The Vicious Circle of Violence

Hinduism is not an ism or religion. That is why it will outlast all and will lead humanity to peace and prosperity. Wars were never fought to spread Sanatan Dharma. Yogi is Hindu. Dhyan-dharana-Samadhi can happen while developing new process for substrating GaAs ..while coming up with faster Simplex algorithm. That is when one reaches to the higher consciousness. In fact, you reach to that higher consciousness so get those ideas.

When you progress on this path you will see oneness of every thing. The barriers and walls will disappear. You will be Sat-Chit-Ananda ie roughly Freedom(truth), Confidence and Bliss.

Indians there is no Paki in the gallery. Ek Dukka Mittars can play to the gallery but there is nobody there. Dont waste ur time here on this chowk. This is probably yet another NGO to manipulate young minds. These people are are employed to post articles and posts. Seems one poster has 5 nicks. Good Bye!

Hope this helped some Indians.

Re: # 110
Vengat...

Mumbai situation was something, which could have been exploited by any Marathi leader. Bal Thakre have taken that cause. People of Konkan have benefitted a lot from Siv Sena. The method used by him is very bad.
Regarding 1992-1993 riot, it was bound to happen anytime. The same Dubai-Muslim Underworld-Congress nexus was forcing business/industry to flee Mumbai. Only people benefitted from this nexus is smugglers and 3rd grade Mumbai movie makers. The situation from mid-eighties were becoming untolerable. It was the muslims, who have initiated the riot (...I was in Mumbai for 2 years. Most commoner's account says so). The basic tactics followed by moslem terrorists are same everywhere (operate from muslim ghettoes. When you attack them,some commoners will get effected. And cry foul about it. Hamas & Hejbullah are using the same tactics).

Re #110
Vengat...

The purpose was simple. Frighten non-moslems and exploit the situation. They have expected support from Congress ( specially Sharad Pawaer) and police. Low level police force (Sub-Inspector and lower ranks), like commoners deserted Congress and ....
Siv Sena have saved Mumbai...

Re: # 125

Mohammad is the real culprit behind this cult of violence. He mastered the art of dis-information. He ensured that no one wrote anything disparaging about him. He ensured that the poetic flowery language of the scribes turn int HIS revelation. And when one of the scribes saw through the act he got them executed.
He mis-represented the pagan religion of Mecca- he spread the mis-information that they "worshipped" idols and that their idols== god . He USED Abrahim to stake a claim on Mecca and destroy the idols.
He USED the Abrahmic hatred for idolatory to kill, loot , rape and occupy Mecca and take reenge for his past humiliations.

Blame this circle of violence of Mehammad. No one else is to e blamed not OBL, not Ali, not Ayesha, Not Maududi.
Destroy Mohammad's FALSE representation through the flowery language of his scribes.
And the circle of violence would END!!!

"Mr. Baig does not participate in chowk discussions."

Mr. Baig is a man of his faith, propounding his faith.

Discussions here will not advance his cause.

(By the way, such men in India are called secularists.)

#127 dost_mittar

The relationship between hinduism and buddhism in India is a different issue. There could well have been fights - I certainly dont believe in stupid statements like "Hinduism is the religion of peace" etc. We know that Buddhism was a state religion of some kings at various points, we know that the some hindu kings did not look on Buddhism with favor...

My question is simpler. If Islam is inherently peaceful etc. where are the historic traditions of afghanistan and pakistan? Why is there this extreme allergy to hindus, buddhists and sikhs in these countries? How come every large indian city has 100s of mosques and an active muslim community but the same is not true of Kabul, Kandahar, Peshawar, Lahore, Karachi, Hyderabad, Rawalpindi etc?

Why does this never get discussed when we consider islamic multi-culturalism - why should we keep repeating this discussion of Spain and Turkey only???

Summarizing: this guy is one of these fanatics who believes fairy tales about his religion based on selective choice of historical facts. So he should be treated accordingly - a not very intelligent twit....

"this guy is one of these fanatics who believes fairy tales about his religion based on selective choice of historical facts."

pmishra ji, with all due respect, this is the biggest problem I have with us Hindus.

We take an ordinary, average, normal, middle-of-the-road person and declare him a fanatic, and extremist, a gonner, instead of recognizing that the person is simply being an average, normal, middle-of-the-road person of his faith.

There is nothing Baig sahib suggests that any Muslim (who call himself or herself a Muslim) will not tell you with complete confidence, or any liberal Nehruvian/Gandhian Hindu would not agree with.

* I know a couple of people who disagree with this 'of peace' business but you can count them on the tips of your fingers.

Eklavya, middle of the raod in certain faiths is a fanatic as identified by 5/6th of the humanity. You are a numbers man..as you said...so numbers speak for themselves. Nothing Baig or you can do about it. We are coming into yoru house and telling you that. tough luck buddy...make sure you can protect tampax by hiding him in a safe and dark place :)

#136 Eklavya

[pmishra ji, with all due respect, this is the biggest problem I have with us Hindus.

We take an ordinary, average, normal, middle-of-the-road person and declare him a fanatic, and extremist, a gonner, instead of recognizing that the person is simply being an average, normal, middle-of-the-road person of his faith.]

This is the biggest problem I have with you liberals. You take a cult-member (albeit by birth), a believer in something far more insidious than Mein Kampf, someone who is part of the very soil that terrorism grows on, someone who would vigorously defend his cult, and declare him a harmless and average man of peace.

As I tell my liberal friends - Daniel Pearl was a liberal.

Eklavya, Ajeya


There is no need to accept this kind of silly fairy tales about mohammed or jesus or krishna or whoever. If your point is that for many muslims this is normal - well, we have to point this out vigorously and defend our position.

People do change - I am not saying its going to be easy - islam definitely has a supremacist side - it has an over-emphasis on how it alone stands for true religion and other bakwaas like that - but many muslims realize this is some ancient baggage and are struggling to move on.

Look, a couple of hundred years ago, christians were still killing heretics and a hundred years ago most hindus believed that jati really meant that some communities were better/purer than others.

So there is no contradiction between being blunt when somebody trots out stupid statements - islam is religion of peace or mohammed was a pacifist gandhi-type - and at the same time thinking that people can learn and move forward. Maybe some are slower than others....

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#140 slyder

[Stop eating cow dung you stupid fukkers and maybe the civilized world will reconsider.

And stop sprinkling gao muthra in the server room while you're at it! ]

Now now. Such language! What would your mothers say?

#139 pmishra2

[...but many muslims realize this is some ancient baggage and are struggling to move on...]

pmishra,

How many of these Muslims would be willing to declare the koran as "ancient baggage" in ANY Islamic country?

I think you are indulging in wishful thinking. The handful like hamidm do so in the safety of the anonymity of the Internet, and that too in the USA.

pmishra2 #31

{{If you really want to talk about tolerance, start with your hometown. How many buddhist, hindu and sikh temples are there? What is their condition? How visible are these minorities? Have their numbers grown or shrunk in the last 50 years??}}

#92

{{If islam is inherently multi-cultural and peaceful, where are the sikh, hindu and buddhist temples of Afghanistan and Pakistan? Hindu and Budhist traditions were active in this region for 3000 years - and most important - where are the hindus, sikhs and buddhists???}}

Pmishra babu, you have repeated the very same question/assertion like a stuck gramophone record in #31, #66, #92, #112, #115, #135. We heard you the first time. Please cease your inane blabbering.

There is absolutely no contradiction between the peaceful and tolerant nature of Islam and the relative absence of other religious traditions in Afghanistan and in the North-West of the Indian subcontinent. When the light of the True Faith arrived there a little more than a millennium ago, tolerant and humane Islamic rulers gave all facilities for benighted Buddhists and Hindus to continue to practice their outworn creeds.

However, the more intelligent sections of the populace – just like the inhabitants of Mecca in 630 CE - perceived the truly enlightened, rational and universalistic nature of Islam – as opposed to the parochial, particularistic and irrational nature of their ancestral faiths – and willingly embraced the Religion of Peace and Justice. Only a few pandit-hates clung to their ancestral religion hoping to lord it over the common people again should Islam ever be vanquished. If the thinking people and the masses voted with their feet for the enlightenment of al-Islam over the barbaric jahalat of Hinduism and Buddhism, it is because the former is manifestly superior in every way to the primitive mindsets and superstitious traditions embodied by the pagan creeds – not because of any supposed intolerance from Muslims.

And naturally, once the pagan creeds lost their adherents, their temples and monasteries were no longer needed and fell into disrepair. Some no doubt were put to better use or simply dismantled – others just crumbled away. QED.

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Coming next on Chowk FP: the great Islamic egalitarianism as the finest of al-Islam's manifold contributions to South Asia.

AN #143
"There is absolutely no contradiction between the peaceful and tolerant nature of Islam and the relative absence of other religious traditions in Afghanistan and in the North-West of the Indian subcontinent."
Wah! Wah!! Peaceful treatment of Ahmdadi's and Bahai faiths and tolerance in Saudi Arabia towards bringing of Hanuman Idols are very strong arguments in favor of your QED
You also failed to mention that only way for someone in peaceful Islamic counteries to renounce Islam as faith is through grave. Very strong proof of tolerance indeed.