Afghanistan - A Strategic Analysis

And in addition to #536, you tahmed if you feel the urge to accuse me baselessly of lying without providing even ONE example, and repeating the BS that I have not substantiated on my claim that you worship the white man and his shit unconditionally, if you feel the urge to repeat that FLUFF again here on this thread, I suggest you go __ yourself...

tahmed #515, don't try to insult the intelligence of the readers here by merely repeating your BS ad nauseum. You are merely ashamed of your views when they get explicitly exposed so you deny them. I have provided here a url of your article published by chowk which substantiates whatever I wrote about you regarding Iraq and your love of the white man's shit. The other points were well substantiated as well. Your posts stink of an enslaved mind that wants to perpetuate the slavery of our people to the white man, you don't need to be an Einstein to figure that one out and whether you deny it to fool the people as your masters do when they deny their carnage the globe over, it does not prove anything, it only proves that in addition to being a spineless snake you are a lying hypocrite as well.

tahmed #515, don't try to insult the intelligence of the readers here by merely repeating your BS ad nauseum. You are merely ashamed of your views when they get explicitly exposed so you deny them. I have provided here a url of your article published by chowk which substantiates whatever I wrote about you regarding Iraq and your love of the white man's shit. The other points were well substantiated as well. Your posts stink of an enslaved mind that wants to perpetuate the slavery of our people to the white man, you don't need to be an Einstein to figure that one out and whether you deny it to fool the people as your masters do when they deny their carnage the globe over, it does not prove anything, it only proves that in addition to being a spineless snake you are a lying hypocrite as well.

Harimau,

My contention is, patriotism is, more often, a tool for whipping up hatred.

Patriotism was the single biggest factor in motivating the English too.

Now, Do you realize the cost of running a nation state?

Don't you think, the idea of nation state has legtimized:
1. a few individuals' aspirations to rule over others
2. to allow these individuals to convert the people to be the enemies of their enemies.
3. people like MK, Mayawati, Jayalalitha and their malice.

Why should a poor peasant have to pay taxes on all the commodities, without which he would have had more purchasing power, disposable income etc...

Why should a peasant subsidize the lives of war mongerers?

Why do we need a government?
Money spent to have a government running is quite exhorbitant.

Does a government represent all the aspirations of all the people?

Why would an Indian/Pakistani die for somebody's cause?

Would anybody in his right mind want to die for the prejudices of a few individuals on either side of the border?

It is just because he cannot afford a lifestyle that has to pay exhorbitant taxes.

The other day, on a NDTV program that purports to motivate the soldiers, Preity Jinta's army officer brother was introducing the soldiers to her. He took enough effort to be careful to introduce the soldiers by Rajputs, Jats, Marathas etc...I believe they are both names of regiments as well castes. What appalled me was, he dismissively pointed towards south indian soldiers and said 'Madrasis'. He wasn't even looking at them. To rub salt, Preity started doling out Telugu dialogues in a very crude way. It was very insulting.

I dunno if Preity and her family had ever wondered why they deserve all the respect and comforts they are enjoying.

What does it mean to be a patriotic soldier?
To be at the receiving end of condescend?
Why do I have to hate a Pakistani? To safeguard Preity and her ilk?

Harimau,

My contention is, patriotism is, more often, a tool for whipping up hatred.

Patriotism was the single biggest factor in motivating the English too.

Now, Do you realize the cost of running a nation state?

Don't you think, the idea of nation state has legtimized:
1. a few individuals' aspirations to rule over others
2. to allow these individuals to convert the people to be the enemies of their enemies.
3. people like MK, Mayawati, Jayalalitha and their malice.

Why should a poor peasant have to pay taxes on all the commodities, without which he would have had more purchasing power, disposable income etc...

Why should a peasant subsidize the lives of war mongerers?

Why do we need a government?
Money spent to have a government running is quite exhorbitant.

Does a government represent all the aspirations of all the people?

Why would an Indian/Pakistani die for somebody's cause?

Would anybody in his right mind want to die for the prejudices of a few individuals on either side of the border?

It is just because he cannot afford a lifestyle that has to pay exhorbitant taxes.

The other day, on a NDTV program that purports to motivate the soldiers, Preity Jinta's army officer brother was introducing the soldiers to her. He took enough effort to be careful to introduce the soldiers by Rajputs, Jats, Marathas etc...I believe they are both names of regiments as well castes. What appalled me was, he dismissively pointed towards south indian soldiers and said 'Madrasis'. He wasn't even looking at them. To rub salt, Preity started doling out Telugu dialogues in a very crude way. It was very insulting.

I dunno if Preity and her family had ever wondered why they deserve all the respect and comforts they are enjoying.

What does it mean to be a patriotic soldier?
To be at the receiving end of condescend?
Why do I have to hate a Pakistani? To safeguard Preity and her ilk?

Ref vengatramanan #532

[Harimau,

I am not lauding MK's aggrandizing ways. Would a person of similar lineage could have ever aspired for such a coveted post if it had not been for Periyar's activism?]

How about Mayawati in Uttar Prdesh? Nobody there has heard of Periyar. As Periyar himself once said about a Tamil politician, there isn't even a latrine named for Periyar in all of UP. And Thol. Thirumavalavan of Liberation Leopards of Tamil Nadu has as his idol Ambedkar.

[About being anti-nationalistic, I believe this is quite an anachronism. Excessive patriotism has been the world's problem for long. This trick of making the ordinary people jingoistic and getting them, voluntarily, as the 1 line of defense has been the forte of a miniscule % of populace (read ruling elites). I definitely see validity/logic in Periyar's fears.]

So you would be willing to continue to live under British Rule where all the plum jobs went to Englishmen, and admission to educational institutions was strictly on merit (and according to you this gave an unfair advantage to brahmins) but not in an independent India with merit-based admission.

Can you explain your logic?

Harimau,

I am not lauding MK's aggrandizing ways. Would a person of similar lineage could have ever aspired for such a coveted post if it had not been for Periyar's activism?


About being anti-nationalistic, I believe this is quite an anachronism. Excessive patriotism has been the world's problem for long. This trick of making the ordinary people jingoistic and getting them, voluntarily, as the 1 line of defense has been the forte of a miniscule % of populace (read ruling elites). I definitely see validity/logic in Periyar's fears.

Ref vengatramanan #529

[If you are right about MK's lineage, isn't it an achievement or vindication of Periyar's thoughts, considering his position in the state?]

From a website called countercurrents.org which is laudatory about Periyar:

[Periyar declared that 15 August 1947, when India became politically free, was a day of mourning because the event marked, in his opinion, only a transfer of power to the Brahmin - Bania Combine, whose socio-cultural domination, in addition to economic exploitation, would be worse than the British rule.]

Yes, you read it right. Periyar and his cohorts were against the independence of India. In fact, his followers took out a black-flag procession in Madras on Aug 15, 1947.

These anti-Nationalists are your heroes!

Learn the truth about the DMK, DK, Justice Party, etc.

Ig Mehru had not been castrated by his experience as a schoolboy in England, he would have banned these guys and thrown them into jail.

From that to head of Tamil Nadu's government, from being penniless to owner of a fortune estimated to be $2 billion... yeas, it is a great achievement. Built on the stupidity of Masanamuthus like you.

Ref vengatramanan #528

[Periyar fought to abolish devdasi system. You were the guys who benefitted from the devdasi system.]

Periyar did squat about anything. He couldn't get elected dogcatcher in Tamil Nadu...maybe dogcatcher because he dis have some followers. Dr. Muthulakshmi Reddy fought in the Madras State Legislature to abolish the devadasi system.

Of course, according you Dravidian idiots, history of Tamil Nadu began with Periyar, Annadurai and Doctor Artist Leader the Fund of Compassion.

You are on a par with Pakistanis for whom the history of Pakistan began with the invasion of Sindh by Arabs.

Most devadasis were kept as mistresses by rich men who happened to be zamindars who happened to be Golts.

A few descendants of devadasi families were MARRIED by brahmins: MS Subbulakshmi by Sadasivam, Madras Lalithangi (mother of M L Vasanthakumari, famous Carnatic musician) by Ayyaswamy Iyer, and Kamakshi (mother of another famous Carnatic duo Brinda-Muktha) by Soundararaja Iyengar. The first two practically became brahmins and were accepted as such by the community.

You are a clueless idiot who has been so brainwashed by Periyar's Thoughts as carefully selected and propagated by Karunanidhi that there is no hope for you to come out of the fog your brain stem is in.

If you are right about MK's lineage, isn't it an achievement or vindication of Periyar's thoughts, considering his position in the state?

Periyar fought to abolish devdasi system. You were the guys who benefitted from the devdasi system.

Harimau,

I am, indeed, a pachai thamizhan. Pachai/Pasumai/Green refers to young plants. Young plants have green stems and not the trees. Anybody who knows Tamil from his childhood days has to be called a pachai thamizhan.

I am not going to hate your community however you provoke.

Harimau,

(Later, President FA Ahmed (a figurehead), acting on the advice of his council of ministers, declared a state of emergency, and suspended the constitutional articles guaranteeing protection of life and liberty.)

A small digression. When Fakhru signed the Emergency document, the guy was lying sozzled and naked in his bathtub. When he woke up sober he realised what he had done and was heartbroken. The poor fellow udn't live with and soon died of a heart attack.

Btw I am enjoying your shastra-arth with your fellow Southies, us Northies are kind of used to thinking of everyone south of the Vindhyas as homogenous Maddus.

Regards

SRK,

Periyar's mother tongue was Kannada and he was a Naicker (Naidu of present times).

His ancestry could be Telugu too.

Ref SRK #522

[#519 and 520,
FYI, I am a Telugu from Andhra. I asked those questions just out of curiosity and i am not Brahmin too. I am interested in the history of Telugu people in TN, thats why i asked.]

If you are offended by my referring to Telugu people as Goltis, welcome to the world of Harimau where everyone is skewered without regard to race, religion, ethnicity or national origin. I am an Equal Opportunity Abuser.

Read Edgar Thurston's "Castes and Tribes of South India". You will realize that practically it is just the Pallans and Parayans who are true natives of Tamil Nadu and almost everybody else is an immigrant.

Quite a few Goltis came into what is now Tamil Nadu as part of conquering armies of Hoysala and Chalukya kings. Almost all of the big zamindars of Tamil Nadu and poligars (Palayakkarans, those who held fife over wide swathes of the land as rajas) were Goltis, including Kattabomman, a big hero of Tamilians. Tirumalai Nayak and his forebears ruled over the southern kingdom of Madurai.

[I understand that Brahmins in TN suffer due to the reservations. But so much bitterness towards your fellow citizens is not going to do any good for you.]

I abuse the Masanamuthus of Tamil Nadu and expose their stupidity. Little people like them cannot and have not held me back so I have no bitterness.

Ref vengatramanan #498

[Rajaji became the Chief minister due to a constitutional impropriety in 1952.In the 1952 elections Congress Party was reduced to a minority in the State Assembly and the Communist Party of India led coalition appeared to be in a better position to form the Government.[4] But Governor Sri Prakasa nominated Rajaji to the Legislative Council without the advice of the council of ministers and the selection of a nominated member as Chief Minister and further majority was obtained by luring opposition MLA[5] to join the party and Nehru was furious and wrote to Rajaji that" the one thing we must avoid giving is the impression that we stick to office and we want to keep others out at all costs"[6][7] Rajaji refused to contest a bye election and remained a non elected member."]

Quoting Nehru! That is rich. Here is the man who maneuvered to hand over the government of India to his daughter and the country has been fcuked over by his descendants since 1947 and you are quoting him on democracy!

Here is something for you to chew on.

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/dilip_hiro/2007/11/states_of_emergenc y.html

Can there be anything in common between General Pervez Musharraf of Pakistan and the late Indira Gandhi, a democrat who was India's prime minister for 15 years? The intriguing answer is, yes.

A craving for power is the common thread between the two leaders from the Indian sub-continent. It is more than craving; it is an obsession to cling to power at all costs.

There are uncanny parallels between the states of emergency declared by Musharraf on Saturday and Indira Gandhi on June 26 1975. Both of them acted to subvert the verdict of the judiciary, actual or imminent. Both of them raised the spectre of the disintegration of the nation state to justify their draconian decision.

On June 12 1975, an Indian court ruled that Indira Gandhi was guilty of corrupt electoral practices, that her election to parliament was invalid and that she should be barred from contesting elections for six years. Arguing that her Congress party in parliament would need time to choose her successor, she gained a stay order for three weeks.

As she manoeuvred behind the scenes to stay in office, opposition leaders called for nationwide rallies from June 29 onwards to force her to step down. In a pre-dawn swoop on June 26, her government arrested hundreds of prominent opposition and other political leaders. Later, President FA Ahmed (a figurehead), acting on the advice of his council of ministers, declared a state of emergency, and suspended the constitutional articles guaranteeing protection of life and liberty.

Indira Gandhi claimed that "forces of disintegration [are] in full swing". Her government imposed censorship and suspended the habeas corpus. Within six months of the emergency, those jailed without trial exceeded 100,000.

In Pakistan now, the state of emergency declared by Musharraf means the suspension of article nine of the constitution safeguarding life and liberty. Citizens can be arrested without being informed of their offence and denied access to lawyers. The government has shut all private radio and television channels.

In his address to the nation on state-run television, Musharraf justified imposing emergency rule "to preserve the unity of Pakistan".

His high-sounding intent was undermined by no less than the president of the governing Pakistan Muslim League-Qaid-e-Azam (PML-Q), Chaudhry Shujaat Hussain. He told the Guardian that the decision to declare a state of emergency was triggered by fears that the supreme court would rule against Musharraf's election by national and provincial legislatures on October 6 as executive president in a legal appeal.

Hussain disclosed that a "friendly judge" on the supreme court bench passed the information to the government on October 31. "He said the verdict may be unanimous", added Hussain. "The [subsequent] debate was whether to impose emergency before or after [the court ruling]."

How long will the emergency last? "As long as it is necessary," replied Hussain.

This is precisely what happened in June 1975 in India. Nobody knew or could guess the length of the emergency. There was a provision whereby the Indian parliament could extend its five-year term by a year at a time. At Indira Gandhi's behest, it did so, and extended its life beyond 1976.

In January 1977, assured by her elite intelligence agency that her Congress party would win a general election, Indira Gandhi announced a parliamentary poll in March. But it lost heavily, and its defeated candidates included Indira Gandhi.

Thus the parallel continues. Now the timing of the next general election in Pakistan has become the prime subject for speculation by diplomats and analysts alike.