The Irreverent Hero Islam Forgot

....if i remember correctly, amir hamza is actually pre-islamic......the religion hamza refers to in his journeys, is din-e-ibrahimi......the abrahamic faith.......not islam.....

people tend to equate amir hamza with muhammad's uncle.......however, that cannot be the case.....amir hamza's colleagues and journeys are into magical kingdoms covering superstitions and wars and what not....

....the stories start with three individuals - hamza, his friend umro ayyar and a third person - when they are children.......and it goes on till they build an army of partners from all over the world......

i believe the person from india was lindhor......who carries the world's biggest gurz (?) on his shoulders, and is undefeatable in battle, until hamza defeats him......after which lindhor joins hamza's army.....

malika bihar is a very power magician, who seduces everyone around her, through the use of magical flowers....

anyways, things that i remember from around 30 years ago......

Re: # 17 bulleya:

The character IS based on Hamza, Mohammed's uncle but only in name. In chronological terms it is from the middle ages, Turko-Persian with Arabic and Indian refernces to suggest a wider, more inclusive base. Also, the "Koh-e-Kaaf ki Pariyan" and the whole "Ko-e-Kaaf" concept is based on the "Caucases" in Southern Russia bordering onto North Iran and modern day Turkey; the mountains separating the two terrains gave an extra dimension to the imaginative work, with the "lure of the fairies of the Caucases - Koh'Kaaf ki pariyan" maintained throughout!

"build an army of partners......"

Wow! Is this an army, or a bunch of traders, or an early version of East India Company as it might appear to some kids in Britain?

Hope that is a misunderstanding...:)

Cheema ji

From bulleya's #17, this seems like a fantasy/dream/story of Arabic (Persian?) world conquest using magic, trade, and social relations.

Since it is an important book, I don't want to misconstrue it. Would you please comment? Thanks.

Re: # 20; Eklavya bhai,

I haven't read this particular book but the comments I made earlier were based on by childhood readings, mostly in Urdu and Persian (via a granparent). These characters, I reckon, developed and evolved rather than created on the spot by one author.

If you read Persian literature, especially what permeated into the western part and parts of northern Pakistan (the Kailash velley, e.g.,), there are folk tales of "Iskander", a mythological character based on "Alexander - the Macedonian". Characters evolve, and eventually through many generations of Chinese whispers, turn into totally different people.

My understing about "Daastan-e-Amir Hamza" is it is of Persio-Turkic origin but I am happy to stand corrected on this.

I think sometimes it is good to just enjoy the work rather than split hairs and perhaps leave that to the "Dan Browns" to find hidden agendas/meanings etc. As one of my favourite authors Douglas Adams said:

"Isn't it enough to see that the garden is beautiful than having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?"

Re: # 21

P.S.: Since you happen to be so deep in Islamic religious teachings at present - or probably always have been - one such example of chinese whispers can be found in Shia mythology. Around "Ashoora" in early Muharram (beginning of Islamic year), Hussain (grandson of Mohammed)'s battle of "Karbala" fought(?) with the Yezidian army is narrated ad-nauseum by "Zaakirs"; the colourful narrations, mutually contradictory at times, are just so fasinating; if only Hussain (or Mohammed for that matter) had any idea! One can only wonder!

Do read the "Arabian nights - Alif Laila, i.e., One thousand and One nights". Absolutely fascinating with, at times, explicit accounts of "high-breasted virgins" having it off with "black slaves"! If you can't read it in Arabic or Urdu, I recommend Richard Burton's translation in classic English; most interesting read.

Cheers.

i think it would seem to be accurate to say that the daastaan e amir hamza is definitely a pan-islamic work of fantasy literature; hazrat sayyid al shuhada hamza ibn abd al muttalib al hashmi (may Allah be well pleased with him) was the uncle of the Prophet Muhammad alayhisalatuwasalam but he was martyred in one of the earlier battles. I wonder how his legendary exploits on the battlefield became transformed into this tale of epic proportions?

I can't wait to buy it and read it!

BOYCOTT CHINA. STOP CHINESE HEGEMONY. FREE TIBET.

send the pakistani hosni mubarak-wannabe to tibet!!

Re: # 26

tahmed,

... uh?.... your mush fixation is getting out of hand ..... this board is discussing the exploits of amir hamza, your prophet's uncle .... i remember my grand mother telling me stories about how amir hamza went to koh-i-kaaf to free husn pari from the chungals of the zalim jinn ....... are you suggesting that mushy is the zalim jinn and the cj is the husn pari - the man does look like a fairy and mush has that evil look ...... okay, so i agree with you and you don't need to reply to this post ........ i am sure masadi will be here soon to blame the rape of the fairies of koh-i-kaaf on the us elite and jayp will blame it on us poor pakis ........ so what else is new?

hamidm: discussing ancient books is like discussing philosophy while ..to put it gently..engaged in the act of procreation. There is a revolution going on in Pakistan. Here is Holbrooks now starting to say what I have been ranting about for years on chowk.

Richard Holbrooke (perhaps the most astute and realistic US diplomat and democrat) finally seems to be understanding what any true Pakistani (as opposed to those who spend their time berating fellow Pakistanis) knew all along!!

Hope in Pakistan
The Problems Are Real, but So Is the Progress
By Richard Holbrooke
Friday, March 21, 2008; Page A17

..the return of a vibrant democratic process ..They have formed a Pakistani version of a grand coalition...Since Musharraf's real power base was as military commander, when he "took off his uniform" last year, it turned out that his residual power as president was largely ceremonial..Another positive straw in the wind is the poor showing of the overtly religious parties in February's elections -- they got only 4 percent of the total vote. In the volatile tribal areas near the Afghan border, where the Taliban and al-Qaeda have had a sanctuary from NATO operations in Afghanistan, the Muslim parties were shut out..But Pakistan..is too big and its civil society -- with its deeply established political parties, its free press, its vibrant and very visible lawyers, its thousands of nongovernmental organizations, its huge business community, and its own moderate Muslim leaders -- too extensive to in fact become "the world's most dangerous nation."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/0 3/20/AR2008032003016.html

Eklavya,

I don't find any contradictions in either Dastaan-e-Amir Hamza or Arabian nights from the basic teachings of Islam!

If these murtids aka ekcheema etc ever tried to look at the 'system' and how it operates over time, particularly in times of peace and in times of conflict, they would know better.

A complete translation by Frances Pritchett is available online at
http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00litlinks/hamzah/index.html

Just curious, how many Indian non-muslims read this while growing up?

zee, cheema ji probably understands that! :)

I was just floored by the beauty and the brevity of the expression whose meaning we know so well: of ruling the world with the help of a single 'army of partners,' in which all vanquished and the defeated join the SAME army as soldier-partners.

This almost solves all problems of rebellion, desertion, abandonment, and lack of focus.

Zee, there is nothing remotely like this in Indic tradtions (may be some Hindu can correct me on that).

So, this does seem to be a purely Islamic imagination and piece of work (Christians might have something similar with their 'march of Christ's soldiers' idea. But then they don't have the Quran. The Bible seems nothing like the Quran.)

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Cheema ji #22, wow, again!

While the logic is simplicity itself, the details and manifestations and expressions are so many, so diverse, and so rich that in order to enjoy their beauty one would probably need 'a few lifetimes'! Will try to at least skim through some stuff. Many, many thanks. :)


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khurram bhai, Indians have no real reason to read this stuff, unless they happen to be a crazy bunch like me. They have their own mirror image of literature. Even that, they don't mostly read (Chowk, though, has some very knowledgeable people.)