The Importance of Natural Selection

Re: # 121 there is nothing new in this - the bible thumpers have done it int he past are are still doing it even today. So are you. There is no diffference.

In fact Urstruly has a lot of sympathy with the bible thumpers of this world (see his #97). Both you guys are made from the same cloth - hence you cannot stand each other.

urstruly and echoboom are living proof that natural selection does not work all the time ...... hopefully they are sterile ....

Re: # 119
Dear secular humanist,

If you insist, I'm very happy for you! One misleader destroys a hundred lives.

You articles and comments make the complete YOU. As for the exact scenario describing how the misled will ask God for twice the punishment for misleaders, and how they in turn will blame the other party, please read the Qur'an.

I do get YOUR picture, and now I'll leave you to accomplish the very important task of talking Darwin with others.

We will meet again.

The whole idea of a God is based on human being's inability to explain a 'starting point' for life. We say because everything we see has a designer so we crave a similar explanation for the existance of everything living there is.

One question that arises from all that is that if it is always 'more complex' beings creating 'relatively simple' things all the time (such as humans creating stuff within the material world around us), then the overall Creator of all that exists would have to be even more complex than anything that exists.

The questions that remain unanswered is 'who created this MOST complex being, i.e., God? And how do we explain his own existence and what comes from it? If he has always been there, why do we stop there and not go beyond? If there is no beyond, do WE exist?'

The answers to those questions are always given by the religious as 'written in this book or that'; what makes those books worthy of our reading since they have been thrashed about right here and nobody has been able to come up with anything better than 'I have faith'! The whole logic is completely flawed and doesn't make any sense whatsoever. But there are those who would be happy to reap the benefits of science in general in their lives, and Darwinian evolution and its products within the field of genetics and medicine, but feel qualified to rubbish it; then they expect everyone to just 'believe' bacause they happen to (in more than 99% of cases) have been born within one set of beliefs or another!

I just find that astounding to say the least. May be in a few years if any one of these 'pious' falls ill with Kidney, liver or heart failure and requires an organ transplant etc (the whole technology is based on genetics and other Darwinian derivatives), they would surely refuse it on moral grounds??

When we have trans-genetic pigs with organs available that don't cause immune system stimulation in humans (in is likely to be a reality sooner than most think), and these organs are available for transplant, may be the same applies as above??

As I have said before many a times, if science doesn't give you an answer immediately for any explanation one might seek about the 'realities' of life, what qualifies religious fairytales to fill in those gaps. I am of the opinion that if science and quest for knowledge doesn't give one an expanation, religion is the last thing that provides anything useful on this subject. It just tells you to stop working on the problem and put it down to 'God' and everything IS going to be allright! Well, quite frankly, that is NOT good enough!

The argument of a 'supreme and super-natural' being shoots itself in the foot by trying to solve any of these arguments as it fails to provide the 'Cause' for 'the Cause'. I have alluded to this 'circular reasoning' before in earlier posts on this very board.

Thank you.

Re: # 120
Dear Hardcore OS-Techie,

Do work on your own operating system. There's a bug bigger than Y2K somewhere.

I don't mind your accusation that "concept of Adam-Eve is stolen by Muhammed". Why? The Qur'an repeatedly speaks of the never-changing core truths, and the same moral lessons woven in the historic episodes the people already knew! It never claims that it is a new religion or has given mankind something entirely unknown.

I've read your books but never do I stoop to mud-slinging whom you worship and idolise. Why then are you doing this instead of solving software problems?

Now get the mouse of your life out of that personal demon's hand.

Shaant ho jao NKG, shaant....

Re: # 132
Dear pig-organ-dealing brother Cheema,

You cannot question God, but He will surely question you! All this is not His pastime, it has a purpose!

Who says? The Qur'an.

You will wind up in LA (lunatic asylum), or worse, become a sufi, if you insist on finding the cause of the Cause. God is unknowable, know Him through His creation and obedient beings.

Obediently,

Your elder brother.

#132 cheema: your post is i assume addressed only to those who believe that "..it is always 'more complex' beings creating 'relatively simple' things all the time ".

if so, i would be interested in your comments on what happens if one makes no such assumption one way or another, as described in my post #98.

Re: # 134; Tahir; Re: "You will wind up in LA (lunatic asylum)".

Great! I always wanted to meet up with you in person.

I am a good handyman around the house too. May be I can help you with some loose screws!

Cheers

tahir sahib: if God is unknowable (as you correctly say), then do you agree that no individual can determine take God's place in passing judgement on someone's religious beliefs?

Re: # 135; tahmed

The 'God' you speak of has nothing whatsoever to do with the concept of 'God' in any religion to which I hold Mohammedenism (aka Islam) no exception to the rule.

We have been here before, you and I. Let's not waste each other's valuable time.

Cheers

Gotta go..

#138 dr sahib: if you insist on replacing the concept of God as unknowable with a straw-man, and if you insist in then charging that straw-man with a lance and cries of "Death to the Strawman that Does Not Exist", then I think it is my duty as your friend to show you the reality.

As Sancho Panza said to Don Quixote - "but senor, all i see you attacking are windmills, not giants."

Re: # 139; tahmed,

without being disrespectful, 'as Hamlet said to Macbeth in Midsummer night's dream............'

work to do; Cheerio..
phirr milain ge no doubt

#140 dr. sahib: May Allah (not the strawman) be with you, doctor sahib, as you do your good work.

Re: # 121 Zeemax

Holy Prophet (pbuh) has said that "Science (knowledge) is like a lost heirloom of a believer; pick it up wherever ye find it".

Therefore, talking about science should come natural to a Muslim. Islam is science and science is Islam. It is like two sides of the same coin.

Engaging with atheists in scientific debates is a separate issue. The core objective of such debates, for a believer, should be to convey the message of Tauheed (Monotheism) to them in the best possible way. It is not about "affirmation", it is about communication and delivery (of the message that every Muslim is charged with to deliver to rest of the humanity, since there are no Prophets coming after Holy Prophet (pbuh)). Just like you cannot deliver a message to a Bengali in French, it is necassary that we speak their "language" (to communicate effectively).

#121 Posted by zeemax on April 7, 2008 11:03:53 pm


Should Muslims study science or not?


Science is too hard for inbred retards...study a city road map instead...that'll help with with your profession..

#142 urstruly: i am glad you have started thinking along these lines. inshallah in another 200 years you will start practicing what you preach.