Preview of Looming Democracy - Two Months of PPP in the Limelight

While I understand your pain, perhaps this will enlighten you on the REAL ROOTS of our troubles.

Love and peace.

Imran

Brig Tariq Jilani
Director, ISPR
Rawalpindi, Pakistan
Fax +9251 9271603

Subject: Telecon / Meeting with General [R] Pervez Musharaf

Dear Brig Jilani

You and the ISPR are well aware of my efforts to save and grow Pakistan vide seminars held for MNAs and politicians in 2006 and publicly available online at www.ahappyworld.info

Background
My efforts to stop smuggling of cell phones in Pakistan have yielded the country USD 1 bn vide CBRs SRO 391 in June 2001 supported by Mr Shaukat Aziz (who happens to be from the same IBA that taught me one thing “DISCIPLINE”), Dr Atta Ur Rehman, General [R] Khalid Basheer and the former Chairmen of CBR, Mr Riaz Malik and Mr Riaz Naqvi. I never asked the Government for even an acknowledgment of my efforts, while it is true that my focus on “governmental” affairs from 1999-2001 did cost me my job as my boss gave a damn to what the Government of Pakistan gained, he didn’t gain much during this time anyway, I survived and am Alhamdolillah, after 7 years back to the level I deserved as Regional Director for a European multinational covering 20 countries in GCC/MENA. All this time I silently continued my efforts to change the country’s policies to enhance foreign investments and law and order.

Past communication with the President (General Musharaf)
Back in June 2001 I wrote a letter to General Musharaf, then CE of Pakistan. To my surprise not only was my communication acknowledged I was invited by a Colonel Kamran Dy MS to CE to visit the “CE” house, now the President house, behind the Secretariat, where we had an in depth discussion. The core idea I proposed was to involve the Army in re establishing law and order in Pakistan besides many other ideas that are on record at the President House. Col Kamran informed me that this idea was discussed by the Core Commanders and in view of foreign pressure (remember this is pre 9/11) we couldn’t do that, moreover the Army’s role is limited to:

1. Give an “injection” to civil institutions
2. Exit once they are “fixed”

I disagreed with Col Kamran on this strategy and openly told him that not only is this incorrect, it will never happen, and when your core commanders DO realize this is wrong CHANGE the strategy. I WISH I was wrong then though time has proved me right.

Current Situation

Law and order
7 years down the road, corruption is rampant in Pakistan-the law and order system is NON EXISTENT, the Judges we have, never gave justice to the poor, the police is an exploited arm of the politicians and administration. Bottom line our PRESIDENT himself does NOT trust this system, hence his demolition of the judiciary, Benazir died due this gap, the PEOPLE OF PAKISTAN ARE FED UP WITH THIS LAWLESS STATE THAT YOU CALL “PAKISTAN” they are dying or moving out of the country, they face inflation beyond logic and have to fight to survive at all levels. YET I SALUTE PAKISTANIS living in Pakistan for their persistence.

Foreign relations/Media
From Tasleema Naseem, Brig Cheema and so many other jokers who played havoc with our image, not to mention the obvious: THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY IS DEAD AGAINST GENERAL MUSHARAF for their reasons (watch Syriana and JFK to get a better idea strategic and tactical actions in the region and priorities) – the recent press conference Gen Musharaf had, was he not able to grasp the animosity and bitterness in the questions? Who was funding GEO? Or the others, one must be stupid with a capital “S” to say “PPP or Nawaz” – there’s a lot more, and deeper into it as described above. Moreover, the TERRORISM card has been way too overplayed by Gen Musharaf and foreign powers have NO FAITH IN HIS ABILITY TO TACKLE THAT ISSUE. In my view they are partly correct in this regard as I will explain in the “WHAT MUST BE DONE” section later

STATUS QUO: What is going to happen STEP BY STEP
1. IF General Musharaf survives assassination, he is 95% sure, by my book, to be deposed as President in a timeframe of within 180 days from now.
2. Interim government will hold polls in 90 days. Nawaz Sharif will be allowed to contest.
3. Elected “LOOTERS” from any party will take office, PPP or PML (N)
4. Phase “x” of corruption, lawlessness and malpractices will re-start in Pakistan, that was “controlled” to some extent in Musharaf era
5. The country will slide to oblivion
6. NO OTHER ARMY GENERAL WILL HAVE THE GUTS TO ENTER POLITICS ONCE MUSHARAF EXITS BY FORCE OR BY CHOICE.
7. The fate of the people of Pakistan (except “party” workers) will be sealed: SIMPLE, LEAVE PAKISTAN IF YOU WANT TO SURVIVE

WHAT MUST BE DONE IMMEDIATELY BY GENERAL MUSHARAF

Put law and order on track
1. Realize and accept that the Army has TWO ROLES:
a. External defense: that you already excel in
b. Internal defense: that is currently with the “police” and “judiciary”
i. As the QURAN says Al RASHI WAL MURTASHI FI NARE JAHANAM i.e. Bribe giver and taker goes to HELL. YOU CANNOT CHANGE OR REFORM THEM (your judges and policemen). PERIOD. You triple their salaries they will STILL be corrupt and abuse powers.
ii. We need a SHORT TERM ALTERNATE SYSTEM during which time we refresh the force and judiciary
iii. This task can ONLY be done by either enforcing APC (Army Penal Code) via serving or RETIRED army personnel
iv. The benefits are obvious, the ARMY is the ONLY institution in the country which follows its CHAIN OF COMMAND DITTO, and there is LEAST corruption in the army compared to the rest (excluding supplies and all, that too at senior levels)
v. Look at the retired sepoys from the Army, they work as private sector SECURITY GUARDS for Rs 3200 per month WITHOUT CORRUPTION, their tummies are intact, they come to duty in ironed uniform ON TIME, they do NOT abuse authority, they FOLLOW their management.
vi. Reality is 80% of EX ARMY PERSONNEL ARE MIS FITS IN PAKISTAN, they don’t belong in this corrupt environment from the disciplined environment they came from. LET THEM ENFORCE LAW AND ORDER IN THE SHORT RUN LATER RECRUIT PEOPLE FROM CIVIL LIFE ON THE SAME PATTERN AS ARMY DOES
vii. Get army judges, QUICKLY modify APC to adjust to LAW NEEDS OF TODAY, REMEMBER our lawyers and judges are following antiquated systems and processes that the BRITISH used to RULE OVER SLAVES (Contract Act of 1872 and Companies Ordinance of 1935 renamed o 1984). Our intellectual think tanks can study models of excellence in Dubai and elsewhere and change laws to deliver SPEEDY JUSTICE
viii. Free the innocent inmates in jail cells, picked up for personal animosity or plainly a woman raped and held for Hudood! Raped further by policemen, poor serfs of landlords and mafia rotting away for no crime, even CHILDREN!
ix. DIVIDE ARMY INTO TWO PARTS, EXTERNAL AND INTERNAL, both report to COAS as of now.
x. General Musharaf: YOU CANNOT SHOW YOUR FACE IN THE OTHER WORLD IF YOU DENY YOUR PEOPLE WHO TRUSTED YOU FOR 9 YEARS NOT EVEN THE BASIC RIGHT OF LAW AND JUSTICE AS OUTLINED ABOVE

Put “Extremism” back on track

I do NOT blame the “WEST” Uncle “Bush” and Uncle “Brown/Blair” for their mistaken policies to handle terrorism, they DON’T UNDERSTAND ISLAM or how this WAR is working internally, YOU DO AT LEAST, why don’t you educate them that:
1. This is an IDEOLOGICAL war waged on the free world by Al Qaeda etc you CANNOT defeat it with cannons, for every 1 person you shoot, 10 more will be born, and INCREASINGLY from the educated class, not just the “Taliban”. CASE IN POINT, London bombing was done by INDIAN DOCTORS that UK cannot reconcile with until now (how come people born and bred and working in UK became “terrorists”?).
2. TO FIGHT THIS WAR, download and read my action plan on www.ahappyworld.info
3. Simply stated:
a. WE MUST IMMEDIATELY STOP THE FIGHT BY FORCE
b. We must get IMAM E KAABA and relevant religious icons to VISIT these areas and go live on air spreading REAL message of Islam of love and peace, General Musharaf doing it is not credible or enough we need role models these people believe in
c. Tell America and Europe straight “WAR ON TERROR IS A WAR ON IDEOLOGY OF MISUNDERSTOOD ISLAM, IT CANNOT BE FOUGHT OR WON BY FORCE AS OF RIGHT NOW” at they same time tell the Western media to START HIGHLIGHTING GOOD THINGS AND PRACTICES IN ISLAM that will soothe the pain on BOTH sides.
4. General Musharaf: You need to get HANDS ON to solve these problems, saying “GOVT IS DOING THIS AND THAT FOR A REASON” WITHOUT GOING INTO DEPTH AND SOLVING IT (like you told foreign journalists when they asked why they cant go to rural areas AFTER you INSTRUCTED them to “GO TO RURAL AREAS TO FIND WHAT PAKISTANIS THINK”, Sir! YOU MUST INVOLVE YOURSELF IN INTERNAL AFFAIRS BEYOND THE OBVIOUS.
5. Islam’s message is of peace and love, OPEN PAKISTAN’S BORDERS to EVERYONE, just charge a HEFTY VISA FEE
a. USD 1000 to visit Pakistan
b. USD 50000 to become a permanent resident of Pakistan
6. ACCEPT ISRAEL, all the Muslim TALK Pakistanis talk about is CRAP. Give visas to Jews and Christians. THAT IS THE WAY TO FIGHT INTERNAL TERRORISM tell your people loud and clear that Islam propagates the message of love, we are LUCKY to be born Muslims hence our SYMPATHIES with NON MUSLIMS who DON’T KNOW THE REAL MESSAGE and through our CONDUCT, LOVE and GOOD BEHAVIOUR alone can we influence them.

I hope to have an audience with the President on phone or in person to apprise him of the situation and the actions he must take immediately.

Pakistan Zindabad!

Regards


Imran Owais Kazmi
Chief Thinking Officer, Strategy2Action

GSM: +971 50 5849562/ +971 55 8094119
www.crscube.com
www.ahappyworld.info

I wanted to end this board with a positive thought.

PAKIS ARE NOT A CURSED NATION.

{"As a nation and society we are hypocrites and opportunists. May be it does not sound pleasing to many of you but just give it a thought. At the start of the New Year let us at least promise to do some thing if not everything for the betterment of ourselves. Let us not let the world think that we are a cursed nation."}

Zafar Sahib,
I can appreciate your frustrations and even understand the hopelessness of the moment. Like you, I too was dejected by the untimely demise of BB. But, what I saw in the last few days following her murder made me even more depressed and angry. As someone said every night is followed by the morn and it's darkest just before daylight.

Please don't be sad forever and certainly don't throw in the towel. We need just a few motivated, honest, patriotic, and dedicated individuals from each community and each province who really love Pakistan. Excuse me for being a doubting Thomas, but I don't think that such people can be found in the likes of Mushy, Zardari, Sharif, the Chaudhrys, or Altaf Bhai. Like BB, all of these people have too much baggage and the fish n their bags, that they brought to feed us, is beginning to rot and smell. We need to dispense with the traditional, useless alliances of party, province, sect, language, and religion. We need to discard these useless pirs, politicians, feudal lords, mullahs, and army generals.

The students and educated youth of Pakistan need to take matters into their own hands. They need to forcefully tell their elders and their so-called movers and shakers to grow up and get out of the way. The youth have the most to lose from the pending doom. The fratricidal leaders and their childish games that even Machiavelli would scoff at have no meaning in this modern world. They cannot keep destroying this country every 10 years or so without serious consequences.

The young people of Pakistan have to resolve that they will make their country work. Not because of the less than Azam Quaid or the rascals posing as "Shaheed," or the bearded 7th century transplants calling themselves Maulana and Alim, and certainly not the "Ghazis" whose only victory has been routing Moola Fadloola in Swat. The youth of Pakistan needs to retire the old school and take over the country.

The young Pakistanis need to take an oath against using ethnic, religious, provincial, sectarian, linguistic, class, or racial excuses to tear each other apart. They need to restore or build our institutions of education, government, healthcare, and legitimate defense. In short, Pakistan needs an educated population that believes in genuine democracy with secularism, freedom, tolerance, and universal prosperity as its cornerstones.

It's not easy to accomplish, but it's not impossible. It was much harder to obtain Pakistan - it should be much easier to maintain and enhance it. Good Luck.

Salim Ahmed Chauhan

#95, PM Sahib,
All's well that ends well. :) Thank you for connecting the dots. Madani sahib is a genius (kinda like the legendary Sehgal - no rehearsal necessary, thank you.) That is why I admire this bastion of truth - he gives it to us fresh from his mind to our ears - very little Madison Ave. with this peddler of facts. :)

tvarad #97 {"PM Bhai, ... Unlike in Pakistan, the Indian army has never interfered in it's politics and, except for a few of the smaller states, the ones that are politically influential like UP, Bihar, Maharashtra etc. are not at each other's throat.

And I would hazard a guess that the politico-religious slaughter in Pakistan last year alone would be more than those killed in all the riots that you mentioned above. "}

TV Bhai,
I agree with you about the Indian Army's restraint and the point about Indian provinces behaving as civilized entities. I disagree about your hazardous guess about the numbers killed in Pakistan vs. Gujarat 2002. You see, we Pakis are like annoying magpies, constantly picking at violence every other day. Meanwhile, thanks to the big guns of people like Modi and Advani, Injuns manage to score numerous centuries when it comes to killing minorities - '02 (Gujarat), '84 (Delhi), '60s (Ahmedabad, Jabalpur), '47 (East Punjab, Delhi, Calcutta, Bihar) were very big scores. :(

Please join the struggle for liberating Pakistan from Military and Feudal Lords by signing up the following site. This is about time when Pakistani youth should take control of the country before they loose this precious land into the hands of tyrants.

http://www.moveforjustice.org/

PM:

"....Surely, Indians with their own history of such $hit (Oh wait, you do agree that thousands were killed in riots in '83, '91, '92 and '02, don't you?) even when in a democratic set-up should be wary of such simplistic explanations, should they not?"

PM bhai,
Even the most cynical India-hater would not state that India's political problems are in the same league as Pakistan's. And your analogy is wrong. Unlike in Pakistan, the Indian army has never interfered in it's politics and, except for a few of the smaller states, the ones that are politically influential like UP, Bihar, Maharashtra etc. are not at each other's throat.

And I would hazard a guess that the politico-religious slaughter in Pakistan last year alone would be more than those killed in all the riots that you mentioned above.

tvarad:

re. "So can you give me YOUR explanation as to why Pakistan is in this s**thole?"

My explanation, were I to attempt one, would be many-faceted and run into several pages, rather than the half-assed attempt to lay all blame at the door of Dictatorship. Surely, Indians with their own history of such $hit (Oh wait, you do agree that thousands were killed in riots in '83, '91, '92 and '02, don't you?) even when in a democratic set-up should be wary of such simplistic explanations, should they not?

haan bhai Salim, I connected the dots (as well as inserted and killed a few when needed) :-) The problem was with the connection, I feel. saaTh saal peheley ki baateiN ko kaal ke waaquei se compare karana kuchH ajeeb nahiN hai? A lot of water has passed under the pull since.

P.S. Can you forgive me for thinking, earlier that he was referring to '71 when he mentioned the rumpage? :-)

PM #92 {"when liquit khan was killed hindustani muslims did not went on rumpage. while feudals sindis just went on burning , like mad men and that was for saddist fun. really they wanted to blame mqm but there was no smoking gun. central leadership of mqm was afraid to stop violence due to possible pouring gas on fire and giving reason for sindhis to make riot"}

PM bhai,
Obviously you are not that big a fan of ahmed madani. :) His style connects various events, timeframes and even topics and he is very frugal with dots - unlike his less intelligent understudy, Hamidumdum Sahib. :)

My point is that ahmed madani is talking about THESE riots in December 2007 after mentioning the fact that Mojos did not riot in 1951. You just have to follow the master's express train as he dispenses accurate opinions. :) Please pay attention to the full stop between "rumpage" and "while" in the 2nd line that I have copied above.

PM

"Oh puhleeze!! Not the freakin Lack-of-Democracy-Leads-to-this-$hit argument that we've heard from TAhmed, Tariq Ali and others here. That's all too convenient a connection. But not an established one."

So can you give me YOUR explanation as to why Pakistan is in this s**thole? Is it because it's citizens are just not listening to army orders to march in lock-step while it takes care of such important things as creating strategic depth, being allies in the war on terror, bleeding India through a thousand cuts etc???

Salim bhai, with all due respect, though I also admire madanisahib's often unique perspective, I think his bringing up events, and reactions to those events, of 1951 is a little odd. We all know how much a people can change in a generation. More so in two.

--which is not, of course, to say that I think that the "hinudstani Muslims" are culpubale here; just pointing out false rationales in their defense.

PM,
I just read ahmedmadani's post on the Bina Shah article where he exposes the rumor about MQM doing any burning or looting. Please read - I am a great fan of ahmedmadani who writes things as he sees them. He is my weathervane for Pakistani opinion. :)

{"#9 Posted by ahmedmadani on December 30, 2007 2:14:37 pm

romair you have described correctly social situation . country has become stagnant pool of feudals. one person can not clean this mess,they go to other clean pond, usa , west, middle east etc. every body who can leaves, these are good ambitious people , cream of pakistan. ...before g we were lucky as many hindustani ambitious muslims left for freign country, pakistan. that kept feudal backward minded peoples country alive by addition of hindustony muslims which brought up social iq. then they started leaving and more calamity started even more backward like jungli tribals of afghanis poured and changed b stan and nwfp. now these jungli tribals influence everthing. it is like weed invading normal crops...when liquit khan was killed hindustani muslims did not went on rumpage. while feudals sindis just went on burning , like mad men and that was for saddist fun. really they wanted to blame mqm but there was no smoking gun. central leadership of mqm was afraid to stop violence due to possible pouring gas on fire and giving reason for sindhis to make riot. anyway now we have god bilawal, praise bilawal."}

#88 PM {"And Salim, let's not start to gloat, man. Word on the street is that other cadre of other pol parties (won't take names here) took advantage of the law and order situation here, looting banks and businesses. It's not at all a an implausible scenario. "}

PM friend,
If that is indeed true and if that other group turns out to be the one you suspect and I am guessing, then instead of gloating I should be holding my head in shame. If that party in fact joined the party of orgy and looting, then it's time to invite Modi and his gang to teach us all a lesson. I am just hoping and praying that you are wrong about this - but somehow I suspect that where there is smoke, there is an arsonist. :(

#84 {"Zensufi Sahib,
Good observation. Exactly, my point"}

Zensufi Sahiba,
My apologies for calling you a Sahib - please consider that a generic salutation of respect. Actually, a very kind angel alerted me about my mistake. Why should we take it for granted that any intelligent point will be made only by Sahibs? :) Actually, most of my intellectual role models are female. :)

re #86 Posted by tvarad

"Did it every occur to you that Mushy and his fauji counterparts have sabotaged legitimate political activity so thoroughly that it is causing people to take the law into their own hands?"

Oh puhleeze!! Not the freakin Lack-of-Democracy-Leads-to-this-$hit argument that we've heard from TAhmed, Tariq Ali and others here. That's all too convenient a connection. But not an established one.

And Salim, let's not start to gloat, man. Word on the street is that other cadre of other pol parties (won't take names here) took advantage of the law and order situation here, looting banks and businesses. It's not at all a an implausible scenario.

Tvarad #86,
Good point. Let's go after both the PPP and the Army - if they could collaborate to lose East Pakistan, they can work together to rebuild the damage they have caused to West Pakistan.

Salim Chauhan

"
If I were Mushy, I would send the entire bill to PPP and put their leaders in jail until they paid for the damage they have caused - we can't bring back the dead, but we sure can make the living pay for their sins."

Did it every occur to you that Mushy and his fauji counterparts have sabotaged legitimate political activity so thoroughly that it is causing people to take the law into their own hands?

If I were a Pakistani, I would start a concerted attempt at de-fanging the army which comprises of nothing but surrender monkeys whose only claim to fame is, as the cliche goes, how successful it is at conquering Pakistan every couple of years.

Salim_Chauhan:

"There is no shortage of excuses that committed right-wing Hindutva type BJP/RSS/VHP/JS/BD/SS/SP orange brigade cheerleaders have in their warchest for killing thousands of Muslims, tearing down Babri Masjid, and electing Modi so many times that he makes Guiliani look like a virgin."

Actually the best thing Modi has done is put a stop to the constant whining of rabble-rousing Muslim medieval revisionists who want to pass off their backwardness as somehow the fault of everyone else. No one gives a s**t for this argument except for the flaky English media who wouldn't know what secularism is if it bit them on their big fat behinds. My fondest and forlorn hope is that the Muslim intelligentsia (an oxymoron, I know) start looking inward after the recent happenings in the land of the pure but why do I have the feeling that it will cause them to furiously start digging into the hole they are in?

And watch out, Modi will soon be coming to a small Mohalla called New Delhi near the UP heartland.

P.S.
Here's the difficult word for you to practice on today:

from Websters: in·tro·spect
Pronunciation: "in-tr&-'spekt
Function: transitive verb
: to examine (one's own mind or its contents) reflectively introspect intransitive senses
: to engage in an examination of one's thought process and sensory experience

zensufi #65 {"I agree with you, Salim, that there was/is no need to plunder the city and innocent people in the name of mourning. Unity, Faith, and Discipline - ...Pakistan mein na unity hai na discipline, magar bohut faith hai... destructive faith it seems."}

Zensufi Sahib,
Good observation. Exactly, my point. Why all this chaos, disorganization, and totally crazy behavior. It's a good thing that Pakistan doesn't have liquor everywhere, wait on second thought, maybe that's the problem. Just look at Hamidumdum Sahib - I have never seen that perfect gentleman ever beat an old airconditioner senseless.

#68 krashid1961,
Paki redneck it is for these goons who get drunk on assassination.

PM #69 {"The muffuking mobs attacked Edhi Centres and amubulances, for crying out loud!!! If these are the awam for which democracy is being fought, please, I'll take the dictator anytime. And don't give me that shyte about how lack of democracy CAUSES these travesties. "}

PM,
How are you? Can you believe it? How will we feel the next time we feel like donating money to Edhi foundation because there aren't enough ambulances in Pakistan? This behavior of PPP goons sucks. :(
If I were Mushy, I would send the entire bill to PPP and put their leaders in jail until they paid for the damage they have caused - we can't bring back the dead, but we sure can make the living pay for their sins.

Saharanpuri #73 {"Hv u been to SRE or any connection with it.Where does your family roots lie?In SRE we have a huge population of Garha muslims.
I always find your articles very informative n bold .ur not afraid of speaking bluntly it may rub some people in a wrong manner but its all very factual.Keep it up"}

Saharanpuri Sahib,
Yes, I have passed through SRE a couple of times - nice big train junction there. I have relatives in the western UP area, but my roots are in Jaipur and southern UP near Agra. Thank you for your kind comments. Speaking bluntly gets me in a lot of trouble on Chowk, but I feel better about shaving myself. :)

tvarad #78 {"Modi being re-elected three times shows that people are sick and tired of Indian Muslim leaders games. "}

TV Air Head,
There is no shortage of excuses that committed right-wing Hindutva type BJP/RSS/VHP/JS/BD/SS/SP orange brigade cheerleaders have in their warchest for killing thousands of Muslims, tearing down Babri Masjid, and electing Modi so many times that he makes Guiliani look like a virgin.

#77 kulharee {"Now questions:
Is this about you or about Benazir? "}

Kala Harry Payee,
Being a lowly commoner I had to use the first person singular. Had I been a vaDera or even a Nawab, I would have said "We." Thanks for your concern. :)

BTW, this is about neither BB nor me. It's about the horrible behavior of her supporters after her sad demise.

Salim_Chauhan "#56 tvarad {"150 million or so Muslims in India who decide to stay and share it's joys and pains will attest to that."}

Tvarad,
Good point, but did you count the ones in Naroda Patya who are no longer around to attest to their share of joy and pain? :("

Tsk. Tsk. Tsk. Just can't get out of your victim mode can you? You see, in India we still have this Mohajiri rump which, after having got a separate country as well as "separate but equal laws", still thinks it's been given a raw deal and so it goads and goads until it gets a Godhra and it's aftermath.

Modi being re-elected three times shows that people are sick and tired of Indian Muslim leaders games.

Salim let me first quote some of your incoherent thoughts: Then ask you one question.
First some quotes:

"… I had been feeling guilty for….. I almost felt ….

….I joined my compatriots in mourning…. I was rudely brought back to reality by ….. grief was not obvious to me.

I started reviewing the short….. …… I sighed with relief as the familiar presence of Pakistani paramilitary forces …."

Now questions:

Is this about you or about Benazir?

Re: # 75

romair, you idiot ! ......

.......stop digging your hole deeper ..... you need to go back and take statistics 101 ..... stop it, before i slap you ...... jeez! .. what a moron !

hamidm mian#: "now we have you with your 1+1=3 math.."

i forgot to put this on slides...i didn't realize that a power point jockey would be reading it......the math is quite straight forward, though perhaps difficult for powerpoint specialists to understand......it is explained below....it requires a bit of division and subtraction.....i hope you haven't forgotten that from your uet days......

......very few pakistanis vote......there is nothing stopping them from voting....they just don't do it....because they have lost faith in any of the leaders.....of those who vote, ppp generally gets 30%.......hence it is quite comical to assume that it has the support of 30% of pakistan.....it has support of 30% of those who vote......which comes out to around 10%+ of the total eligible voters.....

dullabhatti #: "if PP gets 30% of polled votes, with a margin of few percentage points, PPP has 30% of Pakistanis of any age as supporters regardless whether they voted or not."

actually this is not correct.....the fact that so many people do not vote in pakistan is actually an indication that they do not support any of the candidates.....i.e. they have given up on the voting process.......

Re: # 46

Well Salim Chauhan Saab you seem to hv superlative knowledge abt UP towns.Yes I am from Saharanpur but sorry to say that like other places in UP thanks to last 15 year misrule of Mulayam singh Yadav/mayawati/Kalyan singh it has gone to dogs.On the otherside of Jamuna Abdullahpur which was just a village in 1947 has turned out to be much more modern Yamunanagar.Hv u been to SRE or any connection with it.Where does your family roots lie?In SRE we have a huge population of Garha muslims.
I always find your articles very informative n bold .ur not afraid of speaking bluntly it may rub some people in a wrong manner but its all very factual.Keep it up.

there is always this shyte about paki percentages which is comfusing...for a long time there was this thing about 3% religious party vote and now we have lal masjids, dead PM, Swat pulice thanas etc. so lets not get all hung-up about these percentages..if 3% can influence so can 9 or 10

may be a little less than 3 but still..

captain cluleless,

..... quit before some math teacher slaps you silly ! ........ first we had masadi with his mills and boon nonsense and now we have you with your 1+1=3 math ...... you guys are a threat to the development of our children and should be banned from public view ! ..... at this rate we will have poser khalid rearing his ugly head again to torture us with his gibberish .........

bulleya is assuming that only people who are eligible to vote are capable of weeping.:-)

usually the people who stay away from the polls are divided along the poltiical lines very similar to the ones who voted.
if PP gets 30% of polled votes, with a margin of few percentage points, PPP has 30% of Pakistanis of any age as supporters regardless whether they voted or not.

It is a known fact that if the number of people polling in an election goes up, percentages going to various candidates change only marginally....BUT since most elections are decided by margins of 1-2%, it makes a lot of difference to electability of the candidates.

You have to live within 200 meters of a site of a bonfire of private vehicles and, later, private businesses set up by purportedly angry mobs purportedly venting their anguish, to be able to see the sense in what Salim writes.

The muffuking mobs attacked Edhi Centres and amubulances, for crying out loud!!! If these are the awam for which democracy is being fought, please, I'll take the dictator anytime. And don't give me that shyte about how lack of democracy CAUSES these travesties.

Paki redneck:
Salim Chauhan Sahab what an apt description. It should become part of dictionary and apologetic of Killing of Pakistanis should be called Gumashte of Paki redneck.

re. #52 Kamath:

"Yet I give her good marks as she dreamn of installing democracy single handed. "


There is democracy and then there is democracy. So she wanted an end of army rule, and the voice of the people to be heard.

Ah but wait... how much of this was merely self-serving? How much did the voice of the people count in the matter of her own party's (non) democratic make-up? How much did she do for her own peasantry awam in her own fiefdom in Larkana? Universal schooling? Hospitals? Surely she could easily afford it.

As okla99 said somewhere, Political parties in Pakistan are like drug gangs; Pakistan is the turf they fight for; and it's a given that lives will be lost now and then.

Nasah sahib,

(the budbukht Pakistanis of that perpetually self-demeaning land called Pakistan -- did not know what a precious jewel they got -- till they lost it -- and they lost it big.)

I presume u r referring to BB (and I presume people like MKG, ZAB, JLN, possibly even Indira and Rajiv wud be described as jewels). I hope it is our friends across the Radcliffe Line who are blessed with such jewels. I wud settle for a Gujarati Hanud bania version of MAJ (pbuh).

Regards

Someone said on the news the other day, that Pakistanis are very emotional people. I can comprehend that and I know that they are also very patriotic, but why the destructive chaos? I agree with you, Salim, that there was/is no need to plunder the city and innocent people in the name of mourning. Unity, Faith, and Discipline - the 3 talwar's I used to pass by often, seem to be just a symbol from the past. Pakistan mein na unity hai na discipline, magar bohut faith hai... destructive faith it seems.

-zensufi-

Ally #54,
Kardesh Effendi, Nazilsinis,
Thank you for a very heart-warming and sensible message. I agree with you that our collective future lies in coming together as a people. That is exactly why hateful racist remarks like those made by Ghaleezloola BuRbuR and BB (God rest her soul!) are so pernicious to our nation. Even in her death, BB managed to divide us by ethnicity, just as she did when she compared Mohajirs to rats who escape to their hideouts rather than hang around and get shot like brave people.

Hopefully, people will hear your message and stop twisting the ears of the donkey just because they are upset at the dhobi.

#55 bulleya {"if 100 people can vote, and only 33 vote......and out of those 33, 30% go to ppp, then what does that equal 30% of 33 is around 10, if my math is correct......and 10 is 10% of 100...... "}

So, Romair, just tell us very simply - how many of us will have to pay AMT for 2007?

#56 tvarad {"150 million or so Muslims in India who decide to stay and share it's joys and pains will attest to that."}

Tvarad,
Good point, but did you count the ones in Naroda Patya who are no longer around to attest to their share of joy and pain? :(

#58 arjun {"The new video grabs clearly show that benazir was shot. WTF is wrong with the paki government?"}

Arjun,
They are actually very smart. They are copying that lovable Minister of Information from Sadman Houston's regime. Yes, Baghdad Bob looked so amusingly stupid that they went easy on him when the Day of Reckoning came. :)

#53 hamidumdum2 {"as much as i like you and can never get mad at you, i must say that i pity the poor jackass that cariied you into town this morning "}

Hamidumdum Sahib,
You must be feeling sorry about Bubba the Paki redneck. :)

slodhi #50 {"I hope that people of Pak & India will soon get back together & form the United States of India & loose confedration of smaller states independent to run their own lives, with a centralised defense & foreign policy. Monetary policy can be centralised too but i will leave that to the future leaders of the states...
This will give India stability & wil be the answer to all the troubles India is facing today with many states wanting out."}

Lodhi Sahib,
WOW! :) Now, quickly hide before they unite only to shoot at you. :)

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

#49 akhanusa {"Mr Chauhan,
We Indians offer our generosity, goodwill, arms extended in a warm welcome, and supreme affection for your ladies anytime.
Ciao"}

Akhanusa Sahib,
Thank you for your kind gesture. Unfortunately, ever since Meera spread the nasty rumor about you guys, there aren't many takers - except Aroosa Alam and two other ladies with very high mileage. :)

"The real intelligensia like Muhajirs have been totally marginalised They simply migrate to west or middle east.These epeople virtually created Pakistan sacrificed maximum N their leader Liaquat ali mysteroiusly shot in 1951 at the same place where BB was shot.This guy donated all his property including the his own magnificent residence worth crores at Tilak Marg in Delhi which houses Pakistan ambassadors residence(Jinnah cleverly sold his 10 Aurangzeb road house)but to what effect.To be shot like a dog and real culprits were never bought to book."

Don't blame the Sindhis or Punjabis or Pathans or whoever for Mohajiri problems. Mohajirs are "homeless" because they are always running away from imaginary booths and shaithans of their own creation. 150 million or so Muslims in India who decide to stay and share it's joys and pains will attest to that.

anil #: "I cannot say about the weep, but there is certainly a leap. Are you not making an assumption that "voted" voters are uniformly distributed among "eligible" voters, and that 100% of PPP voted? Great leap, Romair."

if 1/3rd of the eligible voters vote, and ppp gets 1/3rd of that, then what percentage of votes does ppp get........

if 100 people can vote, and only 33 vote......and out of those 33, 30% go to ppp, then what does that equal 30% of 33 is around 10, if my math is correct......and 10 is 10% of 100......

hmmm lots to say...

firstly yes we all feel BB loss esp in a humanitarian way... re. the tensions after her loss this is sad, its horrible that punjos and mojos are getting their asses kicked for soemthing they didnt do... didnt the sindhis realise that the supporters at her rallies are also mojos and punjos???

it is true that ppp an bb have wide support throughout pakistan i remember reading a slogan on teh wall 'charo subo ki zancir benazir benazir' in Lahore, she did have support in all provinces... after her demise the way ppl have gone on about punjab needs to do this that and the next thing does nothing other than encite ethnic hatred i just hope and pray to God that we dont find ourselves in the ethnic fighting situation of the 80's and 90's... as much as i dont like the way musharraf has come to power and wants to keep it, at least in his rule (other than b'stan) we havent had this sort of sectarian remarks...

atif2 for once i agree 100% with your post you hit the nail on the head...

aur klifton khala, hasb'e ma'mool aap ke likhe huey se me sau fesad sehmat huN, aap ke durust kehno me danashmandi zahir haiN, khuda sada isse qaim rakhey ameen...

lodhi and akhan usa

what you guys are talking about already exists its called SAARC, and a unified monetary unit has been mentioned called the rupa (like euro) however our ppl will take generations to accept the rupa as common currency from maldives to bhutan...

re Karachi and mqm... mqm may have its base in karachi (not only among mojos now) but it is moving all over pakistan with offices in all provinces altaf bhai has realsied that he can now get votes from other provinces...

karachi in my opinion and experience is no longer a mojo city just like lahore is no longer a punjo only city... my punjo khala moved to karachi after she got married and lived there for 17 years wearing a sari and mainting her (in those days) lovely flat in some leafy karachi suburb (i was too young to remember the name) her kids grew up there and two were born there, they moved to saudia and then back to pak (isloo) they speak urdu like karachiites and speak punjabi only in sarcastic tones to take the piss out of us lot... they still identifiy with karachi just like my punjo cousins born and brought up in london speak english with a cockney accent and identify with london while i with scotland, anyone who has lived there, worked there, and contributed in a positive way to its economy becomes a karachiite regardless of their ethnicity, karachi is a world unto itself and doesnt (cant) belong to anyone ethnicity it is wholly pakistani and represents all the good in pak... unfortunately precisely because of this all of pakistans problems are going to be heightened in karachi too, and it will face the brunt of it in the coming days...

i dont care which ethnicity comes to power in pak, as long as we dont have sectarian violence and the poor ppl of pak actually get some education and health services... i just dont want this horrible punjo/sindhi/mojo/balochi/pathan bs to kick off its the last thing we need on top off all of the bombings etc.

i feel sad looking into the future cause i know either nvash beshareef or ppp will come into power and we will have unpurh pindo rule once again... and unpurh rule is always divisive and this is not what is needed at this moment...

Re: # 42

salim mian,

as much as i like you and can never get mad at you, i must say that i pity the poor jackass that cariied you into town this morning ...... it should have been the other way around - you should have been carrying the poor beast !

"A Sindhi ex-PM gets assassinated in Pindi, Punjab by a Punjabi suicide bomber, probably sent by Pashtun tribals from NWFP, and the PPP goons start murdering and burning Mohajirs in Karachi, Larkana, and Hyderabad. Just because a Mohajir dictator couldn't provide adequate security for her while she voluntarily stuck her neck out of the SUV. "

Salim Chauhan:

These days when there is overwhelming sympathy, tears for Benazir Bhutto (BB), people like to lionize and iconize her. But truth will slowly dawnn on thinking mind as the time goes by. just like after the death of John Kennedy. remember. Much later he was exposed for instance as a skirt chase!

My sympathies goes for her families in this tragedy. But remember BB was a chip of the old bloke-Ali Bhutto. She was pretty demogoguic, she sympathised with militant groups and never dismantled these militant fanatics. She even encouraged Taliban in Pakistan! Once I remember her coming back from Pak-controlled-Kashmir saying Pakistan will fight for Kashmiris for thousand years! There was a retort by then Indian P.M wondering if Pakistan would last 100 years if not 1000!

There was no democracy within PPP structure. She made herself "CHAIRPERSON' for life! , encouraged nepotism, made her husband minister for investment ( 10 percent man)! Now her 19 year son is the Chairperson of the party! 19 year teen ager! Did she really try for Kapda, Makan and roti for the poor of Pakistan?

Now she lies buried in a gleaming white marble mausoleum rivalling those of some vain and notorious Muslim rulers of mideval Hindoostan- that has cost millions of dollars! Go and see in Bijapur in S.India. Today you see in them few tourists and in the evening when light fades, only bats flying around!

Yet I give her good marks as she dremnt of installing democracy single handed. Ummmm!

What a story. Salaaam Yaar, Wa Salaam. Wa salaaam!
Kamath

Salim Chauhan:

These days when there is overwhelming sympathy, tears for Benazir Bhutto (BB), people like to lionize and iconize her. But truth will slowly dawnn on thinking mind as the time goes by. just like after the death of John Kennedy. remember. Much later he was exposed for instance as a skirt chase!

My sympathies goes for her families in this tragedy. But remember BB was a chip of the old bloke-Ali Bhutto. She was pretty demogoguic, she sympathised with militant groups and never dismantled these militant fanatics. She even encouraged Taliban in Pakistan! Once I remember her coming back from Pak-controlled-Kashmir saying Pakistan will fight for Kashmiris for thousand years! There was a retort by then Indian P.M wondering if Pakistan would last 100 years if not 1000!

There was no democracy within PPP structure. She made herself "CHAIRPERSON' for life! , encouraged nepotism, made her husband minister for investment ( 10 percent man)! Now her 19 year son is the Chairperson of the party! 19 year teen ager! Did she really try for Kapda, Makan and roti for the poor of Pakistan?

Now she lies buried in a gleaming white marble mausoleum rivalling those of some vain and notorious Muslim rulers of mideval Hindoostan- that has cost millions of dollars! Go and see in Bijapur in S.India. Today you see in them few tourists and in the evening when light fades, only bats flying around!

Yet I give her good marks as she dremnt of installing democracy single handed. Ummmm!

What a story. Salaaam Yaar, Wa Salaam. Wa salaaam!
Kamath

#45 akhanusa

Well it is an established fact of history that the indian subcontinent has always been one federation. Its boundaries have kept on changing all through its history & 60 or 70 years is not a big deal when you talk about 4000 years of history.

When studying the history of Indian subcontinent you will find that the best form of government it ever had is a federation of Indian States under a strong center. It has always been like that. From Ashoka to Akbar, Indian Sub has always been like this. Smaller sultanates & princely states will take an oath to the strong central ruler. These states were always free to make their own laws according to their own customs. However they have to give the central king a certain amount of money & services & thus will become part of his bigger kingdom. In return the central king will defend them against any agressors.

this way these states were able to concentrate more on their economics, arts & other fields of life & their citizens were happy. each state had to have some sort of army which will become part of the central command and used all over the subc whenever needed.

I am making it look too simple but that was the way it was for almost 4000 years until gora saheb came in & in all their wisdom brought with him the 2 nation theory.

Indian subc was never a country of two nations of green & yellow. It has always been a place where everyone & anyone can live with each other.

In true Indian Subc history there isn't a major war fought on religion (there may be small skirmishes but not a major war). These wars were always for the Real Estate & the resources & people which comes with land. Yes after the British Raj we see many new history books re-written to promote the Raj's agenda to divide the poeple into Hindu Muslim Sikh & Budh.

I hope that people of Pak & India will soon get back together & form the United States of India & loose confedration of smaller states independent to run their own lives, with a centralised defense & foreign policy. Monetary policy can be centralised too but i will leave that to the future leaders of the states.

This will give India stability & wil be the answer to all the troubles India is facing today with many states wanting out.

Mr Chauhan,

We Indians offer our generosity, goodwill, arms extended in a warm welcome, and supreme affection for your ladies anytime.

Ciao

#45 akhanusa {"May Allah destroy Pakistan and unite that "Na Pak" land with Bharat Mata.
(Should Pakistanis get overwhelmed with their Military's brutality, please feel free to contact Indian forces for their liberation.) "}

Dear A Khan USA, A K Hanusa, akh anus a, :)

I am trying to figure you out, but I can't so I give up. Surprisingly, I might even agree with your wish and prayer. However, these things are usually done with generosity, goodwill, arms extended in a warm welcome, and supreme affection. If Bharat Mata is the loving mother, there is no need for the destruction of one of her offsprings. Pakistan is Paak as is Hindustan. :) Pakistan's military is as Indian in blood as the best forces of the Mahabharat, Delhi Sultanate, Mughal Imperial Army, and the Royal Indian Army. Let's not let hatred divide us any further.

#41 slodhi, {"I had the same feeling of sorrow for the first few hours. ..According to her will the among many other things, her hubby & son shall inherit her votebank. Shame. She think of Pakis as inheritable "jaidad", Shame on her & everyone else who from this point want to be affiliated with PPP....Even ZAB will be rolling over in his grave. SHame on BB & rest of the PPP."}

Lodhi Sahib,
Are you representing Sikandar Lodhi in our midst? :) Good nick.
I agree with your sentiments completely. Who doesn't support democracy and who wouldn't want to be on the side of a valiant, charismatic, attractive, well-spoken, well-educated, and brave woman fighting against military dictatorship? I mean that's a no-brainer. Somehow, having gained the mass support of Pakistanis and having served two miserable, incomplete, and divisively bloody terms as PM, she really didn't have a real chance to win - even one that would have been rigged for her benefit.

Saharanpuri #40 {"Well the biggest problem of Pakistan is Feudalism....their leader Liaquat ali mysteroiusly shot in 1951 at the same place where BB was shot...To be shot like a dog and real culprits were never bought to book.
Wonderful stimulating article once again from salim Chauhan "}

Saharanpuri Sahib,
First, let me compliment you on your delightful nomme de plume. Saharanpur, that interesting city on the Jamuna in UP, looking at what was Punjab and is now Haryana. Thank you very much for your appreciation and encouragment.

You said it, my friend. Feudalism is the saddest part of Pakistan's history. It was feudalism that motivated UP, MP, and Bihari Muslims to push for partition and it is feudalism that is tearing Pakistan apart today. Curiously, had Congress been against feudalism in Punjab, Sindh, and Bengal, as it was against this curse in UP, MP, and Bihar, there would have been no partition and probably no feudalism.

Political parties in Pakistan are much like crime families. Benazir's death is quite consistent with how those criminals face their
destiny (Kuttay kuttay hi ke mote murtay hain). I guess, next target for Pakistan Army (code name AlQiada) is either Asif "Mr 10 percent"
or Bilawal "the tender boy". May Allah destroy Pakistan and unite that "Na Pak" land with Bharat Mata.

(Should Pakistanis get overwhelmed with their Military's brutality, please feel free to contact Indian forces for their liberation.)

#39 anil {"...But please don't ask Chowk to go bankrupt from returning money. Gentleman came on his own accord Salim bhai this is called pluralism. ...I enjoyed reading this as much as I enjoy reading your other creations. Already looking forward to more, please do not make me addicted, though."}

Anil Bhai,
Trust me, my friend, I had no intention to have Chowk go bankrupt refunding money to delinquent Chowkies from the cheap seats. :)
Thank you for your kind words and, Anil, if I am addicted to Chowk why should you get any methadone?
Isn't Chowk a wonderful medium, especially when we are far away from home?

anil #37 {"Who is this Almighty. Unless you are ready to make Awam, the Almighty. Problems will stand between you and your goal."}

Anil Bhai,
It certainly isn't Mush or Bush. The Almighty is anyone or anything that you consider the source of all that is good, fair, and just. Since we all have a little divinity in us, you could say that the collective Awam can be designated as an almighty.

My real point, before we get lost in philosophical circles, was that there is retribution for those who instigate violence as a means to attaining momentary gain - Mujib, Bhutto, Indira, Rajiv, Zia, Slobodan, and who knows who's next?

cliftonbridge #35 {"This cycle of hate and violence is the real tragedy."}

My sweet Cliffy,
Indeed, you have narrowed it down. I think that, from what I have heard, people in Karachi are ready to break this cycle. The only problem is that there is nobody reliable or trustworthy to reciprocate from the other side. This horrible orgy of burning and looting really shocked me.

A Sindhi ex-PM gets assassinated in Pindi, Punjab by a Punjabi suicide bomber, probably sent by Pashtun tribals from NWFP, and the PPP goons start murdering and burning Mohajirs in Karachi, Larkana, and Hyderabad. Just because a Mohajir dictator couldn't provide adequate security for her while she voluntarily stuck her neck out of the SUV. :(

Well,
I had the same feeling of sorrow for the first few hours. I am purist when it comes to issues. I think Democracy is the only solution for the people of pak. Does not matter if Ayub, Zia, or Mushy Have done some good things, they have done many bad things too, but they to me are inferior to ZAB, Junejo, BB because no matter how bad they can be they have th guts to go back to the poeple.

Democracy takes time. Look how many time Laloo Parsad can get elected but there will be atime poeple will give up on his trash agenda. If given the chance Pakis will be able to choose the right people like Indians do over a period of time.

BB showed this time that she is dedicate dto the rule of people, however her will turns out to be the stinky fart which exposed her real thoughts.

That will was written by her knowing that she will be killed in a violent way. When confronted with eminent death people show their real behaviour & she showed to the peopel that who she was.

According to her will the among many other things, her hubby & son shall inherit her votebank. Shame. She think of Pakis as inheritable "jaidad", Shame on her & everyone else who from this point want to be affiliated with PPP.

It was another thing that CEC in its meeting on their own accord decided to chose Bilawal, but getting the cahirmanship of the party in inheritance is the most shameful act. Even ZAB will be rolling over in his grave. SHame on BB & rest of the PPP.

In her will she basically told Aitazaz that bhayia, thanks for gpoing to jail many times for the cuse of the poele, I really needed your support to be in power, but you what bhayia, you can not be the next leader of our people, because we need to you be in jail for another few so that beta bilawal can win the election. Shukarya aap kee kurbani ka.

And Amin, oh my darling Amin, how were the good old days when people thought I will be marrying you. And Shukarya for being with me all this time giving me directions and helping me in all these tough time, with your intelectual insight & forsight. However bhayia you dont qualify to be leader of Pakis as you dont have the Bhutto DNA. However please remember that since you are sindhi & if you want to get any benefit as long as sindh remains part of Pakistan then you have to give your support to my son & hubby. Shukarya.


SHAME on BB & PPP of today. SHAME!!!!!!!!

Well the biggest problem of Pakistan is Feudalism.This is the only good thing Nehru did.In Pakistan there cannot be any Lalu Prasad Yadav or Mayawati coming to rule over .All the power is in the hand of chosen few families or Army.It will be better for Pakistan if Kiyani the son of a NCO prevails but then Ayub Khan was also the son of a NCO but not much better.Pakistan is doomed because of feudals ,army and the religious extremeists.The real intelligensia like Muhajirs have been totally marginalised They simply migrate to west or middle east.These epeople virtually created Pakistan sacrificed maximum N their leader Liaquat ali mysteroiusly shot in 1951 at the same place where BB was shot.This guy donated all his property including the his own magnificent residence worth crores at Tilak Marg in Delhi which houses Pakistan ambassadors residence(Jinnah cleverly sold his 10 Aurangzeb road house)but to what effect.To be shot like a dog and real culprits were never bought to book.
Wonderful stimulating article once again from salim Chauhan

Re: # 24

Salim sahib:

"..Chowk Staff,
Please refund this gentleman's money. Thank you. :) ..."

You have arrived, and transform your sentiments quite well. But please don't ask Chowk to go bankrupt from returning money. Gentleman came on his own accord. Salim bhai this is called pluralism. This will make you even better.

I enjoyed reading this as much as I enjoy reading your other creations. Already looking forward to more, please do not make me addicted, though.

Re: # 17

Romair:

"......barely 30-35% of the people vote...out of that ppp gets 30%....so around 10% of the eligible voters is the ppp votebank....even if all of them weep,..."

I cannot say about the weep, but there is certainly a leap. Are you not making an assumption that "voted" voters are uniformly distributed among "eligible" voters, and that 100% of PPP voted? Great leap, Romair.

Re: # 28

Salim Sahib:

"...People who instigate violence for momentary gain are bound to piss off the Almighty...."

Who is this Almighty. Unless you are ready to make Awam, the Almighty. Problems will stand between you and your goal.

Re: # 35

Good advice but unfortunately it is one of the impossibles. A few days ago someone explained the situation in Pakistan with an excellent example. Imagine that Pakistan is a well from where all Pakistanis drink water; it gives them sustenance and a promise of life. But then a dog falls into that well. Now it does not matter how many thousands of buckets of water you pull out of the well, it will remain unclean and unpure as long as the carcass of dead dog is left inside the well. There is absolutely no other way but to get the rotting carcass out of the well if people still want to benefit from it. The carcass of dead dog represents the fouj and especially Musharraf who have ruined the clean water for everyone.

Dog must go.

Darling saleemy,

You are right about the hearts of ordinary pakistani's who have mourned her in all genuineness, despite the horrific consequences of Zardaris national party.

As usual those hearts will now become hardened as we all watch helplessly as the politics of rage seperationism and hatred take over.

I think Pakistani's need to take a breath, search for morality and forgive each other.... as none of us are innocent. This cycle of hate and violence is the real tragedy.

Zeena #1 {"Teri yaad aai teray jaaniy keh baad......"}

Yes,
Terya jaane ke baad teri yaad aayi. Very well stated and to the point emotionally. I have managed to separate my admiration and pain for BB the Dukhtar-e-Pakistan from my memories and anger at Mrs. Zardari, the Saabiq Wazeer-e-Azam of Pakistan.

As a politician, a campaigner, a speaker, she was charismatic, articulate, well-spoken, brilliant, and presented the best face of Pakistan to the world. As a premier, a vaDeri, an autocratic party leader, an ethnic hate-monger, and an administrator she was quite evil and incompetent.

In death, I mourn her for her qualities and what she COULD HAVE accomplished - perhaps if she had married someone more human.

PP has chosen the heir apparent as their new king - congrats to all democrats here.

#2 rf786 {"Salim Sahib,
Not your greatest moments. ..If PPP was disorganized, so was the Govt that has demonstrated its utter and complete incompetence pre and post BB murder. Or, maybe we need more elections before we get some elctoral maturity."}

Bismillah Bhai,
I have had worse ones. :) I agree with your comment about the government. Their incompetence was demonstrated when they stormed the Lal Masjid, which BTW started their steep slide into this quicksand. Maybe even the firing of the CJ earlier was a step in the wrong direction. But then, the comment about MukhtaraaN Mai preceded that - so it does go a ways back. :(

Re: # 21

His math is indeed incorrect because if we go by his math not 10% but 9% of total population vote for PP. He gave you 1% extra.

The calculation is just about seems right assuming that no election is ever rigged. The fact of the matter still is that despite rigging and all, 70% of voting population either remains disenfranchised or has no confidence or stake in the so-called "democratic process".

Zeemax #3 and #4 {"Even before the violence had begun, Aitezaz Ahsan was saying to GEO in a broken voice that Punjab will have a tremendous responsibility in soothing Sindh's feelings because it is the second of their Prime Ministers whom Punjab has sent in a box to them in the dark of the night in a C-130."}

Zee,
My folks back home told me that in LaRkana, Sindhi youths were chanting:

Pakistan ko toRayNge
Punjab ko nahin choRayNge

I agree with you that the PPP has always chanted the "democracy" mantra, but has itself been a hereditary monarchy.

I am disgusted by the violent ethnic twist that the PPP goons have given to this tragedy.

Thank you for your feedback and let's pray for Pakistan.

nasah #6 {"Indeed a 'real surprise' -- It should also tell you right there as to who did it -- shouldn't it?
The rest of the article is pure MQM -- the kettle complaining about the pot!"}

Nasah,
You seem to be connecting some dots, but please stay on the same page. That is one far-reaching leap.
I can't help your bias against the MQM which, BTW, was not mentioned once in the article.

#7 tvarad {"If it worked for Jinnah on January 16th, 1946, the same tactics should work today too, right? You, as a mohajir, should be able to understand it better than anyone."}

TV Airhead,
Touche. Good point. Unfortunately, the joke is on Jinnah - it didn't work then and it won't work now. Just follow Modi until his numerous successes finally expose him for what he is - a demagogue and a charlatan. People who instigate violence for momentary gain are bound to piss off the Almighty.

#9 hamidumdum2 {"salim mian,
shahbash naujawan ! ........ i guess you too could not resist the temptation of throwing gasoline on a burning fire with your silly comment about 'mohajir compassion' and 'urdu logic' .....your intentions are evident ..... shame on you and the jackass you rode in on ! ..... "}

Hamidumdum Sahib,
Shukriya Hazrat - aap ki inaayat he. I take your feedback very seriously - especially when you are somewhat sober. :)
Sir, I wasn't pouring the gasoline on the fire. It was actually the PPP goons pouring the gasoline on poor Mohajirs sitting in buses, cars, and trapped in some factory. Why burning Mohajirs in Karachi for the assassination of BB in Pindi, possibly directed by forces in Wanna Wanna, makes sense is the reason for my own disgust. I thought I was rather restrained in showing my MQM anger at this vulgar behavior in our city. My jackass sends his salaams to you too, my friend - apparently he speaks your language - GHOL MAKHORA.

#10 and #11 okhla99 {"What a crappy article, Salim.
One expected much better from you. Sadly disappointed.
And now, it seems Bilawal will be the new chairman of PPP.... ten percent will be co-chair...."}

Dear Okee from Muskogee :)
I guess you really did feel that way - you posted your disappointment twice! I am deeply sorry.

Chowk Staff,
Please refund Mr. Okhla99's money and without the customary 10%. Thanks

#13 kamath {"Very thoughtful observation and article yaar! Very good!"}

Kamath Sahib,
Thank you, sir, for your encouraging comments. It's so difficult to write when one is mourning in grief as well as vomiting in disgust.

bubba #14 {"Totally racist polarizing views expressed by this person in this article. Sorry chowk staff that you have scooped this low to publish this. "}

Bubba Sahib,
Thank you very much for taking the time out to read this rubbish.

Chowk Staff,
Please refund this gentleman's money. Thank you. :)

#21 hamidumdum2 {"Re: # 17
romair you fool,.... now, let me go and read the rest of your miserable post to see what other gems are hiding there ......."}

Hamidumdum Sahbi,
LOL - I love the way you are able to provide 83% of your response based on reading 11% of his post. It's no wonder that you deserve 116% of my admiration. :)

#16 Urstruly {"I think BB deserved a state funeral with 21 gun salute, coffin draped in national flag and guard of honor."}

Urstruly,
I agree! At least maybe a little bit of dignity in carrying that coffin. I thought I was watching NBA action with an odd-shaped ball. :(

As a former PM and head of government, she definitely deserved the full honors - even Zia got the formal treatment before his journey to hell.

Re: # 17


romair you fool,

.... where did you learn math and statistics? ..... and then you wonder why people don't read your long-winded nonsense !..... "barely 30-35% of the people vote...out of that ppp gets 30%....so around 10% of the eligible voters is the ppp votebank" ........ how did you reach that conclusion - show me your math! ........ if my tenth grader had given me that answer i would have slapped her upside the head and sent her to bed without supper .......... people like you reinforce the horrible hindoos perception that all pakis are fools ! ...... you really are cluless !.....

........ now, let me go and read the rest of your miserable post to see what other gems are hiding there .......

SalmanBKhan #15, {"Salim, most of the people killed, maimed and burnt were Mohajirs...So forget about democracy in Pakistan..It will never happen,period."}

Salman Sahib,
Yes, I noticed that too and the news from family back home seems to confirm your information. :(

"Barq girti he to bechaarey MusalmaanoN per" should be changed to refere to Muhajirs unfortunately. Bengalis got their freedom, Paki soldiers came back home, but our people got over 35 years of exile in their own land.

This time the anger of the PPP goons was also directed against innocent Punjabis.

SalmanBKhan #15, {"Salim, most of the people killed, maimed and burnt were Mohajirs...So forget about democracy in Pakistan..It will never happen,period."}

Salman Sahib,
Yes, I noticed that too and the news from family back home seems to confirm your information. :(

"Barq girti he to bechaarey MusalmaanoN per" should be changed to refere to Muhajirs unfortunately. Bengalis got their freedom, Paki soldiers came back home, but our people got over 35 years of exile in their own land.

This time the anger of the PPP goons was also directed against innocent Punjabis.

atif2 #5 {"I have this feeling that Pakistanis weep, not for their departed leaders, but for themselves and their hopelessness. These ordinary no-name pakistanis, who come out in the street in support of their leaders and get beaten and killed by police, have the least to gain if that leader were to come to power. Yet these leaders, military and feudal, who rule pakistanis with utter disdain and arrogance while living luxurious life, get to secure "martyrdom" too."}

Atif,
Thank you for expressing in a post what I was too chicken to write in my article. Thank you for noticing my sarcastic comment about those "nameless, faceless, ...Pakistanis." After the tears have dried up an