The Irreverent Hero Islam Forgot

Re: # 147; tahmed sahib,
Point taken. I wish I could share your enthusiasm about this farce; have a look at Tariq Ali's website; he is a crank but says something useful now and again.

I would invite you back to the base planet though when you are ready!

#144 akcheema sahib: in making this analogy, you are once again overlooking that "minor" point about the voice of the people which is what makes pakistan after mush different than Syria (or any other arab dictatorship or kingship).

#145 anil sahib: my anger makes no difference. it is the vast majority of pakistanis who have said "enough" to musharraf's outrages.

mush was not beholden to the Pakistani people, and acted accordingly. With the new government it is the reverse. A representative government carries a gravitas that a tinpot dictator can never posses. No doubt Pakistan will be a much stronger and much more reliable member of the world community now that the tinpot is reduced to begging to be allowed to "serve out his 5 years", even if only as a powerless figurehead.

Re: # 138

Tahmed sahib:

Only thing I am attributing to you, is anger against Musharraff. Woh bhi munasib ho sakta hai, abhi.

Yes, Tahmed sahib, I believe that Musharraff could have wrecked the elections, and delayed democracy, and even made the path bloodier. Saudis are no friends of democracy, therefore, neither their protege, Mian Nawaz is.

I also believe, that Pakistani government needs to demonstrate that it can take a stand independent of the U.S. "Bombing back to stone age" etc. indeed put Pakistan as very week and gave birth to thoughts that Arjun expresses. Hopefully, democratic Pakistan will put such nonsense behind.

Re: # 141 tahmed

you mean like ZAB left the throne for BB, and her for Zardari/Bilawal?

anil sahib: If I was Indian, I would no doubt be concerned with exactly the same issues that you describe about BJP and can understand your frustrations with them.

Re: # 135

Tahmed sahib:

Neither BJ nor anyone can send BJP back to 2 or 3 seats in the Parliament. This is the reality of India, as a viable alternative to Congress is essential. Two umbrella organizations for regional parties are needed.

More appropriate would be to let BJ kind of BJP walahs to put relentless pressure on BJP to get rid of Modis and other RSS fascists. BJP is an opportunistic party, and can change faster than a chameleon.

Everyone, including BJP walahs in the U.S., believes that if BJP had brought the deal with the U.S., it would have supported even the worst deal. The same is said about the negotiations with Pakistan, leave it to BJP, else it will never go through. I am surprised to see young Indian generation here to include Laddus, Rangers, and Harimaus. Keeping them in minority is so important whichever party they belong.

#140 akcheema sahib: Asad killed 10,000 people in Syria, make himself dictator for life, and then left the "throne" to his son. This may be OK with you. It is not OK with most Pakistanis.

And these were 10,000 human beings - fathers, sons, mothers, daughters - not "pathetic representations of protoplasm" I am talking about. Please practice what you preach when it comes to "moderation".

Re: # 138; tahmed

Mush did what he could, only not enough. He should have learnt something from Hafiz-ul-Asad (Hama 1982), who sorted out Islamism in Syria for a long time to come!

It would appear that is the only language these pathetic representations of protoplasm understand; sure as day after night, they won't even spare the likes of "moderates - whatever that is" like you unless you conformed.

So thank your lucky stars for living where you live and don't knock it like every other Paki I have seen!

#137 cheema sahib: what did i say that is divorced from reality? and the "survey" was already held on feb 18. so please dont write as if it never happened. the people have spoken loud and clear, so dont write as if they never spoke. hundreds of pakistanis have been killed int he process. the democracy forces are united.

the maulvis, the militarists and the lotas and the man-who-would-be-hosni-mubarak are in disarray. that is the reality of pakistan today.

#136 anil sahib: you think musharraf had a choice in these free and fair elections? i am not calling for him to be lynched - only that he be treated in accordance with the law, and not be placed above the law. so please dont attribute views to me.

Re: # 135; tahmed

I think you are completely detached from reality; or you have your own version of it.

Pakistani politics has always followed the feudalistic system that was never eradicated. Just read what Mr Naqshbandi has said on another board; he is prepared to carry Gilani's shoes to display his respect and to honour this "syed-zaada's" ancestors.

What hope is there for the common joe bloggs in the street? Like I said, it is different when one is completely de-tached from the process....go and do surveys amongst the masses to find out why they vote for whoever they vote; the result may prove more sobering than you think!

I say this coming from a "paindoo" background, or describe it however you will.

Re: # 119

Tahmed sahib:

Aap mein bahut gussa hai, Musharraff ke khilaaf. Whatever, it is please do not take away the crdit of brining free and fair election and restoring grass root democracy from him.

Tahmed sahib, his public prosecution should be postponed by 10 - 15 years. You must not let him be lynched.

#133 bjkumar: you reduce bjp seats in lok sabha to the number of religious party seats in pakistanis national assembly (3), then come talk about secularism.

Re: # 132; bjkumar

If I had a say in the matter, I'd employ you to re-write our Pakistan Studies textbooks!

Jinnah had no idea man; he was, upto the last minute, hoping for a con-federation type arrangement with Nehru. The partition as we know it now was never in anyone's mind including "Iqbal the rhetorician". It was always "muslim majority provinces to have jurisdiction over there affairs UNDER THE STATUTE OF WESTMINSTER"!

He didn't know what hit him when he swore in as GG of "the Dominion of Pakistan",; statesman my ar..! Least he could have done in the year and a half he was around after the mess was to give SOME SORT OF A DIRECTION rather than quoting "the law-giver, prophet of Islam", who he knew nothing about!

It is because of this reason that we have erected a strong, tall wall separating the state from the Church in the USA.

After all, secularism would be rather difficult to practice if the USA were the "Christian States of America"!

Somehow, the contradiction between setting up an "Islamic" republic and practicing secularism does not seem to rattle my Pakistani brothers and sisters too much!

"Mera khota naseeb!" (Long breath)