchy and suicide bombings...and reactionary efforts of Lal Masjid..etc....
On Basant ..in 6 years..full time ...Baighairti...Shabab-o-Kabab mehfils..mujras..and other things...he himself was in Lahore on basant nights for 6 years..when atlast Supreme court put a complete ban on Basant....
He also tried to secularize the Army by regular basis musicaol concerts in every garrison and Abrar ..and other were invited on night dinners...there..still today....while Zia ul haq..never allowed that...
In his foolish thinking that iNdia will compromise on Kashmir..he turned whole pakistan media into indian culture..Meera going there..there singers and actors..and film stars coming here....but the Indians shown him boots on Kashmir issue..no dialogue at all...
he ordered the music classes in Punjab university..although students protested against that..but his nasha of enlightened moderation was overwhelming him...
PTV ..and other private channels are so much that sometimes they beat even indian channels in nudity and baighairti ..but no check from government at all....
these all are the fruits of this Dictator era...
#96 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:21:45 am
These bloody ...broke the country...made pakistan..and heroin state..gave waters of 3 rivers to pakistan....and atlast..made the whole country ..in the burning fire of suicide attacks.....
these lanti...harami..generals ..consider themselves above every law..and rule and regulations.....
they have created a state within a state in pakistan....
there budget is never presented in National Assembly or Senate.....the most highest bodies of pakistan....
Nobody knows where the 60% of GDP go......
Minerva...come and look at he castle or palace of Lahore Corp Commander in Defence area...at night...1000's of bulbs glow..on his palace..who is he ...a soldier ..whose job is to defend country..but these baighairat kuttai....looted the money for thier own luxuries....
go and see ..how these Baighairat generals go in thier precious cars to have golf match in evening.....like they have conquered Kashmir.....
go and see..how these bloody general's wives...go to Cavalary..and Liberty market.. ...for shopping in offical cars....like they are queens of pakistan...bah.... lanti
in same Lahore..people have not pure water to drink..the patients are dying as they have no medicine..and these harami generals are enjoying the Pakistan money for thier badmashi...drunkards kuttai ........
for 60 years...they have made pakistan...the most corrupt...and beggar country....of the world...
these baighairat generals... ...DHA princes..and land mafia generals..are now...on the way..to eat whole Gwadar lands..in thier greed.....
These lanti generals ..consider themselves as very superior ...and call us " bloody civilians" ..lanti na ho tau......
what they have given to pakistan in 60 years..except..the kicking off the elected govermnets of 150 millions...or gallows to elected PM ..etc....
in my eyes..the only solution is...to have gallows...be constructed in Islamabad Abpara Chowk..bring all these baighairat generals ..to that..place..and sentence them to death..in front of all nation.....thats the only solution left...if we want to get rid of this cancer...
these lanti...harami..generals ..consider themselves above every law..and rule and regulations.....
they have created a state within a state in pakistan....
there budget is never presented in National Assembly or Senate.....the most highest bodies of pakistan....
Nobody knows where the 60% of GDP go......
Minerva...come and look at he castle or palace of Lahore Corp Commander in Defence area...at night...1000's of bulbs glow..on his palace..who is he ...a soldier ..whose job is to defend country..but these baighairat kuttai....looted the money for thier own luxuries....
go and see ..how these Baighairat generals go in thier precious cars to have golf match in evening.....like they have conquered Kashmir.....
go and see..how these bloody general's wives...go to Cavalary..and Liberty market.. ...for shopping in offical cars....like they are queens of pakistan...bah.... lanti
in same Lahore..people have not pure water to drink..the patients are dying as they have no medicine..and these harami generals are enjoying the Pakistan money for thier badmashi...drunkards kuttai ........
for 60 years...they have made pakistan...the most corrupt...and beggar country....of the world...
these baighairat generals... ...DHA princes..and land mafia generals..are now...on the way..to eat whole Gwadar lands..in thier greed.....
These lanti generals ..consider themselves as very superior ...and call us " bloody civilians" ..lanti na ho tau......
what they have given to pakistan in 60 years..except..the kicking off the elected govermnets of 150 millions...or gallows to elected PM ..etc....
in my eyes..the only solution is...to have gallows...be constructed in Islamabad Abpara Chowk..bring all these baighairat generals ..to that..place..and sentence them to death..in front of all nation.....thats the only solution left...if we want to get rid of this cancer...
#95 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:20:44 am
An elected leader of 15 crore people declined 5 phone calls of US President...as he knew...if he will not disobey him...2/3 majority in National Assembly against him..will kick him out from PM seat....
While this baighairat general...about which Clinton ..was not willing to shake hands with him...on eve of 11 september 2001..laid down his all weapons on his bed when he listened tothe 3rd level secretary of US ...lanat on him....
is this the respect of a nuclear and missile state....can an elected leader do that.....without taking into consideration his cabinet..NA ..Senate...and pals like Saudia..Emirates..and China etc....
just as this baihghairat Dictaor got a golden chance to "Legetamize" his millitary rule..in eyes of US and West....and for his seat...he pushed the whole pakistan..in fire and hell...of that war..which was not actually of pakistan....and accepted every thing they demanded..shame on him.....
can an elected goverment do that..it is answerable to 10's of institution..this Dictaor was not answerable to anyone....
and plz..dont give me psuedo threats of US attackilng pakistan and taking her to cave era or stone age like crap.....only dictators having no public support fear from these childish threats...not any elected government of 150 millions......
While this baighairat general...about which Clinton ..was not willing to shake hands with him...on eve of 11 september 2001..laid down his all weapons on his bed when he listened tothe 3rd level secretary of US ...lanat on him....
is this the respect of a nuclear and missile state....can an elected leader do that.....without taking into consideration his cabinet..NA ..Senate...and pals like Saudia..Emirates..and China etc....
just as this baihghairat Dictaor got a golden chance to "Legetamize" his millitary rule..in eyes of US and West....and for his seat...he pushed the whole pakistan..in fire and hell...of that war..which was not actually of pakistan....and accepted every thing they demanded..shame on him.....
can an elected goverment do that..it is answerable to 10's of institution..this Dictaor was not answerable to anyone....
and plz..dont give me psuedo threats of US attackilng pakistan and taking her to cave era or stone age like crap.....only dictators having no public support fear from these childish threats...not any elected government of 150 millions......
#94 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:20:02 am
Do you not know this simple fact that newton's 3rd Law..is more applicable to our social life rather than Physics...
do you not know..what this Baighairat general did in 8 years to change the ideological islamic axis of pakistan....
nobody wants cave vesrion of jahil taliban type islam in Pakistan...but is it means that you start Sharab-o-Kabab mehfils..in every nook and corner of the country... semi nude Marathon races...the cable dish atmosphere... ..indian kanjar culture...the indo pak blend of film and drama industry...music cocerts in army areas in whole Pakistan...where these Baighairat generals...having drinks in hands....dance with the singers.....
* do you not know what is happening in pakistan in whole this dictator era....the Basant ....and mujras..and chaklas ...stage dances.....and brothels....where were they leading to pakistan....
Thjis baighairat general....asked for Imam-e-Kaaba ...last few months..when the whole country stood with CJ of Pakistan..why not he remebered to have one more Marathon Race...with logo Dor mairai Lahore.....why he invited Imam-e-Kaaba..and start giving proofs of his entering the Khana Kaaba and on his roof....
can you change the religious axis of pakistan on the name of so called Enlightened Moderation.....can people will accept all these things....
will they not react....before this Dictator..where were all talibans...when they actualy ruling in Afghanistan..therewas no talbinization in whole pakistan..and when they are not actually n the scene..suddenly..this Talbinization ..reached inside Islamabad...why ???????
When you try to change the mindset of traditions..then be ready to face the music also....
do you not know..what this Baighairat general did in 8 years to change the ideological islamic axis of pakistan....
nobody wants cave vesrion of jahil taliban type islam in Pakistan...but is it means that you start Sharab-o-Kabab mehfils..in every nook and corner of the country... semi nude Marathon races...the cable dish atmosphere... ..indian kanjar culture...the indo pak blend of film and drama industry...music cocerts in army areas in whole Pakistan...where these Baighairat generals...having drinks in hands....dance with the singers.....
* do you not know what is happening in pakistan in whole this dictator era....the Basant ....and mujras..and chaklas ...stage dances.....and brothels....where were they leading to pakistan....
Thjis baighairat general....asked for Imam-e-Kaaba ...last few months..when the whole country stood with CJ of Pakistan..why not he remebered to have one more Marathon Race...with logo Dor mairai Lahore.....why he invited Imam-e-Kaaba..and start giving proofs of his entering the Khana Kaaba and on his roof....
can you change the religious axis of pakistan on the name of so called Enlightened Moderation.....can people will accept all these things....
will they not react....before this Dictator..where were all talibans...when they actualy ruling in Afghanistan..therewas no talbinization in whole pakistan..and when they are not actually n the scene..suddenly..this Talbinization ..reached inside Islamabad...why ???????
When you try to change the mindset of traditions..then be ready to face the music also....
#93 Posted by dawa-i-dil on July 31, 2007 4:19:32 am
You said that Lal Masjid was a drama and threat of islamic millitants....
hahahah....
*do you know...the ISI HQ is about 200 or 400 yards from the Lal Mosque....
* the petrol bombs...rocket launchers...gas masks..accumulated to this mosque in invisble mode...i think.....
* the ISI personals were drinkinng daru ..and enjoying soota of powder wali cigaratte when all arms were going in.....
* is it possible that..inside heart of a capital..and adjacent to ISI HQ....the dangerous arms keep on gathering....
* The baighairat general and his bloody baihgat generals ka tola ...instteadof using IB..MI..and ISI for national security..were using them to gather funny and ridiculous....proofs of Chef Justice inside house photographs..bugging the 19 SC judges...phone tapping...and threatening them with pressures.....Lanat on them...is in UK or USA..can you think..the government can do such dirty things....
* bugging of all High Courts ..and judges housese so that they cnnot unfold..the Chor Bazari..of the government..and black mail them...lanat on all the Baighatrs general's Tola again....
*when secret agents are on phone tapping of judges...can they know..wht is happening inside the heart of capital...in a place which is already famous for tensive speeches and vogorousss elements....
*who supported Ghazi brothers for 20 years...were all armed forces were not with them...now they have become the terrorists....
* i am against their implementation ways..but what they are saying...is 100% right..do you not know..what is going on in the name of enlightened Moderation..are you so unaware of that...Aunti Shameem...regulars customers were many Federal Secreatries..and 2 Ministers....and police invited the girls to stop that..as they said ..we are helpless due to government pressure..i am aginst the way the girls raided..but its not the duty of law enforcement agencies to stop these things..tell me...
hahahah....
*do you know...the ISI HQ is about 200 or 400 yards from the Lal Mosque....
* the petrol bombs...rocket launchers...gas masks..accumulated to this mosque in invisble mode...i think.....
* the ISI personals were drinkinng daru ..and enjoying soota of powder wali cigaratte when all arms were going in.....
* is it possible that..inside heart of a capital..and adjacent to ISI HQ....the dangerous arms keep on gathering....
* The baighairat general and his bloody baihgat generals ka tola ...instteadof using IB..MI..and ISI for national security..were using them to gather funny and ridiculous....proofs of Chef Justice inside house photographs..bugging the 19 SC judges...phone tapping...and threatening them with pressures.....Lanat on them...is in UK or USA..can you think..the government can do such dirty things....
* bugging of all High Courts ..and judges housese so that they cnnot unfold..the Chor Bazari..of the government..and black mail them...lanat on all the Baighatrs general's Tola again....
*when secret agents are on phone tapping of judges...can they know..wht is happening inside the heart of capital...in a place which is already famous for tensive speeches and vogorousss elements....
*who supported Ghazi brothers for 20 years...were all armed forces were not with them...now they have become the terrorists....
* i am against their implementation ways..but what they are saying...is 100% right..do you not know..what is going on in the name of enlightened Moderation..are you so unaware of that...Aunti Shameem...regulars customers were many Federal Secreatries..and 2 Ministers....and police invited the girls to stop that..as they said ..we are helpless due to government pressure..i am aginst the way the girls raided..but its not the duty of law enforcement agencies to stop these things..tell me...
#92 Posted by MantoLives on July 31, 2007 4:17:21 am
Yes... Quaid-e-Azam Mahomed Ali Jinnah was a proud member of the Congress when it was still worth it being a Congressman. He was also the person who campaigned for Ghaffar Khan's release in 1931 and his inclusion in round table conference ... some good it did anyone though.
If you don't see a direct link between the activities of Ghaffar Khan in collusion with Fakir of Ipi and the recently departed King Zahir Shah... on the issue of Durand Line... and the subsequent destabilisation of the frontier in the 70s, 80s and the 90s... then what can one say.
However... you must appreciate that when the Khan Brothers raise the banner of revolt by saying that "Pakistan under Jinnah would not be a sharia-based state" in NWFP (presumably because of Jinnah's western dress and shaven face) in July 1947 ... do you really expect that to stop there.
The Taliban movement in Waziristan is actually the Pushtun nationalist movement given a religious color. The pre-cursor to it was Fakir of Ipi... who was hand-in-glove with your "Frontier Gandhi".
As for Barbara "sharif massacre"... I am guessing you are petitioning at this very moment to have Manmohan Singh's Indian government in Delhi held accountable for the "Hyderabad Sharif Massacre" that occured a few days ago, where the police opened indiscriminate fire on protesters and killing several and injuring scores... Oh wait... you won't. Like Bacha Khan, you too have selective memory... (ironic that Bacha Khan in his first address to PCA was abusing Pakistan government for retaining British governors and praising Indian leadership... forgettin that Indians had retained Lord Mountbatten as GG). Ironies... now maybe your friend Sadna will jump in with her favorite story about some unfortuante incident about Abdul Qayyum Khan and NWFP league using the issue of some sikh girl to prove some esoteric point..
The point however remains that the seeds of Pushtun conflict were laid the day formerly "Indian nationalist" and "secular" politicians like Ghaffar Khan suddenly espoused the cause of Pathan racial purity and "Islamic sharia" to try and break Pakistan apart. Denying this is denying history.
If you don't see a direct link between the activities of Ghaffar Khan in collusion with Fakir of Ipi and the recently departed King Zahir Shah... on the issue of Durand Line... and the subsequent destabilisation of the frontier in the 70s, 80s and the 90s... then what can one say.
However... you must appreciate that when the Khan Brothers raise the banner of revolt by saying that "Pakistan under Jinnah would not be a sharia-based state" in NWFP (presumably because of Jinnah's western dress and shaven face) in July 1947 ... do you really expect that to stop there.
The Taliban movement in Waziristan is actually the Pushtun nationalist movement given a religious color. The pre-cursor to it was Fakir of Ipi... who was hand-in-glove with your "Frontier Gandhi".
As for Barbara "sharif massacre"... I am guessing you are petitioning at this very moment to have Manmohan Singh's Indian government in Delhi held accountable for the "Hyderabad Sharif Massacre" that occured a few days ago, where the police opened indiscriminate fire on protesters and killing several and injuring scores... Oh wait... you won't. Like Bacha Khan, you too have selective memory... (ironic that Bacha Khan in his first address to PCA was abusing Pakistan government for retaining British governors and praising Indian leadership... forgettin that Indians had retained Lord Mountbatten as GG). Ironies... now maybe your friend Sadna will jump in with her favorite story about some unfortuante incident about Abdul Qayyum Khan and NWFP league using the issue of some sikh girl to prove some esoteric point..
The point however remains that the seeds of Pushtun conflict were laid the day formerly "Indian nationalist" and "secular" politicians like Ghaffar Khan suddenly espoused the cause of Pathan racial purity and "Islamic sharia" to try and break Pakistan apart. Denying this is denying history.
#91 Posted by adamkhan on July 31, 2007 3:44:56 am
Mantolives:
What “tit for tat”? You mean Qayum Khan orchestrated this massacre to avenge one carried out by the Khudai Khidmatgars? Even the thought is ridiculous. It was a carnage carried out under the Governorship of Jinnah, did Qayum Khan get any reprimand after he committed this atrocity? No he didn’t. As for his past with the congress, well your Quaid I Azam was also a proud member of Congress once, should that be taken against him as well?
Why I did mention the Barbara Massacre was because of the fact that no reprisal or revenge took place after it. No bombings, no ambushes, no nothing. Doesn’t sound like a precursor to the present Taliban movement now does it? The people who kill barbers for shaving beards wouldn’t have so easily forgiven a massacre of 100s.
So don’t insult the intelligence of the readers here, there is no connection between Ghaffar Khan’s non violence movement and the present killing frenzy that has become the hallmark of the NWFP.
This terrorism, this senseless killing has been part and parcel of political Islam ever since its inception. Look up the Azraqis, the assassination of Ali, your fellow Islmailis i.e. the Hashishins, and scores of modern day Harbs, Jaishes in the middle east. I ASSURE YOU none of them is a result of Moplah uprising, and I am SURE you know that yourself as well. So to think that the mullahs in the Sub-continent would have been a meek little lambs had Gandhi jee not shaken their hands is simply naïve.
The main reason behind this senseless killing is this bedouine plague that has cursed this land and transformed the land of Ashoka into the killing fields of Abdali and Ghaznavi.
What “tit for tat”? You mean Qayum Khan orchestrated this massacre to avenge one carried out by the Khudai Khidmatgars? Even the thought is ridiculous. It was a carnage carried out under the Governorship of Jinnah, did Qayum Khan get any reprimand after he committed this atrocity? No he didn’t. As for his past with the congress, well your Quaid I Azam was also a proud member of Congress once, should that be taken against him as well?
Why I did mention the Barbara Massacre was because of the fact that no reprisal or revenge took place after it. No bombings, no ambushes, no nothing. Doesn’t sound like a precursor to the present Taliban movement now does it? The people who kill barbers for shaving beards wouldn’t have so easily forgiven a massacre of 100s.
So don’t insult the intelligence of the readers here, there is no connection between Ghaffar Khan’s non violence movement and the present killing frenzy that has become the hallmark of the NWFP.
This terrorism, this senseless killing has been part and parcel of political Islam ever since its inception. Look up the Azraqis, the assassination of Ali, your fellow Islmailis i.e. the Hashishins, and scores of modern day Harbs, Jaishes in the middle east. I ASSURE YOU none of them is a result of Moplah uprising, and I am SURE you know that yourself as well. So to think that the mullahs in the Sub-continent would have been a meek little lambs had Gandhi jee not shaken their hands is simply naïve.
The main reason behind this senseless killing is this bedouine plague that has cursed this land and transformed the land of Ashoka into the killing fields of Abdali and Ghaznavi.
#90 Posted by jayp on July 31, 2007 1:53:55 am
YLH
Here are some numbers for you about pak economy. Do not believe the economic growth data by mushy, these are actual numbers, no guess work , and one can imagine its impact on jobs.
pakistan is imploding
from dawn of today
Product-wise details showed export of rice dipped by 3.11 per cent during the year 2006-07 to $1.121 billion as against $1.157 billion over the last year. Of these export of basmati was up 16.96 per cent during the year under review. However, export of other rice declined by 17.31 per cent during the same period. This is the only traditional commodity, which crossed the billion dollar mark otherwise export of other products remained in millions.
The export of sport goods declined by 16.14 per cent during the year 2006-07 as against the same period of last year. Of these export of footballs declined by 27.30 per cent. However, export of gloves rose by 214.93 per cent during the same period.
The carpets, rugs and mats exports recorded a negative growth of 9.38 per cent; and leather goods (garments and gloves) by 24.42 per cent during the fiscal year under review over last year. Of the leather goods export of leather garments declined by 22.72pc, leather gloves 17.07pc and other leather manufacturers 52.79pc.
The export of footwear declined by 21.44 per cent during the months of June-July 2007 over the same months of the last year. Of these export of leather footwear dipped 16.64 per cent canvas footwear 46.76 and other footwear 38.43 per cent. Molasses export declined by 35.57 per cent.
Here are some numbers for you about pak economy. Do not believe the economic growth data by mushy, these are actual numbers, no guess work , and one can imagine its impact on jobs.
pakistan is imploding
from dawn of today
Product-wise details showed export of rice dipped by 3.11 per cent during the year 2006-07 to $1.121 billion as against $1.157 billion over the last year. Of these export of basmati was up 16.96 per cent during the year under review. However, export of other rice declined by 17.31 per cent during the same period. This is the only traditional commodity, which crossed the billion dollar mark otherwise export of other products remained in millions.
The export of sport goods declined by 16.14 per cent during the year 2006-07 as against the same period of last year. Of these export of footballs declined by 27.30 per cent. However, export of gloves rose by 214.93 per cent during the same period.
The carpets, rugs and mats exports recorded a negative growth of 9.38 per cent; and leather goods (garments and gloves) by 24.42 per cent during the fiscal year under review over last year. Of the leather goods export of leather garments declined by 22.72pc, leather gloves 17.07pc and other leather manufacturers 52.79pc.
The export of footwear declined by 21.44 per cent during the months of June-July 2007 over the same months of the last year. Of these export of leather footwear dipped 16.64 per cent canvas footwear 46.76 and other footwear 38.43 per cent. Molasses export declined by 35.57 per cent.
Interact Index
Latest Interacts
- tahmed32: #59 maybe india can... ‘Dustbin of history’ or
- dost_mittar: hamidm:#58: Going by his lota... ‘Dustbin of history’ or
- pinku: #58 Posted by BJ2... Terrorism Accused: Is Legal
- jang: #59 cheema, you liked... Terrorism Accused: Is Legal
- akcheema: Re: # 58 Good post... Terrorism Accused: Is Legal
- hamidm2: Re: # 57 bj mian, ....... ‘Dustbin of history’ or
- BJ2: Re: # 13 Harish, I... Terrorism Accused: Is Legal
- BJ2: Re: # 48 [... but... ‘Dustbin of history’ or
