In the Name of Allah, the Most Merciful

Ms. Rashid,

I found the following passage really interesting:

"I question the role and necessity of love, after all we do get just one life to live and if we are dead, that is the end of our story. I don't believe in fate, I don't believe in lies and I don't believe in Allah, but I question if a life of lie and deceit, beginning with the name of Allah and narrowing down and eventually ending in an artificially created and suffocating grave is the fate for the women of Pakistan."

Do we as women in essence live in a world where love does not necessarily function/exist for us when it conflicts with familial/societal desires/needs and structures?


I'm not referring to the spaces we make in our labor, relationships with fam, friends, art, education, etc. (which I argue are individual constructions of self and outward love) that are not a threat to the fam/soc structure.

I mean in the way you have outlined love and it's lack for Pakistani women in the contexts described.

Very well written Azra. It is an on going story that almost never gets talked about because of our "face-saving" cultural background.

We would spend hours discussing "the wrongs" done by "the west" in far flung places, but never face the issues staring us straight in the eye, from within our midst.

I am sure "the pure" inhabitants of the "land of the pure" (especially the male ones, I might add) would be along shortly to offer "perfectly legitimate" excuses for the practices mentioned. It is a pity that they are never on the receiving end of these "honourable" practices in their daily lives themselves!

I personally hold strongly that the character described by the fifth word in the title has as much to do with it as anyone/thing else! After spending sometime on this site, this 'belief' gets stronger by the minute.

Cheers

dear azra...it is high time we focused on the plight of women who are suffering in the name of religion or tradition all over the world. these attitudes have developed over the centuries. we pay lip service to the sacredness of motherhood but do not think twice before insulting or abusing them. i believe women's liberation is an important aspect of human liberation and women like you will play a significant role in educating the masses through the media.
it is not just women's problem it is also men's peoblem as the future of humanity will depend how men and women treat each other. keep on writing and producing documentaries and educating the public. i am so proud of you...all the best...sohail

Hmmm ... I see the murtid has found a GF, the lesbian has found a lover, and the mad psychic has found a patient! Good progress in just one day while I was in a plane.

Azra:

1. Are more women being killed every year or is it the case that more people are now reporting/registering such incidents? Your initial statistics tell us that the latter is definitely true while the former may or may not be true. If you are telling us here that we should be alarmed about honor killings BECAUSE it is on the increase then a little bit of more research on numbers would have been appreciated.

2. If it is not growing numbers, then are you saying that we should be concerned simply because it is barbaric? This is a no brainer, all of us are horrified and know about these incidents. Your article neither adds nor substracts from our horror. However, there are quite a few here (like myself) who are not clear as to why such a barborous act takes place. For example, we know why Bush, Bib Laden or Mehsud act like barbarians. But it would have been nice if you could have shed more light on what makes a father kill his child. You do provide some definitions from some dictionaries. You also claim that you do not believe in God. Laws being ineffective and plainly stupid is another assertion. But none of them provide sufficient reason for a father to kill her child. Yes, you do imply that 2% of the population can be viewed as an uncivilized fringe of a somewhat civilized society. But then we already know that, don't we?

So unless you interact and tell us more, readers like me will keep on wondering as to what was the point of this article? And sadly, you will be elevated to the grand status of chowk glitterati like Hoodbhoy, Beena, Beg and others who put forth c@#p on FP for lesser beings like us to discuss.

#5 Posted by GT,

Do you really expect answers for your intellectually honest questions from a puta? A simple answer would be pre-menstrual syndrome which prompts some she-canines to act up from time to time.

Re: # 6

zeemax,

.... do you always talk about women like this ? ....... why are muslim men misogynists - does it have something to do feelings of sexual inadequacy? ....... get over it! .... women are people too regardless of what it says in the koran and other unholy texts

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

BTW I'm an equal opportunity murtid-hater. It can be a woman or a man. Same same ...

Nice article. But I think this is a very minor issue. 1250 is quite an okii number...

Re: # 5

There is actually a very interesting subtextual thesis here-one that enrages interactors like tampax.

In my reading, the writer asks us the following question: if one of the meanings of God/Allah/the Creator is interpreted as "love", let's say in the performance of the 11 meanings of jihad or internal soul searching, self respect and respect for others, agency and fully actualized personhood, where is the proof of this "love" for women? Where is the proof of this "love" in the lives of women? In essence, we are dealing with at least two Islams-one for men in which these transcendent meanings exist and the other for women in which these meanings do not exist.

Before this becomes about anyone else, or any other group, deal with the subject at hand.

#11 Posted by neembu:

In six lines you have framed a good question. The question also is very clear. Now why do we need a whole FP article, where we even have to guess what is written? Thank you, I deal with this a lot when my daughter forces me to go over her home-work every evening. Moreover, does a question an FP article make? Don't we have UP?

Now, I do not like zeemax's interacts below and I believe that Arza should interact here. Tell us more. Though I am basically dumb, at least I am willing to listen.

Re: # 12

I think at these questions have a 25 volume of the Hadith made. A Muslim scholar has recently published an extremely interesting, exhaustive exploration of the Hadith.

peeweemax, the jihadi rodent, is getting his islamist undies in a knot....

wow..that's new...

#5 GT
to some extent the distinction u make is artificial
whether theres an actual increase in numbers or whether its the result of better reporting ppl's conscience is shaken more when (they learn that) the deaths number in the 1000s rather than in the 100s

Azra:

How can ever be an “honor” in killing or bride burning?

It is not going to change people like Zeemax sahibs until Azaras of the world stop qualifying such brutal acts with adjectives like ‘honor’.

This adjective gives an escape to Zemaax sahibs to open wrong pages of a sacred book. Nothing that Azras to Hamidms can do to stop Zemaax sahibs to open the different page and start their defense. All live in this freer world, no matter what grudge Massaddi Mians have for the elites.

Your wrote, “I don't believe in fate, I don't believe in lies and I don't believe in Allah,…” These are very strong “don’t beliefs”.

Do you have even stronger “beliefs”?

What are they? Set of stronger beliefs are needed to counter the regressive forces of beliefs – that is what all religions are.

I am afraid; Azra “don’t believes” won’t do anything.

Also, if you are going to bring change in Pakistani society, you cannot “don’t believe” in Allah. You suddenly become a single non-entity. Pakistan is far too religios and far more to the right of center. To bring evolutionary and permanent changes, you may need to talk to people who may be too much to the religious right for your comfort.

I respect that you wrote here and expressed your “don’t believes” so clearly. It take courage to do so. Till this courage turns into Tsunami from within, the believers in Allah, nothing can happen. Hamidm sahib can cry himself hoarse – nakkar khane mein tuti ki awaj se ziayad nahin hai.