Jinnah and the Islamic State – Setting the Record Straight

Happy Birthday, Pakistan!

Borivilli_Express

Are you 4 real man? Allah swt doesnt ask us to wage jihad haphazerdly aat our whim or even at maulana masood azhar's desire for that matter. There are laws & procedures- preperations and ground realities that Allah swt asks us to consdier when we are about to do Qital fi sabeel-lilah. Masadi is right..in current scenario when we are backward and behind in every aspect of life the only jiahd is defensive and any scholar of minimal repute will tell u that its incumbent on those ppl that are attacked by non-muslims, its not incumbent on all muslims living everywhere like salat is fard-ul-ayn. Offensive jihaad is done under an islamic state..n that state would have to be powerful enough to have at least an outside chance to be victorious..we are unable to provide clean water to human beings in our countries...baby steps my friend.

"Is it going to be an Islamic government? Is it not begging the question? Is it not like passing a vote of censure on every Leauger? The constitution of Pakistan shall be what the people of Pakistan decide."

That says it. If Jinnah understood the meaning of above then it must be an achievemnt for a senile person. The people of Pakistan did decide. And they are still deciding.

Abey koi mera jawab dey de?

abey kya jawab, stuka? It's called using a similar sounding word when for whatever strange reason not wanting to use the correct word - communalist, in this case.

Communalist is a very bad word, hai na?

HAHA..OH OK..

Re: # 63 Dear Masadi... It is good to hear from you something different than repeating western imperialistic newspapers quoted by local elites. I agree with you lots of time but will request you to moderate your writing, not asking for massaging of facts so the your thinking about topic in not lost in rhetoric. I always found many things to think and know after reading part of book of yours "IN THE SHADOW OF EMPIRE" life and death under usa domination. Then I wrote a little letter ( 2 times) in appreciation of that. Granted I am not very good in writing and not logical like others.And both came on computer for few minutes and was taken off immediately. It is policy to "extinguish you ideas" I do not now for I do not believe in miracle. But whenever I wrote disagreeing with you it was always accepted. Something fishi or sensor or what ?
As law of country allows us to thin k freely they should publish but it is destroyed if I wrote to second your opinion.
Any opinion about something is going , sensor type think. You did write to whip mental retaed about about nuclear attack.
Also you have never said what you think about mr. Gandhi ? You agree with writings of YLH also known as Mr.Manto. Was Gandhi elite and in league with British Imperial powers? I will like to know your thoughts about that. Once I started thinking in terms of our politicains on your line of thinking I do not find any difference between NS, General and BB. All above just looking for american intensions and just trying to please his or her master and exploiting masses. Most elitist thing in india and Pakistani constitution is barring person who is not college graduate. Nothing can come near this in elist snobbery.
Kindly contribute towards different topics. I may not agree with some times but your thinking simulates thinking in my mind . Best thing about you you are not obsessed with personality like mR Gandhi and jinnah. Both have been dead long time. Some time I like you thinking as you are not obssed with some historical people or papers and quote all time. You are eagle flying without map or guidence. I kind of feel like listening to Bada Khayal of Mr.K.G Komkali, no gharana , no beaten path not standard way of aaroh, fresh path with joy of notes one after, some times rising pitch of notes at next second diving down like eagle.. Please contribute and do not pay attention to infant retaerds. Your comments have been very didectic atleast to me.

kaal

Are you calling J-man a communalist?

Re: # 64 B.Express think about general, BB what they are doing to get certificate from USA and they feel that license for ruling country same thing in India. I have written two notes on book by Masadi " life and death under usa domination" but they sensored it. It will prudent for you to study this book then you can write critic mr. Masadi.Please read book to understand who is god father of india and pakistan its usa.

stuka,

Here is another word you can add to your collection of pompous euphemisms useful for politicians of sectarian and anti-individualistic bent: consociationalism.

In my view, the state of Pakistan bears one hundred percent of the responsibility for the disastrous state of India-Pakistan relations – especially since 1989. That state is absolutely responsible for the sub continental edition of the scourge of international terrorism – particularly that directed at India.

The two nation theory was a lie fabricated by a dishonest human being masquerading as a lawyer for satisfying his personal lust for power! The two nation theory is no different from the racial apartheid of the South Africa of the past.

Every person who believes in the two nation theory – or looks the other way instead of denouncing it – every such person is little different from the racist bigot of the segregationist South! Shame on such persons! Most such bigots would deny being the bigots that they are – there are few bigots who are honest!

And the two nation theory can only stabilize as pair of nations of different religions – it shall forever be unstable as one secular country living like “friends” with a hostile, religion-centered, autocracy next door. Like baagh and bakree living together in Phantom’s land!

I don’t find it credible. Nature does not allow it.

Therefore, as long as Pakistanis keep clinging to a justification of the two nation theory – they will sooner or later attack India. They have no choice – because if they do not, then they become like India – then they are faced with the question – what the heck did we break apart for if we just end up like them?!

That is how I see it. But people like me do not matter – the more important fact is that vast majority of Indians (especially young Indians) are driven by common-sense and do not fall for what the Pakistanis preach!

In my view, the present status is unstable by its very nature. Over the longer term, only one will survive – either Pakistan will become like India – or India will become like Pakistan (its flip side). There are a few signs of the latter (Gujarat 2002) but a greater likelihood is of the former.

However, the current lot of Pakistanis is too gutless to own up to their own role in this sordid affair and their own culpability – so the world will have to wait for a change of mindset. I am personally doubtful that can happen soon – too many minds have been poisoned over too long a time – starting with the vamp!

If it does not happen – the next sixty years will be the pits – enough to make the past sixty years look like the golden age!

Abu safwaan
The quran does not proscribe any laws for war other than when the life and property of muslims is violated, these have been repeatedly done so in India.

Nor does the quran tell us to fight only when we are prepared or when we can win, infact hazrat hussain's shahadat is an example of man who sacrificed himself and his whole family rather than accept "nahaq".

But most muslims today are cowardly they only want to defend their feloww muslims when they are ready or can win. Thousands of young men have wilingly sacrificed themselves in Kashmir and are an example to the rest of us. With nukes we are now well prepared and have to start larger scale rearmament other wise India with its nuclear ageement with the US will be far ahead.

And when ever India had superiority it attacked Pakistan and took away land- in 1947 during Partition and Kashmir and during 1971 and even after the first nuclear tests in 1998 there first reaction was to bully pakistan into accepting their terms.

This means keeping hindu duplicity and the quran's injunctions on protecting muslims we must nuke India foirst and reduce its economy to rubble.

But most muslims are cowards today they dont mind the young ghazis dying as long as their own lives are not endangered. we have to follow the example of hazrat hussain, their is no concept of surrender in the quran it enjoins us to fight the unjust until they submit as long as we did not begin the war, that is why their is still resistance in both irq and aghanistan.

This argument of resist only when ready and can win is an argument of Kufr and kafirs not of momins.

Islam zinda hota hai har Karbala ke baad

And one day you wil see a true mard e momin will take over Pakistan or atleast its nukes and fulfill our obligations to allah and his faithfuls

A'null,

I am glad you read what I write so carefully and I am glad to have educated you so extensively. Be sure to write to Arend Lijphart to inform him of your enlightened views on the issue.

The "anti-individualistic" bent...the imposition of a forced national identity is equally anti-individualistic. Infact one would say that consociationalism is the epitome of individualism because it allows people to choose their identity without dealing with the self righteousness that comes with territory - yours that is.

Re: # 75

Have some shame BJKumar... some time atleast. I hope for your sake that you are actually ignorant enough to believe what you just wrote because if you are not then you are utterly dishonest.

You don't understand two nation theory and therefore choose to interpret it in your narrow little way. And then to accuse a man like the Quaid-e-Azam - whose integrity and incorruptibility was beyond question even by his worst opponents- of doing it for personal reasons smacks of an ignorance that just cannot justified or forgiven.

And to think that this display of bigotry comes from the follower of the Racist Casteist Hindu fascist misogynist bigot Gandhi makes the whole thing even more ironic... the same Gandhi who believed black people were subhuman and that people of different castes should not eat together... talk about similarities to the Racist South... how about racist Gandhians?

Jinnah on the other hand stood unbendingly for the equality of man and equality of races... unlike "Mahatma" Gandhi who believed people of Indo-Germanic and Indo Aryan stock were superior to others.

Prof. Hoodbhoy,
However wrong Maudoodi was, he was not a Hindu he was a Muslim. So how're you going to shut him out of Pakistani nationalism?

"Muslim" nationalism has to carry the burden of every Muslim ideology that Muslim Pakistanis choose to espouse. Jinnah keh gaye that what was nonMuslim did not belong in "Muslim" nationalism, and the corollary of that is all that was Muslim does belong in "Muslim" nationalism.

Apostatising is probably the only way to exclude Maudoodi. Good luck.