Mazhar Mazhar October 19, 2007
#6 Posted by hamidm2 on October 24, 2007 6:59:53 am
skeptical,
.... what is common between the ira, the ita and the tamils? ....... nothing ! .... so you really can't blame their terrorism on a root cause ...
.... now what is common between the suiciders and homiciders in morocco, libya, algeria, and all the way to thailand and the phillipines ?........ the answer is very simple if you keep an open mind ...
#5 Posted by Skeptical on October 24, 2007 6:24:12 am
That’s once again down right conclusive. Tell me are all the violent movements Islamic?
IRA did bomb blasts was it Islamic organization, Ata in Spain was involved in blasts, was it Islamic? Tamil rebels and movement in Assam has taken violent turns-are they Islamic. PPP which now is a symbol of liberalism and yet they had been also involved in terrorist activities after Bhutto’s death.
Yes Islamic radicalism is another form but one has to be sceptical before conclusively making rather arrogant verdicts. I am not saying that ideology is not at all responsible but there are certain events which at certain points in history bring out the radical elements. Please do not think I am justifying terrorism, I am merely sceptical about rather conclusive statements. If you had claimed that US elite is responsible like some people here at chowk, I would have been equally sceptical. After all human knowledge has its limitations and is always tainted with our own prejudices. Being conclusive about a complicated social phenomenon is rather taking an extreme view-exactly like Islamic extremism itself in one sidedness and intensity though on the other side of the political spectrum
Be some what sceptical and have an open mind my friend
IRA did bomb blasts was it Islamic organization, Ata in Spain was involved in blasts, was it Islamic? Tamil rebels and movement in Assam has taken violent turns-are they Islamic. PPP which now is a symbol of liberalism and yet they had been also involved in terrorist activities after Bhutto’s death.
Yes Islamic radicalism is another form but one has to be sceptical before conclusively making rather arrogant verdicts. I am not saying that ideology is not at all responsible but there are certain events which at certain points in history bring out the radical elements. Please do not think I am justifying terrorism, I am merely sceptical about rather conclusive statements. If you had claimed that US elite is responsible like some people here at chowk, I would have been equally sceptical. After all human knowledge has its limitations and is always tainted with our own prejudices. Being conclusive about a complicated social phenomenon is rather taking an extreme view-exactly like Islamic extremism itself in one sidedness and intensity though on the other side of the political spectrum
Be some what sceptical and have an open mind my friend
#4 Posted by hamidm2 on October 24, 2007 5:43:49 am
Re: # 3
skeptical,
.... forget about pakistan ..... if you look at the stretch of the world from morocco, all the way to the phillipines, you will notice that jihadism is a common phenomenon ..... there is something fundamentally wrong with this ideology, and until we recognize it there can be no hope of putting and end to the senseless violence .......
skeptical,
.... forget about pakistan ..... if you look at the stretch of the world from morocco, all the way to the phillipines, you will notice that jihadism is a common phenomenon ..... there is something fundamentally wrong with this ideology, and until we recognize it there can be no hope of putting and end to the senseless violence .......
#3 Posted by Skeptical on October 24, 2007 4:00:57 am
Re: # 1
Jihadism is a combination of the two not just USA or for that matter Paki origin. Pakistan's geographical location which made USA set up Madrassa appratus in their zeal to defeat communism has played an important role. That Jihadi element was trained by USA's money and with full training from them. Now the international politics has taken a new twist and the backers are themselves the target.
Any social phenomenon is a generally a combination of many factors. So partly you may be right but one has to be sceptic before making a verdict. Social sciences are never exact and no one can attribute with certainity as to what is behind a complex phenomenon. So the "truth" as you are defining may only be a part of puzzle not the entire solved puzzle. It is good to be sceptical in life, it is a good humbling experience.
Jihadism is a combination of the two not just USA or for that matter Paki origin. Pakistan's geographical location which made USA set up Madrassa appratus in their zeal to defeat communism has played an important role. That Jihadi element was trained by USA's money and with full training from them. Now the international politics has taken a new twist and the backers are themselves the target.
Any social phenomenon is a generally a combination of many factors. So partly you may be right but one has to be sceptic before making a verdict. Social sciences are never exact and no one can attribute with certainity as to what is behind a complex phenomenon. So the "truth" as you are defining may only be a part of puzzle not the entire solved puzzle. It is good to be sceptical in life, it is a good humbling experience.
#2 Posted by jayp on October 24, 2007 3:11:05 am
Mazhar,
Media is very important, and read this from dawn opinion section of today
A stage-managed explosion could possibly be a part of this strategy with a view to including Pakistan in the proposed extension of the ongoing massacre of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan. In this explosion, engineered at a safe distance from her carriage, Benazir was to survive for sure, but hundreds of people were bound to die or suffer injuries.
That is the only role assigned to the people of Pakistan in
Media is very important, and read this from dawn opinion section of today
A stage-managed explosion could possibly be a part of this strategy with a view to including Pakistan in the proposed extension of the ongoing massacre of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan. In this explosion, engineered at a safe distance from her carriage, Benazir was to survive for sure, but hundreds of people were bound to die or suffer injuries.
That is the only role assigned to the people of Pakistan in
#1 Posted by jayp on October 24, 2007 3:02:07 am
Mazhar,
Wake up , look out and see the reality. Pakistan has a literacy rate of aroud 40 percent, the urdu media is more jihadi than anything else. Hence it is the media that is supporting the islamisation, and there is no concept of democrazy in pakistan. Islam is fundamentally non democratic, read what the book says, sorry, the mullahs are telling the wrong things, those are un-islamic, and the correct version comes from the elites of pakistan, in the english media. Give us a break, and accept that the mullahs who have spent a life time learning the book can be so wrong. Try telling the truth for a change, jihadism is not due to the americans, it is of paki origin, and thrives because of people like you, trying to divert attention rather than trying to identify teh root cause.
Read my posts and learn from it.
Wake up , look out and see the reality. Pakistan has a literacy rate of aroud 40 percent, the urdu media is more jihadi than anything else. Hence it is the media that is supporting the islamisation, and there is no concept of democrazy in pakistan. Islam is fundamentally non democratic, read what the book says, sorry, the mullahs are telling the wrong things, those are un-islamic, and the correct version comes from the elites of pakistan, in the english media. Give us a break, and accept that the mullahs who have spent a life time learning the book can be so wrong. Try telling the truth for a change, jihadism is not due to the americans, it is of paki origin, and thrives because of people like you, trying to divert attention rather than trying to identify teh root cause.
Read my posts and learn from it.
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