The need for De-Bhuttofication of the Pakistan People's Party

Tahmed:

I knew you indians would one day catch up with us Pakistanis and realize what a great man MAJ was.

Well. I thank Jinnah for his service to India. He is more like the character "Don Quixote". :-)

The Aitzazification of the Pakistan People's Party:

The deportation of Nawaz Sharif, he said, showed that Musharraf has run out of political options.

"He committed a crime under Pakistani law by abducting a man and moving him from point A to B against his will.

Musharraf's act was not simply a matter of contempt of the Supreme Court's ruling, which is punishable by six months of imprisonment; this was a criminal act punishable by a 10-year jail sentence with hard labour," he added.

"Sharif's party would proffer criminal charges against Musharraf at a local police station any day now," he said and expressed the confidence that he would be indicted when the case goes to the court.

He said he does not think that what future of Musharraf the Supreme Court would determine. "The matter has now gone into the public domain. People will react.

And what will the government do if Nawaz Sharif's wife gets onto a plane and heads for Pakistan? And if his son and daughter come the following week? Will the government keep doing the same thing?" he asked.

"This (deportation) could not have been done without Musharraf's complicity, just as the Chief Justice could not have been arrested (last March) without Musharraf having ordered it.

This case will chase him even in his days of exile outside Pakistan, and the Americans better know it," he said, adding Musharraf would not be in power for long.

"He is not as effective and all-powerful as he used to be.

Remember, Pakistan is not Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Jordan, Syria, Morocco, Libya or Egypt.

It is a South Asian Muslim country where due process of law and an electoral mandate are crucial to the legitimacy of the government," he added.(DT)

Amen!

#210

"The Aitzazification of the Pakistan People's Party":

Aitezaz Ahsan and Javed Hashmi would make much better leaders of their respective parties.

One commentator today was saying Fatima Bhutto is the real ZAB heir, has the same ideology, and has a lot of support in Larkana ... BB is definitely on the way out and is cut off by the rest of the Bhutto clan, and none of her kids is upto the mark to carry the family.

This sounds credible.

What're all you people going on about Aitezaz? As long as BB is at the helm Aitezaz will just be a minion. And BB is the lifelong Chairman of the party in case you didn't know. He'll either have to leave or form his own faction or party.

#209 masanmuthu: don quixote achieved nothing. MAJ founded a nation - and riled you indians up for ever after. so, sorry but your comparison is incorrect and merely reveals how deeply the creation of Pakistan has affected Indians. :-)

#207 chennai: good. I suggest you start celebrating Jinnah's birthday in India to express your gratitude.

Zee sahib,

The cruel reality of subcontinental electoral politics is that Mr. Ahasan will be wiped out if he forms his own party.

INC's experience in India shows that if at all breakway (i.e. non Nehru-Gandhi) factions have survived they have survived as purely regional parties - eg Trinamool Congress or NCP (Maharashtra). All so-called national level Congress factions just vanished into thin air:

Eg:

INC (O): Formed in 1967, heeld the majority of INC organisationally, routed in 1972 polls, vanished into Janata Party after 1975.
Congress (S): Breakaway faction of the INC formed after split in 1978. Held the majority of INC's MPs. Routed in 1980, Pawar went back to INC in 1984, INC (S) survived as 1 MP party for another 15 years or so.
Rashtriya Samajwadi Congress: formed by Pranab Mukherjee in 1985 after he was kicked out of INC disappeared even b4 it was forced Mr. Mukherjee had to crawl on all fours to get readmittance.

The only breakaway faction which had some success at the national level were the socialist elements of the INC (RM Lohia, JB Kripalani and others) which formed the bedrock of the Socialist Party.

Regards

Tahmed sahib,

We already celebrate MAJ (pbuh) birthday. Dec 25 is a gazetted holiday.

Regards

#216 Posted by majumdar,

But you're forgetting he is in a way 'already' the leader of a new party ... i.e. the fiery lawyers of all shades and colours ... from all provinces ... with great public support ....

don quixote achieved nothing. MAJ founded a nation - and riled you indians up for ever after. so, sorry but your comparison is incorrect and merely reveals how deeply the creation of Pakistan has affected Indians. :-)


my comparison is correct.. Jinnah achieved nothing new.. Muslims were dominant in the regions that constitute Pakistan and Bangladesh before 1947 and they are dominant now. If at all he reduced the size of the territory on both sides.. :-)

Zee sahib,

Lawyers dont have a huge amount of votes. Patronage systems do- Caste groups, Labour Unions, Feudal leaders, Village sarpanches and all that.

It will be interesting to see how many seats Mr. Ahsaan manages. Don't expect too many.

Regards

viqarm and others on Indian Muslims versus Pakistani Muslims

Wonder how it always starts, but this debate is so shorn of any intelligence and truth that it should be left exclusively to joint custody of romair and bulleya. How do others get into it?

Isn't it an outright insult for Pakistani Muslims to be compared with an arguably controversial minority with a most traumatized recent past in another country? That is setting disgracefully low standards, and vision, for oneself for ANY majority.

Comparisons can help as benchmarks. But for that right benchmarks are necessary.

Benchmarks shouldn't be used to continuously justify survival or existence (we are better off than at least so and so), but to win.

-------

Please, let's put an end to using Indian Muslims as football. That kind of cynical and fallacious argumentation should belong to romair/bulleya and nobody else ought to steal it from him. Who knows, he might next insult Indian Hindus by setting Pakistani Hindus as benchmarks for them.

Zee sahib,

To add to 220. A curiosity from India as regarding patronage systems- Filmstar's Fanclubs particularly in South India. It was the MGR Fan Club/NTR Fan Club which gave MGR's breakaway faction (ADMK) and NTR's TDP the muscle to cash onto the popular need for a regional voice. Maybe some of our South Indian friends can say something about this.

Regards

#220 Posted by majumdar,

Agreed. Democracy is a slow process.

Re: # 221 kaal

I don't agree with kaal on very many things - but he is right on this... A people with 97% majority is comparing themsevels with a people at 15% minority and feeling good about it? that's ridiculous...

The worst part is - even at 97% majority, pakis still don't come out that far ahead indian muslims, in many ways... In some cases they are actually behind indian muslims

What the heck is wrong with you pakis?.... Never mind... :)...