Bullhe Shah and His Veil of “Meem”

Re: # 200 Bitterladdu

Abdur Rashid Gangohi says

that on Mairaj Prophet peace be upon him went and came back
By GOd if i had gone would have not come back


Sufi is for self and Prophet peace be upon him and his true follower Ulema are for humanity.

Come out of mentality of frog of a well and learn to accept vastness of an ocean and if can not accept this at least grow up and respect others for your own respect. Your Karma may be bitter and frustrated , but it is not for others always!

Re: # 222

"Furhter more why Indians are bent upon always to check things on the bases of theri own terms and consdier themselves the msot educated ones on the surface of earth from times immemorial?"

Mahfari Saheb ,

This steroetype is a prejudice you have been taught in you schools. This official 'untruth' makes to completely unperceptive to what I am talking about as an idolator.
I have said - I REPAEAT- the formless cannot be even talked about . but experienced (Prokshanubhuti) in silence.
I do not have claim to 'truth' because I cannot even speak about the 'truth'.

Let us hope you and other Pakistanis can understand this without filtering it through the Islamic blinkers and prejudices laid by the Pak Studies.

Re: # 225

"Sufi is for self and Prophet peace be upon him and his true follower Ulema are for humanity. "

That is the biggest scandal of humanity- every religious person wants to save other souls - and never doubting if his own karmas would save him or not!!
Mohammad's karma would have got him any way - there is no doubt about the "narak" he is in even now..he is not in the jail as an under-trial waiting for Qayamat.....he is now suffering and he is making all other momeens suffer with him by influencing them to do all sorts of evil things in the name of Islam.

"human experience the only source of morality etc...."

That clarifies the problem. You just don't, even remotely, think like a Muslim :(

tahmed#217:

We have been around this mulberry bush before, haven't we? Urstruly, naqshbandi, sattar, massadi, zeemax, hamidm, you (and yours truly, although that may not count) have all read the quran and have come away with a different understanding of its core message. Now, that won't be a problem, if one were to accept an authoritative interpretation of the core message; but here we are up against a huge problem, as according to you, Islam does not allow any intermediaries and we cannot depend upon the interpretation of those claiming to be the ulema of Islam. Therefore, OBL's interpretation of the Quranic message is as valid as that of the Mufti of Al Azhar or of Massadi or your own.

Re: # 223

Really!! Is that all it said; wonderful!

Distort the truth and cherry pick all you like; it also says something about beating up wives if they are disobedient, it also allows polygamy (for men only though + whatever "one's right hand gets"), half of the inheritence and value on testimony for women, Jihad/Qitaal against the non-believers................................................................... ............................do you really want me to go on.

I have already said believe in fairies all you like; just keep that to yourself and don't expect someone else to just go along on YOUR hunch.

It is not I who needs to read it like a man not a parrot mate. The only reason more than 95% of any given religions' adherents think that is THE ONLY WAY is because it is what they learnt from their families/societies/parents/teachers. There is only a very small minority, in the greater scheme of things, that would convert, in one direction or another. People delude themselves in thinking that they have really given it a "free-thought", when they revert back to the faith of their immediate ancestors; in one shape or another.

The reason Sufism is becoming popular, especially amongst Muslims in the west, is that it is more palatable and keeps that continuity going.

Islam can only survive as "Deen-e-Ghalib"; that is exactly why we are discussing it now. That is how it has survived through the centuries. It was never a "personal" belief as we use that term these days. These are the dilemmas the Muslim diaspora, especially in the west, seems to be facing. Everyone one talks to would say,"this is not my Islam" or "my Islam doesn't teach this", or "I am a muslim but don't think like that". It goes on forever.

By the way, when I first wrote on this site, I did so with a series of questions. I don't remember any one addressing those. (#49)

Re # 222

First cousin marriages are practised by more than 80% of the Lebanese Muslim community residing in Australia. They are the largest Lebanes community outside the country. I have also been related similar statistics by Egyptians and Somalis living in the UK.

Re: # 228

Hey mullahji,

Who decides who is a muslim or not? You mullahji??

Sufis are "better" muslims than the so called sarkari Ulemas.

Sufis' wali is superior to prophet anyway- not to speak about that pedophile charlatan claiming to be a prophet!!

#218 Posted by Eklavya,

You can be used happily, and become a Jihadi (most ignorant people, my chowk experience tells me, tend to be the biggest and 'blindest' jihadis, in their own silly, but very effective, ways :)).

Our good friend tahmed32 is the biggest and the most tirelessly committed Jihadi I've ever seen.

But he would never know how it's possible, nor can anyone explain the 'how' to him. (-;

A better article by Asghar Ali Engineer- All Pakis must read this.

http://www.indianmuslims.info/articles/asghar_ali_engineer/articles/suf ism_its_origin_and_impact_on_indian_islam.html

I FOUND THIS ON THE NET THAT APTLY AND SUCCINTLY ELABORATES ON WHAT SOME OF THE CONTRIBUTERS HAVE BASICALLY PROVEN TO ME TO BE TRUE!! Enjoy! I did!


Dear brothers and sisters in islam:

We live in kuffar country and daily we have to face the infidels who criticize islam and our prophet, and who want to debate us. In an Islamic country if some one did that all we have to do is to announce loudly what he said and the rest is taken care of by an angry mob. The critic is lynched in no time. End of the story. However here we don't have that luxury as yet. Inshallah in forseeble future after we grow by conversions of morons and criminals in prisons, legal and illegal immigration and procreation we will,inshallah, become a majority and will not have to face this problem on daily basis. However, for the time being following is an approach all muslim brothers and sisters can use when faced with such a pest. Jazakallah Khair. Inshallah the vermin will steer clear of you in future.


1. A popular question is "why islam calls for death of Islamic critics and apostates". Insist that their info is false. Quote aya "to you your religion and to me my religion".

2. To answer "Islam spread with sword", say that it is a big lie spread by the jews and hindus and that quran clearly says " there is no compulsion in religion".

3. If some one quotes violent ayas from Koran, accuse him of quoting ayas in bits and pieces and cherry picking .

4. If he then quotes full ayas and ayas before and after, than insist that the translation is wrong.

5. If he brings ten different translations than say correct meanings can be understood only by reading Quran in Arabic.

6. If he happens to be well versed in Arabic language than insist that those ayas don't mean what they appear to mean as they have allegorical meanings.

7. If he is adamant, than say you cannot understand those ayas and it's context without reading hadith and sira.

8.. If he shows up with the hadiths and siras in hand and quotes the context of the violent ayas by referring to hadiths of prophet's rapes, robberies , assassinations and genocides then insist that "all hadiths and siras are heresay and are false, and only truth is in quran.

9. If he says Quran is a man made document and wants proof of it's divinity then refer to the sciences in Quran and the book written by Dr. Bucaile confirming the sciences in our holy book. You can also quote that Mahatama Gandhi read Quran daily and also spoke highly of it.

10. If he says that Bucaile was on Saudi payroll and that nor he nor Gandhi ever changed their religions and that Bucaile was challenged and proven wrong by many experts then challenge him to ask his experts to debate islamists like Zakir Naik..

11. If the pests still hangs around then change the topic and find faults in other religions and their books.

12. If he continues on then use personal attacks and insult him by calling him a jewish a- hole , a Chinese pig or a hindu dog .

13. If that does not frustrate him, then ask him how much he is being paid by jews to throw dirt on Al Islam.

14. If he still does not stop then run for his mother and sister and use very filthy language.

15. If he is very stubborn and wants to continue, then curse him like "Burn in hell, you will repent on last day, Allah will get you in your grave" etc

16. When all of the above has failed, threaten him with bodily harm and end the debate by drum beating and announcing that you won the debate hands down because Koran is the word of allah.

17. If possible anounce about this debate in an islamist website and that you had won it handily. Such announcements do wonders for the iman of muslim website readers and for dawah operations in prisons to convince low IQ prisoners of the truth of Al Islam.

eklavya#186:

"This kind of irrational attachment to land is nothing but the product of a particular way of thinking"

Our friend echoboom once said that the Hindu is attached to the land while the Muslim is attached to his religion. I think that he was on to something.

I haven't read the interact on Bhera (it's too long) but can relate to the feelings expressed there. Many chowkies will recall my own series of my nostalgic visit to my place of birth.

Bhera, apparently, did not have a very good repuation in the surrounding districts on Punjab. My mother used to quote an old saying,

Pind bhera tay miyani, hatth laguni tay jaani
(you only know how dangerous bhera people are once you come in close contact with them)
But that did not prevent my mother from getting her daughters-in-law from a Bhera background; their womenfolk are feisty but also quite beautiful.

And when a murtid punk like akcheema is asked how come he's willing to believe Abraham sacrificed his sons because the scriptures say so, but at the same time not willing to believe he was 90+ because the same scriptures say so - then start googling for something to avoid having to answer or write some inane stuff about personal eating habits.

“Hindu is attached to the land while the Muslim is attached to his religion”

Muslim is attached to a “foreign religion”… that makes him less attached to the land, culture and customs….of his forefathers..

This dual allegiance .. make leaves a muslim little confused…

#236 Posted by dost_mittar,

Yeah he had said hindus were 'Dharti Dharmis'.

Re: # 238 Dear allegiance of a Muslim is to ideas not to forefathers or to customs!