Musharraf’s New Ordinance Hoopla

sri bubbay: specimen like you from india make one realize how much we pakistanis have to be grateful for.

ferozk #63 the more is the pity - musharraf had so much going for him (free press, putting india in its place in 2003), and he blew it all away with his greed for power. now he is doomed to go down in Pakistan history as just another tinput dictator.

hamidm #49 i agree with you here - i have been watching some pakistani TV talk shows, and they are definitely more reasoned and considerate of one another (in terms of letting the other guy speak without interruption) then some of these turkeys on cnn.

Re: bulleya # 61

There are no alliances in Pakistani politics and never will be, because individual interests will always superced politics and personal interests - wish for power - will be always be the deciding factor.

This masquerade will last as long as everyone has a common interest and an outside chance of retaining power and then, the waltz will change partners again to reflect new interests, but the same dance and the same tune will continue; maybe with a slighty varied and a modulated rhythm.

MMA cannot hold together, because Fazl-ur-Rehman and Qazi Hussain Ahmed do not share a similar point of view.Fazl-ur-Rehman's faction has a government in NWFP and an alliance in power in Baluchistan and does not wish to risk them by narrowing his options. Qazi, on the other hand, has no power to retain or risk and thus, can claim to have a principled stand, but when offered political power was too willing to make the pact with the devil, as shown in his conduct during the passage/debate on/over 17th Amendment.

Fazl-ur-Rehman is a politican and he will "rope a dope" to retain power and feels that Qazi has no right, for the sake of his politics, to ruin Fazl-ur-Rehman's political options. There is a divide in MMA. The irony, which was not missed and was pointed on TV, was that it was the MMA government in Peshawar, NWFP, that was beating up the protesting lawyers on Election Day.

MMA is divided because one of its factions supports the government and other does not; one of its leaders is pro-government and other is not. MMA cannot have two leaders in one party and it cannot attack the government's policies while also defending it at the same time.

The best option is, parenthetically speaking, what Anil in post # 60 suggested and that is the emergence of a new political party/power in Pakistani politics. I talked about the "ownership" in politics and what I mean is the Pakistani people will not be handed freedom and democracy on a silver platter, but will have to fight for it and pry it from the hands of status quo that has gripped it since 1947.

Sadly, Pakistani society is a status quo society and given half a chance in the status quo, it will sell out its idealism.

Ciao

if one goes by genuine political credentials, then sheikh rashid fills all of them by pakistani standards.......

he is totally a self-made man......he started off as a street hawker as a boy......from there he became a lawyer (??).....he was a student political leader.....he was jailed on multiple occassions by his opponents, and got his degrees in jail.......

.....he parted company from nawaz sharif, however did not join musharraf during the elections........he won two seats from rawalpindi, on his.......and then joined musharraf........he is considered unbeatable from his constituencies........he left one of his seats, and asked his nephew (??) to contest.....his nephew lost.......

......he, allegedly, personally supported the kashmir struggle, and one of the leaders of the kashmiri leadership, personally, stated this when he came to pakistan.......

sheikh rashid lives in the famous lal haveli in rawalpindi...someone told me that he has or is going to donate the haveli for a women's college.......

ferozek#: "...MMA cannot hold together, because Fazl-ur-Rehman and Qazi Hussain Ahmed do not share a similar point of view...."

...i think a lot of people, who support the liberal parties in pakistan, are hoping the mma falls apart......and the above is their main argument.....

anyone who supports politics and a stable politcal system, should not support or assist in the breaking up of political parties....it is bad for democracy.......even if one disagrees with a political party's agenda, one should defeat it, fair and square, in a vote.......not by breaking it up........

.......while your assertion on differences between fazl and qazi are correct, there is one major difference between religioius parties and with the liberal parties......religious parties, are not, generally, one-man shows, unlike the liberal parties........religious parties are quite a bit more democratic........so the leaders of these parties, do have to listen to their votebase......fazl will have to listen to his votebase.....which is very anti-musharraf and anti-usa.....so he will, eventually have to side with his votebase......even if he doesn't want to......

the other things about the religious parties is that they rarely, if ever, have lotas.......even if they do break up, they will break cleanly along two party lines - jui and ji...each party will not split in half......

and religious party leaders do not have any corruption cases against them.....

liberal parties in pakistan are total dictatorships ......and most of their leaders have so many court cases against them for corruption or murder that they can always be coerced by the military........

pakistan, on the whole, is anti-orthodox religious parties.....but with the backroom deals, and corruption etc. of liberal parties, where they are ready to dance with anyone who can get them in power, i think the public may eventually have no choice left but to go to the religious right.....

smart money is on urstruly, and not on hamidm...................

Frankly, I don’t share the pessimism that is being displayed here. I don’t know why it was not clear to people that if Musharaaf was allowed to contest the elections, he was going to be the only one to win it, and he did. I don’t see the elections as Musharaf’s victory or opposition’s defeat.

The political process in Pakistan has barely begun and we have already seen many stalwarts exposed. I am sure many more would go down in the next few months.

I would like to remind Feroz that the first step towards democracy in Pakistan will always be sharing of power between the civilians and the army. The army will only share it grudgingly. Benazir made some bad calculations but she too was under pressure from the US to make the deal. She will pay a major price for that not only in Punjab but in Sindh too.

Here I will introduce something interesting which apparently hasn’t been touched earlier. Every army regime in Pakistan introduces new political leaders to Pakistan and we get a new set of political characters in politics.

During the ayub regime, all old school politicians disappeared. Bhutto and Mujib emerged as the new leaders of the country. One was nurtured from the inside and the other was groomed or I should say fed from the outside. During the Zia regime another set of politicians emerged. Nawaz was projected from the inside and Benazir was made leader from the outside. They both ended up serving the army for the next ten years.
We did not see a new leadership during the current regime for the simple reason that this regime was too embroiled in the WOT and barely had any incentive to groom another set of leaders.

However, since March 9th Pakistan has seen new leaders emerging. Aitazaz Ahsan, Imran Khan or even the leaders from the lawyers side such as Justice Wajihuddin and the other former Judges as credible leaders. This is a welcome change. These guys have a stellar record in public service and as they gain stature in Pakistani politics, they will, for the first time, form the nucleus of incorruptible leaders that Pakistani body politics desperately needs.

There is dynamism in Pakistani politics. The change was initiated or instigated by the US. It has happened the past and it will happen again. Often people or the interests that instigate the change lose control over the proceedings. I see Pakistan is headed to a phase where the change would create its own leaders. The important part is to continue the process and I think lawyers to a certain extent are committed to continue the process.

The game is not over. We have not even reached the 20 yards line after the kick off yet!

BB is a natural power hungry monster. She will stoop to any level if that sweet post of PM is on the plate. No morals, no ideals, nothing of the sort. She does not care about anyone else but herself.
Plunderers and looters of national exchequer are made saints just by a stroke of pen. What a beauty.
Cry the beloved country..cry.

A cure for pak depression,

As the pakistanis lose their last hope of some kind of accountability from their rulers, and sink into the ravin3es of depression, here is an antidote,

India is a country, pakistan is an experiment, and it must go on till pakistan is finished.

Enlarge the above, past it on all walls, especially by YLH and other so called pakistani patriots.

From dawn of today.

"SOME 59-odd years ago, Mussalman leader Abul Kalam Azad, a genuine true maulana, a profoundly educated man, who habitually and openly imbibed of that God-given fine malt drink and made no bones about it, was heard to murmur one balmy evening, ‘Ummmm, but we must not forget that India is a country whereas Pakistan is an experiment."

Re: # 49

Hamidm,

I suspect Qazi is on board with the strategy.

Just wait and see. Jamaat-e-Islami will not quit the MMA coalition.

Jayp,

The only person depressed here seems to be you. Your constant obsession with the lowly Pakistan and Pakistanis shows us that you are actually very insecure about India.

This is Musharraf's era in Pakistan. Unless the threats from LM are real, Mush is ur Prez for 5 more years.

The criticism of MMA supporting Mush is rubbish. Who didnt support Musharraf? It's a grandslam victory.

The question of propriety was dismissed by the Supreme COurt.

Is that Bernardshaw who siad: 'if rape is inevitable, enjoy it'

??

Good luck guys.

Another non-ordinance.

Pakistan team lost the 20.20 match, and what did they get, more than the indian winning team.

There are no losers in pakistan, all are winners, even the corrupt politicians.

from jang of today


, it is still amazing that the Indian Cricket Board awarded its winning 20:20 team with US$2 million, which if my Sanskrit is right is about 12 crores in Pakistani rupees. However, what do the Indians know about style? Our Board gave its team 20 crores for losing the Championship. Wah! Wah! Wah!

Manto,

I have told you several times, I am a professional pakibasher, a country known over the world for terrorism, and it is expected that they should be bashed.

Contact me at jayp@mossad.com.is

HP #71 That is about the most pertinent post on the subject of this board that I have read.

This (self)election of musharraf is merely the latest in his series of attempts at hanging on to power with the help of smoke and mirrors. The tide of public opinion has turned against him and his defeat in the stand-off with the Chief Justice has nevertheless forced him into power sharing in a number of ways:

1. With one of the previously shunned mainstream parties (PPP);
2. Within the army (where it has become virtually impossible for him to do what he refused to consider upto just a couple of months ago, namely remove his precious wardi, and thus become beholden to his previous subordinates);
3. With the Supreme Court;
4. After January 15, with a newly elected NA which (unless the elections are turned into a sham like yesterday's election) will no doubt serve to reduce Musharraf to a figurehead President even if he were to remain one.

Internationally, he is no longer seen as being the only alternative to islamic extremists - indeed, he is seen as having been a part of the problem in being either ineffective (per his failed "peace deal" with the tribals) or else actually making them stronger (since, his weakening in recent months has resulted in a corresponding weakening of the religious parties and tribals from the mainstream of the Pakistani political scene).

The other original point you make on this board is the emergence of some fresh faces in politics - Aitezaz Ahsan, Wajihuddin in particular. Although too uncertain to say at this point, it does seem that the public is looking for someone other than BB or NS to be the next political leader. The ground is wide open and there is no shortage of honorable and intelligent people more than capable than these individuals of leading the nations in the nation.

So, as you correctly point out - there is every reason to be optimistic. There is even a glimmer of a hope (per his calls for national reconciliation, which may be just another attempt at smoke and mirrors, but at this stage can only be with Musharraf stepping down from power), that Musharraf will realize that his time is up and will still redeem himself by retreating in a more graceful manner than he has fought to hang on to power in recent months.

At least this is my "analysis", inspired by the down-to-earth view of the situation in your post. And no one can really predict where things are headed, so this is simply a "most likely" scenario. :-)

JayP,

Eff the TNT theory. If ur last name is Thackery, thst's even more annoying.

Ur posts are too repetitive.