The Deoband Declaration on Terrorism: Why Now?

Hindus in India forget their castes only at the time of riots.India is now indirectly ruled by the Muslims.Their tactical voting n huge multiplication in population resulting in huge vote bank selects the party in power .Its only a matter of time before they directly rule India.

I believe there's a general sentiment among India's Muslims to want the Union to work. What other choice is there? This is also what gives the Congress its strenght. They know(always have known) we have no other option but to coexist peacefully.
And, any good action should be commended, regardless of the motive.

saharanpuri:

I don't think that any Indian Muslim is thinking of flying green flag atop the red fort. All they want is to able to exercise the rights guaranteed to them in the Indian constitution; nothing more, nothing less.

Bloc voting is not limited to muslims, various castes and other groups do it as well. Even in the US democratic primaries, blacks are voting en bloc for obama and hispanics for Hilary. It's all part of democracy.

Look#2:

Indian Muslims do have choices and they are exercising it, this is why the Congress is worried. In the post-babri masjid period, Muslims have been voting strategically on a constituency basis to vote for the Candidate with the best chance of defeating the BJP candidate. This will continue. The best Congress can hope for is for Muslims to vote for it when the choice is between non-bjp candidates.

yar sahranpuri most indian muslims want to live and let live...they are mostly trying to get better just like most hindus or sikhs or jains. there is no plan of red fort etc. incidentlly are you in paper trade (being sahranpuri an all..).. i personally know a lot of indian muslims and while they are indeed struggling withe the affliction of religion (just like hindoos or jains or sikhs) they are thinking folks . some even do yoga and meditation..go figure.

IMO at this point in time indian non-muslims and indian muslims do not have differing aspirations.

Nicely written yet speculative commentary. The conference only restates the position of Islamic rulings and thoughts of those concerned on the issue of terrorism, for the general understanding of specially those who are not literate on the position of Islamic rulings that discourage violence and violent acts committed in the name of Islam and commonly observed in today's world while blamed on the faith of Islam and it's followers in a stereotype effort.

I think there has always been a divergence of views between Debandis in India and Deobandi-offshoots in Pakistan. I remember in 2001 prior to 911, when the leader of Indian Deoband Maulana Marghoob visited Pakistan for a Deobandi conference, he openly criticized the Taleban for destroying Buddha carvings in Bamian. This criticism was not welcomed by Maulana Fazlur Rahmman of JUI in Pakistan. The Indian Muslims at the time were cognizant of the fact that they could not criticize the destruction of Babri Masjid while at the same time turn a blind eye to the destruction of Buddha statues. Don't forget that Maulana Husain Ahmad Madani of Deoband and the pre-independence JUI-Hind were supporters of a united India and collaborated with Congress rather than the Muslim League. The Muslim League was mainly supported by secular Muslims in its quest for Pakistan. About the only notable Maulana that openly supported Pakistan Muslim League was Maulana Shabbir Ahmad Usmani who became the leader of JUI-Pakistan. He was clearly a small minority among the Indian ulema. The Indian ulema have always been pro-united India and continue to believe in peaceful co-existence with non-Muslims as taught by Islam.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 1
It is not such. India is now ruled by regional sentiments. Moslems are getting more than what they deserve. But that is viotebank politics, which we call democracy. In states like Orissa, Jharkhand, Uttaranchal, Nagaland, Mijoram etc... moslem presence is very less. Why BJP is not able to hold power there. Key to success is good governance. BJP is good on paper, when comes to administration, they have failed to bring radical changes in cow belt states like Rajasthan, MP, UP. If BJP was not able to consolidate so called Hindutwa vote bank in cow belt, it is due to V P Sing. The OBJ vote, which was with BJP is taken away by parties like Laloo and Mulayam.
Coming back to the topics, Deobands etc...should have been banned in India. Why this mediaval barbarism, in the heart of India? Nehru & Congress fresh from the shock it has received during partition (I think most of the Congress leaders have not expected such level of violence), had tried to pacify remaining part of moslems with this kind of carrot.

Muslim population increase may not be a planned activity. How a muslim family in Karala related to a muslim family in Bihar? The population increase is largely due to backwardness in mentality. Whatever rise of islam ocurred in India and Bangladesh, started in middle of 80s, largely due to middle east petro dollar. The process had started in Pakistan long back, and so, they are suffering little earlier. Bangladesh and India is the next Pakistan. Crude oil has touched 100US$. Do you think huge profit from the rising price is used to sponsor reserch projects in Stanford, MIT? Nope.

Whether DM agrees or not, Islam was never a peaceful theology. The history of Persia, Sindh etc...tells different story. Now, the peaceful islam is invention of Nehru and it's followers in post independent India. Noted Bengali authors tells different story (Banking Chatterjee, Rabindranath Tagore). Some people try to brush aside these people, as they have received enough patronage from British rulers, that they may distort history. But, how can you explain the animosity of Gujjus against moslems? Marathis against moslems? Problems in Karnataka? I know large amount of folk stories in Karnataka, which is totally opposite to what History book in India teaches. Most of our books largely concentrate on British period and try to paint that period in negative way. In practice, we follow the rule and institutes created by British people. Furthermore, I can see evidence of islamic barbarism in Hampi, Thirupati etc...

jang#5

"IMO at this point in time indian non-muslims and indian muslims do not have differing aspirations"

Could agree with you as far as domestic issues are concerned. Not too sure about foreign policy issues.

izuber$7:

Speculative, yes. But would you call it reasonable speculation?

RiazHaq#7:

Thanks for pointing out to the difference between the Pak and Indian deobandis. In addition to the old deobandi-nationalist muslim relationship, the two outfits are facing two different situations and have therefore to adjust their positions accordingly. At the same conference in Pakistan, I recall that the Indian deobandis prevented the passage of a resolution on kashmir.

nkg#8:

In what sense are the muslims getting more than their share in India? Certainly not a greater share in the army, police, bureaucracy or economic pie in general,

#9,10:
Why should deobandis be banned and not other religious organizations? If you are suggesting that India should have not been a secular country, that would be a separate issue.

I never said that Islam is a peaceful ideology. Would you say that Hinduism is a peaceful ideology?

Dost mittar an interesting article and interesting observations.

What I find interesting (similar to your observation) in the declarations is that the typical islamic/muslim rationalisation for terror has been toned down. But the collective heads have not been removed from the sand - (your para immediately after the quote from the declaration).

The mullahs and the ulema et al are a worried lot in India. They are finding that their flock is slowly flying the coop, and spreading their wings (as jang has put it rather nicely in #5). Also these same mullahs ulema and moolies and maalis are seeing what #1 says and they want to be in the driving seat. That is why they have changed tune, just enuf to keep their home flock happy, and just enuf not to worry their ummahite hommies from arby (that is why no condemnation of the attack on the sovereign parliament).

The sooner these mullahs et al are put in collars and sent to a remote inaccessible hermitage the better it is for all concerned.

Re: # 14
I have doubt about the term Hinduism ...
Coming to Deoband...What output India is getting from this? It was the institution, which has fought for Khilafat movement. Have ever Congress thought about the dangerous consequence of this?

Muslims are enjoying more freedom than minorities in muslim countries. They have right to establish their own academic institutions and formulate their sylabus. The fund flow is also not monitored. Furthermore,Govt, sponsors this mediaval middle east stuff in many of the states. Have the state tried to idenify why? Is it our basic culture, which needs to be preserved? No. I feel, Govt. should do that for tribals like Bheel, Kole, Santhals, Garo etc... people. Instead, they are more concerned about moslems. May be large vote bank. When, a separate country is created in the name of this culture, what for we need to keep this useless stuff? Why Govt. has to waste money on Urdoo, when Sanskrit needs more patronage (this language has given us the identity in literature. The first language with grammer. Earliest epic created using the literature. If China, Israel can promote their language, why not us) ? If you are talking about the same rhetoric (moslems are under represented in IAS,IPS, IITs etc...), I have the same answer for this. There is no historic evidence of systemic oppression on moslems. If you are fit for the job, prove it. Every institution is ready to pick the best person for the job. Furthermore, a separate country is created for moslems. Why we need to provide separate privilege as minority to these people? Isn't this sounds rediculous? In fact, Patel was firmly against it. Actual ethnic minorities like Anglo Indians, Persians, Jews never complain about discrimnation or special law to protect their cultural identity.

Nkg,

(It was the institution, which has fought for Khilafat movement. Have ever Congress thought about the dangerous consequence of this?)

Exactly!!! That's why some Pakis (like Yasser) and Hindoos (like me) are staunchly pro-MAJ (pbuh) and anti-MKG.

It may be of some interest to you that Deoband was by and large opposed to partition and Pakistan.

Regards

Re: # 17 do also perchance wear kashaaye angavastram!

Re: # 17

How does the support for Khilafat movement negate MKG's all other contributions? You would have to take into account the paradigm shifts that have taken place from MKG's khilafat supporting time to the time you have typed. I never knew that you are the mythical Markandeyan.


Did MKG choose to support the Khilafat movement as an act of contriving against a section of populace or his school of thought might not allowed him to see the euphemistic ideas, of the movement, that would morph in the future?

Dash_Dot:

One wishes that they had at least used "terrorism in the name of jihad/islam", but with 10,000 delegates representing different viewpoints, I guess this kind of diluted statement is all one could expect.

nkg:

This issue has been thrashed at chowk several times. I may agree with some of the points you make. But don't blame muslims for what Gandhi-Nehru did. As kaalchakra says repeatedly, Paksitan solved its communal problem in 1947 but our karta-dhartas did not. Too late now; we have to follow the constitutions, or else change the constitution.

Wah Mitter!

Pakistan solved communal problems just as Idi Amin solved problem of human suffering by cooking him and eating. Pakistan solved it by declaring itself utra Islamic state .. making religious minority third class citizens who do not right to protect their own daughters.

Wah Chor machaye Shor!

Come on, guru ji, you worry too much about daughters. Something has to happen to them, why not marry them off to the majority community?

guru ji, Pakistan has a MUCH better model of dealing with minorities, as evidenced in the relative peace between the majority and minority communities there, and the significantly higher level of minority satisfaction levels in Pakistan. (Before you ask if I have measured their level of satisfaction, I have certainly not heard them complain as much as our minorities.)

We in India need to immediately adopt the Pakistani model. That would be better for everybody and will avoid long-term problems.

eklavya#23:

"We in India need to immediately adopt the Pakistani model."

Not so fast, eklavya bhayya, you might end up losing your other thumb as well.

It's difficult to snatch even a toy from a child once you have given it to him and you are talking about a community which knows how to defend its rights. Even the weasly Hindus in Srilanka and Malaysia are protesting when their rights are being taken from them. In India, you would have a full fledged jihad, this time supported if not sponsored by darul uloom itself, if you try to impose something unacceptable to them. The majority community will be best served by accepting the settlement bequeathed to them by their netas.

Kaal bhai,

(Pakistan has a MUCH better model of dealing with minorities)

True. Get rid of the minorities, you get rid of the minority problem as well.

Regards

Kaal bhai,

Further to #25.

There is no guarantee that Proposition #25 wud solve the minority problems. New minorities can always be generated!!!

Regards

Re: # 23

"We in India need to immediately adopt the Pakistani model. That would be better for everybody and will avoid long-term problems."

Kaale Khan Saheb,

What is that Pakistani model??

Pandit Ladduji Maharaj,

(What is that Pakistani model?? )

Explained in #25. Get rid of minorities, get rid of minority problem as well.

Regards

majumdar#25:

"Get rid of the minorities, you get rid of the minority problem as well."

Two errors. Pakistan did not solve its minority problem, only communal problem, with "communal" as it is understood in India.

Secondly, Pakistan did not get rid of its minority "community". If you understand Urdu, its solution is best described by the urdu expression "tadapnay ki ijaazzat hai Na furyaad ki hai".

DM sahib,

When I was referring to minority problem I was referring to its "religious minority" problem and I am sure Kaal bhai too was referring to the same. I am sure he cannot be unaware that Pakistan has hardly had a great track record in dealing with LINGUISTIC minorities.

(Pakistan did not get rid of its minority "community". )

Well they did reduce the religious minority pop to 3% (from c.20% before 1947) which is not a bad achievement by any means, although not as good as Ataturk sahib's Turkey.

Regards

majumdar#30:

When I said "communal" as it is understood in India, it relates primarily to hindu-sikh-muslim thingy. Problems beween arya samajis and sanatanis or between sunnis and shias fall into sectarian category.

In Pakistan, you still have a sizeable number, around 5 million people belonging to minorities and that proportion has remained constant since early fifties. It's not the numbers but the "terms of endearment" that is important. Unless in India, minorities in Pakistan were never promised a rose garden, MAJ's August 1947 long-concealed speech notwithstanding.

Re: # 31

How did Pakistan solve its communal problem???

By turning into an Islamic state??

How the dhimmi-model is superior to the "sarva-dharma-sambhav" secular model??

DM sahib,

If India's minorities happened to be 3% of the population and that too divided between 2-3 groups of 1% each, they too wud not have complained (too much) about discrimination even if they had been promised the rose garden.

Btw it is not as if Paki minorities have not raised their voice against discrimination only since their voices are very small they ain't heard.

Regards

PS: Thanx for referring to my (and Yasser's) fave speech.

Ref nkg #16

[Actual ethnic minorities like Anglo Indians, Persians, Jews never complain about discrimnation or special law to protect their cultural identity.]

That is because they have not perfected the art of whining "They made me do it. Poor me! Woe unto me" the way Muslims have done for 1400 years.

Nor did they have that pseudo-Hindu Jwahirullah Nehru espousing their cause.

Ref dost_mittar #31

[Unless in India, minorities in Pakistan were never promised a rose garden, MAJ's August 1947 long-concealed speech notwithstanding.]

Jinnah-bhai knew exactly what fate awaited the minorities in Pakistan. He said they would be hostages who would ensure the good treatment of Muslims left behind in India.

Yaaser, dear boy, come on; pipe up on this issue.

Ref dost_mittar #4

[Indian Muslims do have choices and they are exercising it, this is why the Congress is worried. In the post-babri masjid period, Muslims have been voting strategically on a constituency basis to vote for the Candidate with the best chance of defeating the BJP candidate. This will continue. The best Congress can hope for is for Muslims to vote for it when the choice is between non-bjp candidates.]

Congress is the new Muslim League of India!

majumdar#33:

I have been reading Pakistani newspapers for over ten years now. The only minority voices being raised are that of Christians, the voices on behalf of Hindus are also raised, but not by them but by human rights or the PPP activists based in Sindh.

Ref dost_mittar #14

[In what sense are the muslims getting more than their share in India? Certainly not a greater share in the army, police, bureaucracy or economic pie in general]

They can compete for it if they want. Why should they be given quotas for being retarded Arab-wannabe's?

ISlamIslam#35:

I don't know about Jinnah but Maulana Maudoodi was quite consistent. He said that Muslims should accept the status of shudras/malechha in India just as Hindus should accept dhimmi status in Pakistan.
So, give some credit to islamists for being consistent.

[why do you make your name so difficult to spell correctly?]

ISlamIslam#36:

"They can compete for it if they want. Why should they be given quotas for being retarded Arab-wannabe's?"

How do they compete in the "approach" department?

Dost-Mittar writes [I think that the Congress Party has taken the decision to go ahead with the Indo-US nuclear deal despite the staunch opposition to it by the Communist parties...]

Sonia Gandhi has declared that there will be no elections this year. That means no nuclear treaty with the US and China and its fifth-column in India will be happy.

Minority members of the Pakistan National Assembly have alleged that Hindus were being hounded and humiliated to force them to leave Pakistan.[9] Hindu women have been known to be victims of kidnapping and forced conversion to Islam.[10] Krishan Bheel, a Hindu member of the National Assembly of Pakistan, came into news recently for manhandling Qari Gul Rehman.[11]

Hindus in what is now Pakistan have declined from 23 % of the total population in 1947 to less than 2% today. The report condemns Pakistan for systematic state-sponsored religious discrimination against Hindus through bigoted "anti-blasphemy" laws. It documents numerous reports of millions of Hindus being held as "bonded laborers" in slavery-like conditions in rural Pakistan, something repeatedly ignored by the Pakistani government.

Kidnap Hindu, Force Marriage to Muslim
January 04, 2007 12:00 PM EST




Sanao Menghwar has had three of his daughters kidnapped, then forced to marry Muslim men. That means that the young women were coerced into becoming Islamics.

This happens daily, particularly in the Pakistani Sindh province, according to Hasan Mansoor, reporter, Midday.com.

Other Hindus in the province worry when their daughters will disappear. Therefore, there are entire Hindu families leaving Pakistan for Canada, India or other nations.Menghewar and his wife left their house on errands. When they returned to their residence, their daughters were missing. They reported the missing young women to the police department, filing the necessary papers. Neighbors helped them on a search party to locate the daughters, but to no avail.

Menghwar’s daughters have yet to be found. However, authorities have arrested three Islamic young men assumed to be connected with the girls’ kidnapping. The men have been released on bail by a court due to the men being minors.

"’Kidnapping Hindu girls like this has become a normal practice. The girls are then forced to sign stamp papers stating that they’ve become Muslims,’ says Laljee Menghwar, a member of the Hindu Panchayat in Karachi."

Because of extremist Muslim threats, Hindus have had to turn to what those in the Netherlands are resorting to. Both areas have been under extreme pressure from maiming and killing Islamics so that the local citizens have put into action what one person refers to as "self-censorship."

There is no talk. There is no public utterance. There is nothing said negatively about the Muslims in the area for fear of being slain.

So it is that extremist Islamic killers international could overtake country after country, area after area. Instill such fear in the people that no one speaks the facts concerning local extremist Islamics kidnapping and killing; therefore, they have open skies to do just that — more so.

"’Hindus here are too frightened to vent their anger — they fear victimization,’ said one local."

KIDNAPPING GIRLS AND FORCIBLY CONVERTING THEM TO ISLAM

Jan 2006: Sindh's Stolen Brides : Hindu Girls Forced into Islam
Hindus continue to be the target of kidnappings, rape, and intimidation in Pakistan. There are reports of desecration and destruction of Hindu temples and lands, theft and looting of Hindu property, discrimination, abuse, and abduction of Hindu females.

Violence towards Hindu Women
A worrisome trend in Pakistan, particularly in the Sindh province, is that of Muslims kidnapping Hindu girls and forcing them to convert to Islam. One of the most egregious cases of intimidation and kidnapping of young Hindu women occurred in September 2005. On September 14, Hindu parents alleged that four men abducted their daughter in Sindh, and forced her to marry one of the accused and convert to Islam. The authorities arrested two of the abductors, but the court dismissed the case when the girl was forced to provide a legal statement that she willfully married and converted. Gayan Chand Singh, a legislator in Pakistan’s Parliament, said that the kidnapping should be categorized as rape and should be registered as such an offense for the abductors.

In a similar case, Sapna Giyanchand was taken to a shrine in the Shikarpur District by Shamsuddin Dasti, a Muslim married man and father. She was converted to Islam, her name changed and married to a Muslim man. When Sapna’s case was presented in court, Muslim extremists deluged her with rose petals and chanted religious sayings. Sapna, terrified by the setting, could not manage to speak to her parents, who were also present in court. Aziz, also in attendance, is claimed to have said, “How can a Muslim girl live and maintain contact with kafirs ?”

In a recent investigative report it is described how young girls, as young as 12 or 13, have been kidnapped in Sindh, converted to Islam, and forcibly married to Muslim boys. Kidnapping Hindu girls like this has become a normal practice. The girls are then forced to sign stamp[ed] papers stating that they’ve become Muslims. At least 19 similar abduction cases have taken place in Karachi alone, and 6 in the Jacobabad and Larkana districts. Wasim Shahzad, the Minister of State for Interior, upset legislators in the National Assembly when he was quoted by the state-run APP news agency as saying, “These incidents are taking place to force the Hindus to leave Pakistan where they have been living for the past 5,000 years.”

In a shocking incident, it was reported that three young Hindu girls had suddenly coverted to Islam. The three girls, Reena (21), Usha (19) and Rima (17) – daughters of Sanno Amra and Champa, a Hindu couple living in the Punjab Colony section of Karachi, Pakistan – went missing on October 18, 2005. Only after desperate queries to the police, the parents received affidavits stating the daughters’ conversions to Islam. Private visits with their daughters, free from chaperones and even police officers that have supervised their only interactions thus far, have been consistently denied. After their disappearance from home, the girls have been living at a madrassa (Islamic seminary) in the vicinity of their home and may potentially be denied the freedom to return home.

ISlamIslam#41:

That is, of course, yesterday's news. Let's see what the news channels are saying today. The Congress is flip-flopping so often on this issue that it is difficult to know what is going to happen.

Hindus in Pakistan allege humiliation

B. Muralidhar Reddy

An abducted Hindu girl married one of her abductors and embraced Islam

ISLAMABAD: Minority members of the Pakistan National Assembly have alleged that Hindus were being hounded and humiliated to force them to leave Pakistan.

They were taking part in a discussion on a calling attention motion on the abduction of a Hindu girl in Sindh province who has since married one of her four abductors and embraced Islam.

Responding to the motion, Minister of State for Interior Wasim Shahzad said the girl was abducted on September 14 and a case was registered the same day. "Two of the four abductors were arrested," he said.

The Minister said the girl gave a statement in the court that she has married one of the abductors and embraced Islam at Dargah Amrit Sharif. "In the light of her statement the court dismissed the case."

"Sensitive issue"

A member, Gyan Chand Singh, however, said her kidnapping fell in the category of rape and a case should be registered against the abductors. "It is a very sensitive issue which brings a bad name to the country," he said.

The Minister said the case was registered the same day the girl was abducted. "Everything is clear now after her statement in the court," he said.

Another member, Krishan Bheel, said many Hindu men were being kidnapped for ransom in Sindh.

"These incidents are taking place to force Hindus to leave Pakistan where they have been living for the past 5000 years," he said.

Another member, Ramesh Lal, claimed that the abducted girl was only 17 years old and she was not an adult. "According to Hindu laws a girl cannot marry till she is 20," he said.

Mr. Gyan Chand said that in view of the nature of the issue, a house committee should be formed to sort out such matters.

laddu#42:

So, you are disproving ek's and my theory; hindus are now able to whine in Pakistan.

Hindus targeted in Balochistan

Minorities, particularly Hindus and Ahmadiyas, continue to face a wave of violations in Balochistan, the area where Pakistan conducted its nuclear tests on the orders of President Musharraf in October 1999. The native Baluchs experience a severely degraded status since the occupation. Although the exact number is unknown, more than 5,000 Hindus were forced to escape from the unrest in Balochistan and enter Sindh in 2005. Militant Muslim groups have desecrated Hindu temples, set their homes on fire, and destroyed Hindu shops and property. Here too, Hindu females, particularly school students, are forcibly converted to Islam.[lxxxvii]



On March 21, 2005, sixty civilians were killed and one hundred and fifty were injured in Dera Bugti, Balochistan when Pakistan’s Frontier Corps attacked the town with “artillery shelling, rockets, and indiscriminate machine gun fire.” Among those killed were innocent Hindu women and children as well as dozens of Bugti tribesmen.[lxxxviii]
Depiction of Hinduism in School Textbooks

Extracts (translated from Urdu to English) from the government-sponsored textbooks approved by the National Curriculum Wing of the Federal Ministry of Education demonstrate the derogatory and inflammatory portrayal of Hinduism to the youth of Pakistan:[lxxxix]



· Grade IV: “The religion of Hindus did not teach them good things, [and the] Hindus did not respect women.”

· Grade V: “The Hindu has always been an enemy of Islam.”

· Grade VI: “The Hindu setup was based on injustice and cruelty.”

· Grade VII: “Hindus always desired to crush the Muslims as a nation [and] several attempts were made by the Hindus to erase Muslim culture and civilization.”

· Grade VIII: “Before Islam people lived in untold misery all over the world.”

· Grade X: “Islam gives a message of peace and brotherhood…There is no such concept in Hinduism.”

Ref dost_mittar #40

[How do they compete in the "approach" department?]

What do you mean by that?

IAS, IPS, etc., are based on competitive examinations. Two years backm the District Superintendent of Police in Nagapattinam district was a Muslim. He has since been transferred to some other post.

Syed Munir Hoda is a Secretary in the Tamil Nadu state government, close to Docgtor Artist Leader the Fund of Compassion. From his name, one would guess he is not Hindu, Christian, Sikh or Jain, leaving only one conclusion as to his religion.

Let these fcukers study in a regular school rather than in madrassahs and go compete with Hindus the way Christians, Jains and Sikhs do. Shhesh, most Hindus in Tamil Nadu want their kids to study in Christian schools, knowing that the nuns and monks would instill strong discipline in them.

Re: # 47

In the age of internet it is not possible for Islamic states to HIDE their prosecution of kafir population (whatever is left of after the slaughter and assault).

Hindus feel the heat in Pakistan
Riaz Sohail
BBC News, Karachi

Kidnap victim Garish Kumar
Wealthy Hindus like Garish Kumar are targets for kidnappers
The kidnap and murder of a Hindu engineer in Pakistan's southern province of Sindh has increased the insecurity among fellow Hindus.

Garish Kumar disappeared last month near Hyderabad city, 250 km (160 miles) from the port city of Karachi in Sindh.

His dismembered body parts were later found near a madrassa (Islamic religious school).

Police initially said the crime was committed by an outlawed Muslim militant group. Five people were arrested.

However, Hyderabad's police chief, Shaukat Shah, the incident now seems to be a simple kidnapping for ransom case.

Minority report

Kumar's father, Saspal Das, is a trader from Kunri town in Sindh's central district of Umerkot.

Poor Hindus in Sindh
Most Hindus are poor peasants and serve as bonded labour

"No one listens to the Hindu minority," he complains. ""We have no security.

"We are targeted because we are Hindu. There is no other reason for kidnapping Garish."

Pakistan is home to some 2.5 million Hindus, 95% of them living in the southern Sindh province.

Most are poor, low-caste peasants.

However there are also some successful upper caste businessmen. In Sindh, they are a hot commodity for bandits.

They lack the protection afforded to local tribal Muslims.

Whole tribes often go to war with one another in rural Sindh over any slight to their members.

That cushion is not available to the Hindu minority.

Protection money

In recent years kidnapping for ransom and armed robberies have multiplied in the area and Hindus have increasingly been the focus of attacks.

Hindu men
Hindus have to pay thousands of pounds to avoid kidnapping

Many pay protection money regularly to local gangs or influential figures. But in spite of this they are still targeted.

Santosh Kumar, a rice trader from Larkana town in upper Sindh, and his two brothers were kidnapped in separate incidents in 2006. They were later released after paying a huge ransom.

Another wealthy trader from the nearby city of Sukkur in Sindh, Sundeep Kumar, was kidnapped in 2005.

He was released after paying a ransom of over a million rupees ($16,000), according to local sources.

The ransom can sometimes go up to five times that amount.

But not all Hindus are as rich as Sundeep Kumar.

Last August, a youth, Ramesh Lal, was kidnapped. His relatives could not afford the ransom, and his body was later found at a police check post.

In the last three years at least five Hindu traders have been killed after being kidnapped or offering resistance.

"Powerful oppress the weak"

Ramesh Lal, a Hindu MP in Pakistan's parliament says, "The Hindus are not as rich as portrayed."

"Often the kidnappers ask a huge amount that the families cannot pay. As a result the hostages are killed."

Hindu women
Even Hindu women and children are not spared by the kidnappers

The President of the Hindu council in Sukkur district, Mukhi Aishwar Lal says, "the powerful always oppress weaker communities... Hindus are weak so they are targeted."

He relates how a few years back a Hindu family travelling by local bus were kidnapped by local bandits, while rest of the passengers were allowed to go.

Around that time some foreigners were also kidnapped in the same area. The police secured their release without any payment, but the Hindus were released after a huge ransom was doled out.

Such incidents increase the feeling among Hindus that they have no say in power and authority in the country.

Political apartheid

In Pakistan's political system, the minorities, such as Hindus, Christians and Sikhs, remain outcasts despite represented in every major political party.

After Gen Pervez Musharraf seized power in 1999, he scrapped the controversial separate electorate system introduced former dictator Gen Zia-ul-Haq in 1980s.

Under the separate electorate system, non-Muslims could only vote for candidates of their own religion. Seats were reserved for minorities in the national and provincial assemblies.

Critics said Muslim candidates no longer had any incentive to pay attention to the aspirations of the minorities.

Gen Musharraf hoped to reverse that by the simple step of abolishing the system. But that appears to have failed.

Sudham Chand, a Hindu community leader who led a local campaign to scrap the separate electorate system was killed in broad daylight. His murder conveyed many a message.

The killers were not arrested. His brother later migrated to India.

Ramesh Lal, a member of the National Assembly, says that the restoration of the conventional electoral system is of little use if the minorities have no security.

And still, he complains, no one asks the minorities what problems they are suffering.

Losing faith

Mukhi Aishwar Lal agrees that Hindus in Sindh are still afraid.

Saspal Das
Garish Kumar's grieving father, Saspal, wants justice

They are frightened to move outside freely. Some even put themselves under a self-imposed curfew after 2000 hours a few months ago.

"No-one is targeting the minorities," argues Kishanchand Parwani, Advisor for Minorities' Affairs to the Sindh Government.

But he admits that, although the minorities are supposed to be equal citizens according to the constitution, the reality is different. He accepts that they feel like second class citizens.

Garish Kumar's father, Saspal Das, still retains faith in the system: "I will fight till I get justice for my son."

But many Hindu families who stayed in Pakistan after partition have already lost faith and migrated to India

This BBC report provides the correct evaluation of Hindus in Pakistan-

"Pakistan is home to some 2.5 million Hindus, 95% of them living in the southern Sindh province.

Most are poor, low-caste peasants.

However there are also some successful upper caste businessmen. In Sindh, they are a hot commodity for bandits.

They lack the protection afforded to local tribal Muslims."

Hindus are dhimmi slaves , bonded labours or under protection of momeen goons!!
That is the way Pakistan has SOLVED the communal problem.

ISlamIslam#49:

May not be for IAS or IPS but you would perhaps agree that approach is needed for lower level posts.

And don't be simplistic about madrassas; Indian madrassas can be quite good; in fact, a report last week showed that Madrassa Board students show a 91% success rate, better than any other board than ICSE;

"Bihar madrassa board next only to ICSE: Report
25 Feb 2008, 0157 hrs IST,TNN

MUMBAI: Here's something for Maharashtra Navanirman Sena's Raj Thackeray as well as his uncle and inspiration, the founder of Shiv Sena, Bal Thackeray, to chew on: If class X students from across the country were to take a common exam, who would perform the best?

Believe it or not, students from Bihar's madrassa board would stand high, second only to students of the ICSE board in Delhi.

Comparing the performance of educational boards across India, the HRD ministry has just released a report on student performance in various states in class X.

The results have the Council for the Indian School Certificate Examination in Delhi topping with the highest pass percentage of 94.3%, followed by Bihar State Madrassa Board with a success rate of 91.4%. The Central Board of Secondary Education, Delhi, stands third with a pass percentage of 86.4%.

The report compares 2005 data across the country. Madhav Chavan, founder of educational non-profit Pratham, said the findings contradict the "stereotype that madrassas are religious training schools". It vindicates "the historical view" that a voluntary process of education that involves progressive elements in a society coming forward to educate the backward sections often results in a successful model for formal education, he said.

Unlike other boards with a large student base, both the ICSE and madrassa boards have lower student populations taking the exam. States like Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh, Karnataka, West Bengal have lakhs of students sitting for the class X exam.

Peggy Mohan, a linguist and a former JNU professor, said that the madrassa board, being run on a smaller scale, was probably more flexible than such "regimented state boards".

Some experts countered that boards handling lakhs of students see a diverse mix whose results may vary on the basis of several factors. Basanti Roy, divisional secretary of Mumbai, Maharashtra State Board of Secondary and Higher Secondary Education, said of the approximately 15 lakh students who took the class X exam in the state, a large population came from the rural hinterland which lacked good teachers.

The state board thus enjoyed higher success rates in smaller, urban pockets."

laddu#various:

Do you think that it is possible to find several cases of Muslim persecution in India as well? Just go to any Indian Muslim website, such as Milligazette.

Re: # 54

Dm ji,

That was a tu quoque fallacy.

Yes, there are cases of minority prosecution in India. But that is irrelevant to the argument.

I just refuted your and Kaale Khan's suggestion that Pakistan or Islam SOLVES the communal problem!!!

laddu#56:

One might say that Hindus have now started whining because of 8 years of "enlightened Islam" rule Of Musharraf.

Re: # 21
The foundation of Indian Constitution is very good. Special privilege and protection for ethnic minorities should be part of a decent democracy. But, that should not include moslems, sikhs, christians. Some ethnic groups in north east, who are very few in number, should enjoy such privilege. Instead of protecting their rights and cultural identity, we are busy promoting mediaval middle east culture (Islam/Christianity). Now, the actual vulnerable groups are struggling to survive its culture against Christian missionaries. RSS has also joined the bandwagon. Orissa, Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh , MP. The identification of minority was the basic problem. I have heard that J N's father was clerk under a moslem lawyear. So, he had to pay gratitude towards moslems.
I am not blaming muslims for their problem. But, the social condition, what we have inherited from British, was not better. Those who were ahead during that period, they have benifitted more. Muslim backwardness was an issue during British period also.
Coming back to Deoband, do we need it now? What is the implication of this fatwa? Does police, court, parliament recognise it?
DM, you were talking about Tamils in Srilanka and Malayasia. In these countries, Tamils are discriminated. Even if Tamils are less in number, they do not want any favour. The same rule should apply for every citizen in these countries. Backwardness of native Sinhalese and Malays has prompted the Govt. to adopt such policy ( preference in jobs for Malays and Sinhala people). But, when that exceeds limit, it creates unrest.
Regarding Jihad in India, I am expecting that very soon. The bad example of Bangladesh and Pakistan may repeat in India. Huge amount of Middle East money invested in mosques and madressahs will produce some sort of animals, which will not be able to integrate with Indian society and culture. The more crude oil price increases, more the problem will be visible. Europe in sensing it now.

#54 Posted by dost_mittar on March 12, 2008 8:47:27 pm

muslims claim persecution in every country that is non-muslim....

if you set the koolaid aside for a minute, do you think, perhaps, the problem is with muslims themselves?

#53 Posted by dost_mittar on March 12, 2008 8:44:17 pm

well...given that, azim premji and the lack of indians in gitmo, i'd say things are pretty good for muslims...

can't have it both ways...

Re: # 58

nkg,

The most advanced and coordinated jihadi recruitment was for the afghan war. Not even a single indian was found in guntanamo, while muslims from australia to sweden were there. No doubt, the ones from teh west were seeking adventure.

The fact is that for the indian muslims, there are role models, and they can see that with studies and hard work, they can come up. For the pakistanis, they have no hope, all that they see is corruption and they beleive that jihad will get them out, a true sharia implementation will be the road to prosperity.

That is why there is no way out for pakistan, other than a true jihadic war.

I am not aware of the situation in Pakistan. But the situation in Bangladesh is pretty poor. Any decent Bengali family are target of moslems. First they will create such a situation that, you will not be able to live peacefully there. The final assault will be on young girls. I know couple of Bangladeshi girls, who are married in border districts of West Bengal (24 PGS, Nadia etc.) in quite young age ( bellow 18). They simply emulate Muhammed, the barbarian and his co-robbers. The only way left for the wretched families are to submit or leave BD and settle in West Bengal. The total population of Bengalees has reduced from nearly 35% to less than 10% now. And the number is reducing...I am pretty sure, this barbarism can be defeated by whites....

Re: # 61
Most of the muslims in India were busy for food, shelter etc...When Arab $ takes care of it, they will fight for Islam. So, far, flow of Arab $ was concentrated in Pakistan and Bangladesh. BD is now turing into another Afg. It has taken around 20 years to arabize BD ( they have fought for the language and script they have inherited from their ancestors. Now, everywhere, they use Arabic. Radical change happened in last 20 years.) Such can happen in India also. Even 2 years back, people of Karnataka have never expected this islamists/jihadists in their soil. But it is reality now. Muslims are muslims after all. You can domesticate a dog and make it eat milk, biscuit, rice, dal etc...sleep on sofa etc... but that does not turn it into human. Given opportunity, you can not stop the dog from eating shit....

nkg:

Indian Muslims are double victims. First, they are victims of Nehruvian policies which encouraged them to have a separate, ummah oriented identity instead of becoming part of the Indian mainstream. Secondly, they are victims of the Hindu nationalists who still believe in the two nation theory and dont accept muslims as full fledged Indians.

Ref dost_mittar #64

[Indian Muslims are double victims. First, they are victims of Nehruvian policies which encouraged them to have a separate, ummah oriented identity instead of becoming part of the Indian mainstream. Secondly, they are victims of the Hindu nationalists who still believe in the two nation theory and dont accept muslims as full fledged Indians.]

This is totally false.

Were Muslims given separate constituencies? Were they told to enroll only in separate schools?

No.

Indian Muslims chose all this voluntarily.

So, don't blame Hindu Nationalists for the Muslim mindset.

Why are some Indian Muslims waving the Pakistani flag in cricket matches between India and Pakistan? When half the Indian team is Muslim?

The best way to eliminate the Muslim vote bank is to eliminate Muslims from the voting rolls.

Pakistan dealt with its Hindu minority by expelling or forcibly converting them.

Since that seems to be ruled out as a choice (I wonder why), the simplest step would be to deny Muslims the right to vote.

Since it is agreed that the Muslims of UP, Bengal and Bihar were the primary movers behind Pakistan and that the Muslim population in Punjab and Sindh was not agitating for a separate Pakistan, there is no reason to accept India's Muslim population as full loyal citizens of India. Denying them electoral rights would be consistent with their stand that they wanted to live in a separate country. If they won't move their, fin. They just don't get to vote in this country.

That would mean the end of the Congress Party too.

Good riddance to bad rubbish!

While at it, the same thing should apply to Christians. Anytime the Christians demand minority reservation in government and Hindu educational institutions but do not provide reservations for anybody in Christian-run institutions, it is double dipping: what is mine is mine and what is yours is also mine. For that attitude, the Christians should be denied voting rights in India.

Re#59
Yes,the problem is with muslims.They are used to rule,
they cannot accept servile status[ unlike hindoos]

Ref dost_mittar #64

[Indian Muslims are double victims.]Nope, they double-faulted.

They demanded Pakistan but didn't move there: first fault.

They willingly went into their ghettoes and stayed there instead of coming out and attending schools and colleges like Hindus, Sikhs, Jains, Buddhists, Parsis and Christians did: double fault.

They double-faulted when the game was 30-love in favor of Hindus. So the score now is Advantage Hindus.

Tough sh!t.

Ref treetop #67

[Yes,the problem is with muslims.They are used to rule,
they cannot accept servile status]

Muslims are like the white trash that votes Republican in the US even when the Republicans are screwing them. Just like the white trash believes the Republican crap that hard work will make them millionaires like the Republican Party leaders and vote for tax cuts for the rich, Muslims think that they were the rulers of India. 99% of Muslims were working as farmers and leather workers; a miniscule group of Muslims, mostly Afghans, were freeloading on them and leading a royal life.

Brain dead diaper-heads!

Re: # 64
The jehadis caught by Karnataka Police have mostly studied in Govt. sponsored colleges. This defies your logic. I can feel the root cause of problem. Chronologically and quality wise Indian civilisation was much superior than moslems. The evidence is everywhere. Due to social turmoil, moslems had acuired power. With coersion and incentives they were able to bring some of the lower caste people into their fold. The coersion method have not worked for India (the way it had worked in Persia/Iran) fully ( Killing of Ayengars by Tipu Sultan, Story of Guru Gobind Singh). Now, after British has come, the brute force, by which these guys used to capture power, failed. Furthermore, British education has empowered Indians as well as created a united identity of India. Now, muslims can not frighten Indians. Neither, they can prove the utility of this mediaval practices in current India. So, the ghettoisation. Now, fuelled by Arab money, muslims are now trying to flaunt their pro-arab identity. When people mock and reject it, violence starts. For example, muslims students fasting according to some arabic calender. Why a college in India have to adjust it's academic calender to this? So, the student feels alieneted and then these students forms group like SIMI and try to harm Indian administration.

So the RSS thread is still going?

we might have to call shiv sena to stop the non sense on this board!

Furthermore...
DM, I agreee, majority ( Hindu) people are partly to blame for social isaolation as well. Neither we allow them in our celebration, nor we participate in their celebrations, may be the main reason. Both Congress and BJP need to be blamed for this mess.

DM

"Nehruvian policies which encouraged them to have a separate, ummah oriented identity instead of becoming part of the Indian mainstream."

How could Gandhi/Nehru not have encouraged muslims, as a group, to have an identity that was separate from non-Muslims, and was ummah-oriented?

Let's forget Gandhi/Nehru, dm ji. How can ANYONE today, in 2008, not encourage Muslims as a group, to have a separate, ummah-oriented identity?

May be Canada has succeeded, I don't know.

The only way was to give Muslims a separate country. A country specifically for Muslims would allow Islamists to dress themselves up as nationalists, if and when they wanted.

This was the most convenient and most moral option. And Gandhi/Nehru messed that up big time.

Kaal bhai,

(The only way was to give Muslims a separate country.)

&

(And Gandhi/Nehru messed that up big time.)


2/3rd of (undivided) India's Muslims did get a separate country where most non-Muslims were killed, converted or driven out of the country and the balance who remained got used to dhimmitude.

So why did Pak and B'desh flop as nations. Surely the Hindu racist, casteist, fascist, misogynist, bigoted freak could not have been solely responsible for that.

Regards

the circle of jerks gather
saffroned all over
HP dipped his wicker
got poxed all over

#64 Posted by dost_mittar on March 13, 2008 3:24:22 pm


Indian Muslims are double victims.


Seeing as how muslims are behind in the US, UK and pretty much everywhere else, muslims are the ultimate victim..

now would you like a refill of the koolaid?

majumdar dada

Pakistan is a large country with nuclear capabilities. Within sixty years it has already established itself as the Ummah's most powerful member and the most active leader. Its thinkers and leaders are shaping and moulding the Ummah. It's rock solid. All Muslims - nationalists, Islamists - are behind it. By no means it is a flop nation.

After loss of direction initially, Bangladesh too is on its way.

India, by comparison, is nowhere near attaining similar status in its own domain of relevance and interest - the non-Ummah world. We are making some progress, but even the most optimistic of us wouldn't call India the most powerful nation of the un-Ummah.

-------------

Probably we mistake what is happening currently in Pakistan as a sign of 'failure.' IMO, that is a wrong view. We are simply witnessing another cycle of dealing with unIslamic internal elements who had recently stopped playing ball honestly with Islamists.

Peace will return soon if all Pakistanis go back to playing by the same rules and with integrity. Otherwise, it will be a while before unIslamic elements in Pakistan are fully pacified.

This is a natural process unfolding, well, naturally.

#77 Posted by Eklavya,

We are simply witnessing another cycle of dealing with unIslamic internal elements who had recently stopped playing ball honestly with Islamists.

This is accurate. The Islamic forces basically grabbed the anti-Islam establishment by the scruff of the neck, lifted it off the ground, slapped it hard, and forced a regime change within a year. It's now upto the political Government to make suitable amends, or they too will perish.

In that respect the statement released right after the elections was clear "We congratulate the newly elected representatives, and expect them not to repeat the mistakes of the previous regime".

Thanks, zee.

Although Pakistanis can do whatever they want, it is truly tragic that sundry Sindhis, Pakhtoons, Punjabis and everyone else there would want to kill and bomb the very people who are most committed to Pakistan as a state and who have clearly sacrificed the most to build their greatest stake there.

There is a limit to how big, and how brazenly one can ask for, a free lunch, paid for by others.

Re: # 77
Bangladesh has made some progress, largely due to Indian influence on AL. They implemented most of the pro-people measures India suggests and what is implemented in West Bengal. India is dragged by MP,Rajasthan, Bihar, Orissa and UP. You improve these states, India will look far better. Pakistan is far behind, and will be for quite a long time.

zee, I have to tell you, I still can't get over the piece by one of Dailytimes editors, suggesting that Islamists should 'swatted' like the flies that become too much of a nuisance.

That mindset and language one expects from chaltahai, arjun, even jayp, who after all come from a completely different background....

--------------------------

nkg, BIMARU states of India will remain BIMARU. Nothing can be done about them.

Whatever is happening in Bangladesh is happening on its own accord.

Re: # 77
Who bothers about Pakistan's status in Ummah? Your President had admitted publicly that Richard Armitage had threated to bomb Pakisthan to stone age. Is that sign of power? Pakisthan is viewed as breeding ground for terrorists, most dangerous place on earth. Does this look dignified? Your ummah is surviving on arab oil. Let that finish, ummah will vanish. Do you think your old,North Korean missiles will be able to prevent USA/NATO from destroying Pakistan? I am not saying overall, India is doing good in economically. But the sign is very healthy ( education, health, industry, technology) in most of the sectors.

nkg, a LOT of people do care about such things.

And don't forget, the USA does not (have to) threaten weak and incapable states. American must realize that Pakistan can make enough of a difference in world affairs to threaten the US or its interests.

That's more than what many would say for India.

Kaal bhai,

Thanks for #77. It brought a much bigger chuckle on my face than anything else I read today!!!

(Pakistan is a large country with nuclear capabilities. Within sixty years it has already established itself as the Ummah's most powerful member and the most active leader.)

USSR too was a large country with nuke capabilities and it had established itself as the Marxist Ummah's most powerful member and the most active leader. I hope this was not the precedent that you had in mind.

(Its thinkers and leaders are shaping and moulding the Ummah.)

Have you been spending much time with Yasser mian lately???

(After loss of direction initially, Bangladesh too is on its way.)

A nation which is both BONG and MOMIN can go only ONE way but that may well be my personal prejudice so I will not get into it any further.

The other issue of course is that half of B'desh will be under the sea in 15 years time, although to be sure, they can get their compensatory lebensraum in WB and NE.

Regards

PS; Never mind if I didn't agree with some of your post's conclusion, I thoroughly enjoyed #77.

Ref Eklavya #77

[Pakistan is a large country with nuclear capabilities. Within sixty years it has already established itself as the Ummah's most powerful member and the most active leader. Its thinkers and leaders are shaping and moulding the Ummah. It's rock solid. All Muslims - nationalists, Islamists - are behind it. By no means it is a flop nation.

After loss of direction initially, Bangladesh too is on its way.

India, by comparison, is nowhere near attaining similar status in its own domain of relevance and interest - the non-Ummah world. We are making some progress, but even the most optimistic of us wouldn't call India the most powerful nation of the un-Ummah.]

Un-Ummah includes Christians and the Chinese/Japanese/Confucianists besides the Hindus.

Among Hindu nations, India is by far the biggest.... considering that the only Hindu nation is Nepal which is also going to become secular under the Marxists who were trained at Jwahirullah Nehru University.

Wait for Nepali Muslims to get a Haj subsidy; it won't be long.

Ref Eklavya #83

[American must realize that Pakistan can make enough of a difference in world affairs to threaten the US or its interests.]

So, have you got your T-Shirt with the Pakistani flag on it ready? I assume you plan to wear that T-Shirt and wave your green passport nonchalantly at the Immigration counter at JFK airport as you land there in a PIA plane.

What is it I heard lamenting the fact PIA is not even allowed to fly to most European countries whereas India's private carriers are getting landing rights?

[That's more than what many would say for India.]

Yes. That is why the US is offering Pakistan nuclear reactors and fuel along with co-production possibilities if they buy American warplanes, something they are most definitely not offering India!

majum dada, glad you enjoyed, although, perhaps unintentionally on my part? :)

IslamIslam, other than Sikhs, and some Buddhists, may be, Indic people don't count in such matters. To be counted, one has to develop boundaries first. Don't you think?

Ref Eklavya #77

[Pakistan is a large country with nuclear capabilities. Within sixty years it has already established itself as the Ummah's most powerful member and the most active leader. Its thinkers and leaders are shaping and moulding the Ummah.]

King Faroukh of Egypt said 60 years back, "Pakistanis think Islam was invented on Aug 14, 1947."

I notice the delusion hasn't ended.

harimau, some baniyas in northrop grumman and boing are trying to get in bed with india but if pentagon had its way, it would have little to do with india. its a very unreliable "strategic" partner..with commies and swadeshis in a parliamentary system govt it can never count on anything. pakistan is a much better bet with a determined military and somewhat unified nationalism.

79/#81 Posted by Eklavya

Although Pakistanis can do whatever they want, it is truly tragic that sundry Sindhis, Pakhtoons, Punjabis and everyone else there would want to kill and bomb the very people who are most committed to Pakistan as a state and who have clearly sacrificed the most to build their greatest stake there.

Yes, actually it's beyond tragic. It is quite unbelievable in its ignorance and hubris. I had read that Daily Times Op-Ed too. But, I'm sure that person would have done some serious rethinking since then, just as some interactors on these very boards who held the same views have been rethinking their positions.

HP had asked on the other board as to when have the FATA people listened to reason? I said 1947-2005. He said no, only till 1978. At-least he concedes they were not 'criminals' till 1978 and only turned into that afterwards.

Ref jang #89

[harimau, some baniyas in northrop grumman and boing are trying to get in bed with india but if pentagon had its way, it would have little to do with india. its a very unreliable "strategic" partner..with commies and swadeshis in a parliamentary system govt it can never count on anything. pakistan is a much better bet with a determined military and somewhat unified nationalism.]

The US has long-term strategic planners in every department, including the Pentagon and the State Department. Decisions are taken after analyzing short- medium- and long-term implications.

If the decision to aid India is taken with a short-term view, then the equipment offered would have limited life and limited capabilities. Even then, they would be bugged with software viruses that can be remotely activated to render them useless should the conflict in which they are used does not meet with the approval of the US.

The capabilities may be better if the idea is to support India over the medium term; but the ability to cripple the equipment still remains.

India still will not be able to buy nuclear submarines and submarine-launched ballistic missiles even if it signs a formal treaty of alliance with the US. That was given as an exception to only the UK, not even France.

They have studied Pakistan to death and have concluded it has no chance of surviving as a viable state. Hence, Pakistan will be used as a condom and discarded.

India will be allowed to grow as a counterweight to China, just like China was allowed to grow to counter the Soviet Union. Once China is fractured into several countries just like the Soviet Union was, the US will attempt to dismember India in the same fashion. But that is 50+ years into the future.

India's strategy should be to use the US to grow its capabilities while keeping the country intact.

The first step for that would be to ban all the caste-based or one-state-only parties. Mayawathi and her Bahujan Samaj would have to go. So would the DMK, ADMK, Telugu Desam, etc. That would leave the BJP, the Commies and the pseudo-Commies called the Congress.

That is the bad news for India.