Search for Origins of Mahayana Buddhism

Re: # 33

"substantiate the fact that Muslims destroyed the viharas, stupas, and temples."

Yes, Yes, you can also ask every one to substantiate 9/11-s , 7/11-s , WWII Jewish holocaust or even the surrender of 1971!!!

Re: # 35

"Jain, Buddhist & sikh also claim that they are distinct from Hindu"

Define what is Hindu before you re-state the standard Paki propaganda needed to revenge that pathetic state that actually is because of their own karmas!!

Re: # 35

"Temples and hindu idols were absent till 10 th century C.E."

Miyan , kaun se madarasee se par kar dawah karne nikle ho??

Re: # 26

"reached upto these Buddha statutes in Bamiyan and tok out the diamonds out fo eyes and merely said I just wanted to show that they even can not help themselves how can they help you?"

This is standard Islamic propaganda against idolators. First, create a caricature of idolator religion and then abuse that caricature as if that implies critique of that religion. The first caricature is of equating the idols with the spiritual deity - as if the photo of bush is GWB and after burning that photo some Islamist claims - " look he cannot save himself."
Infact, every idolator must look at these Pakistanis and say - "See, even your Allah cannot save you from your current state."
The fact remains that the standard operating manual of Islam prescribes abominable amounts of violence against other religions.

Re: # 35 well said , fully agree!

Re: # 35 well said , fully agree!

*18

"The Mahayana schools believe in effecting the spiritual liberation of all beings from the cycle of reincarnation and rebirth."
Fully agree with you

Temples and hindu idols were absent till 10 th century C.E.
This explained by the fact that for the period between 4th 5th c.e.and 10th c.e.was relatively lull period of hinduism after which hindu asserted them selves overr Jain & Buddha.

In ayodhya Jain claim the temple was built OVER jain temple.

Jain, Buddhist & sikh also claim that they are distinct from Hindu

Re: # 32wonderful I will love to respond!

Re: # 30 except sporadic military instances of destruction there is no historical record substantiate the fact that Muslims destroyed the viharas, stupas, and temples.

How can we guess of huge constructions throughout histroy about a place where the Shudras were not allowed to enter the temples! How many Brahmans were in India who could control the temples and other religious places.

When Arth shastra said pour hot copper in the ears of Shudras if eh listens to sacred Vedas , then how could they have loved to construct temples... so that North indai would ahve been littered with these religious places?

As to South Indai how amny temples we ahve other than famous ones in Kernataka, Orissa, and some other border areas near the coasts and in Gujerat also!

How can there be temples when common people were not allowed to constrcut and enter the temples, read again the Shastric rules about constrcution of Temples and then relate it ot the number of temples!This fad of constrcuting of religious places by all the followers of religions and creeds is the gift of modernity. It was not so rampant in past as it 1s portrayed to be!

#19

The Hinayana school talks of Nirvana for the individual.
Mahayana schools talk of Nirvana for all living beings not just humans. In that sense the individual Mahayana practitioner pledges to some back into the samsara to release all beings.

It seems to me that you say that Mahayana is only for humans and that is not right.

By the way what do you mean by Hinduised sources? Do you suppose the Buddha originated in some country where the predominant form of religious thought was Taoism.
Where do you think the seminal thinking of Buddha originated from? Do you think he was born a Taoist?
Do you think the concept of Hinayana and Mahayana originated in some other country other than India. The Mahayana school originated in South India.

What do you think Pali is ? It is a literary language developed in India patronised by Hindu kings. It is another prakrit language which means vernacular as opposed to Sanskrit.

What are original Buddhist texts? Those written by the Chinese? I suppose they chose to write in Pali because it was their mother tongue.

Do you know what samsara is ?

Since you brought up the original source of Buddhism I suggest you dismiss all discussion of Tibetan, Chinese and Japanese Buddhism. They are all tainted by their local influences just as you use the word "Hinduised".

Re: # 29 Can we count the books written on history of India in pre-Modern times ? who was Alberuni? He wrote first sociological and objective compendium about India in 11th century . Who patronized him son of the so-called but -shikan !

the problem is that due to narrowmindedness of modern times and our own vested interests we are unable to share and understand the human heritage and history and culture !

As far as the non-appreciation of non-Islamic culture is concerned it is an incomplete truth. Have you read Dr. Hasan Dani, Salman Rashid,Yahya Amjad , Rashid Akhter Nadvi, and most important the original sources of indian histroy written by Muslim writers in last more than 1000 years, who without bias describe the events of history. how many Hindu Rajahs patronized historians? we need to histroy from objective eyes and not from eyes of a bigot!

Re: # 26

By other things, I mean temples, stupas, viharas,
etc. I am sure Afghanistan, present day Pakistan, and
northern India must have been littered with them.
You hardly see any of those ancient structures.

Mahfari # 20,

"Muslims were in Bamiyan in 7th century and reached upto the place called Bamiyan and it is also near Ghazni, the Empire of Mahmood Ghazanavi, so why they were not destroyed then by those but-shikans then?"

If it took your firendly neighbourhood ISI bomb experts more than two attempts to blow up the Bamiyan with the most modern explosives, what chances of sucess of destroying them existed in the hands of tech. challenged muslim medival hordes?

This article is a good attempt by a pakistani to start looking for a better understanding of his history. But anyone can see that all Pakistanis suffer from a complete lack of knowledge about anything nonislamic in their country's past.
An interesting and relevant issue for pakistanis with regards to Buddhism would be that Buddha's pictures and statues did not exist for atleast 4 centuries after his death. His message precluded people from worshipping him. Yet centuries later as is the human tendency, people erected statues and pictures to honor him and eventually worship him as a personal deity. Interestingly there is nothing in Buddhism that condemns these followers to hell or decapitation for such acts.

Adios

Re: # 25 yea your understanding is right and it catches the essence of the differnce in Buddhist Tradition.

Re: # 25 yea your understanding is right and it catches the essence of the differnce in Buddhist Tradition.

Re: # 24 It is reported about these statutes in histroy books that in the times of Caliph Usman RA Muslims reached to these areas and in those times these Buddha statutes had precious diamond and pearls studded in them. one Companion of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him)who was of shorter height ran and reached upto these Buddha statutes in Bamiyan and tok out the diamonds out fo eyes and merely said I just wanted to show that they even can not help themselves how can they help you? and came down and they never destroyed these . As far as destroying other many htinsg will you specify the other things?