Pakistan's Universities - Problems and Solutions

Re: # 143

philosopher,

..... i did not mean to imply that khadija forced mo to give women the right to own a camel - i was merely pointing out that bedouin women, like khadija, owned camels before mo appeared on the scene ....... personally i think she was the real mastermind and power behind this enterprise - that is why the prophet (pbuh and his camel) didn't dare to mess with another woman as long as she was alive ...... she had his number .... you are free to disagree with my theory, but be nice ....

anyway, back to the issue at hand - i think pakistan needs to focus on providing primary education to its unwashed masses, instead of creating another bureaucracy like the hec that will end up wasting good money on producing 'scholars'like masadi and the guy who wanted to harness the power of jinns to solve the energy cirsis ......

hamidm: actually, it is the washed and starched masses like musharraf that need kindergarten training (Lesson 1: dont fib; Lesson 2: dont try to act like a bully) more than anyone else.

tahmed (#97):

You are assuming too much regarding what I supposedly assumed. Proposing “how” may be all fine and dandy (although I remain unclear on what you mean by "how vs. what") … but …

… to set things in proper context, apply the same reasoning to consumption of wine and pork also. If legal codes adequately address all concerns, then a Muslim should be OK with having pork chops with a glass of wine. I hope the irony is now clear.

PAVO CAVALRY I LIKED UR FOLLOWING POST ON KHALID BHATTI THAT PUNJABI CHAUVINITS ARTICLE:--

the pashtuns of tribal areas are not what Mr Jinnah the founder of Pakistan called "hopeless Punjabis" .You Punjabis were 90 % of Punjab and the Sikhs were using your Badshahi Mosque of Lahore as a Horse Stable and ypu Punjabis had invented the shuttle cock burqa so that your fair sex are not abducted by the Sikhs at will.And the knight in shining armour General Sir Hugh Gough of Bengal Army of English East India Company saved u Punjabi Muslims from being deflowered by the Sikhs.

You Punjabi Muslims cannot be compared with the indomitable tribals.

You Punjabi Muslim troops fored even at the Holy Kabaa.

Azeem Hussain son of Sir Fazl i Hussian himself a Punjabi thus quoted Jinnah " THE PUNJAB IS A HOPELESS PLACE , I WILL NEVER VISIT IT AGAIN" . You Punjabi Lotus Eaters.

In my humble opinion the greatest contribution of Muslim scientists towards science was the formulation of Acids; particularly the Sulphuric and the Hydrochloric acid. The Chemist Jabir Bin Hayan, who is credited with the formulation of many acids and Alkalis may very well be compared to the Bill Gates who revolutionized the Personal Computing with the formulation of Windows. Similarly, Acids and Bases form the matrix on which each and every chemical ever discovered or formulated establishes itself. In Chemical world, even to this day, the progress of a nation is measured by the annual production of Sulphuric Acid in that country.

Re: # 144 GT

There are many sources available on the net thru google, But the site that I suggested was very comprehensive. The subject matter in the website can be divided into three main categories:

1. Law of Inheritance and its basis in Qura'n.

2. The explanation and interpretation of thsi law through hadith.

3. The application of law - explained through hypothetical situations in Q&A form.

This constitution makes it easy for the reader and allows him to go as deep as he wishes or only skim through it if he wishes.

sattar: by "how" i mean the process through which you decide any issue (e.g. whether drinking should be legal or illegal to use your example), whereas the "what" is the decision itself.

In my post below I was addressing the "how", not the "what" on the inheritance issue. Hope this clarifies. And where I stand on "how" is that it should be a democratically elected parliament that is guided by broad, universal principles embedded in the constitution.

Trouble in Pakistan is that the "how" has too often been a dictator's stroke of a pen (as in case of hadood laws e.g.). That is what I have been saying below. Hope this clarifies.

tahmed (#151),

Quranic guidance regarding inheritance is 2:1 between son and daughter (under normal circumstances). I am not sure why there is any need to drag the constitution or parliament into this.

If you think the 2:1 rule violates broad, universal principles, then your issue is with Quran itself that laid out the 2:1 principle in the first place.

However, if you insist on contextualizing Quranic guidance on inheritance by having the parliament decide what is proper, then apply the same principle to consumption of alcohol and pork also. Arguably, having pork chops with a glass of wine does not violate any “broad, universal principles” either; so I am not sure why a Muslim should have any issues with doing so.

Dear Urstruly,

Thanks once again. The article (and related debate) had to do with proportions, I do not see "algebra" being discussed. Am I on the right page?

Re: # 152 sattar2

''However, if you insist on contextualizing Quranic guidance on inheritance by having the parliament decide what is proper, then apply the same principle to consumption of alcohol and pork also. Arguably, having pork chops with a glass of wine does not violate any “broad, universal principles” either; so I am not sure why a Muslim should have any issues with doing so''

Agreed. you are agreeing with exactly my point that you disagreed with me here....

http://chowk.com/interacts/12085/1/0/416#329511

my interact no is #807 in reply to tahmed2

i reproduce it here.
tahmed sahib

(((I respect your views...and this is perhaps the first time i have come to know what you really stand for....i partially agree with what you said...

But tahmed ji the problem is that `given the nature of our faith`s social dimension, we cannot completely ignore the CONTENT of islamic social philosophy and its ideological dimension.....your views and practices are ideal and admirable on personal level but ,on the social level, how would we ignore other principles of islam???? The principles you are taliking about are very generalised kind of values and can be quite ambigeous and misleading unless they are described in the context of that Ideological system.

Islam has its own comprehensive and `all-inclusive` system....Along with those broad principles what distinguish from other religions and ideologies is that it has CATEGORICAL DESCRIPTION of those BROADER principles...and we cannot ignore IT... even though there is great room for reforms and `ijtehaad` within that `mutable content` but nothing can be accomodated in the framework of islam beyond the CATEGORICAL DESCRIPTION of those `mutable aspects` and the basic core pricnciples....that`s the reason why even Iqbal believes in an islamic ideological system...)

Re: # 153 GT

Oh no, they are not discussing algebra there. The intent of posting that website was to show the mathematical complexity one comes across when dealing with the execution of Law of Inheritence. Algebraic expressions can make these complexities easy to solve; and that was the engine that drove Muslim mathematicians to evolve Algebra. Interestingly enough the alphabet used in Arabic (and Urdu) to this date to represent the unknown quantity "x" (in English) is the alphabet "Laa". The "Laa" in Arabic is also used as a word to say "no", "nothing", or "unknown"

Re: # 142 Hamidm Sahib,
Actually stupidity is far more prevalent, and on constant display, amongst the mindless and vile opponents of Islam.

I do not have enough knowledge of medical sciences. I can either honestly admit it and leave medical issues to those who do have sufficient knowledge; or I can thump my chest, claim to be an expert, and put my ignorance and stupidity on display, in order to win brownie points from those in the crowd who are equally, or even more, prejudiced against medical sciences. The choice, in the end, is mine alone.

While it is generous of you to so concede, there is really no need to convince me that there are idiots among the "Liberty" University crowd. I have known for a long time that there are, in fact, mostly idiots at "Liberty" University and other similar institutions.

Peace.

#155 Posted by Urstruly

Urstruly,

I get you. From the article what I get is that; (a) laws are set; (b) the laws are complex. The Talmudic debate, which I beieve occered say around 400-500 years later have a bit more to do with "fairness" as understood by different scholars. Given my understanding of the article referred by you, what I would be more interested in is: How did Muslim scholars/lawmakers rule on the division of the "residual" (i.e. that proportion left over, in cases where there was a left over, after calculating the shares as directed by the Koran).

Thanks once again.

Re: # 136 Tahmed

"...By focussing on the substance of the Quran..."
Which version do you subscribe to: the modern Arabic, or the San'aa manuscripts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sana'a_manuscripts)?
Thanks

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

Re: # 156

viqram mian,

...... every community has its idiots but the mohammedans have more than their fair share ... as a matter of fact it is hard to find many sane people among the believers - even the best among us suffer from paranoia, schizophrenia and low self-esteem ........

....... if we spend half as much time studying algebra as we spend on discussing who invented algebra we would be much better off ...... any muslim child can rattle off a dozen names of muslim scholars but can't tell his elbow from a hole in the ground ....... what a waste !