Pakistan's Universities - Problems and Solutions

Re: # 59
Moslems use green does not imply Green is absolutely patented to moslems.

Do we still have to stick on to the perception that a person becomes eligible to be called a scientist or given infrastructure to do research or can be employed by R&Ds only if he scores well in his exams, gets enough degrees and have a PhD?

Re: # 66 no but these are just first level indicators ...after that it is upto him//her to show their ability.

You cannot just pluck someone off the streets....

Re: # 67

You cannot just pluck someone off the streets....

We do not have to, but why not provide chances to people who would want to? Why do we have to disqualify somebody just because he lacked the skills to regurgitate the concepts from a text book?

Is research not an incremental knowledge acquisition?

Re: # 62

The word "algebra" emerged from the branch of mathematics called "Al Jabr al Muqabla" by Arab mathematicians. The phrase could roughly be translated as "Equations and comparitors". Algebra came into being as a necessity to solve the mathematical problems faced by the people of that time while deciding on the Muslim Inheritence Law, that prescribes several portions of inheritence to be disburesed among survivors of a deceased, instead of a disbursement through a will. However, one thrid of the inheritence can be bequethed through a will; the two-thrid is disbursed thru fixed portions.

Dr Hoodbhoy, I really appreciate your deconstruction of the claims made by the HEC. As one of my teacher says "I have never seen a revolutionary build the likes of what he destroys". To build something we need craftsmen but to destroy, anyone with a hammer will do". Getting to the point where as you are proficient at pointing out the obvious weaknesses of the project undertaken by the HEC, your suggestions are far from perfect.
Thoughts expressed in the article are very much the stock for intellectuals in Pakistan who are pushing for engineering and sciences in a country that today is need of poets and social scientists, writers, and dramatists. Like many others for you the problem with Pakistan is its material progress, whereas, in truth the problems lies somewhere else. Our culture is dying, a culture which was full of beauty,wisdom, mercy, magnanimity, love, and patience. Individuals pushing for the sciences are the head of this project of throwing out the baby with the bath water .. anglophiles, colonized mentalities, lacking the critical eye which they claim they are promoting. An eye that is incapable of looking beyond the surface.
We are in desperate need of cultural craftsmen who can stop this deathly dance towards destruction, immorality and selfishness ...
What you fail to mention is that the HEC is sending many to study non-engineering subjects, we have historians, sociologists and anthropologists ... these disciplines now need to take center stage .. the engineers have just made a mess of things .. their world view is that just by having more we will be able to fix all the problems. The reality is that our country has the resources but it is distributed with injustice ... we need people to start a movement to awaken our collective conscience ..

And what you suggest will just make the situation worse .. resouces wasted again .. another dead end.

dilsenomad.wordpress.com

urstruly,

"Algebra came into being as a necessity to solve the mathematical problems faced by the people of that time while deciding on the Muslim Inheritence Law"

......... this is just precious ! ........ if it hadn't been for islam, mankind wouldn't have come up with algebra ..... maybe that is why muslims didn't invent toilet paper - we still make do with stones .....

This is what our discourse looks like .. ridicule .. this is the level of discussion. You have not given an argument against the claim made about the origins of algebra. Making fun about the argument is not answering the argument. Read what historians have to say about this question. The statement made is inline with serious scholarly work done by historians .. but our modern colonized mind can only respond with ridicule.

Anyways, what Dr Hoodboy said has elements of truth to it, what he suggests are good short term strategies .. but I only wanted to point out the a reductionist view of the problem will not get is anywhere ... we need to be critical of the western science as much as our own traiditional understandings .. it would be disingenuous to apply critical rigour to one and not the other ..

Re: # 72

dilsenomad,

.... who invented what a thousand years ago is totally irrelevant ..... why are muslims so eager to prove they invented this or that when today most of them are running around butt-naked while chewing on a stick? .... the fact of the matter is that in the last six seven huhdred years muslims have been beaten at every field of human endevour - arts, science, sports and basket weaving ........ like the silly african americans who are anxious to prove that the ancient egyptians were negroes, or get all excited over their ancestor who invented the tooth pick, mohammedans get all worked up over bedouins and persians who could read and write a thousand years ago ....... get over it !

.....what matters is what you are doing now - other than perfecting the art of suicide bombing and washing smelly feet in public restrooms ...........

#69 Posted by Urstruly:

Urstruly, very very interesting. And Hamid, at least shut up here for you may end looking like a fool here. I know about extremely complicated computations regarding Jewish inheritence laws as put forth in the Talmud. These solutions can be seen as the "nucleolous" of a game. Applications of such solution concepts are now widely prevalent in computation and genetics. So Urstruly may have a point here. I would like to know about references to debates on such laws in Islam. Urstruly ... I will be very grateful (English translations if possible please otherwise Arabic etc. would do).

Re: # 74

GT,

... so you blame the poor jews for our silly inheritance laws ?........ how muslim !

Re: # 74 GT

The following website explains the Muslim Law of Inheritence in quite a detail. When you go down the page to the mathematical computation part of it, you will understand why and how Algebra had to be invented.
http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/text.asp?type=article& aid=14

Re: # 73
:)
Again I would say your understanding is based on very reductionist understandings, you should be aware of the fact that the majority of the Muslims condemn suicide bombings. The bombings are a result of a break from our traditional Islamic understandings .. and giving into the pseudo modernism many individuals espouse to .. yes in some human endeavours like you mention Muslims are not worthy of mention but the most important human endeavour is being human, my friend. And many in the glorious west are lagging far behind in this. People to this day appreciate the humanity of Muslims, for a change read and see what others have to say about their experiences in the Muslim world .. dont make an idol out of your own thoughts .. like the true modern person, be self critical and engender humility so you learn. Like socrates said: All i know is I know nothing.

If you love the west be like those in the West who are enlightened. Read history bro, many of the Muslim lands have been colonized by the west and they are still recovering.

Give us time and once again we will reign supreme because of our moral integrity and tolerance.

Re: # 77
Another thing .. yes, the west did create the noble television, which is now the strongest narcotic; yes the west did invent the internet and now the most successful business on the net are pornsites .. they certainly have liberated women; yes the west did surely, make scientific progress, ask peopple from Hiroshima how they have benefitted.

Modern man has been able to control the resources of the planet but has not matured spiritually and in his arrogance fails to see this problem ..

you need algebra to figure out that every son gets twice what every daughter gets? and "muslim laws of inheritance" were advanced for their age, and pointed in the direction of greater rights for women.

if one follows the spirit of the Quran, the logic would be to bring laws up to date and give equal amounts to sons and daughters.

But "muslims" in Pakistan follow the Quranic injunctions the way Musharraf follows the Constitution - violate its basic spirit, take selective parts out of it when convenient, add where material if even selected parts are missing, and give the pretense of following the rules by giving detailed references.

Musharraf abuses the Constitution the way Maulvis abuse Islam.

Re: # 77

I think you are new on chowk. But you will also figure out that it is better to hit your head against a fast moving truch than arguing with hamidm. In case you are wondering who he is; he is the person sitting at the very right in white dress in this panel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Vtx8JOF9AI

how do you argue with him?