Science and the Islamic world --- The quest for rapprochement

And you talk of billionaires? Shame on you ....

LoL. At-least the guy has a sense of humour:

The filmaker Prahlad Kakkar, the auteur of the toilet documentary Bumbay, told a startled interviewer that in Bombay "half the population doesn't have a toilet to shit in, so they shit outside That's five million people. If they shit half a kilo each, that's two and a half million kilos of shit each morning."

The pic may not be from bharat. But the accompanying text certainly is:

Thursday, July 06, 2006
Living in Shit (an excerpt from Mike Davis' Planet of Slums)

India - where an estimated 700 million people are forced to defecate in the open - only 17 of 3700 cities and large towns have any kind of primary sewage treatment before finaly disposal. A study of 22 slums in India found 9 with no latrine facilities at all; in another 10, there were just 19 latrines for 102,000 people. The filmaker Prahlad Kakkar, the auteur of the toilet documentary Bumbay, told a startled interviewer that in Bombay "half the population doesn't have a toilet to shit in, so they shit outside That's five million people. If they shit half a kilo each, that's two and a half million kilos of shit each morning." Similarly, "a 1990 survey of Delhi," reports Susan Chaplin, "showed that the 480,000 families in 1100 slum settlements had access to only 160 toilet seats and 110 mobile toilet vans. The lack of toilet facilities in slum areas has forced slum dwellers to use any open space, such as public parks, and thus has created tensions between them and middle class residents over defecation rights." Indeed, Arundhati Roy tells of three Delhi slum-dwellers who in 1998 were "shot for shitting in public places."

Thursday, July 06, 2006
Living in Shit (an excerpt from Mike Davis' Planet of Slums)

India - where an estimated 700 million people are forced to defecate in the open - only 17 of 3700 cities and large towns have any kind of primary sewage treatment before finaly disposal. A study of 22 slums in India found 9 with no latrine facilities at all; in another 10, there were just 19 latrines for 102,000 people. The filmaker Prahlad Kakkar, the auteur of the toilet documentary Bumbay, told a startled interviewer that in Bombay "half the population doesn't have a toilet to shit in, so they shit outside That's five million people. If they shit half a kilo each, that's two and a half million kilos of shit each morning." Similarly, "a 1990 survey of Delhi," reports Susan Chaplin, "showed that the 480,000 families in 1100 slum settlements had access to only 160 toilet seats and 110 mobile toilet vans. The lack of toilet facilities in slum areas has forced slum dwellers to use any open space, such as public parks, and thus has created tensions between them and middle class residents over defecation rights." Indeed, Arundhati Roy tells of three Delhi slum-dwellers who in 1998 were "shot for shitting in public places."

#394 Posted by harish_hyd,

Not correct. Read Dost_Mittar's post on the subject on this board. Pakistan's doing fine despite all its problems. Much better than could be expected and certainly far ahead of India, domestically.

All India has done is to take advantage of globalization which only benefits a few. Pakistan has a different path.

#394 by harish_hyd

"Economics" should be "economy".

#392 by zeemax

Yaar Zee, the number of billionaires only reflects the country's economic capabilities, and how effectively some people have leveraged it to make more money. As India opened up its economy, people took the opportunities, set up industries, employed people, sold their goods, and made profits. In the process, some became billionaires. There is no reason why Pakistan can't do so too, but unfortunately, that isn't happening. Pakis still seem to be debating on whether Pakistan should be secular or Islamic, and the accompanying strife has put Pakistan's economics on the backburner. Foreigners are not willing to invest in Pakistan, Pakis themselves prefer investing in real estate rather than setting up industries, and the common man has nothing to look forward to. When a country isn't generating enough money for all its people, it is only natural that conditions worsen for its citizens.

At this point of time, India and Pakistan may be at the same stage, but India seems to be looking forward, while Pakistan looks backward.

Yasser,

What apologies? This is classic case of fudging. We are talking abt filth in Isloo and Karachi. U are talking abt apologies. For what?

There's a pix with Islamabad caption. U guys are telling that Hassanabdal is not in Islamabad (though the newspaper Dawn had mention of Islamabad). I went by what ur newspaper wrote.

If u have forgotten, ALL the Pakistanis (incl U) on UP are talking abt firing & deaths IN Hyderabad recently. Nobody from India sought apologies from u or others for that. THE FIRING HAPPENED IN NALGONDA DIST.....250 KMS from HYDERABAD. Nobody from India sought anybody's apologies.

What kind of world do u live? Why u fudge the topic of discussion?

One psychologist on UP rightly said abt ur EQ (guess who).

#391 Posted by harish_hyd,

Harish, my point is simply that having a dozen billionaires is nothing to jump up and down about. India is NOT going anywhere in a hurry with a few more billionaires each year.

What's your point zee mian? That India is poor? We all know it is and will continue to remain so for a long time to come. You have ghettos even in the US, supposedly the richest country in the world. The thing zee mian is that India is providing more opportunities for its people, the people here are upbeat about their future and generally, things are looking up for them.

You guys on the other hand, still aren't clear about which way you want to go. The YLH types swear Pakistan was meant to be secular, while folks like you are sure it was meant to be Islamic. And while you guys battle it out, Pakistan continues to slide downhill. A lot of the senior Pakis say that materially, Pakistan was definitely better in the 70s and is worse off today. Can you deny this fact? OTOH, senior Indians, while lamenting the lack of respect for traditions and the ostentatiousness, concede that India is materially way ahead of how it was 20-30 years ago.

Every statistic, be it from the IMF, WB, UN or any other body, clearly points to the rise of India and the slide of Pakistan. Even so, large sections of our populations are denied access to even basic amenities, but unless there is economic growth, we aren't going to be able to lift them up from poverty, and to this end, India is definitely on the right track. And that takes care of a lot of things.

#387 Posted by Ranjit,

30 years ago? This is Calcutta last year:



...S teve explained that there were countless such areas along the river and throughout the city—even communities that lived in caves.

Teaching the pakistanis,


Indians need to teach the pakistanis the notion of self respect. Immediately after its creation, pakistan was part of CENTO, send the U2 over the USSR from the pak bases.

Then it was the turn of the saudis to be masters of pakistan when the hoodood and blasphemy laws were introduced and the town of lalitpur renamed as faisalabad.

Then it was the americans again during the afghan war and all the generals licked the boots of any GI.

Now it is teh turn of the chinese to rule over the pakistanis. The only reason for the attack on lala masjid was the kidnapping of the chinese.

The situation is so pathetic that the chinese have been allowed to run brothels in islamabad to service the army.

The zeexax of teh world are going gaga about thsi as a significant event, no noe at all, the only significance is that the army will take on even the mullahs when the chinese running brothels are interfered with.

Pakistanis have to be taught some priciples of self respect, and let us start with one at a time, YLH first followed by tahmed.

cost of jihadis,

Pakistan is always telling that they have lost so many soldiers to jihadis in waziristan. The numbers tell a different story. They have lost around 800 and that is nothing compared to the army with half a million.

Pakistanis want the US to say where the jihadis are hiding, promptly the ISI get them out. There was a program where they went with the cameras to catch a jihadi and he had gone. The army general was telling that probably the jihadi jumoped from the balcony which the army did not anticipate.

Pakistan can talk about loses only when around 100,000 of pak army are killed.

The latest count of around 40 should keep the americans quite for a month.

The good part is for the pak press the soldiers are martyred while the jihadis are killed. That is sad, the jihadis have been denied heaven at least by the pak press.

Pathetic is the situation in pakistan.

Re:zeemax
"As soon as indians fix their own dark & dank morass"

Haha!! Bandar kya jaane adrak ka swaad. Ok, feel happy in your delusions based on a visit 30 years back and some left wing internet articles. I just came back from India. Forget about south delhi where my parents live, if you visit the outskirts at gurgaon or noida, your head will spin at the level of affluence. Malls all over the plance, highways, high rises, its amazing. I live in the US and I can tell you that I was dazzled. Anyway, you can continue to stew in your hatred.

#385 Posted by Ranjit

first go and implement Islam in Pakistan and leave India to Indians.

Exactly. As soon as indians fix their own dark & dank morass and leave Pakistan to Pakistanis.

Zeemax,

Ok, India is poor. Shabaash!! But why are you taking out your impotent anger against Musharraf and Pak army on India? What did we do to you?

Just move on in life and worry about Pakistan, where Musharraf is shooting your favorite jihadis and jihadans like people would shoot fish in a barrel. Every day dozens are being killed in NWFP. People like Manto and Hamidm are popping champagne and drooling at the sight of barbecued jihadis. So if you have any balls, first go and implement Islam in Pakistan and leave India to Indians.