Moeed Pirzada April 27, 2008
#33 Posted by mohar11 on April 28, 2008 9:46:49 am
yep, pakis trying to make a buck from every situation... you guys are way ahead of bania on this, aren't you?
:)
:)
#34 Posted by dost_mittar on April 28, 2008 10:28:13 am
Urstruly#30:
How do know if the courts really found him guilty or just gave a verdict based on what the higher-ups wanted? The verdict was given when Musharraf was still maintaing a hostile posture towards India. Notice that both Nawaz Sharief and Burney are casting doubts on his being guilty:
Nawaz Sharif asks Pak govt not to hang Sarabjit
April 28, 2008 22:08 IST
Efforts to save Indian national Sarabjit Singh from the gallows received a boost on Monday with former premier Nawaz Sharif asking the Pakistan government not to hang him on humanitarian grounds.
The Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz chief, whose party is a key player in the ruling coalition led by the Pakistan People's Party, however, did not favour an unconditional pardon for Sarabjit, sentenced to death for his alleged involvement in bomb attacks that killed 14 people in 1990.
"Sarabjit should be released on the condition that he would be sent back to Pakistan if concrete evidence is found against him," Sharif was quoted as saying by TV news channels.
In an interview with the Aaj news channel, Sharif also suggested that any review of Sarabjit's case by the Pakistan government should be linked to similar action by the Indian government in the cases of Pakistanis currently being held in the neighbouring country.
"After seeing the plight of the members of Sarabjit's family who have come to Pakistan, any person can feel the pain they are going through," Sharif said.
"But if this individual (Sarabjit) has actually carried out terrorist attacks, then no person can easily ignore that".
Sharif further said in the interview, "If the Pakistan government is to examine this matter, then the issue of Pakistanis being held in India for similar cases should be linked to it".
The other TV channels said Sharif hinted that Sarabjit could be swapped for Pakistanis currently being held in Indian jails.
Sharif's comments came even as authorities in Punjab province put off Sarabjit's hanging for up to three weeks.
Sarabjit was originally set to be hanged on April 1, but his execution was deferred for 30 days by President Pervez Musharraf [Images]. This was done so that Pakistan's new government could review his case following an appeal for clemency from the Indian government.
According to existing rules, Sarabjit's case has to be put up again before a local court for fixing a fresh date for the execution.
The fresh date cannot be fixed before a period of 14 days or after 21 days. This means that the execution will be postponed for up to three weeks, officials said.
Former Pakistani human rights minister Ansar Burney welcomed Sharif's comments and the decision to put off Sarabjit's hanging.
"It's a very good sign," Burney told PTI, adding he was ready to share the evidence he had gathered in Sarabjit's case with Sharif.
"Due to the suspicious nature of the case against Sarabjit, his execution should not be carried out. Relations between India and Pakistan are improving and India's External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee is scheduled to visit Pakistan next month. In view of these developments, the government should review Sarabjit's case," he said.
Burney also said he had sought appointments with Musharraf and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gillani to take up Sarabjit's case and was hopeful of meeting them sometime soon.
How do know if the courts really found him guilty or just gave a verdict based on what the higher-ups wanted? The verdict was given when Musharraf was still maintaing a hostile posture towards India. Notice that both Nawaz Sharief and Burney are casting doubts on his being guilty:
Nawaz Sharif asks Pak govt not to hang Sarabjit
April 28, 2008 22:08 IST
Efforts to save Indian national Sarabjit Singh from the gallows received a boost on Monday with former premier Nawaz Sharif asking the Pakistan government not to hang him on humanitarian grounds.
The Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz chief, whose party is a key player in the ruling coalition led by the Pakistan People's Party, however, did not favour an unconditional pardon for Sarabjit, sentenced to death for his alleged involvement in bomb attacks that killed 14 people in 1990.
"Sarabjit should be released on the condition that he would be sent back to Pakistan if concrete evidence is found against him," Sharif was quoted as saying by TV news channels.
In an interview with the Aaj news channel, Sharif also suggested that any review of Sarabjit's case by the Pakistan government should be linked to similar action by the Indian government in the cases of Pakistanis currently being held in the neighbouring country.
"After seeing the plight of the members of Sarabjit's family who have come to Pakistan, any person can feel the pain they are going through," Sharif said.
"But if this individual (Sarabjit) has actually carried out terrorist attacks, then no person can easily ignore that".
Sharif further said in the interview, "If the Pakistan government is to examine this matter, then the issue of Pakistanis being held in India for similar cases should be linked to it".
The other TV channels said Sharif hinted that Sarabjit could be swapped for Pakistanis currently being held in Indian jails.
Sharif's comments came even as authorities in Punjab province put off Sarabjit's hanging for up to three weeks.
Sarabjit was originally set to be hanged on April 1, but his execution was deferred for 30 days by President Pervez Musharraf [Images]. This was done so that Pakistan's new government could review his case following an appeal for clemency from the Indian government.
According to existing rules, Sarabjit's case has to be put up again before a local court for fixing a fresh date for the execution.
The fresh date cannot be fixed before a period of 14 days or after 21 days. This means that the execution will be postponed for up to three weeks, officials said.
Former Pakistani human rights minister Ansar Burney welcomed Sharif's comments and the decision to put off Sarabjit's hanging.
"It's a very good sign," Burney told PTI, adding he was ready to share the evidence he had gathered in Sarabjit's case with Sharif.
"Due to the suspicious nature of the case against Sarabjit, his execution should not be carried out. Relations between India and Pakistan are improving and India's External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee is scheduled to visit Pakistan next month. In view of these developments, the government should review Sarabjit's case," he said.
Burney also said he had sought appointments with Musharraf and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gillani to take up Sarabjit's case and was hopeful of meeting them sometime soon.
#35 Posted by Urstruly on April 28, 2008 11:25:25 am
Re: # 34 DM
I am unfamiliar with the history of court proceedings in this case but I have a feeling that the verdict was given by civilian courts; whereby all verdicts and their related documents are catalogued in the books of legal verdicts. These books are made available to general public especially lawyers who use such refernce as to quote precedence in future cases.
So far I have not heard any voice challenging the evidence or the legal proceedings.
This is the situation as it is. But lets apply Murphy's law assume that all evidence was doctored and all proceedings were manipulated. In this case should the authorities let a convict go just because some people are raising hue and cry? Even if that is the case, no government no matter how corrupt would, let a convict go because it undermines its own authority in a bigger scheme of things.
I do not know if Sarabjit has exhausted all his avenues of appeal or not because if he has not then he can file a petition to re-open his case.
But if he has already exhausted all the avenues of an appeal his best option would be to invoke the law of Qisas. Once he has done that Indian government, NGOs, and affluent community should work out a deal with the monetary compensation with the victims. I am pretty sure that with a handsome settlement and a lovey dovey media propaganda this deal is quite possible.
Look, this avenue is guarnteed by the Pakistani constitution (or whatever is left of it) and the law. The only reason that the corrupt, pro-western, coward ruling elite do not let this law into practice because these cowrds are scared to death that their foreign masters would be aggravated by it because the law has the word "Islamic" as an adjective attched to it. Because of this criminal negligence and in defiance of law of God Pakistan has become the fourth country in the world that imparts the death penalty and yet the rate of murders is as high as if country is at war.
I am unfamiliar with the history of court proceedings in this case but I have a feeling that the verdict was given by civilian courts; whereby all verdicts and their related documents are catalogued in the books of legal verdicts. These books are made available to general public especially lawyers who use such refernce as to quote precedence in future cases.
So far I have not heard any voice challenging the evidence or the legal proceedings.
This is the situation as it is. But lets apply Murphy's law assume that all evidence was doctored and all proceedings were manipulated. In this case should the authorities let a convict go just because some people are raising hue and cry? Even if that is the case, no government no matter how corrupt would, let a convict go because it undermines its own authority in a bigger scheme of things.
I do not know if Sarabjit has exhausted all his avenues of appeal or not because if he has not then he can file a petition to re-open his case.
But if he has already exhausted all the avenues of an appeal his best option would be to invoke the law of Qisas. Once he has done that Indian government, NGOs, and affluent community should work out a deal with the monetary compensation with the victims. I am pretty sure that with a handsome settlement and a lovey dovey media propaganda this deal is quite possible.
Look, this avenue is guarnteed by the Pakistani constitution (or whatever is left of it) and the law. The only reason that the corrupt, pro-western, coward ruling elite do not let this law into practice because these cowrds are scared to death that their foreign masters would be aggravated by it because the law has the word "Islamic" as an adjective attched to it. Because of this criminal negligence and in defiance of law of God Pakistan has become the fourth country in the world that imparts the death penalty and yet the rate of murders is as high as if country is at war.
#36 Posted by dost_mittar on April 28, 2008 12:02:18 pm
Urstruly#35:
I too have not followed this case closely but I believe that it was tried in the civilian courts. But I also am aware that the civilian courts did not act entirely independently during the military regime.
"So far I have not heard any voice challenging the evidence or the legal proceedings."
Such voices have been raised, at least in the Indian media, it seems that the case relies mostly on statements by the accused under police interrogation (and you know what that means) and another witness who have retracted their earlier statements. Even the statements of Nawaz and Ansar that I copied seem to suggest that they are not sure if the proceedings were fair.
I personally think that the much vaunted back-channel diplomacy should be able to arrange for a prisoner swap in this situation.
I too have not followed this case closely but I believe that it was tried in the civilian courts. But I also am aware that the civilian courts did not act entirely independently during the military regime.
"So far I have not heard any voice challenging the evidence or the legal proceedings."
Such voices have been raised, at least in the Indian media, it seems that the case relies mostly on statements by the accused under police interrogation (and you know what that means) and another witness who have retracted their earlier statements. Even the statements of Nawaz and Ansar that I copied seem to suggest that they are not sure if the proceedings were fair.
I personally think that the much vaunted back-channel diplomacy should be able to arrange for a prisoner swap in this situation.
#37 Posted by Urstruly on April 28, 2008 12:07:30 pm
Re: # 36 DM
I understand what you wrote, but the problem is that courts of law do not recognize the "raised concerns". they have to look at the evidence. Usually the losing part always makes such fuss, and winning aprty always considers it a victory of justice when the verdict turns their way. GOI is doing a miserable job by not providing legal assistance to Sarabjit if it considers that the "raised voices" have some weight.
I understand what you wrote, but the problem is that courts of law do not recognize the "raised concerns". they have to look at the evidence. Usually the losing part always makes such fuss, and winning aprty always considers it a victory of justice when the verdict turns their way. GOI is doing a miserable job by not providing legal assistance to Sarabjit if it considers that the "raised voices" have some weight.
#38 Posted by dost_mittar on April 28, 2008 12:18:00 pm
Urstruly:
Yes, I think that GOI should provide him with legal assistance, although that may be hard because I believe that he probably is a RAW agent even if he did not blast the train.
Yes, I think that GOI should provide him with legal assistance, although that may be hard because I believe that he probably is a RAW agent even if he did not blast the train.
#39 Posted by zeemax on April 28, 2008 12:24:06 pm
Fuck this stupid board. Zardari has backed out from Judiciary's restoration and coalition will fall apart on 30 April. The Mehsuds had sensed it earlier and announced the end to the peace agreement earlier in the day.
The SOB is playing the Sindh card, same as his bitch of a wife. This means musharraf dismissing the parliament.
Guess hamidm2 will still have something to cheer about till guillotines are set up. The clock is ticking VERY fast now.
The SOB is playing the Sindh card, same as his bitch of a wife. This means musharraf dismissing the parliament.
Guess hamidm2 will still have something to cheer about till guillotines are set up. The clock is ticking VERY fast now.
#40 Posted by zeemax on April 28, 2008 12:35:47 pm
HP your comments please. Zardari has said BB's postmortem was done but the report is hidden, and a major power is involved in her murder.
Breaking news.
Breaking news.
#41 Posted by tahmed32 on April 28, 2008 12:38:50 pm
At first Zardari tried gently backing off from his word through cleverness on restoration of the judiciary..broke into a trot..and now has broken into a full-scale gallop to Dubai..and so Hamidm has a new lota to start cheering..
..but wait..PML is in hot persuit of the runaway stallion..
Shahbaz to remind Asif of deadline on judges
By Ahmad Fraz Khan
LAHORE, April 27: A PML-N delegation headed by the party’s president Mian Shahbaz Sharif was to leave for Dubai on Sunday night to ‘remind Mr Asif Ali Zardari of the approaching deadline set for reinstatement of judges’.
..
Sources in the PML-N said Mr Zardari had gone to Dubai with a promise to return home by Sunday afternoon.
“Since he has extended his stay in Dubai, it is necessary for the party (PML-N) to ensure continuity of talks over the issue of reinstatement of judges.
http://www.dawn.com/2008/04/28/top1.htm
..but wait..PML is in hot persuit of the runaway stallion..
Shahbaz to remind Asif of deadline on judges
By Ahmad Fraz Khan
LAHORE, April 27: A PML-N delegation headed by the party’s president Mian Shahbaz Sharif was to leave for Dubai on Sunday night to ‘remind Mr Asif Ali Zardari of the approaching deadline set for reinstatement of judges’.
..
Sources in the PML-N said Mr Zardari had gone to Dubai with a promise to return home by Sunday afternoon.
“Since he has extended his stay in Dubai, it is necessary for the party (PML-N) to ensure continuity of talks over the issue of reinstatement of judges.
http://www.dawn.com/2008/04/28/top1.htm
#42 Posted by tahmed32 on April 28, 2008 12:44:09 pm
peonofthewest sahib: i want you to know that it is a great honor to have you mistaken for me. this is like someone accusing me of being the real artist responsible for painting the Mona Lisa, the real author responsible for writing Shakespeare's Tempest.
I realize this mistake has been made by two of the more error-prone gentlemen on chowk (Messrs. masadi and laddu), but it remains nevertheless flattering.
I realize this mistake has been made by two of the more error-prone gentlemen on chowk (Messrs. masadi and laddu), but it remains nevertheless flattering.
#43 Posted by Urstruly on April 28, 2008 12:55:11 pm
Re: # 39 Zeemax:
See, I told you so. People of Pakistan do not realize that the deadly mess that our country is in today was created by the very people whom they elect. These 'elected' people have vested interests in keeping Pakistan inefficient, corrupt, and lawless. This chaos has made them some of the richest people in the world. Why would they want to change all this.
I think people of Pakistan's best option is to let Islamists and Talibans weed out these cancers with their guillotines. Unfortunately there remains no easy way for our salvation. Nature has finally run out of all the chances that it has been giving us.
See, I told you so. People of Pakistan do not realize that the deadly mess that our country is in today was created by the very people whom they elect. These 'elected' people have vested interests in keeping Pakistan inefficient, corrupt, and lawless. This chaos has made them some of the richest people in the world. Why would they want to change all this.
I think people of Pakistan's best option is to let Islamists and Talibans weed out these cancers with their guillotines. Unfortunately there remains no easy way for our salvation. Nature has finally run out of all the chances that it has been giving us.
#44 Posted by zeemax on April 28, 2008 1:05:02 pm
#43 Posted by Urstruly,
I really don't know what to think. WTF has zardari done.
He's complaining about his stupid BMW case for not restoring the judiciary, and claiming credit for producing 27,000 MW of electricity via IPPs in 1994 when I KNOW PERSONALLY as a fact both he and BB took the difference between $660/MW cost and $1,000/MW over-invoiced and charged to the public.
I still have hope in PML-N who will sweep the next elections, but will those ever be held? I doubt anyone will survive this crisis Zardari has brought.
The other option, is well ... as you say, and I have been predicting too, but I hope.
I really don't know what to think. WTF has zardari done.
He's complaining about his stupid BMW case for not restoring the judiciary, and claiming credit for producing 27,000 MW of electricity via IPPs in 1994 when I KNOW PERSONALLY as a fact both he and BB took the difference between $660/MW cost and $1,000/MW over-invoiced and charged to the public.
I still have hope in PML-N who will sweep the next elections, but will those ever be held? I doubt anyone will survive this crisis Zardari has brought.
The other option, is well ... as you say, and I have been predicting too, but I hope.
#45 Posted by zeemax on April 28, 2008 1:08:25 pm
... yeah I missed to mention the idiot said 27,000 MW. He just added a zero. What does the dumb public know anyway.
#46 Posted by HP on April 28, 2008 1:22:52 pm
#40 Posted by zeemax
"HP your comments please. Zardari has said BB's postmortem was done but the report is hidden, and a major power is involved in her murder."
The first part of postmortem is new but the second part is old news. You must have seen my earlier posts on this.
I had a long conversations with couple of people in Pakistan last night. What I understand is that they wanna bring the Judges back but don't want them to have the powers to open cases against Mush baba!
Generally, I think lawyers should hit the streets now. The coalition is under pressure and only the street power can help them.
"HP your comments please. Zardari has said BB's postmortem was done but the report is hidden, and a major power is involved in her murder."
The first part of postmortem is new but the second part is old news. You must have seen my earlier posts on this.
I had a long conversations with couple of people in Pakistan last night. What I understand is that they wanna bring the Judges back but don't want them to have the powers to open cases against Mush baba!
Generally, I think lawyers should hit the streets now. The coalition is under pressure and only the street power can help them.
#47 Posted by zeemax on April 28, 2008 1:45:39 pm
#46 Posted by HP,
Did you see the Zardari interview with Dr. Shahid Masood just now? If you didn't, don't miss it on PKpolitics tomorrow. He said many things, and I look forward to your comments WTF this person is doing. He's playing the Sindh card which will break apart the country and wreak havoc on Sindhis and Mohajirs. They will have to sort things between them on their own. Punjab/NWFP will still be fine. How come this guy doesn't realize that?
Did you see the Zardari interview with Dr. Shahid Masood just now? If you didn't, don't miss it on PKpolitics tomorrow. He said many things, and I look forward to your comments WTF this person is doing. He's playing the Sindh card which will break apart the country and wreak havoc on Sindhis and Mohajirs. They will have to sort things between them on their own. Punjab/NWFP will still be fine. How come this guy doesn't realize that?
#48 Posted by stuka on April 28, 2008 1:50:37 pm
"#31 Posted by Urstruly on April 28, 2008 9:12:50 am
My sincere advice to Hindus is that they should make an offer to pay Qisas and Diyat pre-emptively to the next of the kins of sarbjeet's victims. Make them an offer that they ccould not refuse.They must hire lawyers and file a case in supreme court asking for its interference to facilitate Qisas proceedings. "
Sirji, Sarabjit Singh is a Sikh and we are Baniyas. ;)
My sincere advice to Hindus is that they should make an offer to pay Qisas and Diyat pre-emptively to the next of the kins of sarbjeet's victims. Make them an offer that they ccould not refuse.They must hire lawyers and file a case in supreme court asking for its interference to facilitate Qisas proceedings. "
Sirji, Sarabjit Singh is a Sikh and we are Baniyas. ;)
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