Voting For Change

#428 mera pakistan: "sure we can predict."

Only if you are 17 years old (at that age you think you are invincible, as my dentist told me about his daughter who would not give up smoking). As you grow older, you gradually lose these God-like qualities of being invincibile and being able to foretell the future..

laddu: "Over whelming Pakistanis would accept their LAl Masjid Mullah over Bulley Shah when it comes to Islam."

i have given you enough statistics, evidence, election results and history to convince most people......however, if you just don't want to be convinced, then, all i can say is best of luck in your beliefs and views on pakistan......

no one complained about lal masjid crowd getting kicked out of las masjid.....everyone in pakistan supported it.....people only complained, when the brutal military action was taken....an odd pakistani (like hamidm2 and a few others on this) thought it was the birth of a new pakistan, when the lal masjid was attacked and clapped with both hands and two feet......(i hope they know better now).....but nearly everyone else opposed it.....i was one of the biggest opposers of those actions......even though i think the lal masjid leadership (not the naive students) should be tried for treason and perhaps, even be given the death penalty, for brainwashing all these students into death.......

can you tell me any political entity which is right of the religious parties in pakistan that has ever, in its 60 years history, had any support......kindly name one......if you cannot then i am afraid you are clutching to long held biased straws, and cannot convince yourself that pakistan is not what is portrayed in indian media.....

the only political entity that is to the right of religious parties and/or is militant is sipah-e-sahaba......they had one seat they would win from jhang.....now they don't even win that.......

while sufiana islam is so popular in pakistan that the whole political spectrum of pakistan is dominated by the great-great-great grandsons of these pirs and sufis, despite the fact that these great-grandsons are massive crooks and opportunists.......however, just because their names are attached to baha-ud-din zakaria and what not, they win in landslides.....

trust me, if bulley shah had gotten married and had a living descendant today, he would have swept elections in qasur, even if he was a corrupt womanizer......

Re: # 425

tahmed says, "No one can predict how this will play out. But we can at least be clear in our own minds on what is right and what is wrong"

I disagree, sure we can predict. I just wrote the reasons that what are the reasons of not restoring the judiciary, as the restored judiciary will come back and haunt AZ/NS, and I guess any sensible person would know that the independent judiciary would not be benefical for these Waderas and Industrialist.

NS just said that to get the votes from people, and once again Pakistani Awam got fooled by him. These chors show awam "Sabz Baagh", but when they come in power, only then awam see their real face.

#416 Posted by MantoLives on February 22, 2008 4:20:49 am


Given that most Pakistanis still adhere to Barelvi Sunni and popular Islam and given that most Pakistanis always rejected Deobandi-


If that were true, your dad would be buried in a muslim graveyard, not a special ahmedi graveyard...

remember your army's motto: jihad by the way of allah...

sounds very sufi to me..

ananth#423 political parties in a democratic system are beholden to the people. hope this puts your concerns for the welfare of pakistanis to rest.

#422 No one can predict how this will play out. But we can at least be clear in our own minds on what is right and what is wrong.

And what is right is that the rule of law (the pipe in which the "kuttay ki dums" are kept reasonably straight, to use your analogy) needs to be restored. And if NS is saying this loud and clear, then he deserves to be applauded by everyone interested in a strong, stable, Pakistan that is not subject to the personal wishes of dictators.

#395 We Pakistanis sometimes get too involved in things noman can see ("what is going inside X's head", "hidden hands", "agla jehaan") than in things we actually can see. Thus, in politics, what is important is not what is going on in anyone's head, but in where the political dynamics are headed.

#421
"That is why the rule of law is job 1."......

rule of law is possiible in Pakistan only if Pakistan does not bow to pressures from Saudi and US....

Sending its deposed President to be kept in "house arrest" in saudi.... is the lowest point in Pakistan history... worst than kala paani

Re: # 421

I would like to have a $20 bet that there would be NO Restoration of Judges. Just give AZ and NS one month to form their government, they will forget all the promises.

Restoration of judges means No NRO for AZ which is going to open lot of corruption and criminal cases against Zardari, at the same time corruption cases on NS and Supreme Court attack and famous fraud schemes like Yellow Cab, Qarz Uttaro, Mulk Sanwaro etc...

Just watch as the dust settle.

#419 but..as long as the "kuttay ki dum" is in a pipe (i.e. a democratic system based on laws), rather than outside the pipe (as musharraf has set himself up to be), then it remains straight. :-)

That is why the rule of law is job 1. So, I support AZ/NS not because I am unaware of their past misdeeds - but because at this critical time in Pakistan's history they are calling for what Pakistan badly needs - the restoration of the constitution, restoration of the chief justice. in other words, restoration of the pipe in which "kuttay ki dums" (politicians) can be kept reasonably straight.

#395 #400 #419

The only question that matters right now in Pakistan is:
What is going on INSIDE the mind of Nawaz at this moment?

Is he the same that he was in the 90s, or has he changed?

Is he going to watch Zardari self-destruct from the sidelines?

Is he going to put the weight of WOT on PPP and come in later as Emir of Pakistan? Or, is he sincere?

Re: # 415
tahmed,

I guess, hum ko baar baar Bewaqoof banney ki Aadat ho gai hai. Are you serioous? do u expect Mr.10% and Ameer-ul-Momaneen to deliver this?

NS did everything actually worse, what Musharraf did. NS put the curb on media, he tried to introduce Shariat law. He kidnapped Najam Sethi thru Police. He launched attacks on Supreme court. He ordered attack on jang group newspaper. He hijacked the plane with over 100 souls sitting in it. He sacked 2 Army Staff and a Cheif Justice, not to mention NS did all of this when there was no Media or freedom of Speech in Pakistan. You could have never said against the PM of Pakistan at that time. If you did, you would have been kidnapped. Khabarnama used to start with NS name and ends on his name too, and the list is endless, and dont think I am making this up, if you want proof, I can post the links too.

About Zardari, I dont have to say much. Just google Mr.10% and you can see the Kartoots of him (Badnaam-e-Zamana) .

I dont expect them to behave at this time either. "Kuttey ki Dum 100 Saal tak bhi pipe mein rakho, Jab nikalo gay woh Terhi hee rahey gi"

Zmax I have reservation for sartaj Aziz name , he is the same person who advised to freeze accounts of people and every body could recall consequences of his decision

Re: # 416

Manto ji,

There is certainly a perception that out of the mullahs, it is only the sarkari mullahs who perhaps supported Bulley Shahi action on Lal Masjid have lost in the elections, and the Awaam supported thse mullahs who opposed Bulley Shahi dictum on Lal Masjid.

Musharaff is one of the most hated in the awaam probably because he supported Bulley Shah's dictum of demolishing the Lal Masjid!!

So, I think most of the Pakistanis have still not provided a correct analyses of the extent of support to mullahs who are more radical than the sarkari ones.

Laddu,

Given that most Pakistanis still adhere to Barelvi Sunni and popular Islam and given that most Pakistanis always rejected Deobandi-sts (who were in bed with you guys anyway) at the pols... your comments are way out of line.

Bulley Shah is and will always be Pakistan's most popular sufi poet... and it was Bulley Shah's followers in Kasur who rejected the Deobandi Mullahs in 1937, 1946, 1970, 1977, 1985, 1988, 1990, 1997, 2002 and 2007...

Without the contributions of Sufis in mobilizing Punjabi and Sindhi Muslims against the Unionist regime, Pakistan would not even exist.

zeemax #398 I saw a bit of the press conference too over geo. It seemed to me that both were quite comfortable with their roles as party chairmen, with AZ actually saying that this role demanded enough time and attention that he could not do justice to it by heading the government as well.

After all - both of them have in a sense been through hell (jail and exile respectively), and seem to have learnt some much needed lessons (i.e. that being prime minister is not everything by any means).

The interesting thing is that PPP and PML are in fact two very different parties - the former has its organizational base in rural areas, the latter in urban areas. AZ has a landlord background, NS has a capitalist background. Between the two of them, the could do a lot of good for Pakistan in the years ahead. Let us pray God gives them the wisdom to do that.